Open 886 | Trust Fall | Postgame

[Doctor Drew]

I feel like I'm going to have a hard time getting people to trust me

Tbf, on the list of people I don't trust you are only like 3rd or 4th on the list.

[Doctor Drew]

If we're gonna go by meta, we should all want to fall with Alianna who has not rolled scum since Obama was president

She's gotta flip tails one of these days.

[Doctor Drew]

I guess if we're not in much of a rush I can get into theory

The goal of this setup seems to be to make sure no town townreads any scum enough that they exit with them.

That's easier said than done. If you think about the average player in a Mafia game, and you think of their strongest townread. MOST of those reads will be right. But usually at least one won't be. We have to aim for one maximum, or ideally none at all.

Another way of viewing it is, collectively, we have to find all but two town (or one town, if we mess up!). This setup is a lot more scumsided than it seems.

Well, luckily most of us have played a bunch of games together. So as long as we don't get stuck in a wifom spiral, i feel like we will be good?

[Doctor Drew]

Drew, Merlyn is trying to pocket you, trust me. You and me. We're both in this together!

She is a dastardly one isn't she?

[Doctor Drew]

wanted to note real quick that in theory we could use the trustfalls as personalized hammer tests (from the proposers POV). and then we can chain trustfalls if we reveal townies and know their proposees must be town

thats probably not the best idea but eh

Maybe I am missing something, but how exactly does this work?

If I propose to trust fall with you, and you accept.....we both leave the game.

Pre Edit: Oh reading what Ghandi said I get what you mean, just proposing the trust fall.....but then if I propose one with you, and you are scum, you just immediately accept it.

[Doctor Drew]

I like Klicks idea better of coming with up with a consensus town read(or reads). Start with the top 2 strongest consensus town reads, and then move down the list. I will have the boys in the lab run some experiments, accounting will check the math, but I feel like odds wise it should be in towns favor.

[Doctor Drew]

Everyone channeling their inner Ranger and constantly posting reads lists would probably be good, I think Black mentioned using the reads of a conf town who has fallen is a good tool, and constant reads lists would be good to see exactly how their brain is working.

Who the fuck let this version of Drew in the game? Am I actually trying to mech solve the game??

Eww

[Doctor Drew]

Everyone channeling their inner Ranger and constantly posting reads lists would probably be good, I think Black mentioned using the reads of a conf town who has fallen is a good tool, and constant reads lists would be good to see exactly how their brain is working.

Who the fuck let this version of Drew in the game? Am I actually trying to mech solve the game??

Eww

Hmmm. Constantly posting updated readslist probably helps scum more than town I want to say? But I haven't really thought through it completely. I think scum knowing where everyone stands at all times let's them plan out who they can try to trust fall with. Or am I overthinking?

Maybe, I am kinda just spit balling ideas here. But in that scenario scum would have to be a consensus town read for someone else to accept to fall with them. And in lieu of an actual list, just being as transparent as possible with reads seems to help town as a whole, I would think.

[Doctor Drew]

Is it weird that I am town reading mala?

[Doctor Drew]

Is it weird that I am town reading mala?

I dunno, what about her posts make her seem town to you?

That she really isn't doing anything game related.

[Doctor Drew]

lol, okay I get that

I haven't played with Mala when she's scum (or maybe not at all? We've crossed paths but I can't think of a game), but I've read a few of her games and I feel like she has that kind of carefree sound as scum too. Like, she made me laugh but I do think this is in her scumrange.

it probably is in her scumrange
i played a scumgame w her months ago and she was kinda like this

Hence why it is weird lol.

[Doctor Drew]

Ok I kinda don't trust Mala anymore.

Probably good call Black by not trusting back right away, imo.

[Doctor Drew]

I trust Doctor Drew

Let's play hardball

Ooh spicy play by Klick.

But you need to wine and dine me a bit before I agree to dance(callbacks ftw).

[Doctor Drew]

Black

Alianna
Sky
Klick
Nurse
Nuke
Merlyn


Mala

Kinda where I am at, Black is the only solid town read, Mala is the only solid scum read.

Nurse is the null line, I forgot they were even in the game tbh. Nuke is someone if I had experience I feel I would be scum reading, but trying to give their play style the benefit of the doubt for now. Merlyn is definitely a vibe read of lean scum.

Alianna will always start at the top of the town list, if she doesn't start Alianna-ing up, then she may slide.

Sky is just Sky lol, Klick is someone I now realize I always am distrusting of but realize it is their serious demeanor, which I see here, so they can be lean town for now.

[Doctor Drew]

I still feel like mala and Merlyn are kinda scummy for being the first to throw out a trust, even when I take personalities into consideration

Merlyn less so I guess because hers seemed like a test to sort me coming out of it

There is a tin foil thought that you and Mala are scum and this was done to clear you. But most of the rest of my brain just says that is general Mafia paranoia lol.

But either way I do agree it is scummy of Mala, and even basically spent most of the pre trust fall period trying to butter you up.

[Doctor Drew]

I don't think Mala/Black S/S makes sense. If Mala is scum then the goal with her play just now has been to flat-out get herself trusted

Scum have a simple objective - get both members trusted by someone. Mala's play would get Black townread, but at the expense of Mala being less likely to be trusted. It doesn't make sense

The only scum motivation I can see for Mala's play is if she thought she wouldn't get trusted if she didn't do something like this

I don't feel confident but I kinda think it makes Mala likely town

Hmm, that is a good point. They both have to leave to win.

One caveat is that, from what I understand, most of us haven't played this setup and not know the best strategy.

[Doctor Drew]

The only scum motivation I can see for Mala's play is if she thought she wouldn't get trusted if she didn't do something like this

I don't feel confident but I kinda think it makes Mala likely town

Why couldn't the motivation be to just try and do a quick exit? I said before the voting period opened that the only reason I didn't accept mala's offer was because I couldn't yet. She could have taken that seriously and thought it might work once voting opened up

Also hold up, I didn't let it sink in when I first read it.

Isn't the primary scum motivation for Black to trust Mala and scumMala exits the game??

Pretty much what you said Black, but Klick has some splaining to do.

[Doctor Drew]

Okay, so what about the klick strat?

We all agree that Black is the towniest, why don't we ask her to choose two folks to trust fall. She can still be wrong but we know that she won't be actively working against us

I don't mind this idea.

Oooh, this might actually break the game as well(in towns favor). The two people then chosen should trust fall as soon as they can as well, if we go down this route.

[Doctor Drew]

Also I think I would rather have my townreads pair with each other
I’m actually ok with drew and klick pairing
And the fact that they didn’t hammer quickly leads to me thinking highly town

Who are your scum reads? Or at least your 'less likely to be town' reads.

Ps my mom put ghost pepper in chili and I wanna die

JUST SO IF I AN MIA for two days I died bc of this fuckinf shit

This made my mouth water, buddy of mine main chili with a reaper pepper awhile back.......so sooo good

[Doctor Drew]

Also, don't you think two consensus too scum reads leaving(and assuming they both are town) kind of muddies the water the bit, like now we have to try to dig the null pile to find another 'top town read'.

I actually am warming up to a Top Town Committee over just a Mayor Black. Less than I am not trusting her, but more that much like government, no single person should have absolute power.

[Doctor Drew]

Also, don't you think two consensus too scum reads leaving(and assuming they both are town) kind of muddies the water the bit, like now we have to try to dig the null pile to find another 'top town read'.

We're going to have to find 3 correct pairs regardless, so digging of the null pile is inevitable if we can't come up with the needed number of townreads. It could still be helpful to leave top townreads alive to have their thoughts, though, if that's what you mean.

I actually am warming up to a Top Town Committee over just a Mayor Black. Less than I am not trusting her, but more that much like government, no single person should have absolute power.

Because you would be on the committee?

Jokes aside, though, I think that's a fair point.

Yes, it is more keeping top town reads around, instead of sending them on their way together and letting everyone else trying to figure it out.

Also, let me bask in the glow of actually being a top town read in early game. Feels nice lol.

[Doctor Drew]

At risk of WIFOM: Drew, would you hammer Klick as scum here?

Probably.

I feel like there is scum motivation to not hammer for the town read, ie ending up as a shot caller here and controlling the game.

But, at the end of the day scum gotta exit to win, and it happening so relatively earl in the game.....would be hard to figure out who my buddy would be.

[Doctor Drew]

i townread drew independently of the trust; i don't think the lack of hammer is necessarily clearing tbh. not that its not notable

What made you townread Drew then?

I don't love the committee idea, I don't see what it gains us vs what it potentially loses us.

'Keeping top townreads around' doesn't make sense to me? The goal is have town leave the game. And there's not a mechanic in this game, like wagons or lims, that allow us to get more information the longer we go. The top townreads don't gain anything by stay or become more wiser by staying.

Well, I mean more systematically the town reads should trust fall one at a time, instead of all at once(ie, the two top town reads shouldn't trust fall together at this point).

The trust falls basically are our lims and wagons.

[Doctor Drew]

I almost died from a poblano once. Good luck Mala!

What??

Oh you would hate my cooking.

[Doctor Drew]

so drew
you gotta pick right next, ok?

I want to see how it plays out with patch first.

[Doctor Drew]

Well, looks like this is just a one mayor town.

Mayor Drew, ready to save the town. Making Mafia Great Again......MMGA.

Ironically I was feeling worse about Klick then Patch

[Doctor Drew]

Also need two more t/t trust falls.

I kinda think I should be directing traffic here for this next trust fall, then if all goes well I choose who I want to fall with.

Also mod gave me ultimate power and rule over all of you as Mayor, so your input doesn't matter. I am your Overlord. You must do what I say.

[Doctor Drew]

But seriously, still feeling good-ish about Alianna. Bad-ish about Merlyn.

We should wait until Nurse comes back to trust fall at the very least.

I also want more from ol new mod Sky.

[Doctor Drew]

But seriously, still feeling good-ish about Alianna. Bad-ish about Merlyn.

We should wait until Nurse comes back to trust fall at the very least.

I also want more from ol new mod Sky.

What's your read on Nuke?

Kinda bad, there is a real possibility their thing with patch was theater.

But thank you, I forgot about them lol.

Never question your Overlord again though.

[Doctor Drew]

But seriously, still feeling good-ish about Alianna. Bad-ish about Merlyn.

We should wait until Nurse comes back to trust fall at the very least.

I also want more from ol new mod Sky.

What's your read on Nuke?

Kinda bad, there is a real possibility their thing with patch was theater.

But thank you, I forgot about them lol.

Never question your Overlord again though.

We're really doing the whole Utopian cult thing again?

I am drawing a blank on what you mean lol.

[Doctor Drew]

But seriously, still feeling good-ish about Alianna. Bad-ish about Merlyn.

We should wait until Nurse comes back to trust fall at the very least.

I also want more from ol new mod Sky.

What's your read on Nuke?

Kinda bad, there is a real possibility their thing with patch was theater.

But thank you, I forgot about them lol.

Never question your Overlord again though.

We're really doing the whole Utopian cult thing again?

I am drawing a blank on what you mean lol.

I was referencing bianco's game.

I got that.

But don't remember me doing something like this there.

[Doctor Drew]

What have I done that's made you think I'm scum, mayor drew?

Not a solid read, just have a hard time trusting falling with you over Alianna and Sky.

Honestly was hoping people would hold out on trust falling so I could figure you out more.....and see if Alianna fully obv towns it.

[Doctor Drew]

I was trying to wait for yessir to post, but that orob8is just wifom, Merlyn.

Like I don't see Patch being that blatant about their buddy.

[Doctor Drew]

are you using some kind of new fangled slang that the kids taught you Drew? What is orob8is?

Pssh, it's the new slang Grandma.

That, or either I meant to say 'is probably' but my phone decided to have a stroke it seems.

[Doctor Drew]

Honestly was hoping people would hold out on trust falling so I could figure you out more

i kind of figured the trust falls would orob8be happening early on but ye still tragic

this was quoting drew whoops

i have an edit button staring me in the eye that i can't use

Jeez, they make anyone a mod these days I guess.

[Doctor Drew]

I still haven't figured out how you're supposed to get reads in this. Nothing stuck out to me associatives-wise in patch's ISO yesterday (guess I could re-read it?), and can't really speculate on Merlyn's 388 because I know which scenario it is.
Maybe we should have left things a little longer, it kind of feels like I'm trying to hunt a serial killer now.

I trust Alianna

[Doctor Drew]

I still haven't figured out how you're supposed to get reads in this. Nothing stuck out to me associatives-wise in patch's ISO yesterday (guess I could re-read it?), and can't really speculate on Merlyn's 388 because I know which scenario it is.
Maybe we should have left things a little longer, it kind of feels like I'm trying to hunt a serial killer now.

I trust Alianna

Not hammering!

[Doctor Drew]

is this the unsure Alianna is town!Alianna?

More or less

[Doctor Drew]

Listen Yess, I am your benevolent Mayor, you should show me some respect or get the steppin(lol).

But I always will default to a town read on Alianna, and eventually if she is town it will become obvious.....and at the point I trusted her is when I saw it become obvious.

But, you do bring up a good point about Merlyn.

Merlyn, why would I throw her under the buss at that point when I had just trusted her.....and why is that what makes me town in your eyes?

[Doctor Drew]

or maybe i misunderstood drew's last post

It wasn't super clear.

I meant why would I trust Alianna, the watch Alianna not hammer(which as you said makes her basically confTown), and then pull a 180 and throw her under the buss......so I don't know why THAT is the point that Merlyn thinks makes me town, unless I have the time line incorrect(which I am going to double check), this progression of Merlyn's read on me doesn't make any sense.

[Doctor Drew]

or maybe i misunderstood drew's last post

It wasn't super clear.

I meant why would I trust Alianna, the watch Alianna not hammer(which as you said makes her basically confTown), and then pull a 180 and throw her under the buss......so I don't know why THAT is the point that Merlyn thinks makes me town, unless I have the time line incorrect(which I am going to double check), this progression of Merlyn's read on me doesn't make any sense.

Ok lol, I was afraid of that. I misremembered when Merlyn brought up a possible Patch/Alianna associative, for some reason I thought it was after I trusted Alianna.

Well, that makes me feel a bit better about Merlyn then, and slightly worse about Yess.

[Doctor Drew]

Well I kinda feel good-ish about everyone not named Nuke or Yess to trust fall.

Could have one of Ali/Me trust fall with one of Sky/Merlyn

[Doctor Drew]

Hmm, we could chance it and have you and sky trust each other. If you both are town then Ali and I trust fall next, and assuming she isn't pulling a fast one, we ride off in the sunset with a town victory.

[Doctor Drew]

i just wanna settle this question real quick

I trust drew

The pressure lol

I do feel like I am going to overthink everyone besides Alianna

[Doctor Drew]

i just wanna settle this question real quick

I trust drew

The pressure lol

I do feel like I am going to overthink everyone besides Alianna

yay drew is town

This pings me the wrong way from Sky.

I already was trust tested(which I know isn't a 100% town confirmation). But why when I don't trust back, especially when I was just talking about doing a trust fall with someone, are you treating it like another test?

I actually think you are scum and wanted me to trust back.

[Doctor Drew]

i was treating like a test beforehand too ("i just wanna settle this question real quick")

i think the jump from 95% town to 100% town was good to clear up just for my own brain because it wouldn't be great to put in effort over a forgone conclusion

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I do agree that something needs to happen, I feel everyone will lose interest.

[Doctor Drew]

YOLO

I trust Nuke

[Doctor Drew]

gg i can't stop rolling for scum lmao

As your Benevolent Mayor, I forgive you lol.

I almost did pull the trigger and trust Sky, but than Nuke came and obv towned it up, so felt like the right move.

Fun game though, tough trying to actually trust someone though lol.