Micro 1074: 09:12 - Game Over!

[Not Known 15]

VOTE: Kokichi Oma

Let's have fun.

[Not Known 15]

kawaii hasn't posted at all.
@kawaii - if you're reading this, your thoughts on the game so far would be appreciated.

I actually don't like this post

VOTE: Abnegation

[Not Known 15]

kawaii hasn't posted at all.
@kawaii - if you're reading this, your thoughts on the game so far would be appreciated.

We might have got our first scum here. I mean, why would a townie talk to a player who hasn't posted yet at that stage? Why would that player be singled out for information when there is no real reason to, and it's obviously better(for town) to look into people who have posted and didn't post their thoughts?
This seems like a post made to replicate scumhunting, instead of a genuine town post.
I don't see anything that would make me townread Kokichi or Kawaii so I'd like those who do to explain.

[Not Known 15]

Everyone coasting while mafia either takes hold of the game or coasts too to blend in is handing scum the win.

Well if there's so little to go on why do you completely ignore the push on Abnegation?
I need to see more from Kowahbunga to be able to accurately assess their posts.

[Not Known 15]

Unofficial

votecount

KittyTacky (2) - skitter30, HighPrincessErinys,

Kokichi Oma (2) - Abnegation, KawaiiKame,

Not voting (1) - Kokichi Oma

Abnegation (1) - Kowahbunga, Not Known 15,

Kowahbunga (1) - Arko,

Arko (1) - KittyTacky,

skitter30 (0) -

Not Known 15 (0) -

HighPrincessErinys (0) -

KawaiiKame (0) -

No Elimination (0) -

(expired on 2023-03-24 18:01:00) remain until day end

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to reach a majority.

[Not Known 15]

Corrected

Unofficial

votecount

KittyTacky (2) - skitter30, HighPrincessErinys,

Kokichi Oma (2) - Abnegation, KawaiiKame,

Abnegation (2) - Kowahbunga, Not Known 15,

Not voting (1) - Kokichi Oma

Kowahbunga (1) - Arko,

Arko (1) - KittyTacky,

skitter30 (0) -

Not Known 15 (0) -

HighPrincessErinys (0) -

KawaiiKame (0) -

No Elimination (0) -

(expired on 2023-03-24 18:01:00) remain until day end

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to reach a majority.

Previous unofficial count had an error.

[Not Known 15]

I currently have two scumreads. Abnegation and Kowahbunga.

[Not Known 15]

Well lets talk about it then. Who is scummier? Me for casting a 2nd vote during RVS or Kitty for thinking it is scummy? Lets get some opinions and conversation going.

This is a bit weird...

[Not Known 15]

Usually I talk a lot but I feel like I'll be just talking to myself.

You can talk to me
VOTE: Kokichi

Whose opening do you think was the worst so far and why

Idk if anyone had a bad opening

Usually I talk a lot but I feel like I'll be just talking to myself.

You can talk to me
VOTE: Kokichi

Whose opening do you think was the worst so far and why

since you’re asking this, do you think anyone’s opening was scummy?

I don't

Leaving aside the fact that it's a random number generator and I did it as a joke, I think checking a moderate townread is good.

On that note, this one would like to ask everyone who their current top town and scum reads are.

Town exists among:
HPE
NK15/Skitter
Kitty

Here are three examples of casting a wide net. You seem more like you're wanting to please the playerbase rather than ruffle any feathers.

Even your most recent post literally means nothing because as long as you listed 3 or more people, your statement was always going to be true.

VOTE: kawaii

Doesn't look like real scumhunting here, more like attempts to make scumminess out of air.

[Not Known 15]

Hm.
VOTE: Kowahbunga

E-1

[Not Known 15]

I don't like the speed of the kowah wagon in this lethargic game, and i'm sus of quite a few votes on it

Why do you dislike that speed? Why do you think it is too fast in this situation?
And which votes look sus to you?

[Not Known 15]

I don't like the speed of the kowah wagon in this lethargic game, and i'm sus of quite a few votes on it

Why do you dislike that speed? Why do you think it is too fast in this situation?
And which votes look sus to you?

And why.

[Not Known 15]

Why are people voting kowah? I think their posts are fine.

VOTE: kawaii

Why? What are your counterarguments?
Why do you think kawaii is scum?

[Not Known 15]

Why are people voting kowah? I think their posts are fine.

VOTE: kawaii

Why? What are your counterarguments?
Why do you think kawaii is scum?

That I think there is nothing scummy about their posts at all so far. and because his reads feel fake is why I think kawaii is prob scum right now

Why do you think that the arguments against kowah are wrong?
Why do you think kawaii's reads are fake?

[Not Known 15]

Just a feeling, just like I'm feeling your questioning feels off for some reasoning

ok then we can ignore that.

[Not Known 15]

I don't like the speed of the kowah wagon in this lethargic game, and i'm sus of quite a few votes on it

Why do you dislike that speed? Why do you think it is too fast in this situation?
And which votes look sus to you?

And why.

I feel like for both of u you're trying to hard to find reasons to vote them, and particularly for yours i don't think you had enuf justification for e2

Of course I did, the game was stagnant.

I don't like the speed of the kowah wagon in this lethargic game, and i'm sus of quite a few votes on it

Why do you dislike that speed? Why do you think it is too fast in this situation?
And which votes look sus to you?

There's like six pages of content and someone's at e1and idon't their actual content is scummy

And abnegation's and yours

Yep Abnegation's vote, that's fine. It doesn't look great but it could easily be a bus vote.

Why do you find the arguments for kowah being scum not convincing?

[Not Known 15]

VOTE: Abnegation

You talked about Kowah being scummy but never voted Kowah. Why?
Why did you decide to vote Abnegation again after unvoting?

[Not Known 15]

Votecount 1.4

Kowahbunga

(3) -

KittyTacky

,

Abnegation

,

Not Known 15

KawaiiKame

(2) -

Kowahbunga

,

Kokichi Oma

Abnegation

(2) -

skitter30

,

KawaiiKame

Not voting (2) -

Arko

,

HighPrincessErinys

(expired on 2023-03-24 18:01:00) remain until day end

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to reach a majority.

skitter30 is V/LA on Fridays and Saturdays.

Let me shed some light on things.

As we can see, the paint-by-numbers leaves 4 suspects: NK15, Kokichi, Kawaii and HPE.

Kokichi and Kawaii aren't scum together.

The other opener I was gonna go with was 'It's time to rhyme', so I'll bung that in this post as well.

Hai!

Where are these Kowah and Abnegation townreads coming from?

[Not Known 15]

Well lets talk about it then. Who is scummier? Me for casting a 2nd vote during RVS or Kitty for thinking it is scummy? Lets get some opinions and conversation going.

Town tend to not discuss their own scumminess because they usually don't acknowledge it.
+scum

Usually I talk a lot but I feel like I'll be just talking to myself.

You can talk to me
VOTE: Kokichi

Whose opening do you think was the worst so far and why

Idk if anyone had a bad opening

Doesn't necessarily mean someone had to have a bad opening to answer this. Who do you think had the best opening so far?

The second part is fine, the first part is throwing shade for not doing something that wasn't expected.

Leaving aside the fact that it's a random number generator and I did it as a joke, I think checking a moderate townread is good.

On that note, this one would like to ask everyone who their current top town and scum reads are.

Town exists among:
HPE
NK15/Skitter
Kitty

Of course it does. You've just listed more players than what could make up a scum team in this game.

Trying to push for nothing here. It is strangely worded, but in a way that would normally result in questions, not this shade.

Usually I talk a lot but I feel like I'll be just talking to myself.

You can talk to me
VOTE: Kokichi

Whose opening do you think was the worst so far and why

Idk if anyone had a bad opening

Usually I talk a lot but I feel like I'll be just talking to myself.

You can talk to me
VOTE: Kokichi

Whose opening do you think was the worst so far and why

since you’re asking this, do you think anyone’s opening was scummy?

I don't

Leaving aside the fact that it's a random number generator and I did it as a joke, I think checking a moderate townread is good.

On that note, this one would like to ask everyone who their current top town and scum reads are.

Town exists among:
HPE
NK15/Skitter
Kitty

Here are three examples of casting a wide net. You seem more like you're wanting to please the playerbase rather than ruffle any feathers.

Even your most recent post literally means nothing because as long as you listed 3 or more people, your statement was always going to be true.

VOTE: kawaii

and now all together here mashed up; this is literally made out of air. A push for the sake of a push instead of some real thought process behind it.
That's scummy.

[Not Known 15]

Usually I talk a lot but I feel like I'll be just talking to myself.

You can talk to me
VOTE: Kokichi

Whose opening do you think was the worst so far and why

Idk if anyone had a bad opening

Doesn't necessarily mean someone had to have a bad opening to answer this. Who do you think had the best opening so far?

Why are you throwing this shade on the answer? The answer is perfectly fine. If you don't think that anyone had a bad opening then there is no single worst opening... just a bunch of NAI openings that make up the bulk of openings anyways.

[Not Known 15]

We lost two innos:(

[Not Known 15]

A mafia rolecop and a town follower flipped. We either have a tracker or a jailkeeper. This means we should claim targets for last night because the real target would be an inno. Does anyone disagree?

[Not Known 15]

if y'all want to do the plan in 320 before we yeet anyone, we can, but does anyone object to that vote?

I don't, but we still should claim our potential visits to avoid robbing ourselves of a confirmed townie.

[Not Known 15]

is there an order you want to do it in?

Kokichi first, then popcorn?

[Not Known 15]

I don't think it's wise to claim. we might have another important role. i think we are ahead and should wait till tomorrow

The other important role is either a tracker or a jailkeeper. Both produce innos... and to not lose the inno or the PR's anonymity everyone claims one person they have a inno on... but of course only one claim will be true... the deception will be cleared up tomorrow either way(unless we lim scum ofc).

[Not Known 15]

Targeting claims
(Whom you have an innocent result on if you are the other PR)

skitter30 -
Abnegation -
Not Known 15 -
HighPrincessErinys -
KittyTacky -
KawaiiKame -
Kokichi Oma - furtiveglance

Next claim: skitter30

[Not Known 15]

VOTE: skitter

Would you like to contribute your thoughts on the matter before laying down a naked vote?

I think it's skitter or you and I was going to visit skitter tonight so I'm voting them now

Why do you think it's HPE or skitter?

[Not Known 15]

Targeting claims
(Whom you have an innocent result on if you are the other PR)

skitter30 -
Abnegation -
Not Known 15 -
HighPrincessErinys -
KittyTacky -
KawaiiKame -
Kokichi Oma - furtiveglance

Next claim: skitter30

skitter it's your turn

[Not Known 15]

Targeting claims
(Whom you have an innocent result on if you are the other PR)

skitter30 - HighPrincessErinys
Abnegation -
Not Known 15 - Abnegation
HighPrincessErinys -
KittyTacky -
KawaiiKame -
Kokichi Oma - furtiveglance

Next claim: KawaiiKame; please popcorn to another person.

[Not Known 15]

Yeah, that's what i was saying before - it's a v weird kill

Was i supposed to popcorn?

You were, but we needed to speed things up so I claimed next and went to kawaii.

[Not Known 15]

I suspect it is kawaii.

kawaii only voted kowah in bus conditions and furtive was suspicious of kawaii... and was promptly nightkilled!

[Not Known 15]

VOTE: kawaii

but don't put anyone at e-1 or before we are finished!

[Not Known 15]

Good points. It's probably not kawaii, then. Good.

[Not Known 15]

UNVOTE:

[Not Known 15]

I could actually see that

You can see that, yeah? Kawaii had more reasons to bus than me. And I actually do agree that you're right and it is probably not Kawaii.

[Not Known 15]

I could actually see that

You can see that, yeah? Kawaii had more reasons to bus than me. And I actually do agree that you're right and it is probably not Kawaii.

A bit defensive aren't we?

Yeah. So what?

[Not Known 15]

Targeting claims
(Whom you have an innocent result on if you are the other PR)

skitter30 - HighPrincessErinys
Abnegation -
Not Known 15 - Abnegation
HighPrincessErinys -
KittyTacky -
KawaiiKame - Vanilla Townie
Kokichi Oma - furtiveglance

Next claim:??

Kawaii you select the next.

[Not Known 15]

Targeting claims
(Whom you have an innocent result on if you are the other PR)

skitter30 - HighPrincessErinys
Abnegation -

KittyTacky

Not Known 15 - Abnegation
HighPrincessErinys -

VT

KittyTacky -

VT

KawaiiKame - Vanilla Townie
Kokichi Oma - furtiveglance

These are our final visit claims then. That's two VTs unaccounted for, and a PoE lying in our 4 claims. This one is pretty sure that's a PR, two VTs and our last Mafia in them.

The lim target here is pretty obvious.
VOTE: Kokichi Oma
Voting out skitter or you makes no sense, voting out me, Abnegation, skitter or you makes no sense, nor does voting out Kitty. Then it's between kawaii and Kokichi, and kawaii is much more likely town(as we have discussed earlier) than Kokichi whose actions on day 1 are entirely consistent with being the scumpartner.

[Not Known 15]

Targeting claims
(Whom you have an innocent result on if you are the other PR)

skitter30 - HighPrincessErinys
Abnegation -

KittyTacky

Not Known 15 - Abnegation
HighPrincessErinys -

VT

KittyTacky -

VT

KawaiiKame - Vanilla Townie
Kokichi Oma - furtiveglance

These are our final visit claims then. That's two VTs unaccounted for, and a PoE lying in our 4 claims. This one is pretty sure that's a PR, two VTs and our last Mafia in them.

The lim target here is pretty obvious.
VOTE: Kokichi Oma
Voting out skitter or you makes no sense, voting out me, Abnegation, skitter or you makes no sense, nor does voting out Kitty. Then it's between kawaii and Kokichi, and kawaii is much more likely town(as we have discussed earlier) than Kokichi whose actions on day 1 are entirely consistent with being the scumpartner.

Or this one

If kawaii and kokichi were of equal scumminess we'd lim kawaii but they are not. Everyone else is covered.

[Not Known 15]

Kokichi only covers himself which makes him the second best target for the lim, mechanically.

[Not Known 15]

I also think it's not kawaii. He put him on E-1 without asking for him to claim. He was ok with someone just hammering if Ab didn't ask the question on whether there should be a claim or not.

Honestly odds are final scum bussed since it seemed Kowah was getting voted out

This looks inconsistent.

[Not Known 15]

Yes, his way of voting I don't think was scummy because of what I said already. Pretty clear. i think you're trying to make it look scummy when it's right

Ok, so who's it then if it isn't me?

[Not Known 15]

Yes, his way of voting I don't think was scummy because of what I said already. Pretty clear. i think you're trying to make it look scummy when it's right

Ok, so who's it then if it isn't me?

I've already answered this. It looks to me like you're asking questions to make it seem like you're scumhunting and it's just questions to answers that are already there

No, you have not. skitter didn't vote Kowah.

[Not Known 15]

i agree, that's why i think pr claiming would be helpful here.

I tracked you last night. But we still need to talk about HPE...
Why do you think HPE is not scum?
Also, UNVOTE: for discussion.

[Not Known 15]

And I am still not 100% town on kawaii.

[Not Known 15]

That didn't work out so well, thanks to all these VT claims. Please give the game a bit more attention right now.

[Not Known 15]

And yes, I am the tracker so unvote.

[Not Known 15]

Which leaves kawaii. Is kawaii really 100% town? Is that behaviour really inconsistent with a bus?

[Not Known 15]

I think Kitty can be town so there's that.

[Not Known 15]

It's most likely skitter/kokichi but we need to be sure about the 3rd.

[Not Known 15]

But seriously if that was ACTUALLY a bus between Kawaii/Kowah, Kawaii can throw me for as many loops as he likes, for real.

If it's between kitty and kawaii lim kawaii, not kitty. Kitty is far more likely not kowahs partner than kawaii. Kitty has a consistent track record of pushing kowah, kawaii... not so consistent.

[Not Known 15]

skitter, you are at E-1. What are your reads?

[Not Known 15]

This feels like a solved game unless something wacky and uncharacteristic happens. We kill 1 PR claim, and if NK15 dies tonight we kill the last one. If NK15 doesn't, that's a Tracker we have and then we just kill Koki anyway. And if for some reason it all goes to shit, we should be able to kill NK15 still in like, final 3. Scum HAS to be within NK15/skitter/Koki, this one is certain of it.

I am confirmed town.

[Not Known 15]

You don't FEEL truly confirmed. Either way you're low on my elim list as stated.

This is a semi open setup with two town prs and one scum pr. The scum pr and one town pr have flipped.
There is one scum remaining. No one counterclaimed me. I am the other town PR. That's mechanics.

[Not Known 15]

Please unvote. I want to see skitter reply.

[Not Known 15]

Soo... who is in the POE?
I'm revisiting...

Abnegation, Not Known 15

- confirmed town.

HighPrincessErinys

- Their posting is consistent with someone who thought kowah could be a PR if not scum; reasonable efforts to keep game alive, and probably confusion about the setup... not really hard town tho.

KittyTacky

- Could be scum... if it's really an attempt at a consistent planned Day 1 bus. Really dangerous with all that info town gains from a Day 1 lim on scum, though. If they are scum and would have targeted HPE then it would be legit game over today. But that's unlikely and their ISO more looks like town who found scum and didn't see anything further down the line that would make them consider otherwise.

Kokichi Oma

- ISO is entirely consistent with being Mafia, and kowah's partner. A push on me is also great from their scum POV, all of that checks out.

skitter30

- That's practically the same as above! Maybe a bit more likely to be scum.

KawaiiKame

- Their ISO is mostly consistent with being kowah's partner, only kowah when the lim looked inevitable, and having kowah on the reads list but never voting them before it became obvious that kowah would be the lim. Yes, it is more dangerous to put kowah in your list like this if you are scum this game, but with a certain scum mindset and/or a bungled understanding of the setup(from both kowah and kawaii, far from unlikely), so this can be scum nontheless.

kowah is objectively scummy imo, but the little voice in my head is saying "what if that's limbait town?"

Then we should objectively eliminate Kowah, only way we advance this game is with a Kowah flip
UNVOTE: Abnegation
VOTE: Kowah

This could be the result of kawaii realizing that there are far too many people pushing for kowah for that to be not the lim.
At that point, kawaii, abnegation and kowah were at E-2, with kawaii voting abnegation. Kawaii had no other viable option at that time to avoid their lim; and kowah would have had even lower survival chances the next day if we flipped kawaii. The rolecop would be a town rolecop guilty in two of the 8 scum rolecop setups, and the goon would not. This is consistent with a bus.

The POE is, without a sliver of doubt by me, {Kawaii, skitter, kokichi}

[Not Known 15]

@everyone else: Please also provide your readslists.

[Not Known 15]

KittyTacky
- Could be scum... if it's really an attempt at a consistent planned Day 1 bus. Really dangerous with all that info town gains from a Day 1 lim on scum, though. If they are scum and would have targeted HPE then it would be legit game over today. But that's unlikely and their ISO more looks like town who found scum and didn't see anything further down the line that would make them consider otherwise.

To make this clear... this was also consistent with what I saw in kowah. I never saw a reason to remove kowah from my scumreads - rightly so.

[Not Known 15]

Post your readslists!

[Not Known 15]

Still frankly don't get NK15's scum!Kawaii argument but, eh.

What do you not get?
And why do you not accept that me and abnegation are confirmed town?

[Not Known 15]

Unvote at once.

[Not Known 15]

I have refuted the arguments on kawaii being town. Make counterarguments.

[Not Known 15]

I will try to rephrase my thoughts on kawaii.

1. Why would you bus the rolecop?

This is a semi open setup, with 12 setups in total, arranged on a clock. Mafia Rolecop sits on 3 and 9 o'clock.

It appears in setup 2, 3, 4, 8, 9 and 10.
Setup 2 contains a Vanilla Cop, with a guilty on the rolecop and an inno on others if the goon dies. Setups 9 and 10 contain a Town Rolecop, with a hard guilty on the Mafia Rolecop(and innos on others on a goon flip).

This is a massive incentive to save the goon instead of the scum rolecop.

2. Kitty never voted kowah before danger

2 votes on Abnegation, kawaii and Kowah. One of the votes on Abnegation was kawaii. That's when kawaii voted kowah.

3. Shallow push on kowah before

"Feels potentially perfomative" was the only prior

read

on kowah.

4. Lack of PR claim/insistence on claim

Insisting on claim at E-1 is nothing special, just LAMIST. A fakeclaim could have had disastrous consequences to scum due to the gamestate and lack of time. If there was no counterclaim in time we could have ended up with the alternative lim... with 3 votes... kawaii, which would have caused a sure loss for scum kawaii.

With the doctor and babysitter on two of the scum rolecop setups a claim could have helped town protect a PR.

5. Furtive pushed KawaiiKame

Furtive is confirmed (and dead) town.

[Not Known 15]

skitter -> Kokichi is still my preferred elim order, THEN Kawaii if need be.

That's fine.

[Not Known 15]

I would prefer kokichi first. Tbh i still don't think it's kawaii here

Who is the third person in your POE, other than kokochi and yourself?

[Not Known 15]

And why?

[Not Known 15]

If this was a town fakeclaim....

[Not Known 15]

Free win for me despite doing nothing!

That’s not really true!

[Not Known 15]

and yeah good game! You don't always need lots and lots of posts to find scum!

[Not Known 15]

and yeah good game! You don't always need lots and lots of posts to find scum!

Well, except kokichi, who played really badly here.

[Not Known 15]

how did i play bad? I wanted skitter

I didn't cc or i would have voted NK15. it just takes some non surface level thinking. i was trying to confuse mafia in the event it wasn't skitter

Your claim was a cc no matter what... there were only two town pr's possible, and one of them was dead.