Mini 1602: Game Over

[Aneninen]

No objections here.

*Handing the hammer to Tman so that he can give it to Kitty*

[Tammy]

My only problem with Neil as scum is I actually kinda liked Flames, but I have a soft spot for people who joke with me.

[Oso]

...

By the way, there's one thing I don't understand. Many of you are scumreading him without voting for him. Am I the idiot becuase I vote for the one whom I think scum and want to lynch or is there something strange going on?

I'll happily hammer him myself, if Mala doesn't come in and pre-emptively hammer him.

But I would like to hear from Agar and Shadowz, the only two, I think, who were on the Niel wagon pre-claim that haven't posted post claim.

[tman2nd]

...

By the way, there's one thing I don't understand. Many of you are scumreading him without voting for him. Am I the idiot becuase I vote for the one whom I think scum and want to lynch or is there something strange going on?

I'll happily hammer him myself, if Mala doesn't come in and pre-emptively hammer him.

But I would like to hear from Agar and Shadowz, the only two, I think, who were on the Niel wagon pre-claim that haven't posted post claim.

I'll wait for them then.

[Tammy]

Okay so flames goes downhill after page 2.

[Malakittens]

I WANT THE HAMMER.

[Elias_the_thief]

This is disappointing. I don't buy the claim either. Which makes it unfortunate that I've been the only one defending the slot this whole time.

[shaddowez]

I don't like the claim. I've gone through Flames' ISO and saw no crumbs whatsoever...he knew he was in deep, and while it was RVS he did manage to pick up 4 votes in no time. If he had a PR, one would think that would be a good time to start crumbing. It also reads as a stall tactic - he started posting info, disappeared until what should have been after a prod, claims and says he has to disappear again.

I'm really not liking Anen at this point either. First, he fires off these two posts:

I have an idea.

@Everyone: if you are counterclaiming Neil, DO IT in your very next post!

If there is no counterclaim, we should assume that Neil's claim is real and disband his wagon. (After all, if his claim is fake we'll find that out soon.) If you've posted anything without counterclaiming start posting your other scumreads as soon as you can.

UNVOTE: – I'm willing to revote him if anyone counterclaims but now I'm scared of a derphammer on Neil.

Yes, KittyPryde, but we were wagoning him

before

his claim. Call me a bunny, but I think it's too risky to lynch him. So, counterclaim him or go scumhunting somewhere else.

And then without providing any info, claiming only site rules on why he can't, we get a vote:

I have just done a similar examination as Tammy. I'm not allowed to provide any details (site rules) but I'm almost sure that he's faking.

VOTE: Neil

By the way, there's one thing I don't understand. Many of you are scumreading him without voting for him. Am I the idiot becuase I vote for the one whom I think scum and want to lynch or is there something strange going on?

[shaddowez]

Elias

- Please explain how this was defending the slot?

I can get behind the Flames wagon...I don't like decision to speak for Rack in 119, in a defensive sort of way, then in his very next post claim to have a complete turn around on him. Especially considering he mirrors my reasons for thinking Rack is scum...like, exactly mirrors them. In the post DIRECTLY after mine.

VOTE: Flames
That's L-2.

[tman2nd]

This is disappointing. I don't buy the claim either. Which makes it unfortunate that I've been the only one defending the slot this whole time.

So, is the claim the only reason you fos him is the claim?

[Elias_the_thief]

Elias

- Please explain how this was defending the slot?

I can get behind the Flames wagon...I don't like decision to speak for Rack in 119, in a defensive sort of way, then in his very next post claim to have a complete turn around on him. Especially considering he mirrors my reasons for thinking Rack is scum...like, exactly mirrors them. In the post DIRECTLY after mine.

VOTE: Flames
That's L-2.

That's almost 200 posts ago, when the slot was flames. I said I was down for his wagon, not his lynch. I've been against his lynch since Neil took over.

[Elias_the_thief]

This is disappointing. I don't buy the claim either. Which makes it unfortunate that I've been the only one defending the slot this whole time.

So, is the claim the only reason you fos him is the claim?

The only thing that Neil has done. There were a few posts that smelled fishy from Flames, but nothing lynch worthy.

[SleepyKrew]

VC 1.16

neil1113

(5) - AGar, phokdapolees, chaoslord54, shaddowez, Aneninen

tman2nd

(2) - Oso, Malakittens

rack

(2) - neil1113, Elias_the_thief

Not Voting

(4) - Tammy, tman2nd, rack, implosion

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 deadline will hit in: (expired on 2014-08-31 16:48:15)

neil1113 is V/LA for a few days. I'm going to try to get some more concrete dates.

[Tammy]

Okay was able to sit down and get caught up. woooo. If I don't make sense here and there, don't mind me I'm still on very little sleep. Anyway, I'm going to be quick and brief because I still have a lecture to finish writing and other stuff to do.

I still like my town reads for the most part. If Neil comes back scum, I think I'll feel even better about Agar as it doesn't feel like a bus. I think. Well that's how I feel right now.

I'm not entirely sure what Malakittens sees in tman though. He is null territory and sometimes what she says pings seems a bit nitpicky.

Not a fan of Neil though. I really don't know how he can have the reads he has, like at all. He feels like scum who thought I'd be an easy push so went for it; his tone is just so eh. Some things are just funny though, and I refuse to believe that someone with any amount of experience in this game is reading it the way he is and is town, especially after looking through his meta a bit. He actually has thoughtful reads, which demonstrate an attempt to solve the game, and I'm not seeing that here. Like the things he makes a big deal out of concerning me are things I don't accept he actually thinks. He said I had no good reason to call myself town in my first post. Well I do have good reason, it's called a town role pm. He has played with people who declare they're town in their first post before and not made a deal of it.

He's also not new, so should understand that early bandwagons happen, they can tell you a lot about the person being wagoned and who's voting, and he's characterizing my very obvious joke votes as something serious. Like literally I claimed that my cat told me to vote flames in rvs and then thanked malakittens for confessing. I don't understand how anyone could think those were serious votes and I was just going for "anything that would stick".

Oh you know what was funny? He considered that Implosion made the only sound post on page one and liked him for it. On page one, Neil was scum reading me; Implosion made a joke about me and claimed I was town. Now how in the hell does someone town reading his big suspect garner him the most thoughtful post of the page?

His read on phok and tman are complete crap as well. Actually I find that people who are unwilling to change their mind when their argument has been proven incorrect to be more likely scum. Scum tend to stick to early reads even when they're pointed out for crap reasons, not town. So when someone scum reads you, and they're told they completely misinterpreted everything and decides the person is still scum, it's more likely scum not town sticking to their guns.

Tman's pointing out that I had called myself town several times does not in any way shape or form demonstrate someone who is reading the game and is pointing out motivations. It's a null tell. It's also something that scum can very easily do to look like they're scum hunting. Oh she called herself town too many times, that's scummy. And for Neil to be all "oh I didn't know if anyone would notice it" I mean what? Town and scum have come after me for calling myself town before. It's never stopped me from calling myself town! (What I think makes him look town from the affair is that it looks to me like Rack said this was my scum meta, not long after that Tman pulled up posts where I'm referring to myself being town and says it looks like a joke but do I do it often. Considering that was the most of what I did do, it makes sense that if someone says hey she's scum by meta, he'd go looking. It looks like he took Tman's accusation seriously and went looking for what could make me scum. That's something that I'd expect more from town trying to figure out the game than from scum who would know that Rack was lying.)

Oh the Rack thing is crap as well. I mean obviously I know I'm town and this is my town meta, cuz you know kind of an expert on me, so when he said that I was definitely scum by meta, I knew that there was something else there. Neil trying to claim that I was invalidate his opinion by calling out what he was doing is pure bullshit. Of course I was trying to figure out what he was doing with that. He says it's interesting I called out Rack's lie before he admitted it. UM you usually know when someone is lying about you. (You slept with my boyfriend. No, I didn't that's a lie. How do you know it's a lie?!?!?!? Y'all must have planned it GOTCHA) Also, if anyone thinks that's a planned reaction test, they must be on serious crack. I just don't believe he believes his conclusion. What I am concerned about here is that Rack is his partner, and he's trying to tie me to his partner.

Oh also whoever is scum reading Rack for claiming that he lied about my meta in order to find a reason to get off of my wagon, that's a bad reason to be voting Rack. Things don't work that way and it's a complete null tell. Rack would have never been able to get by with voting me and causing a wagon based on my meta anyway. As a brief site search would have netted anyone who looked the exact opposite view of me. Not only that but Implosion had already mentioned playing with me, and I think it was obvious that Agar and Malakittens have experience with me too. Rack was either doing exactly what he said he was doing...reaction testing. Or he was scum pretending to reaction test. But jumping off my wagon because this isn't my scum meta doesn't make him scum. Rack could have potentially been reaction testing me as well, but it does not work so well when it's in the beginning of the game and I don't know who you are.

I was going to point out that Neil hadn't mentioned chaos lord at all, but his last catch up post reached page five and chaos didn't post until page 6.

The only thing that worries me with my Neil read is that I feel like I'm getting overly involved in his read on me and just how shit it is. I'd probably feel better about his read on me if he was a newb or a VI, but reading through his games today he's just not so I don't believe the tells he's using. I more feel like he thought I'd be an easy target.

My other biggest suspect besides Neil is chaos lord. He just feels like he's trying to look involved in the game but really isn't trying to figure out the game.

I have the same feeling with Elias though. He also still didn't answer my question why it was wifom for my tell with Rack. It's my tell, and unless Rack had been in a game with me where I used that tell to call someone town, then it can't be wifom. And really it would be silly in the first place. it's like he's trying to argue that Rack went oh Tammy thinks unhelpful people tend to be town so I'm going to claim to have meta and then refuse to answer because then Tammy will call me town for refusing to answer. And that wasn't the point I was making in the first place, considering I ended up calling it a null town. Oh also scum aren't more preservationists than town. Some people hate getting mislynched worse than correctly lynched. I feel like Elias is focusing on the wrong thing there, and asked me a question about it just to do it. It felt like busy work.

Okay I really need to write this lecture for tomorrow, and I promised this would be brief and LIED!

[Tammy]

I just realized that it sounds like I'm scum reading Phok and I'm not. I meant that Neil's reason is crap, not that I disagree with the read.

I'm telling you. I'm tired.

[tman2nd]

I said I was down for his wagon, not his lynch.

What's the difference?

[shaddowez]

Elias

- Please explain how this was defending the slot?

I can get behind the Flames wagon...I don't like decision to speak for Rack in 119, in a defensive sort of way, then in his very next post claim to have a complete turn around on him. Especially considering he mirrors my reasons for thinking Rack is scum...like, exactly mirrors them. In the post DIRECTLY after mine.

VOTE: Flames
That's L-2.

That's almost 200 posts ago, when the slot was flames. I said I was down for his wagon, not his lynch. I've been against his lynch since Neil took over.

I'll give you the fact that it was over 200 pages ago. However, you said you were defending the slot, which implies it doesn't matter who the player was. Can you provide me any evidence of you defending the slot before Post #360 when Neil took over? Even your unvote wasn't in defense of the slot, as evidenced here:

Anen: I unvoted because I wanted an answer from Shadow about why his vote was different. Also because I'm about to be outtie for two days.

[AGar]

Hello folks, replacing Riabi.

Unless asked a direct question, nothing substantive from me until Neil answers the L-1 wagon.

Please, do everyone a favor and

don't do this

. Unless you think SKrew made a 12:1 setup. In which case let's all go mob him.

Neil's claim is pretty bullshit.

I have also seen the propensity for him to fakeclaim as scum.

[implosion]

Yeah honestly at this point my main motivation in wanting to lynch neil is wanting to see what his alignment is.

Although I think he's certainly a very strong candidate for scum. Let's go ahead and do this.

VOTE: neil

That's L-1 (I say this for Malakittens' benefit). At this point I don't really care what else neil has to say. People keep convincing me he's scum. The weirdest thing about the neil wagon is the sheer fact that I don't hear any loud voices against it. Which means if he's scum, then other scum are keeping quiet/on the sidelines or are bussing pretty strongly. But that's perfectly reasonable.

[Aneninen]

@Shadowez, 432: you're absolutely right, my posts – 390, 393, 423 – were weak.
In general, I think it's too risky to lynch a player who claimed a PR. But, it seemed that most of the players weren't buy the claim so I started thinking that I was naive unvoting Neil. That'swhy I gathered some additional information about Neil so as to get an own opinion instead of merely sheeping the majority. The

"I have just done a similar examination as Tammy."

meant Tammy's previous post, 422. That's all I can say.

[SleepyKrew]

rack has been prodded.

[Malakittens]

VOTE: Neil

HAMMAH BABEH.

SEE YAZ ON THE FLIPSIDE~~

reads:

AGar * - TOWN DO NOT LYNCH EVER
Tammy - TOWN DO NOT LYNCH EVER
Oso Riabi - null
chaoslord54 * - leaning scum
Malakittens - town
Aneninen - leaning town
implosion - i stil wanna call him scum.
phokdapolees * - town
shaddowez - maybe town
tman2nd * - leaning scum
neil1113 Flames682 * - dead scummmmmm woooo~
Elias_the_thief - maybe town, idk
rack ^ * - prob town

[SleepyKrew]

VC 1.17

neil1113

(7) - AGar, phokdapolees, chaoslord54, shaddowez, Aneninen, implosion, Malakittens

rack

(2) - neil1113, Elias_the_thief

tman2nd

(1) - Oso

Not Voting

(3) - Tammy, tman2nd, rack

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

neil1113 is V/LA for a few days. I'm going to try to get some more concrete dates.

Unfortunately, the flip will not happen until the morning. I can just feel the anticipation building.

[SleepyKrew]

neil1113 has been lynched. He was a

Mafia Goon

.
Night 1 begins now. The deadline to submit actions is (expired on 2014-08-30 10:39:14).

I want everyone to PM me during the Night, regardless of if you have an action or not, so I can be sure you're all still active.

[SleepyKrew]

Tammy has been killed. She was a

Vanilla Townie

.
Day 2 will begin shortly.