Open 909 | A Newbie Game | Game Over

[KayJayQueue]

Reading back it was primarly kay's interaction with ydra that pinged me

Meh

[skitter30]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

Ok, how are you reading them?

[ketchup777]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

Ok, how are you reading them?

Kay top town, Jackson+Flush townleans

[KayJayQueue]

Zach, Purple - thoughts on the last few pages?

I know you both had reasons for inactivity so this is just more of gentle push for any reads you guys might have gleaned.

[ketchup777]

VOTE: No elimination

if I do this with no context who will hop on

[DragonEater70]

VOTE: Jackson

Finally, a wagon.

[ketchup777]

VOTE: DragonEater70

Finally, a dragon.

[DragonEater70]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

it kinda feels to me like you have arbitrarily decided to scumread certain people and townread others and that you have dug up your heels into the ground with regards to your reads and are not willing to reconsider. Respectfully, I'd advise that if you want to become a better player, you should consider reconsidering.

[DragonEater70]

VOTE: DragonEater70

Finally, a dragon.

M8 you were already voting me

[skitter30]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

Ok, how are you reading them?

Kay top town, Jackson+Flush townleans

Can you talk a little more abt these, particularly jackson?

Also I didn't realize you were voting Dragon, I think he's town - can you talk abt why yoy're voting him?

[KayJayQueue]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

it kinda feels to me like you have arbitrarily decided to scumread certain people and townread others and that you have dug up your heels into the ground with regards to your reads and are not willing to reconsider. Respectfully, I'd advise that if you want to become a better player, you should consider reconsidering.

It seems like you disagree with his reads and are telling him he’s wrong. I don’t think it has anything to do with him being a good player or not. This post definitely feels condescend-y. How do you know he’s not willing to reconsider his reads? To assume you know better than anyone else right now is very odd to me. And to tell him that he needs to basically change his reads to be a better player is kind of ridiculous.

[skitter30]

I think it was more meant in a ' hey, maybe it's time to reconsider some of your reads', but it could have maybe been said a little better

I think a lot of what dragon is getting voted for rn is more of a playstyle thing than him actually being scummy

[KayJayQueue]

I think it was more meant in a ' hey, maybe it's time to reconsider some of your reads', but it could have maybe been said a little better

I think a lot of what dragon is getting voted for rn is more of a playstyle thing than him actually being scummy

It’s weird to push someone to reconsider reads they just came out with in the last page. I also don’t think he is blindly following anything here because he’s pushed back and asked us all questions about why we’re doing certain things. This reads way more like dragon not agreeing with reads and trying to use his experience to tell someone to change their mind which for a newbie game, I’d say is kinda not cool. You can’t just disagree with someone and tell them if they want to be better at the game, they should play the way you want them to play.

I can’t comment on why dragon is being voted, I have no idea what’s behind those votes.

[skitter30]

I think ketchup's been on dragon for a while, and he's kinda annoyed abt it so trying to get him to reassess/reconsider his reads in general

But yeah like i said could maybe be said a little better

[DragonEater70]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

it kinda feels to me like you have arbitrarily decided to scumread certain people and townread others and that you have dug up your heels into the ground with regards to your reads and are not willing to reconsider. Respectfully, I'd advise that if you want to become a better player, you should consider reconsidering.

It seems like you disagree with his reads and are telling him he’s wrong. I don’t think it has anything to do with him being a good player or not. This post definitely feels condescend-y. How do you know he’s not willing to reconsider his reads? To assume you know better than anyone else right now is very odd to me. And to tell him that he needs to basically change his reads to be a better player is kind of ridiculous.

No, I am not just disagreeing with his reads. I am disagreeing with his approach to the game. I have provided reasons for why his read was wrong, and he has dismissed them. Prior to that he basically made fun of my frustration with his approach to reading me and the game, an approach that in a world where I am town (which happens to be this world) is completely unconstructive. My complaint is not that he disagrees with me but that he has completely dismissed any worldview different than his own, and for no good reason at that.

Is calling it out condescending to him? Maybe a bit. But I also happen to know that I am town and that his play isn't helping him, or any other player on the side of town, to solve the game. So even if it's a bit condescending, yes I'm going to call him out. I am not asking him to change his reads to be a better player, I am asking him to change him approach to be a better player.

[KayJayQueue]

So this is just about his read on you? The way it was framed you seemed to also be admonishing his townreads as well but I didn’t see you give reasoning why those were “wrong”. I guess that’s where my frustration was, mostly. But also, yeah, I didn’t love the condescension towards a newer player (not as new as the rest of us, but still) just because he isn’t townreading you the way you think you deserve. (I’ve been in that position and it’s not fun at all)

[DragonEater70]

Okay let me put this differently:

If Ketchup777 is a scumhunting god and has caught scum (me), then he should not be sitting twiddling his thumbs while nothing is happening and instead should be writing cases convincing people to vote me. If he is NOT a scumhunting god then I think he should be showing more willingness to consider the possibility he is wrong.

As he is not doing either of these things, I'm calling out his play as bad.

[DragonEater70]

So this is just about his read on you? The way it was framed you seemed to also be admonishing his townreads as well but I didn’t see you give reasoning why those were “wrong”. I guess that’s where my frustration was, mostly. But also, yeah, I didn’t love the condescension towards a newer player (not as new as the rest of us, but still) just because he isn’t townreading you the way you think you deserve. (I’ve been in that position and it’s not fun at all)

No, it's not just the read on me. I gave it as an example.

[KayJayQueue]

So this is just about his read on you? The way it was framed you seemed to also be admonishing his townreads as well but I didn’t see you give reasoning why those were “wrong”. I guess that’s where my frustration was, mostly. But also, yeah, I didn’t love the condescension towards a newer player (not as new as the rest of us, but still) just because he isn’t townreading you the way you think you deserve. (I’ve been in that position and it’s not fun at all)

No, it's not just the read on me. I gave it as an example.

Okay, so make a case as to why his town reads are wrong.

[skitter30]

Dragon I also don't know if that's his playstyle tbh, I don't think he's abt to be writing lengthy cases on anyone

[skitter30]

Dragon what do u think of jackson?

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: No elimination

if I do this with no context who will hop on

Hell nahhh

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Jackson

Finally, a wagon.

Want a cookie?

[JacksonVirgo]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

it kinda feels to me like you have arbitrarily decided to scumread certain people and townread others and that you have dug up your heels into the ground with regards to your reads and are not willing to reconsider. Respectfully, I'd advise that if you want to become a better player, you should consider reconsidering.

Jesus Christ, is the condescending behaviour contagious?

[JacksonVirgo]

i don't agree with any of your bottom 3 but ok

it kinda feels to me like you have arbitrarily decided to scumread certain people and townread others and that you have dug up your heels into the ground with regards to your reads and are not willing to reconsider. Respectfully, I'd advise that if you want to become a better player, you should consider reconsidering.

It seems like you disagree with his reads and are telling him he’s wrong. I don’t think it has anything to do with him being a good player or not. This post definitely feels condescend-y. How do you know he’s not willing to reconsider his reads? To assume you know better than anyone else right now is very odd to me. And to tell him that he needs to basically change his reads to be a better player is kind of ridiculous.

No, I am not just disagreeing with his reads. I am disagreeing with his approach to the game. I have provided reasons for why his read was wrong, and he has dismissed them. Prior to that he basically made fun of my frustration with his approach to reading me and the game, an approach that in a world where I am town (which happens to be this world) is completely unconstructive. My complaint is not that he disagrees with me but that he has completely dismissed any worldview different than his own, and for no good reason at that.

Is calling it out condescending to him? Maybe a bit. But I also happen to know that I am town and that his play isn't helping him, or any other player on the side of town, to solve the game. So even if it's a bit condescending, yes I'm going to call him out. I am not asking him to change his reads to be a better player, I am asking him to change him approach to be a better player.

As a friend, I think you need to soften up. This entire game you’ve felt like you had a stick up your ass, it’s not even anything ketchup is doing wrong. He’s playing the game, the way he wants to play it. Why are you not assuming this might be coming from a wolf? You did this with me as well. It seems your base assumption is that people are town, and all behaviour that you feel is wrong is still coming from town.