Mini Theme 1588 - FTL: Faster Than Light - Game Over!

[hitogoroshi]

/le confirm

[hitogoroshi]

I am not town. Discuss.

you can claim scum but that's still less scummy then Anatole Kuragin, hands up if you see it

Vote: Anatole Kuragin

[hitogoroshi]

From your join date, I surmise you are new to mafia and consequently to the wonderful game that is Hands Up If You See It. Basically how it works is, if you see it, you put your hand up.

[hitogoroshi]

Also ABR please be advised that if you actually use that govern I am going to lynch your face off

[hitogoroshi]

Well that was easy, we're supposed to be looking for rebels and a few of you are quite literally rebelling right before our eyes. Permission to fire, sir?

Awesome Reck is town, I like games where Reck is town

[hitogoroshi]

oh and I suppose Albert too, you still can't use the govern though Albert Benmage ruined it for everyone

[hitogoroshi]

Vernob's scum too, fitz is probably town

[hitogoroshi]

Hey Anatole Reck claimed scum, how does that make you feel

You aren't captain, you are pilot. Albert is captain. And I am brig guard guarding Aronis? Well I think I'll trust the captain here and VOTE: Aronis

okay I still want Anatole but I want Vernob more

Unvote, Vote: Vernob

Albert policy lynches are the bomb diggity but look at this vote. Vernob is suddenly not using his stupid way-too-early "activity" tell to vote Arnois he's explicitly quoting you using meta he hasn't read (despite advocating us to read meta) to vote Arnois. This is because he wants to vote for Aronis while distancing himself from his flip (in the first case because of his single post, in the second case because of you) Vernob is scum and Aronis is town so let's vote for scum and not town.

[hitogoroshi]

Do you believe that Reck is scum?

[hitogoroshi]

Well that was easy, we're supposed to be looking for rebels and a few of you are quite literally rebelling right before our eyes. Permission to fire, sir?

Do you believe that Reck is scum?

Based on his one comment alone? I have no idea. pointless to even try to wifom that

[hitogoroshi]

do you want me to break down "the aristocrats" for you too? perhaps a treatise on the ins and outs of airline food or blondes?

sorry son if your "jest" was not actually distinguishable as a joke it is the sources fault not the audience, comedians can't blame the audience that is Just The Rule. I guess I do see it though, which sucks because now Reck isn't confirmed town anymore

Nah for real though I'm liking Anatole's recent posts enough I think it outweighs the hands-up-if-you-see-it.

I'm aborting the mutiny. Anatole has no profile picture, and wishes to remain anonymous.

VOTE: Anatole

this is a bad vote, wagon swelling without acknowledging it is skeevy

TSO is legit

[hitogoroshi]

I'm just gonna repeat myself because I am a Man of Action

Aronis has only 1 post... VOTE: Aronis

You aren't captain, you are pilot. Albert is captain. And I am brig guard guarding Aronis? Well I think I'll trust the captain here and VOTE: Aronis

two back to back votes for Aronis, BOTH of which have escape mechanisms so he doesn't have to be responsible for Aronis's flip

[hitogoroshi]

No, we do

not

"all" agree on anything.

Venrob is lynchbait and I will rot in hell before I'll grant scum a free mislynch because a player has an unpopular playstyle. If you want my vote on someone, show me scum motivated actions, not "scummy" (read: varied from current sitemeta) playstyle.

Anatole is also town. He's done more scumhunting than anyone this game.

That's what I'm doing dog. Trying to distance yourself from the flip of your lynch target BEFORE their flip is hella scum motivated.

Because I think you're falling into a trap here where you're assuming that scummy-players-as-town are less likely to receive scum role PM's. It's kinda what people do with newbies in non-Newbie games.

damn T S O wreckin' it with the good posts

[hitogoroshi]

O agree with your 153, and as such will hold my vote.

Venrob distancing himself from Aronis's flip before Aronis is lynched counter: 3

Who cares about alignment? He will screw us over as town or scum.

Policy lynching d1 is definitely better than a shot in the dark, but lynching scum is better than a policy lynch. And policy lynching means you don't MIND if you hit a town player, but you still WANT to hit them as scum (and are essentially just going for them on the random chance they drew scum, instead of aiming for a read). You probably still shouldn't policy lynch a player who's confirmed town, no matter how bad. And I think Aronis is pretty heavily town by virtue of Venrob's interaction with him. Do you disagree with me? What are your reads, in general?

I'm not going to shut down and refuse to discuss a policy lynch, but you can't use it as an excuse not to mention your thoughts on the others in this game.

At this point, I don't care what happens

Why not?

[hitogoroshi]

Hito. Speak to me.

Hi. You've been pointing out a lot of good stuff on Venrob, I don't know why you're not voting him, you should. Or sell me on Jargo. Also you should get Quantum, it's a super fun board game and it involves space so I feel like I can bring it up here. Actually yesterday I played Quantum and Space Alert for a combined like five hours. Space.

Belisarius, no one seems to be following you on ABR. How does that make you feel?

[hitogoroshi]

You're the one who pointed out that Venrob read the meta game and not the current game. I guess I was counting "dat self meta wall" because I remembered it as a zing on Venrob, but it probably doesn't qualify as a point per se? So pointed out "a good thing" is more accurate than "a lot of good stuff", but I remembered it as a lot and that was just off the cuff

[hitogoroshi]

Aronis' vote on me is terrible. He knows that my vote on him is legitimate after what he's pulled. This makes him even more likely to be scum.

If he's so bad under pressure he's a lock in policy lynch, why on earth is it a scumtell that he's not calmly accepting you trying to policy lynch him?

Why is Venrob town (aside from him being scum shooting down your policy lynch)?

[hitogoroshi]

Hito, are you cool with espresso right now?

Espresso ISO 9 was pretty ugly, nothing really jumps out aside from that. His next few content posts that aren't just defensive bristling should be pretty instructive.

[hitogoroshi]

Are you really scumhunting me for RVS?

When'd your vote for Anatole turn non-random?

[hitogoroshi]

Venrob is constantly mislynched. Trying to vote for him Day 1 is a joke.

But why do you think he's

town

?

[hitogoroshi]

HMMMM.

Is ABR+Venrob scumteam really this slamdunky? Is it?

Eh, I dunno. I don't know why Venrob as scum would try to deflect lynch responsibility on his scumbuddy. But I also don't understand ABR's divergent stances on Venrob and Aronis from a town perspective. He said Venrob was TOWN, but when I asked why, it suddenly changed to "Well I'm not reading Venrob D1 that's silly". It's inconsistent and strange, but a Venrob/ABR scumteam doesn't feel coherent.

rampage can be town (though idk why he felt like justifying his policy wagon on aronis by calling aronis scummy, seems unnecessary), belisarius and espresso are both pretty scummy/cringy, hito and reck, idk, they seem town so far so they can be town so far. paschendale seems somewhat town i guess.

everyone else i don't particularly care about.

(i might have skipped/skimmed pages 8-10, but thats okay)

that's fucked up

Really? I actually think it's pretty sensible to focus on reads as they happen and not try to force reads on the whole town too early - it's prone to confirmation bias. In fact, even in this game I haven't given my opinion on quite a few players; do you find that scummy?

I find it weird ABR's down to policy lynch Aronis and tries to justify it as "but he's scum", but then whitewashes the Venrob wagon by basically doing the opposite and saying, "But he's bad and gets lynched D1 all the time!"

Like, both are players with a meta that would call for a policy lynch, but in one case he goes out of his way to make one scum from his POV, and the other one is just "oh he's always like that" and I don't get why there's the distinction.

Yeah, this is what I'm grappling with.

I tend to join a couple games and feel them out, see which ones I get invested in the most. Hint: it's not this one.

what exactly are you saying here Albert

[hitogoroshi]

Damn! I was pretty sure that Anatole was scum!

Why?

ABR was clearly thinking about the game a lot last night (seeing as he opened with a huge missive about why he was lying when he said he thought Venrob was town), but his Jargo vote seems at odds with that. Do you earnestly think Jargo-scum's plan was to lynch Venrob to indict

you?

Anatole Kuragin, I was going to use my governor ability on you today. You were a loyal soldier.

Why did you think Anatole would be lynched today?

That Juls read post is whack, it's setting up a Jargo lynch if ABR flips town and kinda lends support to calling him scum, but then just camps on Venmar for lurking instead? Especially when she threw Esspreso into town for essentially "people voting him seem like scum, although the only one I can remember is confirmed town and I don't feel like looking up any others?". Kinda gives me the vibe that maybe ABR is town and it's Juls and probably Esspreso.

You know if she flips town though, I gotta vote you. Right now I am at a place of it's either you or her.

haha wait, so now you're suddenly following your scum read but STILL trying to chain a lynch off of a mislynch, but from the opposite direction? Why are you at a place where it's either ABR or Jargo? Why in the world did you vote VENMAR if that's your view of the gamestate?

Vote: Juls

To be continued but I don't want to do a huge wall

[hitogoroshi]

Actually weirdly enough I don't think Venrob as scum blatantly sheeps "the captain" if the captain is his scumbuddy. So...

unvote

Yeah this is what I was trying to figure out in my ISO 20. Alberts clearly fake read on Venrob vs. why would Venrob proxy mislynch responsibility onto his scumbuddy?

-Bargaining. Scum motivation: check. Town motivation: nope

Elaborate on this. What bargaining has ABR done that has no town motivation?

@Belis: I am really curious as to what you know about this third party. Please spill some beans.

On Albert: I definitely still see him as scum. It is an Important and Popular Fact that scum do sometimes bus. Bussing a slot as maligned and potentially useless as Venrob's is not much of a stretch.

I also definitely see the reasons to suspect Venmar. Jargo is also a possibility. Gonna reread day 1 tomorrow before voting.

"Hey Belis share everything you know about the 3rd party so I know what you know, also my suspects are literally everyone that has been voted for today but I don't want to vote until I see where the winds are blowing, thank you all and god bless". Pasch is so SK it hurts. We should go for scum today, though.

[hitogoroshi]

man wait a minute I'm fucking bad, Juls repped into Aronis slot which is almost certainly not groupscum. Maybe sk because that bidirectional chain-if-mislynch is still gross but I want groupscum today

Unvote: Juls

Hey Albert, why did you think Anatole would be lynched today?

If the sk is the firebug it means that scum killed Fitz. Kind of strange. I think I like Esspreso for now but it will depend a lot on his answer to why he thought Anatole was scum, as well.

Vote: Espressojet

[hitogoroshi]

Nah, I'm pretty sick and tired of kills going by and having everyone go, "NOOOO DON'T DO NIGHTKILL SPECULATION THAT'S BAD". It's not bad. There are fucking reasons behind kills, try to suss them out.

Eh, kill speculation can be good later on after some solid info is down but I find early game it should be taken with a liberal grain of salt. I can accept that the weird fitz kill might point to his suspects a bit more than I otherwise would think. But Anatole kill could be been his suspects, could have been someone catching a PR tell, could have BEEN his PR (Senior Security Officer does sound like a bodyguard), could have been "we fear a doctor, who's the most trusted player who we think won't be docced", etc. I don't like trying to guess on which one of these factors it is when I have so little to go on, unless it's someone where there aren't that many possibilities (i.e Fitz). Kill speculation can do wonderful things when claims have been thrown down and the picture is a lot more stable (although the best part of kill speculation there is just the threat of it being a deterrent to otherwise "easy" kills).

Juls I'm sorry I ever doubted you, the attack on Pasch reeks of sincerity. Although as far as Pasch goes "there's momentum there and it would be foolish to squander that" was earnestly a pretty good answer.

I did forget that Belli had the ugly post re: Venrob but overall I think Bellis reaction has been decent and anyway Esspreso's [url=http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p6035020] ISO 47[url] is giving me awful vibes; when faced with an ABR wagoner going for Beli he responds by "oh my gosh how are you not voting albert??" without trying to draw Pasch back or point to reasons that ABR is better than Beli or etc. Like I don't get the vibe that he actually WANTS us to lynch ABR, feels a lot more like he wants us to lynch Beli while he is very explicitly voting for someone who isn't Beli.

Still looking for some answers.

Albert

, why did you think Anatole would be lynched?

Esspreso

, why did you think Anatole was scum?

[hitogoroshi]

I did forget that Belli had the ugly post re: Venrob but overall I think Bellis reaction has been decent and anyway Esspreso's ISO 47 is giving me awful vibes; when faced with an ABR wagoner going for Beli he responds by "oh my gosh how are you not voting albert??" without trying to draw Pasch back or point to reasons that ABR is better than Beli or etc. Like I don't get the vibe that he actually WANTS us to lynch ABR, feels a lot more like he wants us to lynch Beli while he is very explicitly voting for someone who isn't Beli.

If

he

is either pasch or myself, this is dead wrong. We both want ABR lynched.

You definitely want to be seen wanting ABR lynched. You don't want to say whether he's groupscum or third party. You don't want to engage with people who think he's town, aside from loudly decrying them from afar. You don't want to give other reads on other players. You want to be able to say:

Well I may have missed that one, but that in no way defends you.

I've made my point.

I've cast my vote.

There's nothing else to do but wait for the rest of the players to pick up the slack.

Even though you clearly have NOT made your point, seeing as ABR has NOT been lynched, you are seemingly content using this ABR 'read' as an excuse to completely disengage with the game until such time as he's lynched. In your eyes, we're all wrong, but your reaction is to "wait". I think if you actually wanted ABR to be lynched you'd be naming town reads / engaging with them trying to gather lynch capital, not using your fervor as an excuse to NOT work with others.

hito what specifically gave you the impression that Juls was town?

Juls is almost certainly not groupscum because Venrob was very obviously trying to not be responsible for the flip, which he wouldn't do for a bus. Could be third-party, but the point of calling out Pasch for voting with you was pretty involved; seems a lot more earnest than a typical third party can be asked to do.

Arsonist found. I just ISO'd myself to confirm that I never told anyone I was a rock man. So how the crispy crunchy Christ did you know that?

I knew it the instant you claimed, it's not like it's a huge leap of logic that the person who fights the person who does fires would be the kind of person who is immune to fire in the thing that this is.

I didn't think Jarg was scum because she wouldn't bus Venrob with stated ABR suspcison/momentum but her last two posts reek of "I would like to defend Espressojet but without mentioning his name"

[hitogoroshi]

I'm not defending espresso. I was hoping ABR would tell me why tunneling makes beli scum.

Why do you care what ABR thinks?

Question for everyone

: how do you feel about Venmar's 528 to 541?

I don't blame him for missing the point; it's an involved one. It does seem weird he would bother posting his 528 "searching reasons to unvote, none found" if he was just skimming - seems like noise for the sake of noise, kinda like Esspreso is doing but comparatively minor. He's definitely being a lump but I haven't really seen anything heavily alignment-indicative.

I am willing to lynch Venmar or Jargo.
I could compromise on ABR or pasch
I am unwilling to lynch Juls, hito, reck, T S O, Belli, and Espresso

Unvote, vote Jargonaut

That was one of the scummiest things I've ever seen

Hey Esspreso, what's your read on Jargonaut?

Unvote, vote Espressojet

I've never been wrong with this vote.

Hmm? You haven't voted Esspreso yet this game. In fact near as I can tell your first thought on him was that rant Monday that helpfully included the phrase:

Do you have any worthwhile reads or are you wasting my time deciphering your poorly strung together sentences for the first time in this game?

Why

are

you voting for Esspreso, aside from him being the largest wagon that isn't you? How would you rank his scuminess against Jargonaut and Belisarius?

[hitogoroshi]

Sheesh I have people staying over for a few days and am basically V/LA and there are many new pages. So no detail posting just quick reactions

obviously mod has given fakeclaims that's common sense. Beli point suspecting Juls for knowing it "so quickly" is pretty silly. I dunno about you kids but when I saw I had a character name I was 100% sure scum had fakeclaims because otherwise we could try to nail people on them.

recks point on the hydras isn't a really good one, it's a pretty sensible thing to ask if there's something big to know ASAP and I don't think it's pandering at all - does feel a bit weird that just that can make you throw away your read on the slot from TSO and start hatin' on the hydrae, feels a bit like jumping on them because they're bad?

ABR's thing trying to get clarifications on Esspreso and then jumping back when he didn't get them like single-handedly kills my zeal for voting Esspreso. Why on EARTH would you say "wouldn't mind Esspreso getting nk'd?" And this post was just ugly as sin:

So let me get this straight. The guy who we think is scum claims bulletproof, and we decide to let him live? Serious?

Literally less than a hour before this post

you unvoted him but tried to get the details of his BP out of him, and when he didn't, suddenly it's this? No way those thoughts are happening in the same town brain.

Unvote, Vote: Albert B. Rampage

skimmed through the rest but my gosh it's a lot of noise, Albert jumping on Pasch is the funniest thing though. Cries holy hell over Jargonaut and that he's going for scum and not just people suspecting him but then she unvotes you and suddenly oh gosh, it's gotta be Pasch who is the scum, what a coincidence all of my Jargonaut suspicion is gone when she is not voting me, wow. Albert, why is Pasch scum beyond "I believe I am confirmed town and Pasch is scum for not having the analytical depth to recognize that"? Especially when your point is "When the Espresso wagon looked inevitable I jumped over to a different wagon very prominently almost as though I was distancing myself from the flip, but obviously if I was scum I would hammered Espresso-town like an hour after I said 'Isn't Jargo's vote on Esspreso suspicious?', but I didn't do that so I'm town.", because guess what that is not a good point at all.

[hitogoroshi]

if you saying you skimmed my paragraph is you sassin' me I will not be having it y'all posted a buttload and I have limited time

but that's actually a decent explanation on the Esspreso side to me I guess. Why are you voting Pasch and not Jargonaut though?

[hitogoroshi]

It wouldn't be scummy for me to hammer someone who has a death tunnel on me. People would just assume I was frustrated with you for constantly being on my back. I'd blend right in with the others who are voting you for self-voting and being scummy.

It would be INSANELY scummy to hammer Esspreso after just jumping off and saying "Wow, isn't Jargonaut's vote on Esspreso scummy?" You would have been lynched in a heartbeat, regardless of what Esspreso flipped. I don't know why you think you would get a pass for that but you 100% would not. And you can't talk about hammering Esspreso before you made that jump because before you made that jump

you were on Espresso

. I see in the preview edit you have a lot of reallys; I am happy to be addressing so many reallys.

If you're town, talking more about why Pasch is now a bigger scum suspect than Jargonaut will help show you're town; if you're scum, it can give more of a chance to catch you and helps inform our reads if you flip. So I want it either way.

[hitogoroshi]

Hey ABR, why is Pasch scum?

Belli, Venmar, you're both pretty comfortable being all lonely on your lonely little wagons. Why is that?

Fish is confirming what we already know about that Aronis slot.

Jargonaut not voting for anyone is ugly.

[hitogoroshi]

I'm not sure if Pasch is scum or not, the town seems intent on being on my case instead of scumhunting.

What about the scum?

Belli, Venmar, you're both pretty comfortable being all lonely on your lonely little wagons. Why is that?

I put my vote where I think scum is. There's not a wagon there now, so be it. There wasn't a wagon on ABR when I voted him, either.

We're not at deadline. I don't have to compromise to avoid a no-lynch yet.

No, but if you want Juls to be lynched it's probably necessary to talk about her now and again.

[hitogoroshi]

Other than a scumread on Juls, all I've got on anyone else is hito's stated lack of concern over the NKs. It would make sense for a strongly townread townie to expect to die last night, especially in light of the fact that there are two kills, and most likely both scum and SK are aiming for town right now.

I did expect to die; I just have no interest in speculating on why I didn't when there are so many possiblities. Maybe Anatole's role was a BG and he BG'd me, maybe scum had an indication there's an SK (e.g a two-man scumteam or an FBI-esque role) and both anti-towns left me alone thinking the other might kill me, maybe the anti-towns were leery of a potential watcher or doctor. Trying to guess which one would just have me chasing my tail. NK analysis gets a lot more meaningful when the pool of potential targets is smaller and a lot of potential reasons for the kills can be ruled out. There's always the danger that I'm being kept alive because I have a really wrong read and am being used to muscle out that read; but coming to that conclusion D2 is a lot more likely to have me throw out good reads out of paranoia.

[hitogoroshi]

just caught up and maaaaaaaan this myko lynch is ugly. at least there's a ton to follow up on.

Beli thinking it's "pretty clear" he won't get Juls when ABR just got on Juls to vote the wagon du jour without prompting? Esspreso voting for myko because he "may as well" even though ABR and myko scum don't make since as a team at all? ABR producing the world's ugliest hammer:

Seeing how Jargonaut was one of my original suspects:

Unvote, vote Mykonian

literally saying "seeing as how this can be accounted with my past record" and not "this is why I think myko is scum"??

and all of this when mykos catch up was pretty earnest. bad bad times.

[hitogoroshi]

not everyone on it can be scum obviously though but make sure these questions get answered:

Beli:

Why switch to myko when you finally had another Juls voter and there was over a week left?[/b]

Esspreso:

Why vote myko if ABR is your #1 suspect?

ABR:

Why vote for Jargo/myko, back off when they stop voting for you, evade my questions about why you're voting Pasch and not myko, follow Juls ONTO myko again, then vote FOR Juls, and then hammer myko by mentioning that you have past evidence of voting myko and not mentioning why you think he's scum / why you're willing to vote for a wagon propelled by the person you were just voting? I guess this is more of a case than a question but I like the syntactic similarity to the other two

brownie points to any of the above who answer the question before the thread is locked so myko and I can talk about your answer

[hitogoroshi]

Look at how long I sat alone on that wagon and the average number of posts per day in that span. The game was stalled and something had to happen. If I'd sat still, ABR was probably going to be today's lynch. Myko's reads didn't make sense to me, which could be a sign of scum trying to muddy the waters.

And the "something" that had to happen was "Now that I finally have someone else voting for my scum suspect, what I actually want to do is sheep her?"

And surely most people's reads don't make sense to you, since most of us don't suspect Juls.

[hitogoroshi]

But why do you think Juls has been pushing Jarg/myko so relentlessly?

[hitogoroshi]

Yeah that's fair. Maybe "frequently" is a better word? The point is I think voting for myko as a Juls opponent is quite strange, from both Beli and ABR. Just like Esspreso voting myko is weird because ABR and myko are like 100% not scum together. A lot of people had to vote against type to get this wagon out of nowhere.

[hitogoroshi]

That ABR hammer was super bad AGAIN.

I was clear that nobody was going to lynch ABR (much to my dismay) so I might as well go with my second, which people are ACTUALLY voting.

Do you think ABR and myko are scum together?

[hitogoroshi]

I'm unreasonably angry that ABR is town.

Pasch, please extemporate on this line, especially the bolded:

I thought that perhaps he declined to kill the first night to protect himself

, but I see now that he was simply immune to scum's factional kill.

[hitogoroshi]

But you said that his immunity to the scum's factional kill is what changed your mind. When was that?

[hitogoroshi]

Also, is that your whole, unaltered role PM? It's fine to say no without details, but don't lie.

[hitogoroshi]

ABR absolutely cannot make it to LYLO town or not. He's been too crazy to not vote for.

I mean ABR is basicially conf-town now and I agree his voting has been annoying and erratic but I don't see the translation for "cannot make it to LYLO" given that it would be nutso if he was anything but town

[hitogoroshi]

Also it's pretty weird that Pasch isn't immune to fire.

[hitogoroshi]

Also it's pretty weird that Pasch isn't immune to fire.

Do you think a scumkill immune unlimited town vigilante is a balanced role?

Not at all. But I also don't think a Lanius being killed by fire makes any sense. This could be Bella just diverging from canon, of course, but a vigilante is one of the easiest things to justify in the FTL universe (an Engi with an Anti-Personnel Drone, Hacking the Medbay, any race as a combatant, etc.) so I don't see why Bella would make a game with a subsystem involving fire and people being immune to fire, and then have a race that de-oxygeniates the room as a character who dies to fire. I'm not going to call Pasch certain scum based on flavor spec, but I definitely want to look more in to it. Especially since his reasoning for killing Bellisarus is quite confusing - I'm fairly sure multiple players in-thread commented that Rockmen are immune to fire, so Pasch's "If only I knew then what I know now!" feels artificial. But I don't have a cohesive theory to explain the ambiguity - just a feeling that something is off. And I want to get to the bottom of this before night in case I'm killed tonight.

[hitogoroshi]

The Rockman thing, as far as I could tell, was an explicit reference to a past game that I was not in. I had no idea what the fuck he was talking about with that.

But I am? What is your vote based off of exactly? Me wanting to know what Belisarius has on a SK? All I see is that Anatole was burned to a crisp (maybe the doings of a rockman), only reason i'd suspect an Arsonist, and weak one at that.

Arsonist found. I just ISO'd myself to confirm that I never told anyone I was a rock man. So how the crispy crunchy Christ did you know that?

Scum first though.

LOL WHAT? I WAS USING MY FUCKING GAME KNOWLEDGE OF THE GAME THAT ROCKMEN ARE IMMUNE TO FIRE? ITS WHAT A PERSON HANDLING FIRE I IMAGINED TO BE

(Notice I never implied anyone in particular was a Rockman, and that I was implying the Arsonist themselves would logically be a Rockman)

Here's my opinion on the whole third party thing.

Whomever is the rockman is just a semi-bulletproof townie who is immune to fire attacks. This would lead us to believe that there is an arsonist, and thusly a third party. Beli confirmed semi-bulletproof townie.

now that that's done, can we lynch ABR yet?

Arsonist found. I just ISO'd myself to confirm that I never told anyone I was a rock man. So how the crispy crunchy Christ did you know that?

I knew it the instant you claimed, it's not like it's a huge leap of logic that the person who fights the person who does fires would be the kind of person who is immune to fire in the thing that this is.

[hitogoroshi]

It's different from mine, but so was ABR's and he's town. I think Bella just wasn't that precise and consistent making her PMs? The fact that it doesn't modify the name is a lot more worrying, but I don't think it's a slam dunk. It's a point against Espresso for sure, but if I can be brutally honest - if Pasch is telling the truth AND Espresso is the last scum, I'm sure we win the game no matter what happens today, so right now I'm more interesting in sticking to my guns here.

[hitogoroshi]

Pasch, please give me:

1.) The reason you shot ABR even though, as I belabored throughout yesterday, he makes no sense as Jarg/mykos scumbuddy.

2.) How you managed to miss all these fucking posts about Belli's ability.

[hitogoroshi]

Confirming I was neighborized by Reck.

Nick Breckon, Federation Ensign. I'm a Nice Guy redditor-type science officer who always wears a fedora. I vaguely crumbed it with "le confirm" in case there was some flavor-dependent element.

I still think Pasch is probably an SK. Venmar's making a good point, but there are a ton others. His reasoning for the Beli kill requires him to have ignored a ton of posts from and about his 'chief suspect', he solicited the town for opinions on how to kill and then just went ahead and shot Albert without any engaging of us pointing out he was obvious town, his ISO 60 is ugly because he says he "doesn't plan on killing without a consensus from here on out" - as a town vig, if we don't lynch scum today, then Pasch shooting takes away our last lynch and doesn't make sense, but as SK, the no-brainer strategy is "shoot anyone if we lynch scum and try to shoot scum if we lynch town". So a vig should be thinking a lot more about it then an sk, and Pasch isn't thinking about it.

Reck, what do you think we should do today?

[hitogoroshi]

So you legitimately think it's me, and you want me lynched?

[hitogoroshi]

Well damn, I wanted to be pimp as heck with my reveal but 1233 has it kind of.

If Reck's role works as claimed,

he has absolutely no incentive to lynch scum today

. It would make sense to lynch me (or Juls who I'm pretty sure is town is as well) if you were scum with a neighborizing ability. My only worry was that Reck did have the role has claimed, thought Pasch was an sk, thought Venmar was scum, and pulled his "happy town vibes :3" out of his ass to secure a mislynch. I don't think that's the case now, though.

Pasch-sk and Reck-scum makes everything work out perfectly and make sense. There's also this gem:

Pasch is confirmed not to be mafia (and is probably town) unless we're actually in 3-1-1 right now which is just clownshoes. In any case he's not the lynch for today.

Reck acknowledging 3-1-1 and not 2-1-1-1.

[hitogoroshi]

You're admitting that lynching me will make you lose if I'm scum,

while voting me.

This means that,

a.) You are deliberately acting against wincon

b.) You have the role as claimed, but do not believe I'm scum

c.) You do not have the role as claimed.

Admitting it means that a.) is

not an option

. So it's b) or c). I worried about b because it would make sense with your Venmar reversal if you believed Pasch-vig, Venmar-scum, but I don't think you would make post 1233 if we were in situation b). So it's c).

[hitogoroshi]

We're not lynching the SK if they exist. Town loses in that scenario. We lynch scum, and I kind of doubt it's Reck, so its you or Juls.

Town only loses lynching Pasch-sk if Reck is truly a survivor and someone else is third scum. Otherwise, we can lynch Pasch-sk and then Reck-scum no problem.

[hitogoroshi]

LOL.

"Town only loses if the most likely scenario to happen actually happens!"

For that to be the most likely scenario you would need to actually have the role you're claiming to have.

[hitogoroshi]

Well I mean, I believed you right until now when you're acting against the wincon of Reck-survivor and absolutely toward the wincon of Reck-scum.

[hitogoroshi]

Hey, Reck, you should ask Bella if it's announced in thread if you fufill your wincon.

[hitogoroshi]

Never mind, scratch that.

[hitogoroshi]

Although my confusion raises another point, because I remember why I have the impression Reck's role worked like that. Juls, check out neighbor QT post 17 and compare it with Reck 1197. I obviously can't quote the QT, but you can see he clearly wasn't claiming survivor when he first claimed.

Reck, I asked that because I was trying to secure an endgame where you would lose if you're scum but win with town if you were your claimed role - even when you're 99% sure someone is scum it's good to secure lockdown wins. That would be possible if you were the version you claimed at first in the QT AND it was announced when you won, but not with what you posted now. We DO get that endgame security with Pasch - if he's town, we'll just win, and if we don't win we can lynch him.

Vote: xRECKONERx

[hitogoroshi]

That doesn't even make sense. Why would it be dumb for a survivor to claim with an SK out there?

[hitogoroshi]

Yeesh. That was not a fun scumteam to be having. I hate bussing but Venrob commited my chief scumtell and anyone who meta'd me would instantly know I was scum with him for not going for it. I tried my best to protect Jarg and kind of succeed (she has suspicion but it was deflected mostly) but then myko repped in and got fragged like instantly.

I like that our roles were two VT and a godfather (with no investgative abilities? unless Anatole was an investigator I guess) who couldn't kill unless we were both dead, against townies BP to each of one of our kills, a vig, a doctor, and whatever Anatole was.

How exactly did Reck win? It's not in the RAW; and leveraging his survivor role was a part of my plan for most of the endgame.

Still, fun enough game. I think I'm finally getting a decent scum game going? But PoE, she is a harsh mistress.