Open 510: DUCK DUCK GOOSE- SCUM WIN!!

[Generic]

First post!

[Generic]

Sorry for the comment, in over two years of mafia games that is a tally the first time I've had first post in a game :p

All to do with the opening times of games, being English I'm normally in bed when a game opens...

Anyway,

vote treble

because the accounts making up the hydra aren't listed... That's scummy.

[Generic]

Since I'm fairly new to site it won't actually make any difference because there are very few players here I have an impression of to allow for any form of meta read, I just found it odd that we have three hydras in game and treble is the only one without the users behind it listed.

I didn't know you could look up hydras, is there a database on here?

unvote, vote mutley

O. M. G. U. S....

[Generic]

unvote, vote Sakura hana

I don't know you

[Generic]

So that's four docs. Starting to feel like an ER around here...

[Generic]

Hello. This is a hydra of Rob13 and Maestro. I'll attempt to remember to sign posts but may occasionally forget - just ask if you aren't sure who's posting.

Also - are you guys even serious right now? There are a decent amount of players with experience in this game and no one has even remotely attempted to get out of RVS even a little bit.

Sixth Post!

Siv is a better player than this. No RVS vote. No attempt to provoke anyone or prod anyone into giving more info.

Counterclaim doctor

VOTE: IrishPope

Keeps us in RVS. No attempt to make any useful contributions. Again - Siv is better than this. There were multiple things to potentially pressure before this post that he could have taken up and prodded at to see if anything squirmed. Instead, he was totally content to keep us in RVS.

Other offenders on the Doc shiz include Sakura Hana (new to the game, so I doubt this is alignment indicative) and Taskmaster (same). TIP is not someone I'm concerned about "claiming" doctor because he did it first. If anything, it's a decent attempt to get reactions which is a town-tell (although an extremely small one).

But, after all that, I'm gonna place my vote on someone else entirely. Generic is not looking good. His #3 is fine RVS material for a first post of the game - not alignment indicative. His apology for it without anyone calling him out on it in #8 is alignment indicative, though. He's overly concerned with how people are viewing him. That's scum behavior, not town behavior. He then does more-or-less the same thing in #11 where he changes his vote and defends himself pretty hard against someone telling him to do the research if he wants to know the heads in their hydra - which isn't even an accusation of anything. Overly defensive, throwing votes around left-and-right with no attempt to find scum, commented on the doc business with no analysis, etc. - all of them point to either complete noob-town or scum. He claims two years of experience playing the game, so I'm going to go with scum. Even on another site without the rigor of play that MS has, he would know better as town if he played for a solid two years.

Vote: Generic

This, if not obvious, is a serious vote.

~Rob

That's a hell of a reach for something of any worth notmara.

I stand by my 2nd post in game, I was pleased to finally steal first post of the game. My 2nd vote was RVS, and so was my 3rd.
And you wanted me to analyse 4 claims of doc in RVS?

Come back when you have an actual case. The more interesting reaction though was hana. Blindly follows you weak case before questioning me on something that happened at the start of the game involving an RVS vote I made.
It doesn't matter hana, that was my point when I mentioned not really having meta as an option.

And both of you cling to this comment of it being odd behaviour from me. Please do elaborate how it's odd play for me. What's usual for me?

[Generic]

Sigh.

Ok hana, lets start over, cos you aren't listening or you are just slow...

Since I'm fairly new to site it won't actually make any difference because there are very few players here I have an impression of to allow for any form of meta read, I just found it odd that we have three hydras in game and treble is the only one without the users behind it listed.

I didn't know you could look up hydras, is there a database on here?

unvote, vote mutley

O. M. G. U. S....

Ok, lets go through it step by step for you...

New to site, won't make a difference if I know the usernames or not.

This means I don't actually care and just found it odd their identities are hidden.

Meta doesn't matter to me.

Meta has nothing to do with it, just curiosity at hidden info.

Sinking in yet?

[Generic]

It's odd for anyone to defend themselves against an accusation that no one made. It's indicative of being overly concerned with your appearance to others - something that is generally exhibited only by scum or noob-town. The fact that you're talking about the game in a rather sophisticated manner (especially in the line of defense involving my lack of established meta on you) and claim a lot of experience makes me think you're not noob-town. From there, I connected the dots.

And is it reaching? Yes. This is page 2. It's the best lead I have at the moment. I think it's a pretty good one, though.

~Rob

It was figure of speech apologetic, that's the most you can call it. Maybe I am too British for your tastes, but to try and build a case on it is a reach.

Your logic was only n00b or scum would apologise without provocation due to self image. Why would n00b town be hung up on image? Only type who get caught in that are n00b scum. So you insult me sir to not only wrongly accuse me as scum, but n00b scum at that.

You said it yourself, I'm not new to mafia, so why would I get hung up in self image? As town or mafia what the hell is my motivation?

Your whole case hinges on the assumption that experienced scum would openly show self image awareness on their 2nd post? Are your experienced a I'm players on mafiascum that transparent?

Like I said, weak case. You feel free to pursue it, I will be interested to see your reads going forwards from here.

[Generic]

a I'm = scum

Typing on an iPhone, so apologies for lapses in grammar.

[Generic]

oh wow i just realized, you're still fence sitting on my vote from the RVS, are you out of RVS yet

P-Edit: did you just use WIFOM ._.

Oh no hana, I'm not fence sitting on it. While notmara is trying to make something of nothing, you are riding his coat tails... Badly I might add. You have tried to add to it and messed up, so went back to 'what he said'.

So my vote stays where it is for the time being. Why are you so worried about a single vote on you anyway?

[Generic]

And on the wifom, notmara is building a case on a single assumption that only scum or new town are obvious in self image awareness. That simply ain't true on any level. That's making the analysis fit the desired conclusion.

Pedit, and I did say something on the 'apology'. Figure of speech, and I usually like to lead into a game with more than screaming 'first post' so it was simply recognition of the giddiness.
To me it's something of nothing, but if you guys really want to insult my intelligence over it carry on getting bogged down with the insincere apologetic opening to my 2nd post (which was more in line with my intended opening until I realised I was first in on the thread)

[Generic]

Defenders single comment on it prior to my response without a vote attached or a follow up attempt to build a case on me?

Yeah, that's the same as you hana...

[Generic]

Are you be deliberately dense or is sarcasm alien to you?

You opportunistically jumped on my wagon based solely on a weak case before I had even responded. You tried to add to it yourself but much like now failed to read what was written and came up with a total misinterpretation. You then when your addition fell apart reverted to 'oh, err, what he said then'.
You continue to either misinterpret or misrepresent me and then began to try and force me to unvote you by making that somehow scummy, and when all that failed you tried to throw someone else into the cross fire.

No, my vote is good where it is right now.

[Generic]

*are you being...

[Generic]

Why vote you instead of who?
I gave my reason for voting you. I said notmara has tried to make a case against me out of nothing but at least it was his case, all you did was you leapt onto opportunistically without waiting on my response. Or do you mean the other guy, who just said they agreed with the comments made but did nothing else with it at that point?

Mafia rarely try to build a case from very little because they risk it being torn apart and they are then in focus, or if it somehow gets run up and there is a mislynch from it the person who pushed the case is first to be scrutinised. Most of the time mafia tag on to the cases of others with minimal persuasion needed... Sound familiar?


You seem really reactive to a single vote on you, and from a person you claim to think I'd scum anyway so why are you so antagonised by it?

[Generic]

Think I'd scum = think is scum

[Generic]

Dare I ask why Nara is pretending to be a seagull from finding memo?

[Generic]

*nemo

[Generic]

Nvm... I see now.

[Generic]

Mara... You need to put my three votes together.

~Votes on Treble and Mutley are noted, though unvotes are not recorded in the vote counts, and thus those votes will not show up on there

[Generic]

Your arguement against me never stood at all, let alone on its own notmara.

You basically said I was worried about self image, which is your interpretation of my 2nd post, and then said only new town and mafia would do that. So immediately you are placing only two scenarios I could possibly be based on your interpretation of a single line in a single post and already armed with information I freely offered up. You then accuse my vote on hana of bring OMGUS which is a cheap tactic and defence of the same person who leapt blindly onto the wagon you started. I gave my reasons for the vote REMAINING on hana after she made a big deal that I was still voting for her.

You feel that Hanas play in jumping on a vote immediately after you did, misrep me with a follow up arguement before backing down and simply going 'well what rob said then' and making a big deal of my vote not bring taken off her from RVS and then try to throw someone else in the way of the arguement to a kid being the focus was perfectly fine then?

[Generic]

I was in RVS, maybe I missed something but isn't the point if RVS to have fun?

And how can I be concerned with self image one minute and then tossing votes around with reckless abandon the next? I'm either carefully ensuring I don't look bad or I'm wildly pissing about and not caring.., it can't be both.

And the doc business is pathetic. The setup is one shot PGOs, no docs. Are you seriously wanting me to analyse 4 people claiming a role that has already been established by the mod as not even in the game?

This isn't a weak case... This is no case at all. I was giving notmara a little credit by focusing on the only part if that case that had even the slightest bit of something realistic about it, a misinterpretation of my figure of speech.

[Generic]

oh wow i just realized, you're still fence sitting on my vote from the RVS, are you out of RVS yet

P-Edit: did you just use WIFOM ._.

And hana, that's reaction to the vote being on you, you try to spin the fact it was still on you as tactical when I was busy arguing against the poor case against me. You were more concerned the vote was there than my reasons for it.

[Generic]

Because you were reminding me where my vote was in the hope I would remove it.

[Generic]

Hey voodoo lady, I notice you completely ignored my response to the rest if the 'case' against me, shall I assume you realised it was actually not a case?

I believe if you look at the time stamp there is 2 minutes between post 7 and 8. I am working from a phone, posting while at work. I was responding in #8 to something before mutleys post, then returned to it in #11. Again, trying to build something from nothing.

And notmara, you are about to tell me that I am not skilled in posting correctly in RVS I take it. Mafiascum players seem to think they are the cream of the crop, yet you apparently according to you, hana and voodoo have a case against me consisting of misinterpretation of a figure of speech, self awareness of self image but also reckless abandon, and not commenting on 4 doctor claims in a game with no do for role... You guys are the BEST at this, no doubt.


Led it: ninja'd. But I don't always read the additional posts, especially if I'm busy and want to get my point down in between stuff...

[Generic]

Do for role = doctor role

[Generic]

on 4 doctor claims in a game with no do for role...

You ever heard of joking? i've played with syv and TIP before so i felt like following them up on their game, TaskMaster is also an hydra of 2 people i know so my guess is that they also were continuing the joke. I was perfectly aware about there being no docs on the setup, so i realized from the start they were just joking around.

Makes me wonder if you're just trying to find reasons to suspect me or are you gonna ever ask me questions to determine my alignment.

Ok, now I know you are doing this deliberately. You CANNOT be as stupid as you are coming across.

Read both notmaras original post THAT YOU ENDORSED, and voodoo lady's recently. Both poke at me as suspicious for not analysing 4 doctor claims.... That was the basis of a reason why I'm scum, be ause I joked about the 4 doctor claims rather than do so e indepth analysis about it...

Now stay with me hana, we are almost here...

This game has no doctors. None at all. It's in the setup. WHY would I need to analyse the claims?

Are you getting it now hana?

[Generic]

This is a piss take it really is.

I'm going to appeal to ANYONE else in this game, is there another language I need to put it in that hana will understand? German, French, Spanish?

Hello. This is a hydra of Rob13 and Maestro. I'll attempt to remember to sign posts but may occasionally forget - just ask if you aren't sure who's posting.

Also - are you guys even serious right now? There are a decent amount of players with experience in this game and no one has even remotely attempted to get out of RVS even a little bit.

Sixth Post!

Siv is a better player than this. No RVS vote. No attempt to provoke anyone or prod anyone into giving more info.

Counterclaim doctor

VOTE: IrishPope

Keeps us in RVS. No attempt to make any useful contributions. Again - Siv is better than this. There were multiple things to potentially pressure before this post that he could have taken up and prodded at to see if anything squirmed. Instead, he was totally content to keep us in RVS.

Other offenders on the Doc shiz include Sakura Hana (new to the game, so I doubt this is alignment indicative) and Taskmaster (same). TIP is not someone I'm concerned about "claiming" doctor because he did it first. If anything, it's a decent attempt to get reactions which is a town-tell (although an extremely small one).

But, after all that, I'm gonna place my vote on someone else entirely. Generic is not looking good. His #3 is fine RVS material for a first post of the game - not alignment indicative. His apology for it without anyone calling him out on it in #8 is alignment indicative, though. He's overly concerned with how people are viewing him. That's scum behavior, not town behavior. He then does more-or-less the same thing in #11 where he changes his vote and defends himself pretty hard against someone telling him to do the research if he wants to know the heads in their hydra - which isn't even an accusation of anything. Overly defensive, throwing votes around left-and-right with no attempt to find scum,

commented on the doc business with no analysis, etc.

- all of them point to either complete noob-town or scum. He claims two years of experience playing the game, so I'm going to go with scum. Even on another site without the rigor of play that MS has, he would know better as town if he played for a solid two years.

Vote: Generic

This, if not obvious, is a serious vote.

~Rob

This is part of the case against me. That I didn't analyse a fucking set of obvious jokes about being a role NOT in the fucking game.

Nothing to do with any of you who claimed doc AT ALL.

I'm going now, because this is a fucking wind up and I'm too tired to bother anymore

[Generic]

Siveure, I was in RVS still in my mind, and after the 4th person claimed doc (flogging that joke to beyond life support) I made the ER joke.
Why would it warrant analysis when I knew all the claims were jokes? And why am I the one having it wielded as an accusation against me when 3 people copied the joke of TIP rather than analyse the others they lazily copied.

At least I took the unfunny joke in an unfunny new tangent.

[Generic]

And treble is leaning scum why hana?

[Generic]

But hana you have tip as null when his entire contribution to the game has been a doc claim, an introduction, drum noise, congratulating notmara on a town tell from him, calling defender a wizard, returning to notmara with displeasure at being considered null when he displayed a 'towntell', despair at 'not being a doc', pissing about with the mod and then pointing out you have half the games posts.

So that's disengagement with any other player in the game during RVS, self image awareness when his town tell doesn't make him a town read to someone, more disengagement with all ongoing events outside RVS, then an irrelevant point about the game.

And that's a null read to you over treble and myself?

unvote, vote the Irish pope

Time to get involved tip.

[Generic]

Ninja'd in a post where tip also doesn't want to participate... Add that to the list so far for him.

[Generic]

Did you or did you not say that it was nothing to do with the vote but the reasons why that you took issue?

My vote is a pressure vote to stop a player who is clearly avoiding engaging with anyone or any issue and for e him to engage me.
Strange how you now change your mind on tip when someo e else mentions him not doing anything.

[Generic]

Not really a useless vote when I stand by it and intend to keep pointing it out until tip actually does something of value.

It's all well and good three of you attacking me on nothing point while you allow several players to sit back and do fuck all.

I will just go silent and leave you all to it, rather than actively engage in the game, because any enjoyment for it early on left when hana decided to play stupid on everything I wrote making have to repeat every fucking point three times.

But you carry on building nothing out of nothing, so much more productive than calling out those thinking they can hide away until day end.

[Generic]

Saying the intention behind it made no difference. Hana had tip as null until he/she realised the hypocrisy of having treble as leaning d I'm for much less, my intentions have further highlighted tip not being willing to involve himself. That's not pro town in the slightest.

[Generic]

Saying the intention behind it made no difference. Hana had tip as null until he/she realised the hypocrisy of having treble as leaning d I'm for much less, my intentions have further highlighted tip not being willing to involve himself. That's not pro town in the slightest.

That was before i read #107 I flipped him from null to FoS at that post, just because you managed to ninja me doesn't mean i flipped because of you calling me on it.

Nothing to do with me. You changed your mind when defender pointed out tips unusual behaviour.

Covering your arse as an afterthought doesn't change the fact your reads are either motivated by a tactic or simply lazily thrown together. Either makes them unreliable.

[Generic]

Vote Count 1.1

Voting:

Generic (1)

: Mutleyddmc

TheIrishPope (3)

: Siverure DtTrikyp, TaskMaster, Generic

Sakura Hana(1)

: Treble

Generic (1)

: Sakura Hana

Not voting

:Voodoo Lady, Sound of Silence, Karnage, TheIrishPope, D3f3nd3r, NotMara,

Deadline is 7/24/2013 4:30 GMT (That's (expired on 2013-07-24 08:30:00))

mara, you have two wagons there for me. Put them together please. I should have three votes on me.

~

My VC's are perfectly perfect fixed

[Generic]

Two actually, forgot notmara unvoted...

[Generic]

So I'm being voted for for over defensiveness now? Two people attacking me with points I have disputed. Defender I think it was said I was unsuccessful in defending them, can I ask them which were the valid points?

The self awareness of image coupled with no consideration for image by scattered voting?

Or was it not analysing 4 people claiming a role that's not in the game?

And I'm fighting my corner against three people, because notmara presented the weak case, and hana and voodoo lady were opportunistically trying to push on it. Neither brought anything extra to the table.


As for scum hunting, I am voting tip, was voting hana and both had reasons attached that were my own. Hana has been doing more scum hunting by riding notmaras coat tails, changing her opinion of tip based on defenders comments, and called treble scummy for fluffiness.

Wow, scumhunting here is different to what I'm used to, I put independent thought into mine, guess I shouldn't other.

I haven't got a chance of defending myself because a few of you are setting boundaries to stop me. Can't fight my corner cos I'm being over defensive, the only thing people are apparently voting for me on. When should I defend myself then? I had three votes on me, that's now 4 (possibly 5 when notmara jumps back on).

Do very on with lynching me, at least there will be my wagon to analyse day 2 and those who boxed me in so I can't even defend myself.

Good luck.

[Generic]

Oh and taskmaster, you really think the only way mislynches occur is when mafia start them? Nothing to do with them knowing who the mafia is so joining and supporting wagons they know are on town players then?

Mafiascum have a very odd way of looking at games

[Generic]

This head is just catching up. A lot of useless shit came from the last 5 pages

For instance:
- Generic overreacting to the obvious joke doctor claims
- Generic changing RVS votes (Notw: he claims that its OMGUS, but muttley voted him even before his first vote)
- Treble doing the same with the second RVS OMGUS
- Generic changing again. Seriously, we do not need 3 RVS votes
- Generic being defensive as hell for one post made by NotMara
- TIP doing absolutely nothing but stalling
- Treble's 'go team'

This makes the whole thread a huge headache to read. Theres lots of unnecessary shit here.

Aside from that
- Why is defender defending all the doctor claims? And defending Generic after VoodooLady accused him of the weird OMGUS
- Why is Sakura OMGUS-ing everyone who suspects her?
- Rob, why is Generic looking better? IMO he looks a lot worse
- Generic's vote on Sakura was pretty much OMGUS on the WEAKER target. Generic made a case on him. Sakura agreed. Generic then tunnels on Sakura but rarely focuses on NotMara.
-

BTW Generic's "Mafia dont bother making cases" is a lot of crap. If they dont make cases, they cant get mislynches.

Simple as that. It seems like youre trying to make us think you're making cases, so you can't be mafia
- TIP is literally doing nothing this game
- SOS, why is TIP town for an RVS joke that literally anyone can make?
- Pope's 128 was bad. Now thats a shit vote
- Muttley also hasn't caught up and decided to comment on the ducks. And not give reasons for why both are scum. Are they bussing, muttley?


People I like: NotMara, VoodooLady
People who deserve votes: Generic, Muttley, TIP
So the vote was already on TIP, but I like a Generic vote better

VOTE: Generic

- Ironman

If they don't make cases, they can't get mislynches... Your exact words. So I pointed out mafia have other methods so they aren't even in focus when the shit hits the fan.

And is there more of you who don't read? I NEVER brought up the thing about the doc jokes. Notmara and then voodoo lady both claimed as part of a case against me that I had joked about the doc claims but not ANALYSED it??? I mentioned this 4 times, yet every time people respond back like its me making a big deal about it, I'm defending a spurious point, one of many.

I'm accused of over defensiveness and defeatism, too ducking right I am now. I've been worn down, frustrated like you wouldn't ducking believe at having to re dxain every single point because people like hana and taskmaster are either misinterpreting or misrepresenting me.

So take the easy lynch, I've had enough for today. I have to repeat myself and I'm accused over over defending, it's bullshit.

[Generic]

unvote

Lets have a vote count mara so the rest know how many vote they need to toss out to finish the day.

[Generic]

Ignore me, just seen it.

[Generic]

He can be carefree about it though, people are seeing a wagon over halfway and going for the easy option. Why bother checking if there was any case behind it, just vote.

Depressing looking in on this game, will have to do what the rest do and lurk or avoid posting anything on topic. Cos it's n00bish otherwise...

[Generic]

Hate to interrupt your bandwagoning, but Taskmaster's scum.

Take a gander at 156-- the second and third bullet points in particular.

2) I think the case against Generic is crap, but I'm not dismissing he can be scum.

This seems alright at first glance. He disagrees with the points NotMara and co. brought up, but he still thinks Generic is scummy for different reasons.

The problem with this point is-- beyond the passive-aggression of voting for someone then saying that you're "not dismissing he can be scum"-- the terrible attempt to distance himself from NotMara's argument. Which is plain outright ridiculous because in 149, he brought up practically all of the points NotMara made against Generic in his first post. Let's go over those, shall we?

• 1) NotMara calls out Generic for being overly defensive. Taskmaster criticizes Generic for being "defensive as hell for one post made by NotMara" in 149, and later claims that "being defensive clearly indicates you have something to hide" in 155 to solidify his read.
  2) NotMara calls out Generic for tossing around his vote willy-nilly during RVS. Taskmaster complains about Generic's vote changing-- "Seriously, we do not need 3 RVS votes."
  3) NotMara calls out Generic for his reaction to the fake doc claims. Taskmaster calls out Generic's reaction to the fake doc claims.

These were the three tenets of NotMara's case, and Taskmaster's problems with Generic's actions fall in line with that. His desire to distance himself from the other cases against Generic strikes me as a conscious attempt to avoid being accused of bandwagoning.

The icing on the cake is his most recent post, 236.

VOTE: Sakura

TERRIBLE response. Looks like scum who knows they're in trouble and buddies someone who presents a legitimate case.

3) I think Sakura is town.

People who deserve votes: Generic, Muttley, TIP

Huh? You had Sakura as a townread before, then suddenly do a 180 with all of one line of justification? You had three other people you thought deserved posts earlier, but all of them seem to have dropped off your lists for some reason. I wonder why? Oh right-- they don't have major wagons forming on them right now.

Taskmaster is being blatantly opportunistic and deserves much, much more scrutiny.

VOTE: Taskmaster

I misjudged you earlier in the game voodoo lady when I thought you were joining the push on me over nothing. But this is a very good case, and as always the right to reply is important.
Some excellent points made, let's see what taskmasters defense to this will be.

You wanna tango? Bring it on.

Ok, acknowledges there is a case against them, must be a marker post to give a strong comeback.

First 2 quotes were me, last was the other head. We don't agree on everything, but we do agree your case is bad and should feel bad.

l0l

So a hydra hiding behind multiplayer setup to excuse all inconsistencies in their comments. That's the whole defense.
This is why I don't like the idea of hydras, but at least some of them make it clear when they are the different users talking.

Not at all convinced you have a defense for that case, and earlier you pulled a similar trick to Hana in misrepresenting me to further push my buttons.

vote taskmaster

[Generic]

Only one game in the last dozen or so I have played have I not had a day 1 where I'm accused of being scum. Not sure what it is but I start badly and grow into games.

[Generic]

You do realize that the posts where I agree with NotMara was mine and the one where we say Generic's case was bad was notscience's right? I voted for Generic cause I thought he was being scummy. I guess science was at fault for not fucking signing but your case is pretty opportunistic, considering its pretty obvious that it was hydra dissonance.

Also, do you not agree that the turn around was scummy? I know i said I had people I want to lynch, but do you not consider that thing by Sakura as scummy? When i saw that, i was gonna vote for her. So apparently, because we had voted out of the range I previously listed, it means we're scum, right? Because people can't change their minds, right? /sarcasm

BTW Generic's vote was opportunistic as fuck. "I thought you were bad over pushing me, but now Im totally buddying you, Voodoo!"

Taskmaster, you just used my voting for hana instead of notmara against me as picking on a weaker target when I had already pointed out her vote was opportunistic.
And look, you tell me my vote is opportunistic, hypocricisy. Guess I'm the weaker target out of me and voodoo.

And yes I change my opinion of voodoo lady, she explained where I had misinterpreted her post to me. It's called misjudgement, are you incapable of changing your opinion based on later explanations?
I read her pointing to other parts of the weak case against me as her joining in and pointing out things I hadn't answered. She just explained that in fact she was helping me debunk a weak case.

Her case on you though I thought had merit, a case you still haven't bothered to defend against beyond hiding behind a difference of opinion in the hydra.

[Generic]

Other head here. Generic, thats bullshit.

1. I dont know where you're the weaker target off you and voodoo when a) we havent voted either of you and b) we attacked voodoo's case. Even more. Why. So. Defensive?
2. Where havent we attacked the case? Are you misrepping us on purpose??

Oh I see, you are pulling that shit again pretending to be stupid. Do you know how many times you reference me in that post I quoted? I don't see voodoo mentioned, but you then directly attack me calling my vote opportunistic.

If you check my posts, I have a reason for voting hana, the person one of you thinks is s btw, and it was to do with her wheeling notmaras case and the vote was opportunistic.

You are accusing me of this, but you also accused me of being d ummy for my voting for hana... That's hypocrisy. It's one or the other, either my vote on you is bullshit or my vote for her that led to you voting for me is bullshit. Can't be both.

Difference here again is I went on to dispute every single aspect of the case on me, you keep harping back to hydra indecision then trying to divert attention back to me.
So why do defensive? Because you are focusing on me, so I will defend myself.

[Generic]

*one of you thinks is SCUM btw...

[Generic]

And we're you not being a hypocrite then? Or has the hydra heads started writing different halves of the same post now?

You have one user thinking notmaras case is crap, yet you voted for me (fuck knows who made that decision) based on over defensiveness. What was over defensive about being run up to 3 votes off no case, then that growing to 5 when I dared to dispute it frustratedly?

You are hiding behind user indecision, do you not have a provision to discuss the game with each other or is it really blind posting each, one making a decision and the other posting the exact ducking opposite?

Vote, keeping the duckings rather than rewriting them with the F as its on theme then...

[Generic]

Vote = btw

[Generic]

How so hana, it misrepresents me to justify a vote, then it misrepresents me to try and make my vote invalid. And that's null?

[Generic]

Your only case against us is the fact that we are undecided as a hydra, yet we agree swimmingly now. When have we contradicted each other recently? Oh and we are hypocrites. Which doesnt make sense. Explain.

Defensiveness is scummy because you'd rather defend yourself and avoid votes than actually getting votes off you by scum hunting and convincing people youre motivations are protown. If you were town, you wouldnt be so concerned.

Absolute bullshit. You are defending yourself now. Don't argue the case taskmaster, scumhunting to show you are town... See, ducking crap.

I dispute a weak case and defend myself, it's me and its what I do. I also pointed to Hanas scumminess, is that not scum hunting. I pointed out I felt tip was avoiding engaging with the game which I thought was trying to coast. I'm calling you out on hypocricy and at the time I also called voodoo out on what appeared to be opportunism latching on to the nothing case against me and then ignoring my response.

So on e again making the analysis got the conclusion you want. All shit.

[Generic]

To back to voting me taskmaster, I'm done with this shit for today. Do t even know why I bothered to return to this to get involved again, it's the same bullshit arguement put back out there with duck all to it.

My fucking typing is shit, I've had enough

Just get on with it.

[Generic]

You want the answer to the question, read back

The hypocricy is targeting me with suspicion for what you call an opportunistic vote on you... Yet you used my voting for hana as a reason I'm scum, when I clearly stated her vote was opportunistic.
So which is it? Am I the weaker target of me and voodoo you are attacking like you accused me of with hana, or did I have a point about hana and therefore your reason for calling me scum was bullshit?
Hypocricy.

And again, I am not meant to defend myself against the nothing case against me, I must only scumhunting to prove I'm town or else get accused of being over defensive.
But you? You are fine to defend yourself over what you call a weak case... But you aren't being over defensive?

My vote stays where it is, you aren't about proving the case was weak, you are about trying to misrepresent me through it. Scummy.

[Generic]

You accused me of over defensiveness for disputing a nothing case. So you are misrepresenting me there.

You still failed to answer my point about hypocricy. You made a scum point against me for voting hana, yet my reason for voting her was her vote was opportunistic, the same thing you are now accusing me of.

Do how does that not answer the misrepresenting? You are either calling me scummy now for bullshit reasons or you were back originally. You can't be genuine in your reason for both, they contradict each other.

[Generic]

Your only case against us is the fact that we are undecided as a hydra, yet we agree swimmingly now. When have we contradicted each other recently? Oh and we are hypocrites. Which doesnt make sense. Explain.

Defensiveness is scummy because you'd rather defend yourself and avoid votes than actually getting votes off you by scum hunting and convincing people youre motivations are protown.

If you were town, you wouldnt be so concerned.

I disputed a weak case against me. Just like you are claiming to be doing.
I took issue with the person who voted second, just like you.

Exactly the same, yet I was scummy for doing it, you aren't in your opinion.

[Generic]

How is that a misrep? I see youre being over defensive. I see it that way. You not seeing it this way is not equal to misrepresentation. Misrepresentation is me blatantly accusing you of something you didnt do. So in any case, what you are doing is misrepresenting us.

Hypocrisy (spell it right) is NOT a scum tell. By that logic, all townies make logical arguments, right? They never make mistakes, right? By that logic, town always wins, right? So what the fuck is the point of playing. Anyway our reasons for voting for Sakura's defensiveness were in DIFFERENT CONTEXTS. It would be hypocrisy if I said Sakura i scum for jumping you. However, I find Sakura scummy for something entirely different. Now thats a misrep.

Have I not taken issue with the first person who voted as well?

I never said you found her scummy for that reason. I said she was scummy to me for the exact reason you accused me of when I voted for you. Yet you also said my vote on her was unjustified. So that is an hypocrisy (happy now grammar nazi?, people in glass houses...)
And how is it not misrepresenting me? You called me scum for voting for her yet you call me scum under the same logic I voted for her on. Total misrep.

[Generic]

Context is different. Thats what is different. We used them under different context. Why the fuck is that so hard to understand

So that is hypocrisy* Yes Im a total grammar nazi

The context is only different because its you now using it rather than me. And they are different yes, cos my vote was not opportunistic, but you read it that way yet it wasnt an acceptable reason when I voted for hana.
And it seems you knowingly did that as you haven't admitted to indecision causing that hypocrisy, so it was a misrep.

[Generic]

The context was different because you voted Sakura for jumping on a case against you, while not attacking Rob. We voted for Sakura because she said she agrees with someone's case against her. Thats why the context is different. Why is it so hard to understand??
You are acting like TiP in the first ever game I rage quit from. You are useless. Useless as fuck

Says the moron not listening.

I'm not comparing your fucking vote on hana to mine retard. I'm comparing you calling me s um for voting for her based in her opportunistic vote and then calling me scum for what you call an opportunistic vote. The fact you haven't voted for me is worse because you are trying to paint me as a I'm without bothering to make a statement yourself on it. I would have had more respect for your arguement had you voted for me over it, but you are happy to wait and hope the shit you are slinging stick and no doubt will aim to move in later on me. You don't want the accusation of OMGUS.

[Generic]

Every time I go to write something, my spelling and grammar is awful and I have six more posts to review before I can post my comment.

Taskmaster, lets draw the line in the sand here. You have had your day, I have had mine. We don't agree. Vote for me if you think I'm scum, stay with hana if you think she is scummier. But I need to do some work and we have consumed the game with this enough.

[Generic]

Day = say.

Ffs.

[Generic]

Arguements over misreading mainly.

[Generic]

I'm lost now.

Tip is town because he is spamming the game?, seems like an easy tell to hide behind. Tip, can I please have one honest post from you on topic and give us your strongest reads in either camp (town and/or mafia)

[Generic]

I've been saying tip has been coasting on disengaged posts all game, suddenly someone who isn't under fire points it out and he jumps on it with a vote. Jittery as hell there tip, what's the reason for shit suddenly getting serious when you couldn't give a fuck up til now?

[Generic]

I think he has read the game pretty well do far. Notmara has been trying along with voodoo lady to scumhunting with a case attached. Just because notmaras case was weak doesnt mean wasn't trying, and he dropped it when he realised he was wrong.

You and mutley have been the same, pissing about with the jokes rather than participate with scumhunting, why would either of you think meta would make that acceptable? Mutley is more genuine than you cos he seems to shrug and realise if he chooses to play like that he will be considered scummy. I start every game badly for reasons I haven't been able to figure out then improve as I go... Should you all just write off suspicious things you see fos that's how it always goes for me?

That's why I fight the case, not hide behind meta to explain it away.

And I agree with his top scum read cos I'm voting for that player. So nothing wrong with the thoughts he put out there and yet you panicked and voted. Worth noting.

[Generic]

Whenever I write scumhunt it predicts it as scumhunting... I can speak English I promise.

[Generic]

So your own personal little RVS just happened to end when defender had you in the bottom half of his list? And hate not panicking?

[Generic]

I voted for you before he did for reasons that happen to be similar.

I went through his whole list and besides knowing I'm town so higher up that list I can't deny my early play always leaves me stranded in the middle. The whole reason for tips vote on defender is OMGUS.

Your whole reason for leaping to his defence is being butthurt that I am voting for you.

[Generic]

I see you have started signing posts, the plan to hide behind the hydra setup failed miserably for you.

[Generic]

And your case against me is what exactly? Cos earlier in the game I was attacking hana cos she was weak opposition compared to notmara, NOW they are my scumbuddy?

Keep going, you are making the arguement for me.

Pedit: And look, every action I take is scummy, convenient analysis.

I've been arguing with you from my vote on you, and I've been out of the wagon for a long time now.

Is everything you say bullshit or is that just the one head?

[Generic]

You say I called you scum for arguing with me. Please quote my post. Because do far its been a strong of bullshit from you, that being the latest.

You say defenders reads are bad, but your reads are built on lying, so that makes you the scum and him correct in his placing of you. I'm not defending the post, I'm pointing out the suspicious vote from tip, a player uninterested in much beyond the jokes until he is considered scum and he throws out that vote.
Your heavy defence of him is fine though and not at all either chainsawing?

And cockiness how? Two of you like to attack me with absolutely nothing, I notice you completely ignored the point about hana because you have no answer, instead trying to attack my attitude through text rather than my content.

You are running out of ideas to try and sell your crap.

[Generic]

*so far it's been a string of bullshit...

[Generic]

I see you have started signing posts, the plan to hide behind the hydra setup failed miserably for you.

I'm town, and chainsawing or WKing implies I'm scum. But TIP's town, so I'm going to carry on.

Tell me, what is lying? The fact I can make implications makes me a liar? lol, that's cute.

And if that above post doesn't sound cocky as fuck, I don't know what does.

Your sarcasm and condescending comments towards me is more of an example of cockiness.

But the real reason I wuoted that post was to highlight your continual reaffirming of you being town. Do you think if you say it enough you will convince yourself?

And if every arguement you are going to use is 'when you do it it's scummy cos you are scum, when I do it it doesn't count cos I'm town' then I have nothing more I need to say, because that's laughably bad defending.

[Generic]

You are giving a player a pass because he always disengages and tries not to actively comment on anyone?

What does you trying to turn every one of my posts into a scumtell have to do with you taking every opportunity to go "but I'm town, so that doesn't count!" ?

[Generic]

Your turning most of what I say into a scumtell and saying what I say is scummy.

He doesnt "get a pass" but im not seeing him as scum based on how ive seen him.

He comments when asked.

And so the pot turns to the kettle and shouts "you're black".

[Generic]

Im not denying I do it. You are too though.

It appears you (as a team) and I are very similar then. And on yhat basis I can't justify still voting for you. If our approaches are he same it means your is actually coming from a town mindset after all.

unvote

[Generic]

I see you have started signing posts, the plan to hide behind the hydra setup failed miserably for you.

This is a terrible discredit. After saying this you have the gall to flip flop on reads and say we arent scum anymore?

You need a vig kill.

DP

Keep arguing with your other head DP, I've got what I need from the exchange.

[Generic]

Very good spot on the point on tip and his reason for unvoting hana.

Question on that though, was he unvoting because he got no traction on the wagon, or because he needed an excuse to move his vote to the more popular wagon?
On my phone do being lazy, was it an unvote or a move of vote I guess is my question.

[Generic]

Had a look back, the unvote came immediately after the vote count.

[Generic]

Cough bullshit cough

Oh hi tip

Ns

DP nailed his/her colours to the flag with a /tip is town' statement, but can I ask NS if they agree with their other head?

You seem as unsold on the excuse as a few of us, given the comment above.

[Generic]

My apologies, that's even more interesting then.

DP, what is your take on TIP up to now?

[Generic]

I don't think taskmaster is mafia due to the amount of hypocrisies and admitted tunnelling. I get where the pair of them is coming from as a mindset now.
I don't believe in that defender wagon either, just because his t/s list lacked paragraphs of detail... Odd logic.

Tip is the one who bothers me most, but the amount of experienced mafiascum players in this immediately writing off his play as 'town tip' gives me reason to hesitate on the vote.
I also misrepresented him when I said he wasn't scumhunting up until he voted for defender, looking at his posts he has pushed other votes and opinions as well as asked questions, but he only speaks in single sentences.
But tip, your excuse for the hana unvote sucks. It literally makes no sense as a plan.

[Generic]

Ok tip, if you or someone else can point me to a case against defender that isn't built on his t/s list I will consider giving intent to hammer.

Cos right now I don't see this case.

[Generic]

I only have distinct reads on 3 or 4 of you, so at this stage in the game I don't think that counts as a scumtell.

[Generic]

Ok after karnage flagged up that post and a reread has been in order.

Taskmaster if you want to control the hammer vote you will at least then be able to dictate when day 1 ends, but far too many people are raising issue with defender for me to ignore I might have read it all wrong.

vote defender

[Generic]

that is L-1 I believe

[Generic]

Sorry to hear that mutley. You giving up on all mafia?

I'm treated like and idiot and attacked as scum every game I play on day 1. I wouldn't let people's arrogance at thinking they know mafia play better than anyone put you off.

[Generic]

Has this game really been reduced to pathetic tricks from people who really haven't earned the right to be so cocky at this stage in play?

Defender, your reaction sucked big time, and if you have been caught out by hana you really need to hang your head in shame.

[Generic]

My opinion of tip depends on how the day pans out. I didn't like his early play at all, but since my vote on him he has been pretty pro town and a driving force in the scum hunting in this latest spell of posting.
I just feel very uneasy at this being so different from his early play which many called his town meta.

Has he smelt blood or has he got serious cos he has found something worth pushing on? I currently believe the latter, hence my current vote.

[Generic]

With day-talk in play, that just earned both D3f and Sakura some major scum points. Still, TIP is my stronger read, so I'm still holding onto hope that people will spare him a second glance.

~Rob

Sorry, can I crank it back there, I missed this latest development. Day talk?

[Generic]

How funny of you mara to notice that, but not notice that we had already talked this over before.

And I started the wagon, so.... yeah, omgus
A reminder to everyone: scum have daytalk in this setup; D3f just asked for help in his QT and responded with this. It made me chuckle

wait what? scum have daytalk? o.o

Why do i always not notice when they do.

yeah i somehow always fail to read sample role PMs this happened also during pyp which is one of my latest finished game.
Dang then maybe im wrong, because scum always sneaks past by when they have day chat.

So unless Generic hasn't been paying attention he should've known scum have daytalk by now. Unless you have a reason for purposefully missing those 2 posts?

How does tip have information like that though?

[Generic]

Ok, as you all know I'm in and out of this game by iPhone. I am in 4 games here and 4 games elsewhere.
When I came back and saw notmara say day talk I wanted clarification because I could only assume he meant this talk in day 1 but the context made no sense.
I looked back to where I last posted as I had stupidly assumed my skimming up to that post would have spotted a reference to whatever notmara was dropping come t on, but there was nothing. So I asked for clarity, and even went to the opening posts from purple to see if she mentioned anything there.

What post did top mention it so I can look back now and see all posts around it for context, because if tip just happens to know that detail why in the hell are we not lynching him over it? Surely only s um would be party to that knowledge, unless the mod referenced it, which I don't understand the logic of either. So can I please be directed to ground zero to see it in context please...

[Generic]

Top = tip

[Generic]

V/LA for personal issues, will update Sunday

[Generic]

Why would scum kill Voodoo? She only made 12 posts, didn't really attack anyone...

Hey Generic, didn't I tell you to ask me what I found suspicious about post 11? Anyway, here you go.

• In post 7, Mutley votes for you.
  In post 8, you vote for Treble because you find it weird that its heads weren't listed.
  In post 11, you vote for Mutley because OMGUS.

I'm finding it weird that you made an OMGUS vote on Mutley in the post

after

the post immediately after Mutley voted you. Wouldn't it be more sensible to make an OMGUS vote on Mutley in post 8?

Oh, would you look at that.

Voodoo lady later clarified she wasn't attacking me, she was helping me debunk a poor case against me. Her main attack was on taskmaster, so essentially my opinion of him was right. He is the last person who would have chose to kill her, way too obvious.

And notmara, if you have t figured out why people are declaring the use if the PGO shot you need to think a little more laterally.

[Generic]

Can we also slow down this tip wagon please. He is at L-1 by my count, someone unvote so mafia do t try and fast lynch him here.

Notmara makes a good point about his actions with the defender wagon. I have major suspicions on him, but hana worries me more. Her sarcasm has a feel of mafia frustration at odd logic in her mind being used to call her scummy. Weak logic finding her out is insulting to her so she reacts angrily... And the wagon on her is nothing compared to tips.

But she does seem to be subtly defending tip, I am going to Iso them both tonight when I get on my laptop.

But hold this wagon up please, I have only just come back into the game and had to skim like hell to see where things are at!

[Generic]

Or winning the game for us.

I laughed at this, bearing in mind he is arguing with hana at this point. At first I read it as him telling her he is winning it for them, as opposed to what I can only assume is the actual meaning unless he has completely lost his mind and s unskilled like a five year old.

Ok, I asked for a slow down in the wagon due to concerns that a quick hammer to avoid more information gathering happening... And since then hana and tip have spam argued.

I agree with mutleys sentiment but I still think this day has a lot to offer.

For example, hana in post 650 answers tips assured comment that two scum were on the defender wagon (two? Why guaranteeing two? Not one or all of them..) with me and treble. Was there a vote on me or treble?
But tip doesn't answer her questions and suddenly (conveniently timed with the growing wagon) votes tip who she was debating the scum options with not long before.

vote Sakura hana

as a show of intent. I am also happy with tip as a suspect, the pairs interactions feel forced at times.

[Generic]

You make no mention of tip yet he got your vote. The reason I call it convenient is your actions are either bussing a teammate or pushing a mislynch.

The reason I suspect you is because you keep happily calling me scum yet no vote for me, tip fails to answer a question or two snd he gets the vote. That's odd behavious given your clear suspicions of me on both this day phase and the last.

[Generic]

Why are you keen to rush the day with hana on self destruct here notmara?

[Generic]

Ok, I will hammer tip if I hear from everyone except for hana and tip that everyone feels there is nothing else to be gained from the day.

Intent to hammer I suppose, but on condition others are happy with a fast day phase.

[Generic]

Task: What do you think of Generic and NotMara wanting to end the day early, and NotMara's double standard logic from D1?

You are a joke hana. Read my posts and tell me where I tried to end the day early? Was it when I asked for the wagon to hold up, or when I asked for someone to unvote to avoid mafia ending it? Maybe it was when I said allowing you to self destruct done more was worth keeping the day going for or when I said I would only hammer if everyone except the two scummiest players in the game agreed it was time?

Go back to analysing the use of the same words as each other, that was less ridiculous than that attempt to mud sling.

[Generic]

Notice she ignored my points. Because her post against me was pure mud slinging.

[Generic]

Notice she ignored my points. Because her post against me was pure mud slinging.

No your post is pure BS.

You literally have no arguement. Scum breakdown in full swing.

[Generic]

I told you the day need not end so fast with hans on a meltdown. Glad I kept pushing and poking her.

There was a connection between tip and hana the previous day as I said at the time, but one more time notmara can we have a bit if time to discuss? It worked for us the previous day did it not?

[Generic]

Notmara has presented an excellent case there, I particularly like the addition to the tip case of him voting to try and make a frustrated town statement only to leap off at intent to hammer.

Add to this tips defence this day consisting of one line responses that don't deconstruct the arguement and instead attempt to hand wave it away.

I still don't want a fast day phase here as there is one more scum to find, but tip isn't handling the pressure at all and there needs to be intent for the day here.

vote theIrishpope

[Generic]

Why am I scum too mutley?

Carry over from the last game I assume. I pushed hana into exposing her scumminess. You have done what in this game exactly besides threaten to quit mafia?

[Generic]

About to go on holiday so reduced activity although not going full v/la ok.

[Generic]

Why Siv mutley?

[Generic]

I assumed that was a gambit to make life harder for mafia... But I could see a bluff. I still think taskmaster is more likely town though, treble has been the one who concerns me more of who is left.

Also, did sound if silence post at all yesterDay?

[Generic]

We are in late game now, so I might as well say.

I assumed two or three were trying to draw the night kill on the first day, saying they had used the PGO when they hadn't and would use it that night. When not targeted they were out if a shot, so you double bluff it then and say you used it that night instead, hoping the mafia have already figured out the gambit and will hesitate to target you the night you actually are vulnerable...

Writing it out actually it seems a bit of a long shot plan so maybe I'm giving too much credit to people around here that they have the gamblers mentality :p

[Generic]

OK, have had a look back on siv, the key things that stoof out:

#10 - Sheeps the doctor claim joke from TIP

#93 - Excuses for lost analysis, then I vague set of comments on people with little commitment to any form of read.

#229 - more light commentary on people without commiting to any sort of read.

#342 - Filler, claiming no scum reads at all even though he has touched on criticism of the posts of others. This post is awful cos he says he doesn't want to post fluff, which is what this post is, wanted to jump on the taskmaster wagon just to have somewhere to start (?), then a comment about trying new meta. A lot of self image awareness present here.

#346 - takes issue with a naked vote from a player he has been slight buddying.
#356 - votes taskmaster with the reason of "whatever, im just going to follow voodoo".

#469 - makes a very odd post about how he couldn't possibly be scum with taskmaster with a logic that makes very little sense even if they were both scum. Makes a comment about how one of his options (having a way of getting off taskmasters wagon at a later point) doesn't fit with how he has been playing up to now (you know, totally uncommitted to any read or vote) and then promptly leaves the taskmaster wagon and votes for defender... so there was an exit strategy then?

#532 - explains he is voting for defender because his reads are all leaning and open to flexibility... yet siv has not commited to a single read yet. Also smoke screens his meta with a comment that this is his scum meta... Kaiser soze, hiding in plain sight.

#643 - the gambit of claiming he used his PGO shot in the night. Is this the gambit I explained above, or is this trying to draw out more people admitting they used theirs? Treble interestingly follows immediately after with the same admittance... both are conveniently still alive at this stage.

#679 - a push on TIP, finally with some reasons behind them. The most telling thing here is this was the last post he made on the day we got Hana. He never once made any push towards her or agreement about her scummy actions, he just disappeared completely.

#836 - Pops back up and is pushing TIP again. No mention of the hana lynch at all, but makes the second claim of the PGO use.

#856 - Posts filler and then claims later it was a prod dodge. But the comment is basically presenting TIP for the lynch again, and why is he concerned about a prod just 12 hours after his last post?

#876 - another awful self image post. wants to link lurking to his town meta. Also makes a snide comment about notmara running the day phase

#878 - WIFOM about notmara being killed in the night? link this to his comment about notmara being in charge and it feels like trying to distance from an intended night action.

#884 - What an awful post this is too. Slef meta again announced, this time claiming he finds an obvtown early in a game and sheeps them... claims this is notmara (buddying) and yet this is neither early game nor has he sheeped notmara at all by my read. He sheeped voodoo, and then spent two day phases attacking TIP as scum... and then in this post he promptly UNVOTES TIP to be scummy??? WTF? And add into that this was an unvote AFTER THE HAMMER, this is such a shitty move I don't even know what else I can say about it.

#890 - "Why is treble ignoring me" - mmaybe distancing themselves from the sinking ship after the ridiculous unvote debacle?
"Why is notmara recommending my lynch only if tip flips scum?" - Just making sure everyone is aware of this before TIP flips town and notmara dies in the night?

#891 - more trying to look scummy comments, trying to Kaiser soze your way out of trouble...

I have read enough, taskmaster had it right and I should have done the read back long ago... being at my laptop does help this a lot though.

vote siveure

[Generic]

Sorry, Mutley has it right, its cos taskmaster has been commenting on that gambit which is what made me ISO siv.

[Generic]

Siv, you claimed to have used it TWICE. How comes its scummy when mutley does it but not you? and even then you fence sit on the comment... sigh.

Why do I have to write you off as town just because you are playing terribly again? You are so conscious of self image and you try to make a big point of blatant scumminess. That's trying to cover your arse on the scum slips you didn't mean.

[Generic]

You are basing the point on no hammer vote mutley?

By that same logic you are also implicated then.

[Generic]

Ok,

Siv - scum, for the reasons stated.

sound of silence - the lurking and filler posts alone give him a scum lean, but he is so uninvolved I cant remember a single read they gave on anyone or a vote they laid.

treble - leaning scum because of previous links to hana and the playing on differences of opinion on eventual mislynches within the hydra. There is also similar to my point against siv a clear buddying to notmara as well as intent to sheep him the day before his death, so both coordinatedly had identified him as the strongest town player.

mutley - leaning town, despite bizarre comments with limited explanation until pushed. I have played in a game with town mutley and his posts do seem to come across as genuine. I have concluded he simply isn't a person who knows how to present a full case or he simply doesn't see any value in it... either way he hasn't posted anything scummy, shown any signs of buddying and has always been clear when he thinks someone is scummy.

taskmaster - leaning town. I have already stated that my early butting of head with him opened my eyes to the point that their thought process is more similar to mine as well as their approach to things than I had first realised. And you can say its a stupid reason to consider someone town over but I can obviously see a town mindset from them as a result.

Basically as I see it now siv you are one of the scum, and then if its one more its between sound of silence or treble.

[Generic]

Your turn mutley and siv, and when the hydras join us they can also present a set of reads too...

[Generic]

confbias? please explain the term as its new to me.

And why ask someone to give their reads if you have no intention of doing the same? That simply reads like someone not wishing to implicate a teammate.

[Generic]

OK, I see what you mean, and unfortunately I think that's mafia in a nutshell. Many players who stick with it are pig headed, because they have found their reads to be right more often they are wrong. But I do know what you mean about how the mindset dictates the read on a post.

I asked for both of you to give reads as you two are the only ones posting. I want everyone to give their reads since we have only 5 other people to analyse each.

[Generic]

Mutley, can you at least summarise briefly WHY you see scum in each person? at least then I can get an idea of if you have spotted anything I missed.

[Generic]

At the risk of self meta-ing I generally play to my mood and not my alignment. I'm borderline autistic, so if I'm in good spirits I'm involved and helpful, sometimes playful. When I'm in a bad frame of mind I'm detached and nasty.

Mutley, im happy to hear why you suspect me but you need to quantify it with specifics. Summarise why I'm scum in this game, like I asked. You claimed everyone is scum so tell me why.

Because right now you are just sitting on the fence, claiming everyone is scum but not any leanings on anyone specific nor what brings you to that conclusion. You voted for div so he stood out most I can only assume, but how is the detached approach helping the games progress?

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Also, who in the treble team has player against me as mafia? It must be on this site, which narrows it down to two games, and clearly wasnt the game mutley was in or your arguement would have focused on that... So I can't comment any further (ongoing game).

But treble at game end will I get to know who is in your hydra?

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Yes you are mutley, because you aren't commuting to any opinions on anyone.

Call the whole remaining player list scummy, where does that get you? After Siv you have the next suspect figured out do you?

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You want to sit on voting for Siv first, I point out you are willing to commit to anything in terms of reads and meanwhile you have commented only one of me and Siv is scum yet you are happy for either if us to be lynched?
Not bothered about the potential mislynch then that could be avoided if you did bother to analyse people?

Threatening me with a vote won't stop me pressing you for answers, if anything it makes me more curious why you reacting do badly to it when you weren't under suspicion.

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And now I begin to understand your reasons, which was all I have been asking for.

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I did wonder if you would jump on any excuse to switch your vote after I accused you of using it as a threat against me, but to switch on nothing at all is awful.

You have gone down in my estimations, you have been evasive dismissive and defensive without any noticeable pressure, and I suspect you were always keen to get off the Siv wagon... Why is the real question.

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Last post was to mutley btw.

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Hand waving it away doesn't make your move any less pitifully weak.

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You present me as scum because you are butthurt about a different game we played in and your perception of Hanas actions rather than mine?

Do you want to actually present a case against me any time soon or just dance around the topic never providing any a tubal content?

I will have to see what it is I said to you or Siv in this day phase that had you suddenly begin to panic mutley, cos the u-turn is very noticeable.

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This seems more scum generic to me. Although I don't know his town game. He is very much like this as scum too, very analyitical etc

Oh well the scum game I was in with him when it got to this stage it was

Nah, you don't use other games to form your opinions do you.

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I care little for other games. The fact you think that is stupid. Would I have first been on siv. I'd have come out for you straight away.
Not panicking?

One of you two is scum. The more I think the more I lean you. I look at logical stuffs. I know sak likes that 1 vs 1 gambit. As scum she would do it to a scum buddy to try and clear one of them. That's bad for you.

two your approach here of wanting people to go back and forth with you feels like what you did to ald is the previous game.

You jumped onto my early siv vote. I find in 6 player mylo. The person voting second is often scum. Waiting for someone else to take the leap so the other buddy can hammer

You base a scum read on my actions in a single previous game, what snother player likes to do, and my voting 2nd in a 6player mylo stage.

My vote on Siv came after I asked you about your vote and then researching his ISO. So where was me leaping on anything? I backed up a vote with a detailed analysis of why, one which the person himself didn't dispute.

So your only direct association to me actually doing anything scummy is a lie anyway. My vote didn't put him in a position of being hammered and unlike your vote I actually had analysis as to why I was voting him. Just cos you went first doesnt make your vote pro town or bullet proof. You could easily be bussing a teammate out the gates to earn town credit but hasn't thought through a legitimate reason to do it.

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Meta can be a great thing sometimes.

I agree, but meta off a single game ISNT meta. Its an isolated example.

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No your main reasons are your opinion of the actions of someone else. So you have no reason that I've done to suspect me, only what a scum player did.

To say that is reaching is an understatement. And I gave you more credit than to be that tenuous, so it concerns me that it's tactical and I misread you.

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I don't think the primary reason to vote for so done being 'this is what player x does meaning player y must be scum' is valid no.

You haven't presented a case against me, just some associative tell where y you claim whenever hana tries to push a 1v1 the other person is always scum. That's not identifying me as scummy.

And also she turned on me that day because I placed focus on her meltdown, which is what got her lynched. She backlashed on me but ultimately lost out, so she didn't initiate anything, I did.

You can vote whoever you like with any bullshit you like to justify it, doesn't make it valid though.

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Vote for so done = vote for someone

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Maybe im too new to this site, but do scum make it obvious they are scum in games around here?

A fast lynch when there is no guarantee they will get a successful kill tonight (they have no idea how many have and haven't used their PGO shot) could mean if Siv were a mislynch one dies tonight and the other from the quick hammer would stand out for the lynch.

But I think the reason the lynch hasn't moved quickly is we have one of the scum in div, and the teammate is either reluctant to hammer while there is uncertainty or as pointed out has already made a vote on Siv toDay

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I think that's what Siv is banking on.

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How many games of mafia have you played Siv? You have fell to pieces in this so I'm curious.

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Siv is just talking now isnt he. Don't kill him cos he hasn't used his shot after saying he had twice and survived the subsequent night both times.
Tells us he is the bad choice for the lynch today AND tomorrow, so happily assumes he will survive the night phase without question.
Claimed he thought accusing me of confbias would dismiss the case I made but realised it has t... But hasn't gone back to dismiss it the old fashioned way (with evidence to the contrary).

why is he not being lynched? What's the town arguement for him?

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I think its siv and treble/sound of silence. Still haven't decided cos treble was better this day phase and sound of silence was worse having finally decided to join us.

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Told you he was scum. And he appears to be distancing from mutley very badly.

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Unfortunately through necessity I have learned how to fight out of a day 1 wagon. I end up in a day 1 wagon 90% of the time no matter what my alignment, and I have no idea why :p

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Yeah thanks for tip, you were a big help to us in this win :p

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One of them is metal sonic, correct?

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That's two now mutley :p

I think I'm going to have to refuse to play in the same games as you now, you will try and get me lynched just to make sure I don't do it three times

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If you legitimately read me as town one day mutley I will add you to the select few who are able to actually read me some of the time.


I do t count scum reading as much as town reading because everyone is accused of scum in game so it's easy to point back at that as having read a person.

You town read me correctly and that's a lot trickier.

Besides, your three reasons werent reads on me. Treble was right (assumed it was metal sonic talking) I have not played this the same as either of my two scum games previous to this, all three have been different by design. But I will take it as a partial point cos you can read what you are specifically wanting to see into anything.

Calling me scum on the grounds of Hanas actions isn't reading me. So that's null.

As for the fast follow vote, it wasnt that fast considering I questioned why you voted so and put in a full reread to div and wrote a case on him inbetween. So again that's a false statement to fit what you were looking for.

And ultimately that's why you wouldn't have got the case to stick I'm afraid. But you are becoming my mafiascum nemesis mutley, I must add you as a friend

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We did discuss it, it's why ffery suggested gif was the star of the night kill choices.

I assumed a major tactical play, gif saw double bluff... Either that or wanted out :p his hydra team went death wishy on me two nights ago and were killing targets with a side hope of death! Won us the game ultimately, cos had I been in lylo with mutley again... He would have made the noise with his own hair and lynched me himself

Pedigree: point taken with hana mutley but its not a read on me was my point. But that doesn't matter when you bag a mafia anyway so I do see what you are saying.

I have played 4 games on mafiascum, and am now out of all four (even ongoing ones) so it's safe for me to point out I have been mafia 3 times out if those 4 only town game I have here is a newbie one, so you have yet to enjoy my town game mutley like so many around here at present.

But I'm on a season of mafia roles, on mtgs the first three roles I got given were two mafia and a neutral! :p
Rest are ongoing games there do I won't be speculating the rest of the numbers

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also on the fast vote, just because it wasn't timely fast. It was gamely fast. In the sense there was little posts inbetween my vote and your vote. Just cos you wrote a case doesn't mean you follow straight onto it in lylo. town would make the case and then say but as there is a vote on him I will wait for coutner arguements

I disagree, required 4 votes to lynch and my vote was number 2 (in more ways than one ) so even as town I think I would have made that vote safe in the knowledge it required two votes to push it through.

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Leave mutley alone, he looks after me in games by suspecting me without voting for me