(1765) Star Wars: The Force Awakens [D5]

[Venmar]

Holy fuck can we all just stop making wall posts where there are like 50 quotes you are giving one line responses to? They are fucking awful and I struggle digesting them. I don't care what you think about every single thing said, just compact your thoughts into well-made concise posts please, thanks

[Venmar]

Mostly caught up now.

Not sure what to think other than that I think Trollie is OK, and that a lot of the suspicion on him looks like confirmation-bias based on that really odd scumread people put on him based on his first post.

My gut tells me to go with Aneninem, I haven't liked almost all of his posts.

VOTE: Aneninem

I think a lot of people here are

trying

to scumhunt but :shrug: I feel like they're just grasping and nitpicking a lot of the time.

[Venmar]

I am also not a big fan of Camn advocating any kind of a massclaim. It shouldn't even be discussed this early unless she has a reason to. Would like to hear a concise reason from her as to why she thinks it's a good idea and what prompted her to propose it in the first place.

Snarky's hated claim is also something I want to test but I know a lot of you won't be willing to do that. A Hated claim is grounds for a policy lynch/test a lot of the time since town or not they're dangerous to leave alive lategame in fear of scum quickhammers and because it's an easy claim scum can attempt to hide behind and say "NO WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING DON'T VOTE ME AHHHHHHHHHH"

[camn]

Thats what I am saying about the hated thing!

In re: claim- I have a LOT of good reasons, most of which revolve around controlling night actions and outing scum. But I agree that there could be a lot of unintended consequences, and I am not totally pushing this. Especially since it would have to be done correctly, and mostly people are not up to that. It requires a pretty high level of coordinated townplay- which we may or may not have. I will come back around to this on Day 3, I think.. if I still live.

As to why? I come from a generation of gamebreakers. Maybe things are different now. But Reck is from the same crop- and almost certainly we should break this setup open before the end of the game.

[Aeronaut]

Catching up since I have some free time.

p

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7-

8

The only thing that makes me feel strange about trollie is the fact that he has been absent

Well there's a lot of people absent, and there are people who when you posted this had only posted once. Are you saying it's strange for trollie as a player to be absent because he is usually active, or are you saying it's weird that he's absent in general?

If the second one, why weren't you suspicious of the other inactive people?

Trollie is a 2012 account with modding experience. There's no way he doesn't know what pre-game talk is. Lone Wolf is probably his partner. If he did have meta with Trollie, I would expect him just to let RC know, not let him know and then vote him. Sounds like someone's getting a little too protective.

town

Trollie is a 2012 account with modding experience. There's no way he doesn't know what pre-game talk is. Lone Wolf is probably his partner. If he did have meta with Trollie, I would expect him just to let RC know, not let him know and then vote him. Sounds like someone's getting a little too protective.

literally 100% same thoughts as I had.

town

So RC is town for having the saying he agreed with Tails on that one issue (of you being town)? No.

I don't want to vote anyone right now before I see a vote count but...
RC is town
Tails is probtown

EE & Aero could easily be scum

Suspicious of Snarky and Amihan

Ok, so if the above is true, why does RC agreeing with Tails on something make RC

more town

than tails?

Vigilante target #1: SnarkySnowman

?????

VOTE: Amihan
Pretty much everyone who claims town in the first two pages turns out to be scum, in my experience.

I have no observation like that, but this is the page top of the THIRD page, so NOW I can say that I'm town.

TROLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!

Amihan and Aneninen confirmed not scum together, remember this future self.

How?

1. I am town
2. I am usually right

I'm actually just getting some strong gut-townvibes from Amihan since coming back.

however

@Amihan

do you really feel like scum would claim a double voter?

[Aeronaut]

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!

Huh. I just clicked Trollies GTKAS link and God a "not authorized to view this forum". Weird.

Anyway...this has been a lot of talk.
I see a few little questions for me- mostly they are not worth getting into right now... But I'll hit them later.

Trollies reenterence is scummy as fuck. It's crazy...but more later.
Also Amihan seems very confused about things.

Let's get after that:
Trollie-
" now" is just a turn of the phrase in American English. Like "listen,-" , "look,-" , or "but seriously,-"
That answered.... Please explain your first post to Amihan. What happened there? Why did you post that, and then where did you disappear to? Where did you hear about "pregame talk" . break it down, cuz its been a major item here while you have been away.

More soon.

I feel like a lot of things happened in the game since your last post, yet you go with answering the grammar question about the Now word. Seeeeems selective.

In general I may take a dive into camp's meta, and see if she's always this passive about not answering anybody's questions.

It was half read-list/half action-list.
"Comfortable" = they do not require my immediate attention.
"Same-wavelength. More please." = similar opinions expressed but require more input.
"Who are you guys?" = please post.
"Not scum-reading, but not quite on the same page." = good and bad. Require attention to figure out positions.
"Uncomfortable" = made a stink.
"Fist of suspicion" = require

immediate

sorting.

Okay.
This goes for the rest of your post too.

I use too many words

What did you mean by this?

I don't want to vote anyone right now before I see a vote count but...
RC is town
Tails is probtown

EE & Aero could easily be scum

Suspicious of Snarky and Amihan

Why do you need a vote count for getting reads? Or was that for voting? Although at this game phase I don't get that either.
I'm reading your other posts, too. They're okay. For now.

I.e I thought it was suspicious that Aneninen ruled out all other options.

Need I care

now

if he's [Trollie] Mason or something like that?

Also, there are two wagons on RadiantCowbells.

Isn't he voting for me?

Aninainensaininininennim's questions here look like they're being asked for the sake of asking questions and looking busy. Looking at most of them, I don't really know what info he plans to even get out of them.

I'm hoping there is a vote redirector that puts RCs vote on RC no matter what

This is hilarious, and will likely be featured in my next game

@Key what is it that we're not on the same page about?

Re-reading your ISO, we do actually hold similar positions on a various items:

- Aneninen's post 14 (post 61)
- wanting Tails to explain his reads (but not out-right agreeing with your "you're scum in my mind" comment).
- similar confusion on camn's "he is probably scum this game and we should Lynch him" post.
- Extrapolated Eagle's emotional "overreaction" was alarming (post 72)
- read/stance on SnarkySnowman's intro post 110

+1

I believe I was originally not 'comfortable' with you due to your interactions with RadiantCowbells (pre-flip associations )

I'm going to review my read on RadiantCowbells next.

I used to actually really pick on people for doing pre-flip associatives; but then I sort of thought about it and realized that if I see something off between two players, it might be more beneficial to point it out so on Day 5 I or whoever is still alive can look back on it for later.

also

Spoiler: small sidenote about key (not alignment indicative)

I don't know if I ever have mentioned this, but i've generally come to like your style of posting in the games I play with you. More and more popular on this site has been the nonchalant, one word and naked votes by certain players that seems to be really growing as meta here; i'm even guilty of it. I really like that you tend to have a more structured and unique way of presenting your thoughts on the game, and it's one of the reasons I usually enjoy playing with you.
/end sidenote

No, trollie- we are not getting off of you. We are hanging you.

First things first- lets come back to your first post. Why did you write it? Why wont you explain it? The people who called you out on it- you call them town. This implies you KNOW that it was scummy. So explain. In plain words.

Second- this attack of yours..Im going to show the town how you made it up. You are trying to pull a crapcase out of thin air, because you are scum and you are scared to try a nightkill on me.

what made you change your mind against the massclaim which was, in fact, something YOU threw out there?

Im asking WHY, WHEN, and HOW you changed your mind from "hey guys maybe we should mass-map-claim" to "NO WE DEF DONT WANT TO KNOW THAT SHIT"

So- I never changed my mind. I am clear about this. I, at ALL TIMES, think/thought it is worth discussing. I, AT NO TIME, am saying we should do it immediately. This is plain as day. This may be subtle- but I dont think so.

Spoiler: Let >ME< be the one to bold for emphasis:

I haven't thought it through yet.... But it is kicking around in my head it

might

be worthwhile

I can table the thought for now... But it seems like it is maybe something worth doing

at some point.

Im Not necessarily saying we gotta do this

... But what are your thoughts AGAINST

I absolutely do not want anyone coming in here saying what the map gets them...OR saying it doesn't get them anything.

As you can see above- my veiw has certainly not changed. Now the idea that Trollie is floating that it HAS- its a crapcase, pure and simple. There is no way to read my posts any other way.

That, combined with Trollies TOTAL LACK of anything redeeming coming into this game puts him squarely scum.
You guys- I wanna see a Trollie wagon again. He wasnt here for the first one. Lets do it again. Maybe he will vanish again, though.

Keyser- after Cowbells look at Trollie.

tbh I actually think this is a pretty good rebuttal to trollie, though. I'm really not a fan of camn this game, but trollie here looks like he really is taking things out of thin air; basically it looks exactly like the kind of argument where scum take a quick skim of someone's post, and then immediately call them out without really paying attention, just to look busy. +1

Back from Vegas. I'll read up and give me thoughts in a bit. Maybe.

The maybe at the end of this sentence really pissed me off.

I feel a great disturbance in the Force: RadiantCowbells

VOTE: Camn

Start talking, sweet cheeks.

This is not a RVS vote. This feels like RadiantCowbells with an ulterior motive (aka scum finding an awkward entrance into the game via a player).

Wagon on Tails is sketchy.

How can RadiantCowbells hold this position by post 17?

Continuation with the latch-onto-camn narrative:

Spoiler:

Camn needs to post more, pronto.

Again, camn?

Camn, do you ever roll town?

I think Camn is scum but I know that you're scum.

Moves vote to Aeronaut:

VOTE: Aeronaut

Camn, should I not find it odd and scummy that you are unwilling to engage me here when I'd expect the first thing you'd do as town is to engage me?

It almost feels like you suggested that you be bussed in pregame but your team was on the fence about it so you guys decided that you'd stay away from me while you get your team to pressure me and lock me down.

And that's exactly what Aeronaut feels like he's doing.

I expect you to talk with me! jeez.

Camn finally posts:

I'm just hungover!
God!

Well, fine.

After all this 'theatre' RadiantCowbells is now happy with camn's simple "I'm just hungover!" explanation.

Camn, I think that you're town.

Besides the fact that she didn't immediately engage with me, she's been actually pretty towny, which makes me think that she's town.

This isn't a player simply changing his read (non-alignment indicative)... this is RadiantCowbells with a manufactured entrance and fake read, which inevitably ends with a predictable town-read on camn (reasons?>>>

"actually pretty towny, which makes me think that she's town"

= generic/easy town read).

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

Yea. RC has been acting extremely bizarre this game for sure. Usually he's called the scum team and the game's over by now.

No, trollie- we are not getting off of you. We are hanging you.

First things first- lets come back to your first post. Why did you write it? Why wont you explain it? The people who called you out on it- you call them town. This implies you KNOW that it was scummy. So explain. In plain words.

Second- this attack of yours..Im going to show the town how you made it up. You are trying to pull a crapcase out of thin air, because you are scum and you are scared to try a nightkill on me.

what made you change your mind against the massclaim which was, in fact, something YOU threw out there?

Im asking WHY, WHEN, and HOW you changed your mind from "hey guys maybe we should mass-map-claim" to "NO WE DEF DONT WANT TO KNOW THAT SHIT"

So- I never changed my mind. I am clear about this. I, at ALL TIMES, think/thought it is worth discussing. I, AT NO TIME, am saying we should do it immediately. This is plain as day. This may be subtle- but I dont think so.

Spoiler: Let >ME< be the one to bold for emphasis:

I haven't thought it through yet.... But it is kicking around in my head it

might

be worthwhile

I can table the thought for now... But it seems like it is maybe something worth doing

at some point.

Im Not necessarily saying we gotta do this

... But what are your thoughts AGAINST

I absolutely do not want anyone coming in here saying what the map gets them...OR saying it doesn't get them anything.

As you can see above- my veiw has certainly not changed. Now the idea that Trollie is floating that it HAS- its a crapcase, pure and simple. There is no way to read my posts any other way.

That, combined with Trollies TOTAL LACK of anything redeeming coming into this game puts him squarely scum.
You guys- I wanna see a Trollie wagon again. He wasnt here for the first one. Lets do it again. Maybe he will vanish again, though.

Keyser- after Cowbells look at Trollie.

ugh yall are so annoying

camn im ignoring you now because i think you are town and paying attention to you is making me angry

I dont like the RC wagon. I think those arguments are bad and I think, actually, that you just strengthened my town read on Tyco RC

Welp, you can't really beat the rebuttal of "ugh you're annoying"

GG camn

[Aeronaut]

also, fuck saying you don't like the RC wagon because "the arguments are bad"

booo

[Aeronaut]

More catchup after I stuff my face with some sushi

[Tails]

This Anen wagon is terrible. Trollie still needs to happen.

[TheTrollie]

anemin is different than aero right?

I wanna vote aero

[Aeronaut]

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can't pass this up

VOTE: camn

<3

I have to admit i'm pretty confused with Wolf's posting up to this point. Like not even scummy, just bizarre in my opinion.

Leave camn alone jeez I think she's actually town in this one.

but camn why haven't you given me someone to vote?

Weird RC is being weird.

Sorry, my bad.

Cowbells- lets run up Trollie and see what shakes out, huh?

VOTE: Trollie

At lease you're voting scum, though.

I don't see camn as scum at all. That said, I think if camn is scum, they're partnered with RC. I like my vote where it is atm.

Snarky, i'd love you to post like 1000x more than you're posting. You kind of just showed up, claimed, and then left the building.

Amihan

pls convince me to join you on the SS wagon

Yuck.

Tails is feeling pretty town to me.

If that should confirm anything at all, it's that Trollie has NO access to any pre-game talks.

^^^
Still troubled with this...

.

I think it's inexperience falling for the fake town slip. He really didn't take the time to think about it, which points to town. (Oh look, I explained a read...)

Are you talking about aneninen here?

Did you really think I was talking about Keyser?

I mean you did quote him.

What's up that you want me to talk about EE?

I don't know. I feel kind of lost right now and I dint know why. You seem kind of lost feeling too. Tails feels all weird, like... I think he's town but he keeps attacking people and it feels like it's for no reason like there's no push or anything, he just wants people to NOT work with him. And keysor is talking a lot and I like him but I feel like a lot of people are ignoring him reads wise. And aneninen is very certain he wants to go in his direction, but as usual that's perpendicular to the directions town and scum are trying to go. And trollie feels so weirdly about his posts (because they're plural now) but I can't seem to comprehend him acting that way as scum. It's just really not pro anything.

I don't know I guess I feel like my strong reads are the people who done post anything and then as soon as they start posting I get all wishy washy about them. I don't think I've ever been this uncertain about EVERYONE before and I don't know why I'm looking to you for direction, but maybe it's because I feel like I at least understand you a little bit?

help?

I feel really confused why you would go to the person who's literally sheeping another player to help you with reads. That doesn't make any sense to me.

I think that Adenine's scum.

I'll try to make a case on him.

Who's Adenine referring to?

Too many "A" names that are annoying to type.

Spoiler: I've spoiled what is literally Wolf's entire ISO and spared you from ludicrous amounts of scrolling

Get everybody and their stuff together

ok

3

2

1

VOTE: Tails

The Trollie I know doesn't think that fast RC

Unvote:
Vote: RadiantCowbells

Damn caught on page 1....

Sorry Trollie

Tails I think you've been buddied by scum a bit too easily.

I was about to let RC have a pass and just let him know, but him calling the Tails wagon suspect so early pinged my gut.

shits and giggles

And I'm sure his getting an extra vote to put him in the lead had nothing to do with it...

I don't know what you're trying to say here.

Because Camn's is RVS. Lone Wolf's is not. He went for the larger potential wagon that could protect Trollie.

That's a bit of stretch to be making but it could just be due to your inexperience

Vigilante target #1: SnarkySnowman

VOTE: Amihan
Pretty much everyone who claims town in the first two pages turns out to be scum, in my experience.

I have no observation like that, but this is the page top of the THIRD page, so NOW I can say that I'm town.

TROLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!

Amihan and Aneninen confirmed not scum together, remember this future self.

this checks out.

You literally just quoted the whole ISO and then said "this checks out" and you're trying to pass that as a real read.

Bitch, pls

RC's posts are getting a bit better over time

They're really not.

Let me show the real version of my thought process:

Yes I'm voting people who have voted Trolliel, currently camn, because I think he's in his careless town state of mind. I believe this is being exploited by ambitious scum.

Wait, you're voting Camn but you think he's town? i'm not sure I'm following your logic.

[Tails]

Aero, Lone Wolf is scum. Just deal with it.

[Aeronaut]

If camn is town the only scumread I have is Eagle but I was trying to keep that under wraps

Unvote
Vote: Eagle

WTF why are you trying to keep your scum reads under wraps?
Also, you literally said less than a day ago that you were leaning scum on RC. Also also, you called snarky a good option for a Vig shot. But EE is your only scumread? what?

In general, I don't get the "interaction pattern" of the players at all. I can see at least three possible scenarios, but all of them would be based upon partner speculations. Camn, Trollie, RC – at least one of them must be scum and I know it's pretty much no-content.

Why

must

there be scum in the three of them either? Just because they're the three people viable for a lynch besides you?

The Trollie I know doesn't think that fast RC

Damn caught on page 1....

Sorry Trollie

Because Camn's is RVS. Lone Wolf's is not. He went for the larger potential wagon that could protect Trollie.

That's a bit of stretch to be making but it could just be due to your inexperience

15 and 18 both protect you.

15?

Again that seems to be a stretch to call voting a not Trollie wagon on page 1 defending

Let me show the real version of my thought process:

Yes I'm voting people who have voted Trolliel, currently camn, because I think he's in his careless town state of mind. I believe this is being exploited by ambitious scum.

Tails vote is basically RVS with me ignoring the so called "Trollie slip" since I thought it was a town slip.

Explained RC vote.

camn's push on Trollie feels off, mostly because I'd expect other competent town players to be reading Trollie the same as myself.

If you mean direct interaction with Trollie that's not on me, there isn't much I need from him.

.... Because you're scum with him? Legitimate question.

"Yes, I admit Trollie is weird, but...LOOK OVER THERE!
...
And that's why he's town. Now who were we talking about and can we lynch Camn?"

Tails is town, confirmed.

VOTE: TheLoneWolf

Yea. I'm feeling this lynch. Trollie is bad too.

[Aeronaut]

Me, too. If we are talking about the same person.

VOTE: Aneninen

Dont misunderstand- I will come back to trollie with furious anger at any provocation. But this town needs a wagon.

Well... it's not like trollie doesn't have a wagon behind it. If you were planning on trying to get a wagon going for the town, I don't get why you wouldn't just join the trollie one.

~ Why has nobody seemingly talked about the fact snowman claimed hated

I personally think he's town for it; I also do agree though that we should test it out at some point, because he could actually coast all the way to the end with that claim.

I am also not a big fan of Camn advocating any kind of a massclaim. It shouldn't even be discussed this early unless she has a reason to. Would like to hear a concise reason from her as to why she thinks it's a good idea and what prompted her to propose it in the first place.

Would also like to hear this.

Feeling like Venmar is pretty town with his recent postings as well. Still just kind of gut there right now, though.

[Aeronaut]

Holy fuck can we all just stop making wall posts where there are like 50 quotes you are giving one line responses to? They are fucking awful and I struggle digesting them. I don't care what you think about every single thing said, just compact your thoughts into well-made concise posts please, thanks

I also legitimately apologize for making literally five wall posts as soon as you said this...

[camn]

Would also like to hear this.

Read more, post less. I addressed it.

[Amihan]

Does anyone want to talk with me about anything actually important? This already feels like a 20 page game just by how far behind I am after only a day away. And I can't afford much more time.

[Aeronaut]

Reads List v. 1.01

Town

{Keyser Söze, Tails}

Key

just all game is really striking me with a town logic; most of of his reads I agree with, and it seems like they all had a logical progression to them.

Tails

... has a bit less of a progression, but at the same time a lot of his posting seems really organic and genuine and I find myself feeling like he believes what he's saying. No scum theatre here.

Town for Today

[Gut Reads + Snarky]

{SnarkySnowman, Venmar, Amihan}

Since my catchup,

Venmar

and

Amihan

have both struck me as town for now. For example, Amihan is being p aggressive in some places, but it really doesn't feel like scum-theatre aggressive, more like "i'm pissed off because everyone's voting me for my first post" aggressive. Venmar is also coming in way stronger / bolderish then i'd really expect scum to. They're both town for today.

As for

SS

, I don't feel like he (or really anyone) would make a hated townie claim as scum. Although, me saying that kind of makes it WIFOM, so eh. I really like Ven's idea of testing him out for later, to see if he's telling the truth. I don't feel like that's really the right move for today, though, so i'm fine waiting on that.

Nullbys

{The Bulge}

Isn't bulge due for a prod or something? He's posted literally once.

Scum Lite™

{Aneninen, Extrapolated Eagle, Camn, RadiantCowbells}

I really hated

Aneninen's

#186; it was literally a whole post where he was asking useless questions that are only there to show he's doing stuff. His wagon feels kind of weird to me right now though.

Eagle

feels like (and honestly has mentioned several times) that he doesn't have any sort of direction right now. While those posts themselves don't seem very fabricated, I feel like complaining about having no direction or sense of who to push is a good way for scum to coast through this game.

Camn

is really strange, especially with RC. I feel like she should have more paranoia about RC being like that to her. Some of her motivations on things are also weird to me; especially why she would want a masjclaim this early.

RC

is

still

weird to me. This is the first time I've seen him ever act this passive / sheepish. It's starting to feel like something I might want to leave alone for a bit, though. It's not indicative from what i've seen from RC, period.

Scum

{TheTrollie, TheLoneWolf}

TheTrollie:

* Weird Unexplained townread on RC, which also makes zero sense with his Tails townread.
* Trollie answers an entire post from camn calling him out, by saying "you're annoying!" and ignoring the rest.
* "I don't like the RC wagon because the arguments are bad"
* Post 234, where Trollie posts Wolf's entire ISO and says "it checks out" after being asked about his thoughts on Wolf. This is a weird-ass interaction
* General unwillingless to give detailed comments about really anything; strange reactions with no real motivations in general.

With

TheLoneWolf

, a lot of that is similar; just straight up weirdness when it comes to talking about Trollie. In addition, I'm honestly failing to see any town motivation for most of what he's doing. Posts like 171 just seem like trying to look busy, and honestly the fact that he has like one scumread is sus as fuck. Finally, there's various people he's said were scum reads that he doesn't push. I'm feeling really strong scum vibes here.

[Aeronaut]

Does anyone want to talk with me about anything actually important? This already feels like a 20 page game just by how far behind I am after only a day away. And I can't afford much more time.

Yea, I asked this in one of the walls, but do you feel like scum would claim a hated townie?

[Aeronaut]

Thats what I am saying about the hated thing!

In re: claim- I have a LOT of good reasons, most of which revolve around controlling night actions and outing scum. But I agree that there could be a lot of unintended consequences, and I am not totally pushing this. Especially since it would have to be done correctly, and mostly people are not up to that. It requires a pretty high level of coordinated townplay- which we may or may not have. I will come back around to this on Day 3, I think.. if I still live.

As to why? I come from a generation of gamebreakers. Maybe things are different now. But Reck is from the same crop- and almost certainly we should break this setup open before the end of the game.

I suppose this is fair enough; I also don't know how likely it is that scum would just come outright and ask that, but I don't really know right now.

[Aeronaut]

Anenimyen is really not looking good to me, but I'm just not getting good vibes about that wagon rn, sorry.

[RadiantCowbells]

If Adenine flips scum I'd want to autolynch Aero.

And I'm barely being outside of my norm. I voted Adenine, remember?

I could be a lot more passive / sheepish.

[Aeronaut]

You really couldn't.

[RadiantCowbells]

UNVOTE:

I await Camn's instructions on who to vote.

[camn]

Fine. Let's go back to Trollie.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Trollie

And Aero... Let me explain something to you, since my game is apparently beyond you.

First...RC as town gets auto nightkilled N1 in pretty much every game.
Thus, there is absolutely no point in going after him day 1.

Furthermore, if he lives though a couple nights, he is pretty much confscum, and we Lynch him then. It is actually magically self-resolving. Thus, I am not worried about him today.

Second, the massclaim idea is both a) awesome, and b) tabled at this time.
You keep bringing it up tho. Again...read more, post less. You are too long winded, and filling the thread with spam.