Open 623 (White Flag) - A Moment in Time (Over)

[SirCakez]

Hello everyone!
VOTE: Something_Smart

[SirCakez]

Cerberus, why no RVS?

[SirCakez]

Vote on SS is now serious.

[SirCakez]

The way you answered to RQS plus 21.

[SirCakez]

Not liking Rhazh either. Taking some things too seriously, others not enough.

[SirCakez]

In especially this setup not using associatives is odd. Want to hear an elaboration on that from PC.

[SirCakez]

AI is voting in all the wrong places right now.
Phantom I find not using associative to be odd.

[SirCakez]

PC, Cow and Titus can go in the town pile.
SS and Rhazh can go in the scum pile.
Cerberus can be in the null pile alone.

[SirCakez]

AI can go in the scum pile.
Wasn't a slip really, just scummy behavior in general.
P-Edit: She's wagoning in the right place.

[SirCakez]

PC, Cow and Titus can go in the town pile.
SS and Rhazh can go in the scum pile.
Cerberus can be in the null pile alone.

VOTE: Rhazh
Attacking people without voting to support it, making unprompted references to what the scum want or do, inconsistencies in play. Overall feels like he is trying to fit in and play like everyone else is.

what do you make of this, sc?

Cerb, make a few posts. I'm interested in what you sound like.

The vote was prompted by Titus asking why he wasn't voting a scum read so null. Maybe bad early bussing.

[SirCakez]

AI can go in the scum pile.
Wasn't a slip really, just scummy behavior in general.
P-Edit: She's wagoning in the right place.

What the hell are you talking about?

Your vote on PC was bad. You said SS was a scumread but didn't vote him in 44 which was also bad.

[SirCakez]

Do you object to my posting a reads list?

[SirCakez]

The question was aimed at Pistachion who apparently disliked my posting of a reads list.

[SirCakez]

What a vote to change to when I scum read you. And only after someone else voted first too.
I thought my reads reasoning was fairly clear at the moment. Ask about which ones you don't understand.

[SirCakez]

You believe Titus to be scum?

[SirCakez]

I've never played with Titus before. I know she's a strong player but that's about it. I like who's she pushing so I'll town read the slot. Should I just be null reading her or put in her own special pile? That's what you're implying.

[SirCakez]

Now that's definitely a scum vote.

[SirCakez]

Nope other way.
You too easily changed votes for someone who was previously so invested in their Rhazh scum read. Scum opportunistically jumping on a wagon that looked to take pressure away from them.

[SirCakez]

The actual motivation they have is getting a counterwagon off of your scum butt.

[SirCakez]

Whoops typed they instead of you
"The actual motivation you have is getting a counter wagon off of your scum butt."

[SirCakez]

Because your points are wrong. My statement are supported by the posts and nothing has been overly explained. Really, I've only explained what I've been questioned over.
I also find it interesting that Pistachion is accusing me of not explaining while SS is accusing me of overexplaining.

[SirCakez]

What an interesting wagon composition.
Cerberus are you willing to place a vote yet?

[SirCakez]

AI is OMGUSing both Titus and myself. He has developed scumreads on both of us immediately after he has been scumread which I find very scummy.

[SirCakez]

Speaking of buddying look at that first sentence.

[SirCakez]

How does it work then?

[SirCakez]

I'm busy right now, will post here tomorrow.

[SirCakez]

How does it work then?

AI are you gonna respond to this or keep ignoring it?

I vote, Titus, but not for reasons this weak.

Cakes: how does your read on SS relate to your read on rhazh?

Rhazh is most likely to be town out of my three scumreads. SS's vote on Rhazh supports that.

What an interesting wagon composition.
Cerberus are you willing to place a vote yet?

Could you comment on what you find interesting about it?

All of my scumreads were on my wagon and all of my town reads were on the SS wagon.

SS is so eager to change votes. I think this is his third serious vote now. Why are you switching wagons so much?

I kinda have to agree with SirCakez and PC here, Something_Smart seems to be jumping on conclusions too fast and too randomly.

VOTE: Something_Smart

This was your only explanation for your vote. It seems like a weak buddying attempt and a crap explanation that could easily apply to several other players (how is the flashwagon on me not jumping to conclusions?). What I did was neither too fast (barely out of RVS) nor random (I gave reasons for each vote), and that qualifies your vote as opportunism.

Pfft, buddying attempt? If I were trying to buddy, I would do it in

style

and not like that. SirCakez is the 2nd scummiest on my list and don't think I would want to buddy them.

Why no mention of this before in your "I agree with SirCakez and PC" post?

[SirCakez]

All of my scumreads were on my wagon and all of my town reads were on the SS wagon.

But what's the causality here? You're implying that they're on your wagon because you're scumreading them. Is that the case, or are you scumreading them because they're on your wagon? Same question with the townreads on the SS wagon.

No I made my scumreads before the wagon on me developed. I'm saying it supports my scumreads that the three people I'm scumreading were all voting together on town.
And the same applies to the townreads. They were all voting a scumread of mine together which fits with me being the scum counterwagon to SS and them all being town.

[SirCakez]

SirCakez, the confbias is real. When I vote you, you call it opportunistic and trying to avoid a lynch by pushing a counterwagon. When I move off of you, you say I'm moving my vote around too much. One of those decisions had to be consistent with your expectation of town, so why are you pretending that neither is?

Yes because you jumped on me only after others had voted me despite you apparently having a steadfast scum read on Rhazh. I'd have expected town to stay on me if they really believed I was scum as you apparently had a strong scum read on me as well. Same issue with both votes: jumping off of votes onto other wagons easily despite previous apparent strong scum reads.

[SirCakez]

Townies usually have confidence in their scumreads.

[SirCakez]

Fair enough Yonom.

SS I'm saying you jumped votes too easily for how apparently confident you were in your scumreads. No conviction in actually pushing a wagon through on the person being voted.

Different site different meta Rhazh.

[SirCakez]

And that game I was awful in you're referring to was closed, bastard, heavily-themed and flavor-based, allowed arguments based on flavor and allowed rolecard quoting in thread. Not exactly similar to this game.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: Rhazh
Attacking people without voting to support it, making unprompted references to what the scum want or do, inconsistencies in play. Overall feels like he is trying to fit in and play like everyone else is.

This doesn't sound like "mildly scummy".

[SirCakez]

SS why make such a big case on Rhazh if it's "only so serious"?
AI's reads list is awful. Why is NotAnAlt top scum? Why are Cow and PC scum?

[SirCakez]

SS similar questions: why are PC and Yonom scum?

[SirCakez]

It goes back into the "changing votes too easily" discussion. And for page three it was a fairly big case.

[SirCakez]

You believe being cocky is indicative of scum?
And what do you think of AlwaysInnocent?

[SirCakez]

SS why make such a big case on Rhazh if it's "only so serious"?
AI's reads list is awful. Why is NotAnAlt top scum? Why are Cow and PC scum?

Why didn't you ask about you?

Because he had made his reasons for scumreading me earlier clear. Bad reasons, mind you.
Cerberus if you had to place a vote right now who would it be on?

[SirCakez]

How is that backtracking? I said townies are confident in reads then called SS scummy for having no confidence in his reads.
Why wouldn't I be confident in that? Isn't white flag about the associatives and scum trying to keep each other alive?

Regarding the "playstyles that draw suspicion"
SS I've never played with before.
Rhazh I've played with offsite and this definitely feels off from his usual play. Trying to blend in much more then usual.
AI I've played with in another ongoing game. Can't go in detail there until it ends. I am scumreading him for switching votes around 4 times in the first four pages then basically OMGUSing me when I scumread him.

[SirCakez]

Apparently confident =/= actually confident. By moving the votes he showed he wasn't actually confident.

[SirCakez]

So, to clarify...

when you made this post:

SirCakez, the confbias is real. When I vote you, you call it opportunistic and trying to avoid a lynch by pushing a counterwagon. When I move off of you, you say I'm moving my vote around too much. One of those decisions had to be consistent with your expectation of town, so why are you pretending that neither is?

Yes because you jumped on me only after others had voted me despite you apparently having a steadfast scum read on Rhazh. I'd have expected town to stay on me if they really believed I was scum as you apparently had a strong scum read on me as well. Same issue with both votes: jumping off of votes onto other wagons easily despite previous apparent strong scum reads.

What specifically was scummy about what SS had done?

Jumping votes too easily and his "it was a joke" thing mainly

[SirCakez]

Why wouldn't I be confident in that? Isn't white flag about the associatives and scum trying to keep each other alive?

This has gone unanswered.

[SirCakez]

This

VOTE: Rhazh
Attacking people without voting to support it, making unprompted references to what the scum want or do, inconsistencies in play. Overall feels like he is trying to fit in and play like everyone else is.

and this

I don't like Cakez because he's making unsupported statements while overly explaining his actions. He gives the feeling of scum trying not to stand out.
VOTE: SirCakez

and this

Now that's definitely a scum vote.

if you mean a vote on scum then yeah sure

and this

you know what
VOTE: AlwaysInnocent
This is both whiteknighting and buddying, and it's unacceptable.

all struck me as pretending to be confident that the person being voted was scum. It looks fake because he changed votes way too easily for someone who just said, "this is a vote on scum".

[SirCakez]

Not confident. I thought it was pretty clear.

[SirCakez]

Pretty confident. This discussion is going in circles.

[SirCakez]

Not confident. I thought it was pretty clear.

but you said his tone was confident

His tone is confident but his actions do not reflect actually being confident.

[SirCakez]

Yes that's what I mean.

[SirCakez]

Not confident. I thought it was pretty clear.

but you said his tone was confident

His tone is confident but his actions do not reflect actually being confident.

so when you say that townies are confident
do you mean that townies are condinnt
or townies have confident tones

Townies are confident. I've said it multiple times.
Interested to see what Cerberus finds.

[SirCakez]

Pretty confident. This discussion is going in circles.

Okay then SirCakez, answer this: What makes you so confident? Do you really think you are that good at Mafia?

The reactions of you and others throughout the thread is making me confident. My townreads are agreeing with me is also making me confident.
And I don't think I'm good at mafia honestly.

[SirCakez]

guys drop it about the avatar
how hard is it to read a name anyway

Pretty confident. This discussion is going in circles.

Okay then SirCakez, answer this: What makes you so confident? Do you really think you are that good at Mafia?

The reactions of you and others throughout the thread is making me confident. My townreads are agreeing with me is also making me confident.
And I don't think I'm good at mafia honestly.

So basically, confbias. Have any specific reasons?

The series of posts I quoted earlier. That progression of thinking was one I don't see coming from town.
The "It was a joke" thing. That's been hashed over a ton already.

[SirCakez]

Townies are confident. I've said it multiple times.

Okay but...what? Why? This makes no sense.

Vanilla townies don't have any way of being certain of anyone's alignment (unless there's an IC or similar, which there isn't in this game.)

Assuming a normal, non-multiball setup like this one, scum know everybody's alignment. So I wouldn't expect scum to fake confidence, I'd expect them to fake a degree of uncertainty.

Scum knows their reads are bull because they know who the actual scum and town are. It's naturally harder for people to push something they know is false. At least in my experience.

[SirCakez]

Yonom put that far better then I was putting it.

[SirCakez]

Yonom you summed up my thought process pretty well.
Basically, my feeling is that I have one vote and more than one scumread. Since my reads are constantly changing and shifting, my top scumread changes frequently, although any given read never changes that fast.
For instance, I find it likely that I will vote SirCakez soon. This is not because AI has gotten any less scummy, it's just I'm starting to see SirCakez as scum who screwed up how confident he was supposed to be in his reads.
Yonom's analysis is very good but could have come from town or scum. It seems genuine, but it also seems easy enough to fake (I recall faking a similar case in my first game).
That last sentence is horrible, however.

I am confident in my reads. There is nothing screwed up about that.
Since it's being debated right now I think Yonom is town.
Also my Cow townread is dead.

[SirCakez]

Incoming.

[SirCakez]

Top town

SirCakez

- Obvious

Titus, Yonom

- These two are my top townreads outside of myself. I see clear Town motivation from both of them and followable cases from both.

Droog, Pistachion, Extrapolated Eagle

- I like what these three are posting. Nothing that screams scum to me from any of them.

PhantomCobalt

- He was a higher townread earlier for taking hard stances, but he's disappeared from the thread and has thus dropped down in my reads.

Cerberus v66

- Not really taking a stance on anything. A lot of his posts are just his opinions on mechanics like RVS. Just barely on the town side of my reads.

----null line-----

RhazhBash, NotAnAlt

- I'll split these up.
-----Rhazh - Generally being useless and making bad pushes. Too defensive as well.
-----NotAnAlt - Call this gut but I really don't like his posts. Popping in randomly to make pushes, weird progression of reads. Just not a good feeling from this slot.

TheCow

- Was a townread earlier but I took a look at him again earlier and he's being really useless while trying to blend in.. Lots of bad and pointless questions, unvoted the SS wagon randomly for no reason, and his recent readslist was quite bad.

Something_Smart, AlwaysInnocent

- Will split these up
-----Something_Smart - I've beaten my scumread on him to death already.
-----AlwaysInnocent - Very very scummy player. OMGUSing, making weird unexplained comments, buddying, generally useless, terrible readslist.

Scummiest scum

[SirCakez]

Apologies if that was taken wrongly. It was a read based on play, nothing more.

[SirCakez]

I officially can't judge sarcasm.

[SirCakez]

How is AI top town?

[SirCakez]

I don't understand AI townreads at all. Guy has been absurdly scummy all game.
Phantom why does super confidence = null?

[SirCakez]

What do you think of AI cerberus?

[SirCakez]

You should respond to his questions AI.

[SirCakez]

I've never played with Titus before (._. )

[SirCakez]

You just agreed with Cerberus that you're familiar with me and know I've had experience with Titus, but I have no experience with Titus other then this game.

[SirCakez]

not understand

What don't you understand? I think it was pretty obvious.

[SirCakez]

My read on AI is waffling a bit. EE raises some good points about him.

[SirCakez]

What?

[SirCakez]

What don't you like about my resppnse? I thought the case made sense. (I assume you're referring to EE's case for AI being town.)

[SirCakez]

Why has it gone away?

[SirCakez]

Droog join us on SS already.

[SirCakez]

Titus isn't doing very much iirc.

[SirCakez]

Keep reading please.

[SirCakez]

Cow can you put down a vote like you said you would days ago?

[SirCakez]

I need Fire to finish reading up before I can give him a solid read.

[SirCakez]

I want droog to put his vote down because he's been dancing around it for a while now but hasn't actually put the vote down.

[SirCakez]

I meant on SS. The only vote he's placed so far was on me and he unvoted a while ago.

[SirCakez]

AI's Titus tunnel is very bad.
However Titus do you still think the Rhazh slot is scum?

[SirCakez]

Titus has Fire not changed your read on the slot at all?
I don't want to wagon Titus or EE today.

[SirCakez]

Yeah I did. I still think Titus is town right now.

[SirCakez]

Why is townreading Titus scummy?

[SirCakez]

Because I like her reads and she's not doing anything scummy?

[SirCakez]

The fact Cow still hasn't placed a vote irritates me.
Pretty sure Viva vs Titus is T v T honestly.

[SirCakez]

Because I like her reads and she's not doing anything scummy?

[SirCakez]

The Yonom 180 doesn't even look like a thing to me since it was within the span of two posts. At least from what I saw in her ISO.

[SirCakez]

Like it wasn't a 180.

[SirCakez]

Depends.

[SirCakez]

Fire go read the thread please, it'll be useful.

[SirCakez]

If SS does flip town somehow then I would obviously reevaluate my reads. My reads right now are based on SS being scum.

[SirCakez]

Because Titus, EE, AI and Rhazh/Fire all have associative with SS. Some are townreading and some are scum reading so his flip will be invaluable to sorting those reads further.

[SirCakez]

Asbit stands, a SS lynch would bring us somewhere I want to be.

Then why haven't you voted him?

[SirCakez]

Why do you call everyone who town reads you whiteknighting?

[SirCakez]

You're considering it which is close enough.

[SirCakez]

^Too many townreads; only two scumreads which have both been super easy targets. Come up with some better scumreads. Make some enemies.

This is such a terrible post, especially the last sentence.
I like my EE town read more and more.

[SirCakez]

Nah I like my reads.

[SirCakez]

What is your read on EE pistach?

[SirCakez]

I don't think anyone is scumreading EE right now except you.

[SirCakez]

You think voting her will make her engage? She'll just keep repeating what she's said and calling her wagon scum-led. Besides, if you notice, she does have an understandable (understandably wrong, but still) reason to vote me. EE on the other hand has a bunch of lies and misrepresentations.
Vote EE with me and make HIM engage.

This is so bad. So you're saying voting Titus is pointless because she won't explain anything, so we should vote Eagle, who actually explained his reads and case, instead?

[SirCakez]

[SirCakez]

Wouldn't scum have desperation as well?

[SirCakez]

I like how AI's scumread on Eagle suddenly developed only when Eagle started to get pressured by other players.

[SirCakez]

Titus you remind me of someone I play with on another site in a good way.

I like how AI's scumread on Eagle suddenly developed only when Eagle started to get pressured by other players.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlati ... _causation

I think it does in this case.

I like how AI's scumread on Eagle suddenly developed only when Eagle started to get pressured by other players.

...I've been pressuring Eagle for a while?

Pedit: Sorry Eagle I misread your question. I thought you meant why I responded to Titus taking me seriously by saying "lol you guys realize that was a joke right".
I thought Titus's "you're scum with Rhazh" was a joke, so I joked back.

Peditedit: AI, Eagle is right, stop using Wikipedia to defend yourself.

I mean AI made no mention of an Eagle scumread until the pressuring from multiple players had been going on for a bit.

[SirCakez]

Drixx said he deleted it from his outbox which means Viva never opened it as it would have been in sent messages if it was opened.

[SirCakez]

Eagle, I already answered it. My response to the quoted post of Titus's was to make that joke, as I thought there was no way she could be serious that early, especially saying "Discuss."

Pedit: Going on a bit? Really? That's saying he's scummy for changing his mind in the face of new information.

There wasn't "new information". The posts Eagle is being scumread for (the "misrepresentation" of the SS case) were there before he started being seriously pressured.

[SirCakez]

Yeah I think we lynch Cow tomorrow.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: TheCow
I like this vote better.

[SirCakez]

You're probably scum when Titus flips town. I've given my reasons for townreading Titus and you're ignoring them to further your own goals.

[SirCakez]

You're probably scum when Titus flips town. I've given my reasons for townreading Titus and you're ignoring them to further your own goals.

Please convince me that Titus is town.

-Confident in reads and not jumping between people whenever pressure moves to them
-The Yonom associative "issue" was explained by her and was not scummy like Viva is pushing it to be.
-Did give a defense unlike how Viva is claiming. 574 for example.
-Actually has good reads.

[SirCakez]

^please wagon this.

[SirCakez]

Hey Viva
What if Titus is town?
More votes on Cow please

[SirCakez]

And right now, ironically enough Viva is deathtunneling Titus.

[SirCakez]

Viva's reads are hilariously wrong.

[SirCakez]

This is scum Cow, I've seen it several times offsite. Fake scumhunting, extremely disinterested in the game, loads of shitposts, prodging frequently.

[SirCakez]

I literally just watched two games finish with scum Cow. I know his play.

[SirCakez]

Except you've flaked all of those games and those were all town games.

[SirCakez]

I've already substantiated why Cow is scum here.

[SirCakez]

No he's scum because this is his exact scum game I've witnessed multiple times. The fact he hasn't flaked out of this game yet is already abnormal.

[SirCakez]

If he's town I jump off a cliff.

[SirCakez]

http://blankmediagames.com/phpbb/search ... &start=175

Best example.

[SirCakez]

You aren't going to get NKed because your reads are completely off.

[SirCakez]

Titus I hope that's a good thing.
It's not cherry picked, it's very recent. I don't think Cow even has a scum game on site.

[SirCakez]

Or you're just scum who already knew SS was town and knew he was going to be lynched so tried to take advantage.

[SirCakez]

Still deathtunneling

[SirCakez]

EE is absolutely right. Viva is voting/scum reading whoever disagrees with her Titus tunnel and not who's actually scum.

[SirCakez]

I like how he only mentions this after Viva places a vote.

[SirCakez]

Good question.

[SirCakez]

Yeah your reads are bad and based on your own bias.

[SirCakez]

Nah Titus is town.

[SirCakez]

No bad dragon that's a bad wagon.

[SirCakez]

I will enjoy Viva's reaction to Titus's town flip.
Like look at cow's vote in Titus. Absolutely no conviction in his reads.

[SirCakez]

No bad dragon that's a bad wagon.

I am a good dragon, toothless is good.

Toothless is flying the wrong way.

[SirCakez]

We wagon Viva when Titus flips town, yeah?

[SirCakez]

Posted them earlier.

[SirCakez]

Your arrogance is both completely misplaced and terribly wrong.

[SirCakez]

Same applies to you.

[SirCakez]

What, why? He's done nothing all game.

[SirCakez]

We wagon Viva when Titus flips town, yeah?

I would go with EE if Titus flips town. But I don't think Titus is going to flip town.

[SirCakez]

Cerberus you said you could do more analysis with flips. What do the two flips tell you?

[SirCakez]

I don't see the scumminess from Pistachion honestly.

[SirCakez]

AI can you make a new reads list?

[SirCakez]

I don't see the scumminess from Pistachion honestly.

So you're townreading Titus and you think that Pistachion's "oh we can just lynch Titus if she's wrong" line was okay?
Do you even have the capacity for cognitive dissonance?

I just looked through her ISO. Not seeing it.

[SirCakez]

You're an alt, yeah?

[SirCakez]

So Viva let me get this straight
-You've never played a game with Cow except this one
-You've never played a game with scum Cow
-You've never seen a game with scum Cow

I'm pretty sure my meta read on him is better then yours.
Viva feels like awful town to me.

I really want to hear Cerberus's thoughts so no hammer please.

[SirCakez]

AI can you make a new reads list?

[SirCakez]

Cerberus is Titus a high townread for you now? The homegirl comment implies so.

[SirCakez]

Titus being conftown is a stretch.
Viva wrong game

[SirCakez]

I never called him "confirmed scum".

[SirCakez]

Why that vote AI? I agree with him about FB.

[SirCakez]

Viva can you stop your vanity wagon on Titus and vote Cow already?

[SirCakez]

Because Titus, EE, AI and Rhazh/Fire all have associative with SS. Some are townreading and some are scum reading so his flip will be invaluable to sorting those reads further.

can you take us through how your reads in these players have changed?

Titus read is no longer as strong of a townread, but I think her tunnel mainly came from her tell which obviously didn't work out and not from scum intention.
EE read is weaker town since he was a high scumread of SS. I personally didn't see whatever SS was seeing and think Eagle's posts are fine but always have to consider the reads of the dead town.
AI is stronger town since he was defending SS consistently in a blatant way scum wouldn't and I don't see it as white knighting.
Rhazh/Fire more likely scum for lurking out the SS wagon and being a scumread of SS's. He's also doing the same thing today so a good candidate for scum.

[SirCakez]

Pretty sure she explained her tell although it obviously didn't work out
Why not lynch Fire?

[SirCakez]

Pretty sure she explained her tell although it obviously didn't work out
Why not lynch Fire?

Why not lynch you?
Your definitely in my top 3 scum reads

Not even aimed at you.

[SirCakez]

Eagle, you seem to have an answer for everybody's play. It seems that you know what is going on a little too well.

This is pretty bad. Just because he's making analyses he "knows what's going on too well"?

[SirCakez]

Except his reasons make sense?

[SirCakez]

Eagle can you do a reads list? Your stances are disorganized, I'll give AI that.
P-Edit: Hopefully I'm not one of those people

[SirCakez]

AI do you think Eagle's white knighting or something?

[SirCakez]

Ehhh.... I'm too tired to do cakez right now. @sc, could you give reads and explanations for any places you disagree with me?

I agree with basically all of your reads except Pistachio is a null read for me, basically like you said earlier he doesn't seem particularly townie or scummy and honestly I'm having a rough time sorting him atm, and Cow is high scum for reasons I've dissected in thread already.

[SirCakez]

Viva stop saying my Cow read sucks

So Viva let me get this straight
-You've never played a game with Cow except this one
-You've never played a game with scum Cow
-You've never seen a game with scum Cow

I'm pretty sure my meta read on him is better then yours.
Viva feels like awful town to me.

I really want to hear Cerberus's thoughts so no hammer please.

And all these vanity votes and no voters need to move their votes somewhere useful. The only vanity vote I'd consider voting right now is FB.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: Firebringer
Cow still needs rope but this slot is going unpressured and needs some badly.

[SirCakez]

KAAG I've been wanting to vote FB for a while now. It's clear in my ISO. Cow's wagon is just completely dead and I want to pressure another slot that's received none all game. I'm still confident in a lynch of Cow.
Eagle if you want to lynch Fire join us on his wagon.

[SirCakez]

Never mind that part then.

[SirCakez]

It's not bussing, he's just scummy?

[SirCakez]

Not impressed with Fire's defense so far.

[SirCakez]

Viva why do you think Karnage is scum?

[SirCakez]

My reads aren't the same as Titus's. Mainly it's our two top scum reads that align. She think Viva and Pistach are scum for example and I don't.
And yeah Droog unvoted me pretty quickly. Suggesting I would shoot him as scum after he unvoted me easily is absurd.

[SirCakez]

If I was scum and wanted to get rid of a threat, why wouldn't I shoot someone like you who has been consistently scumreading me?

[SirCakez]

^ was aimed at AI
Droog was a kill aimed to not upset the game state I think, since he did fairly little. Which means the wrong people were in the spotlight.

[SirCakez]

AI was much more active, not sure about who's the better player but I'm pretty new still so I couldn't judge well.

I mean the people like Titus, Eagle and I who were pushing the SS wagon and would consequently become suspicious after the town flip of SS.

[SirCakez]

I didn't do anything. I'm just explaining why I wouldn't have shot droog if I was scum.

[SirCakez]

I didn't do anything. I'm just explaining why I wouldn't have shot droog if I was scum.

[SirCakez]

I speak the truth, young Always.

[SirCakez]

I'm gonna look hella stupid if FB flips town but something tells me that he's not going to flip town.

Then why aren't you voting him?

[SirCakez]

I'm gonna look hella stupid if FB flips town but

something tells me that he's not going to flip town.

Pretty sure FB is town

as well based on wagon makeup.

In the same post? Is he town or not?

[SirCakez]

You said "flip town" twice in the same sentence so I interpreted it that way.

[SirCakez]

Good, maybe we'll get a wagon on scum through without your noise.

[SirCakez]

VOTE: Viva

Don't care. Can't hunt with the noise. Kill it or me. Ty.

Good, maybe we'll get a wagon on scum through without your noise.

Yeah...again I get this little yucky feeling that you are just sheeping Titus. I'm not convinced she's scum, but I do begin to think you are.

If I were to give in to Viva's insistence that Titus needs to die and voted Titus, what do I learn if she flips Town? Not a lot: the one pushing her is prob!town.

But if you die, we learn from your flip, as you were the D1 counter-wagon. And while Droog did unvote you on D1, where would his vote have gone on D2 after SS flipped town? There's a reason Droog was targeted IMHO...

I'm still pretty suspicious of TheCow, but I think I'm going to:

UNVOTE: TheCow
VOTE: SirCakez

Because A) you may well be scum, and B) if we do mislynch, you are the best mislynch.

How is this sheeping? Like half the game has called Viva out for making noise at this point?

[SirCakez]

Viva your reads are garbage because you're just townreading everyone who agrees with you and scumreading those who disagree which is a shitty way to do reads and not actually indicative of who's scum and who's town.

[SirCakez]

I could see scum in the town block. The only person I'm really hard town reading of the group is Titus.

[SirCakez]

Actually what are people thinking of Karnage? That slot has been lurky all game.

[SirCakez]

What Eagle says goes into my theory of why droog was killed. Scum didn't want to kill someone loud or active because in the current game state with Titus, Eagle and I being wagoned by Viva and AI, all of the scum are being allowed to successfully lurk out of the spotlight and no one's giving a hard look to these lurkers. If they had killed someone in the spotlight like Viva then attention would have shifted off of the people attention is on now.

[SirCakez]

No because right now the lynches on the table are Titus and myself which is what scum wants. It doesn't POE down the lurkers because the lurkers aren't getting pressured enough.
I honestly don't remember Yonom's posts at all. Super forgettable which is not a good thing.

[SirCakez]

No because right now the lynches on the table are Titus and myself which is what scum wants. It doesn't POE down the lurkers because the lurkers aren't getting pressured enough.
I honestly don't remember Yonom's posts at all. Super forgettable which is not a good thing.

Firebringer is also an option...

Yeah but that lynch is being disabled by the wagons on you and I right now.

And I'm not seeing the towniness from Karnage. He came in, dropped some questions and placed a pointless vanity vote on KAAG then left.

[SirCakez]

No one on the Titus wagon has expressed interest in voting Fire and Viva is refusing to vote Fire because Titus and I are voting him. So maybe KAAG could be moved to vote Fire but I doubt any of those other voters will move.

[SirCakez]

If Titus is scum then she successfully buddied the hell out of me which would be sad.

[SirCakez]

Totally down for wagonning AI too. He's doing everything in his power to avoid taking a stance on Firebringer.

Don't want to go here today at all. I want AI to take a stance but I don't want to wagon him for it.

[SirCakez]

AI do you think Fire's lurking is indicative of town or scum?

[SirCakez]

KAAG where are you at with Firebringer right now?

[SirCakez]

Viva how do you think Fire's lurking out his wagon is indicative of town?

[SirCakez]

Lynch it with fire! (Sorry I had to)

[SirCakez]

Fire can you give us a readslist?

[SirCakez]

Don't want an AI wagon right now. His posts look pretty townie to me other then taking too long to take a stance on Titus vs Fire.

[SirCakez]

Why is Cow top town?

[SirCakez]

His posts day one or two?
Karnage needs a prod and Cow will need one in four hours also.

[SirCakez]

They're OK. I'm not feeling the AI push though. I'd like it if he gave reads on the other half of the player list that I'm actually having trouble sorting. If he keeps up the activity and doesnt go back to lurking my read might improve.

And yeah Fire's a pretty likable guy, at least from what I've seen so far. Don't know if it would affect your read on him but it's not affecting mine.

[SirCakez]

Read List 2.1

{AlwaysInnocent}

{KAAG}

{Viva La Gloria}

{Cerberus v666, Karnage}

{pistachi0n}

{Titus, SirCakez, Firebringer}

{TheCow, Eagle}

No explanation. Screw you.

Fire what's opportunistic about these reads?

[SirCakez]

Yeah Titus did back off the Fire scum read too easily, agree with AI on that.
Don't sue me over a compliment please.

[SirCakez]

AI and KAAG are obv town. I don't like how Fire is pushing obvtown AI based on nonexistent opportunistic reads.

[SirCakez]

See Fire you are likable.
Viva would you wagon Karnage?

[SirCakez]

OK good one read we agree on at least.

[SirCakez]

He's scummier than Titus. Her push was single-minded; Cakez has entered every debate on every topic, changed his vote on a single word from Titus (post 1228) and throws spurious logic around about "read confidence is a town tell" and "N1 kill was not to 'unbalance' the game" like confetti.

Being involved is scummy?
I was already scumreading Fire, not like I developed the scumread because Titus told me to.
That logic was good and I already explained why.

[SirCakez]

AI and KAAG are obv town. I don't like how Fire is pushing obvtown AI based on nonexistent opportunistic reads.

Huh?

What's huh about this?

[SirCakez]

The first quote was about FB, not AI. I said I didn't want to push AI then said my Fire read would improve if he kept up activity.