Micro 1083: Garlic Bread Heist! (Game Over)

[Enchant]

[Enchant]

hi

So you are conftown here?

[Enchant]

well technically i could be an ascetic mafia or a mafia roleblocker or a mafia strongman but pretty much yes

Okay and who mafia

[Enchant]

Makes sense. Imagine being caught in jailkeep.

VOTE: Alisae

Choo choo

[Enchant]

... oh

[Enchant]

VOTE: hellbooks

I agree

[Enchant]

not me

[Enchant]

let's just blast ppl randomly and hope we win

[Enchant]

I never read anything

I live successfull but simple life

[Enchant]

I regret my vote

[Enchant]

VOTE: Thestatusquo

[Enchant]

I just gonna sheep your decision anyway so

[Enchant]

I just gonna sheep your decision anyway so

Who you sheeping?

guess

[Enchant]

I just gonna sheep your decision anyway so

Who you sheeping?

guess

Ausuka

who is this

[Enchant]

who the fuck is uwu

[Enchant]

I think the mafia is within Enchant, hellbooks, and Thestatusquo.

No shit sherlock

[Enchant]

yes i am allowed to do it because i am hypocrite

[Enchant]

VOTE: Dunnstral

die

[Enchant]

Fine

VOTE: Shea

[Enchant]

now i can fit xof into poe tho and not worry about losing to that slot, big poggers

Huh? You want to vote me?

VOTE: Dunn

No way i allow that.

[Enchant]

I blame Ausuka.

[Enchant]

Oh jeez you still alive.

Go ahead, say how i am obvscum.

[Enchant]

OH DAMN

FINALLY

THIS IS FIRST TIME I GET FAKEGUILTIED

I AM SO HAPPY, MOSTLY PEOPLE JUST SHITPUSH ME FOR BAD HAMMERS

[Enchant]

VOTE: shea

Why not

VOTE: VP Baltar
This one has made the unfortunate mistake of turning off his oven.
I believe they have access to the recipe book and are listing ingredients that we are trying to figure out.

How do you feel about shea?

Is this when we fight now Shea? I don't think I'm misrepping you. If you'd like to explain your point in whatever subtlety you think I'm missing, be my guest.

I think the D1 elimination will probably be Shea Sheep or Balter

can u explain why you want to lim shea? I am going back through your iso and you were calling him town at one point. I'm confused.

VOTE: alisae

I feel most comfortable here right now. I don't like the hellbrooks lim for D1 personally.

I don't think alisae is actually scumhunting and keeps trying to shade me for ???. This bugged me earlier when she was demanding a reads list from me, and clearly wasn't paying attention to the game.

I also think she's trying to get by on social schmoozing rather than hunting scum. The xof town read is eh, and I don't see how she goes from town read Shea-> let's lim Shea--> asking Shea for advice.

Just a bowl of wtf soup

I think there are a few main things that keep bugging me about Alisae:

Unexplained reads, even when asked for a little more depth

Let's go back to when she votes me first.

The fact you are trying to build a multi-point case on page six is pretty absurd on its face though. I find it hard to believe you're taking the game that seriously at this point.

VOTE: VP

It's a naked vote that obviously leaves a lot of room for interpretation. Does she think GB's case at that point was good? Does she think I'm being too critical? Is this a chainsaw? I have no idea, but also at the time I'm kind of like "whatever, maybe she vibing"

The very next thing we get from Alisae is the xof townread...again for thin reasoning.

oh also xof unvote could be townie so for now they are my strongest tr
it's not that strong but it is what it is

You'll remember I asked xof about this because it definitely feels pockety to me personally. Xof didn't seem to think so and said they have played together a lot, so I'm taking that under advisement. But what I think bugs me here is that this is the start of a pattern of reads that feel a little pulled out of a hat and designed to keep Alisae from doing work in the game more than they are actual sorting.

I brought this up around her shea play as well. She goes back and forth on calling him town and scum several times (but mostly town! don't want to ruffle feathers) with no explanation, even when I inquired more directly. You'll recall, she said she voted him for taking a "do nothing" strategy, which sounds like projection to me. Keep in mind, sheep-VP-shea are the only three names I've seen her throw out in an apparently serious way. It's all a bit flimsy and falls over with even the slightest closer inspection.

Now, let's be fair here, some of this this is very early game. But my issue real issue is that this has persisted through page 30 whatever now. I was willing to give it a pass early on. People need to find their feet in the early game. But if your naked vote on page 2 or whatever is still your top scum read after 30 pages and that's almost never changed? BEEEEP BOOOOPP SCUM LOCK ALERT BEEEP BOOOP

I can't tell you how many times I've played scum where I lock onto an early game read, forget I'm really there and then dozens of pages pass and I'm like "LOL, I'm still voting my RVS person, better make up some reason why that is."

Alisae occassionally takes pot shots at me that don't even make sense, and I think that's actually her trying to justfiy her vote being there. I'll touch on this as my third point in a minute.

Social positioning away from a D1 lim

As I mentioned above, I thought the xof read felt a little pockety, which is why I was asking xof a bit about it. Willing to admit my instincts differ from xof's there, but whatever.

I don't think I need to have a good read on users Tris + Skygazer + Hellbooks
I imagine those 3 will probably towntell or wolftell eventually.
User Alisae will find it

This also struck me as pockety. Or at the very least, attempting to get a third of the users to not look at her until later in the game. Again, it's a bit cynical of a read on my part, I'll admit, but it's actually kind of a smart wolf play if that's what it is in the sense that 1) you are reducing expectations on who you will provide opinions on D1 and 2) maybe those people reciprocate and don't take a hard look at you either D1. That essentially guarantees an elimination on you is tough if not impossible. A smart social play imo in an alisae!scum world. (it's probably also no surprise she ends up at town reads on all three here I think)

I think she's been schmoozing tris a bit since then, and largely ignoring the other two except for a very brief vote on hellbrooks when momentum was swinging that way.

More broadly, this feeds back into point 1 about how static her reads have been. Unless she has a HIGH LEVEL of confidence the solve is VP + sheep, i don't see how anyone can look at her play to this point and feel like she's actually trying to sort people.

Pot shots as justification for static reads

I mentioned above that Ali is trying to score cheap points with the audience rather than scum hunt, and I think this is peppered throughout her ISO. An example is when she tried to call me out for not having a reads list. I had literally just said I didn't have one. Here is the exchange:

Ok, if meta isn't really your thing, that makes sense.

Who is aligned with the mafia VP Baller

Ur mom

I don't know yet. I'll be sure to tell you first when I do though

my mum is aligned with the mafia so you must be aligned with the village to have such an accurate read on my mum

Did you not read this exact exchange I just had with garlic bread?

I don't think I care about it

I don't think I care about it

Why did you ask me for scum reads then?

Because I wanted to know who u thought was mafia

But I just said like a few pages ago that I had no clue at this point. Did you not read that part?

Ig I didn’t see it!

I think it's easy to see she didn't actually even care about the answer to the question. There's no deeper reason to why she asked me what my reads were than "I wanted to see". And when I say I don't have one, she just backs away from the convo. I think the intent here was to paint me as someone who isn't playing the game, and when I called her out for actually being the person who isn't paying attention to the game, she just disengages with the convo. This is what I mean by pot shots.

Here is another one (along with another "D1 pass" which is the social positioning I was talking about)

I want to give shea a d1 pass.

@Skygazer + Shea

- does VP Baller feel like they actually do care about trying to figure out alignments? I want to say yes but last time I played w/ them I TR'd them when they were wolf.

Like, I think it's reasonable to poke at me for sure. But if the criticism is "he's not trying to figure out alignments"...uh ok. I think my signal to noise ratio is pretty decent (except for when I felt like shit posting yesterday bc I was in a silly mood). This is such a blanket criticism that's detached from reality if you are even looking for two mins at my ISO. It's shade and it's trying to loop in supporting voice on a blanket shade comment. thx I hate it.

There are a million examples of this, from dropping my name repeatedly in quiet ways that seem intent on keeping me in the ether of discussion to stuff like this:

I also think they’ve pushed me in ways wolves probably would so there’s that too

which sounds neat...until you even spend 1 second thinking about what it actually means.

I've pushed her in wolfy ways? What does that mean? I didn't start pushing her until recently. She has incredibly static reads and is trying to schmooze people, all of which has been bugging me, but I also didn't want to launch into a whole thing if this is her town meta (which I don't think it is).

Last night she beetlejuiced in here when I called for a flash wagon on her. I think she can see I'm starting to feel better about this read being correct and that I'm going to push it in a more serious way, and that's bugging her. that's when she made they "wolfy reasons" comment without even hearing my reasons in an explained way. It's shade all the way down.



If you want a hot take, i think there's a non-zero chance that shea or Garlic Bread are her partner.

THE END

anyone with experience with shea have seen him tunnel illogically like this as town?

I think a tunnel fight with Shea can go bad. I've been in that with a TvT with him before. I said things that were mean and regretted them. I think it's best if you two just take a break from the fight and chat with others. My two cents

I also think there's probably one wolf in {ali GB} and not two I don't think the interplay between them was theatre I think its one pocketing the other.

Is Shea pocketing me? Maybe

My scum buddy is VPB so don't come after either of us.

bruh
I did nothing i just isoed VP baltar and opened page 1.

[Enchant]

I kinda have nothing to say, if you have any questions, ask.

[Enchant]

Enchant, why aren't you voting Shea?

Hammer is mine

[Enchant]

There's actually simple basis which exposes Shea. Also i am not fighting that claim: Shea can be rolecop or vanilla cop or even neapolitan, no difference, but they have some way to learn info.

Why there's RoleCop? Like yes, assume i am mafia bodybuilder, if i am executed,who gonna stop Jailkeeper spree? Probably nothing. So yeah, my existance makes sense maybe.
But vice versa. If mafia goon executed, then common assumption will be that other mafia teammate is PR of some sort. So Rolecop

turns in real Cop and confirms all vanilla checks as clear until they get 1-Shot Strongman result

. Unless of course, someone think Mafia Goon+Mafia Goon is balanced against Jail+Bulletproof+Rolecop somehow.


It leads to unstable equilibrium. Let's assume town was not complete dodo and did kill mafia D1 and let's assume that i am mafia bodybuilder. Basically, Mafia chances wither away after loss of any member.

If 1-Shot Strongman dies, then Jailkeeper gets Innocent results and sooner or later will find remaining maf or will keep them at toes with clears before finally being shot.
If Mafia Goon dies... Then not only Jailkeeper can and probably will continue jail spree, unless 1-Shot PREDICTS when they get jailkept, but there's also Rolecop who gets Innocent results. Fair?

Now think which role will help mafia better: Rolecop or Strongman?

Rolecop? Helps them to shred PR shot-list pretty fast, before they get guiltied at first place. Mouse vs Cat basically.
1-Shot Strongman? To counter claimed Bulletproof, or to PREDICT when jailkeeper will put you in cell? Good luck with that.

Town Rolecop/Mafia 1-Shot Strongman makes no sense.
Mafia Rolecop is more beneficial overall.

[Enchant]

Also claim is plainly sterile.

Shea tried to make self look "belivable" with "actions on reads", crumbs and etc. Truth it, town are paranoids who change opinion every 30 seconds.
I tell this as person who as Cop started night targeting mafia member and before 4 hours of deadline, changed it to obvtown townie who got NKed.
(Not in this game but i am disgrace lol)

[Enchant]

Show me a setup where only one scum remains and none of the power roles in the game ever die that ISN'T unwinnable for scum?

Anything can be winnable.

It's more matter how fair.

[Enchant]

Why you even argue with me?

You never prove me that i am evil, and i see no reason to talk for you.

Unless it's memes.

[Enchant]

But again.

YOu want to implue game have TWO INVESTIGATIVE ROLES.

[Enchant]

Ok not really investigative. Jailkeeper still can decimate scum if there's only one of them. Rolecop as well.

[Enchant]

Newbie Setup

Newbie Setup

NewD3 (as designed by RadiantCowbells):

	A	B	C
Mafia	Mafia Roleblocker	Mafia Rolecop	Mafia Goon
Row 1	Town Cop and Town Doctor	Town Tracker and Town Friendly Neighbor	Town Cop and Vanilla Townie
Row 2	Town Jailkeeper and Town Tracker	Town Jailkeeper and Town Friendly Neighbor	Town Jailkeeper and Vanilla Townie
Row 3	Town Mason and Town Mason	Town Tracker and Town Doctor	Town Mason and Town Mason

Each Newbie Game will be given a setup that incorporates one mafia role from the top of a column, and then two town roles from a row below the selected mafia role. The remaining six roles will be filled in by

one mafia goon

and

five vanilla townies

appropriately, to create a

2-mafia

and

7-town

setup.


This is game for newbies which designed to be as OP as possible to give noobs more way to get mafia mechanically while not breaking game.

[Enchant]

Role cop is an incredibly weak investigative role.

Gets clears after Mafia Goon death.
Gets guilty on Mafia Strongman out of bat.


Before anyone tell that i am scumslipping i am talking from perspective that i am really mafia 1-shot bodybuilder.
And it makes no sense for me to exist.

[Enchant]

If Shea "checked" hellbooks and knew she are Vanilla, did they express TOWNREAD atleast, because Vanilla result with already flipped Mafia Goon should be clear?
Atleast i can't find so.
Or did Shea overcrumb self screaming about how rolecop they are and didn't even translate results? Did they even bother to defend Hell?

[Enchant]

No i mean, "I think Hellbooks is townie" is practically enough i just can't find and my eyes hurt

[Enchant]

I need more dirt to throw at Shea please help

[Enchant]

I go to sleep.

If you want to hammer me for some reason, wait before i come back and yell at you

[Enchant]

Insomnia again

[Enchant]

I mean Shea claimed scum with VP D1 in hopes that it proves they are not team.

It's like child play. And you somehow forced me to hammer Dunn.

[Enchant]

By you i mean everyone.

[Enchant]

Also, what these arguments.

I should just lie here like bum and wait execution?

[Enchant]

... wait actually why i would't do that.

[Enchant]

No idea. I'm not great with mech stuff like this. I can think of a some reasons why it would make sense to save it if you want but ultimately I'm not really sure what the right play for scum would be.

I think that as an investigative role cop is very weak and it makes sense to me as a natural counter to the JK while also being the only role that gets guiltied by me. So like weak invest + protective with anti town utility makes some amount of sense to me. I've never designed a micro before so I don't really claim to be an expert but I think gun to my head I'd say its town sided, but I'm not really sure. I think the JK kind of makes sense too as a possible false positive to the role cop.

But like I said micro balance is not really a thing I have any experience or confidence in.

these answers give off the vibe of someone who is afraid to self advocate too hard which i wifomly read as kind of town

[Enchant]

Shea works on public. Just read first post of day.

Normal townie just says "I CAUGHT ENCHANT!!!!!!!!!!!111oneone" there's is tirade how there's crumbs and etc and etc.

[Enchant]

And how he would NEVER do this as mafia.

[Enchant]

Let's be plain.

I was among first to vote Shea and also voted Hell and didn't like it afterwards, so i had unfavorable opinion to him. So, he 1vs1 me anyway. Decided to give self a little jumpstart.

[Enchant]

Go ahead i won't stop you.

[Enchant]

no

[Enchant]

We can vote no-lim while shea no-kill and annoy mod to closing this game in draw.

[Enchant]

goes to show you that i really only have like 5 jokes

Vote Shea pls

[Enchant]

where's my funny comment from shea

[Enchant]

funny thing is it wasnt even a guilty cuz they killed the BP

[Enchant]

I actually had this argument to use (that BP is liability) but tried to put it in way to throw dirt on Shea.

I just waked up to be dead already.

[Enchant]

Oh idk who i bullied put of game by replacing in, but.

Can you uh, tell me next time so we won't end up in disaster.

[Enchant]

Oh idk who i bullied put of game by replacing in, but.

Can you uh, tell me next time so we won't end up in disaster.

you didn't bully me I just didn't feel like dealing with it at the time.
I woke up saw your vote and thought "ya lmao this isn't going away" xD

Do i really look like that stubborn.