Mini 1760: A Midsummer Night's Dream (GAME OVER)

[itlepip]

VOTE: GreyICE all of the games to use your alt...

[itlepip]

Your lover making is confirmable. Doesn't confirm your alignment.

Still thinking you're telling the truth. Your ability seems more anti-scum than anti-town, though. Will you listen to consensus on who to make lovers?

Town can use this to take out null and scumreads.

I think the best way for me to fulfill my WC is to find two people who can't be scum together but at least one is scum, then after I make them lovers we can lynch them and then both will die so we are guaranteed to hit scum. I actually exit the game when I get two successful pairs of lovers.

I have some reservations about this claim. If it is true, than we basically get two lynches in a game balanced where town gets 1 lynch, so this game will be fairly easy. The problem is the claim seems to be directly in opposition to the win condition of the role. Because it is so powerful, it will probably be a high priority NK target, but NK is a great way for this role to lose.

So it looks like the role is one that wants to be NKed, but that's as far as I got, I can't think of any 3rd party roles that want to be NKed outside of maybe a traitor that wants to be recruited.

We definitely leave Dwee alive for a bit since he likely can make people lovers which is very powerful, but I really doubt that his wincon is what he says it is.

[itlepip]

does it happen in the night and does it just last the day phase?

Pedit: I just realized that after the first successful lover couple dwlee becomes a 2 person per night cop that sees through stuff like GF and miller if he is telling the truth.

[itlepip]

so if we kill a pair of lovers who contain a mafia, if the next pair of lovers contain a mafia dwlee according to what he has claimed would then exit the game, and we know that if we kill the lovers we will get rid of another mafia. Which means that if two lovers don't mean that dwlee exits the game, they are 100% confirmed town.

[itlepip]

Getting two non-scum controlled kills with one lynch is inherently pro town.

You're a moron too, eh?

dwlee, it isn't a minute detail, it affects certain interactions.

[itlepip]

I had quote + ed and forgot about it. When I did a quick reply it got added.

[itlepip]

I'm a bit 50/50 on it right now. I still think that claiming like you did seems to not be reasonable with your wincon. If I believed your claim honestly I think the best strategy is for you to pick the lovers and have them claim the next day, but since I don't fully I think we should leash you.

[itlepip]

leash right now.

[itlepip]

LLD, insulting people doesn't change the fact that trying to kill Dwlee here is 100% antitown and shit play. You are trying to hide antitown play behind the fact that you are being as loud and acerbic as possible. All of your insults have come off way over the top and more acting than actual rage. Like I know you are a little rage kitty but even still the escalation in this game seems really fake.

VOTE: LLD

[itlepip]

We leash him for all of those LLD. It would be exactly like he claimed d2 except we get to know then if he is willing to be leashed.

His wincon helps town, which makes killing him proscum or antitown or whatever the fuck you want to label it with, but it means that he at least has to seem like he is helping town.

[itlepip]

What I don't understand is why Itle is down with letting the claimed third party live. He literally just got out of a game where the claimed third party was most certainly anti-town and lied through his teeth about what he knew. So he at least should be somewhat suspicious.

And he's doing the same damn things he did with his vote in that game...

Itle you have GOT to master the art of not drawing scum in games where I'm town.

Vote: itlepip

P.S. Hey guys, I've dated her for 4 years. She's fucking hard for me to read, but that's very far different from impossible. She's not scum here. Don't believe me, lynch me first. But lets just lynch scum.

Remember that I got lynched that game for trying to get EP to shoot sharky instead of TN and then died by association? Which is basically the same thing LLD is doing.

Also the 4 year dating thing is totally not just "I don't want anyone else getting a better read on my GF than me" when combined with your egos

[itlepip]

Rob, the vote total goes up even if the people voting are sum

(snarky vote in the last VC the number is wrong

[itlepip]

itlepip talking exclusively about the 3rd party claim, being non-committal about it, and not sharing reads is pretty bad.

What are everyone's thoughts on an itlepip-FS loverize?

OMG Spliffeh thinks I'm scum, alright someone make sure to save me tonight then since I'm confirmed.

Honestly though I missed the first few pages but I wanted to say certain points about the claim so I haven't really interacted with posts yet. On the whole though LLD is by far my biggest scum read, followed by snarky probably.

pedit: cause we have plenty of time in the day, also a bit kettle black with what you are accusing me of.

[itlepip]

Literally read back we went over this.

GI is nominating himself today. As of the moment he's saying FS and Itlepip lovered, with a Snarky lynhc.

So we burden of proficiency GI? Who if he is completely wrong we are looking at a 5v3 mylo d3. Nothing about this impresses me.

My top two would probably be LLD and snarky, but I kinda want to have LLD and GI just for fun.

[itlepip]

I do agree with the point that the people that we want lovered should change depending on how the lynch flips.

[itlepip]

Alright Ari is probably town here.

[itlepip]

I really really hate the whole idea of having anyone that isn't an innocent child choose the what is happening here. If we follow the leader here and the leader happens to be scum we are in guaranteed mylo d3. LLD has been trying to just run over town this entire game, which might be her town play but when what she is trying to set up a situation where if she is scum she basically just wins the game is super worrying.

Pedit: LLD was better TLW.

[itlepip]

Well your plan is so bad it seems to want to.

We use consensus for our lynches, we don't use consensus for our Leash.

It's much easier to put the burden onto someone, and learn from that. It's just BETTER too, because it means Dwlee can't be like "oh I trusted player X's opinion most so I went with his lol".

No, one person, one opinion. Stepping up to the plate, you're right you live, you're wrong on both, you die. Simple easy.

Not at all.
If we choose our towniest folk, he has bad reads, and we lynch our towniest folk because of it, that hurts the town.

If we all come to a consensus and make it obvious who we have agreed on, it eliminates that excuse from Dwlee.
It gets conversation to flow and makes people push their reads and take hard stances.


Also, to go back to your point on the possibility of scum killing the lovers if we don't (since I didn't respond at the time), I don't see why that is a problem.
No extra kill is gained in the process and we still are lynching who we think is scum, rather then settling for old reads that may have changed.

Right, so we should just let our "towniest folk" continue to mislynch people until we lose and suddenly we're "lol outplayed"

no fuck that We have the option here to cover our bases on all ends of the spectrum, by forcing people into situations where they get reads right or suffer the consequences.

I will happily volunteer for this procedure first, if you think I'm doing this just to control what happens and win. I will happily accept my death if I can't find a single scum in 3 reads (Lynch + 2 lovers).

Happily.

Holy Shit this is exactly my point. "OMG we can't trust town, just trust me and if I'm wrong then lynch me and then be in mylo (assuming the scum don't have a way to kill anyone ever this game, cause if they do then trusting LLD here just flat out loses the game for town)". Look LLD 3 lynches in a 13 player game is a ton. Burden of proficiency is 1 maybe 2 at the most. Town has 3 mislynches in a 13 player game, and 1 double lynch makes that mylo instead of lylo. You can't waste 3 lynches to then say "oops, I guess LLD was scum". Stop trying to manipulate town here.

I don't understand how this isn't the obvious lynch for today.

[itlepip]

Because she's not scummy

(ಠ_ಠ)

[itlepip]

I thought you said that you were townreading Spiffeh since he had similar reads to you? Nobody else is going to have that same read.

[itlepip]

Titus?

[itlepip]

I'm 100% certain that however people have scumread me it's wrong. And in some cases I believe it's been intentionally wrong.

what is this post?

[itlepip]

I am also in a position where I want MaxwellPuckett and Seniors Hydra to both be scum right now but I can't see them being on the same scum team ://///

Do you have any other scum reads?

[itlepip]

So you don't have any opinions on Abinsthe vs GM thing? Are you now townreading GrayIce, you were voting there?

I don't have a strong scumread on your slot, but you need to do more than weakly pressuring your top scumread and ignoring you second strongest.

[itlepip]

Beeboy is my top lover contender right now, I'm trying to either get a towny reaction from him or in the very least an inkling of a possible partner. The weird "LDD is town" thing that he put in his post with no prompting is worrying because I don't think scum put their partners in like that, so I might have to reevaluate something in this game right now. I'm pretty sure at this point that an LLD Beeboy pairing would have exactly 1 scum in it in the very least right now.

[itlepip]

I am so certain you are wrong about LLD though, I can't see anything towny about that slot. Snarky would be a scum lean if he didn't have such a big counterwagon to obvious scum, but as such he is null.

[itlepip]

I feel like I am the only player that generally looks up to Titus, but her quality of read on me dropped really heavily starting with that game. Cerb though nailed me, and I still think you had the worst case on me ever, you just got lucky that I happened to be scum that game. I still don't believe that you honestly called my alignment with that bs.

Pedit: avatar bets are banned, aw I'd make one with you about LLD.

[itlepip]

That's an amazing tell if that's the case, still think you might have just gotten lucky though.

[itlepip]

He made a quantom physics reference -> thus he is town

[itlepip]

yeah holy shit why am I not in there :|

If LLD is going to get loverized, VOTE: Spiffeh

[itlepip]

Chainsaw defenses aren't even fucking scummy but that's a story for another day!

Well, sometimes they are.

But sometimes they aren't.

--
Much as I'd like to continue this tunnel, I'm starting to think absinthe is too inconsistent to be Scum.

Can someone ask me something about beeboy? I'm having thoughts but I don't know where to start.

What has beeboy been trying to do this game? (and the answer isn't look town or find scum, but specifically in regard to certain members of town)

[itlepip]

sorry, I've been keeping up with the game I just haven't felt the need to say anything for a while.

[itlepip]

its called voting scum, something I generally advocate for. Even if you're scum it can be good from time to time to vote scum. It's fun for the whole family.

[itlepip]

Ugh I'm beginning to mix games up. In general your iso is really weak, not many reads and the ones that you do have (the early scumread on FS for making a real post, the townread on LLD for absolutely nothing) lack any explanation and don't really sit well with me this game. I remember having another point, but I'm blanking on it right now.

[itlepip]

The townread on LLD feels a little TMI than it does an actual read, I would like you to go over that one.

[itlepip]

VOTE: LLD don't remember why I got off this wagon, still my biggest scumread.

[itlepip]

(ಠ_ಠ) I don't see how that was a scum claim. Like I don't like abinsthe that much, but not scum claim level.

[itlepip]

Based on that last post I completely agree to Dwlee's lovers.

[itlepip]

yes? Trying to lynch dwlee and reduce town's killing power just to prevent yourself from getting loverized is the right play for scum and the wrong play for town so therefore you must be scum.

[itlepip]

Could you explain all of your reads please?

[itlepip]

I want the reasons from AP obviously.

[itlepip]

People are voting me for pointing claimed scum. No wonder I am losing interest in this game.

What?

Also UNVOTE: because I no longer want to be on the same wagon as beeboy, despite how I feel about absinthe. Might come back to that one later, I'll look at the context that made me vote her again.

ewww.

Second the ew on this post, but for different reasons. You shouldn't get off wagons just because a scumread is voting for that wagon. Like first off bussing is a thing that exists, and second there is no way you can be 100% certain in your reads unless you are scum here. That said I don't think that post is especially alignment indicative.

[itlepip]

"second the ew on this post, but for different reasons" is classically scummy. None of your reads make any sense whatsoever.

[itlepip]

yeah that was an exaggeration, I had a similar GM read as you did. I think Absinthe and Spiffeh are more scummy than you do, Ari is a really strong townread of mine. I am someone that people accuse of scumslipping all the time with no correlation to alignment, but I honestly don't understand the issue with 1339. My read on you is still mostly my read on LLD, all I honestly got from your slot is that you are a pretty good player. You had a genuine read on GM, but none of your other reads felt really genuine to me. I would appreciate just explaining where your reads are coming from.

[itlepip]

Beeboy there is a reason abinsthe is a null read for me, and that is that he actually hasn't claimed scum. I don't mind exaggeration, but holy fuck shit you have to actually try to make any sort of case. This feels like scum knowing that they need reads to seem towny, but don't actually have much to go on so they just make one up and hide how weak it is by saying that abinthe claimed scum when he objectively hasn't. I am going to reiso beeboy soon and depending on its contents there is a fair chance my vote will move there.

[itlepip]

that's not very nice.

Trust me. I'm playing like shit for a reason.

Can we please lynch this?

VOTE: Friendless Seniors

Yes because him playing poorly is super alignment indicative of hiplop. Especially coming from you, a person that probably would have been lynched if they weren't confirmable, should probably realize that bad play doesn't mean scum. Please find something alignment indicative before you vote.

[itlepip]

Why is what other people think change your reads?

[itlepip]

Holy shit nothing droog has said has been coherant. I was his biggest scumread, than abinsthe, than Seniors and Beeboy right before deadline. None of those you even tried to push yet and suddently seniors is super scummy for advocating for your lynch. His townread is literally what everyone has said this game and he offers no explanation.


VOTE: Droog

Besides seniors I think most of the deadline candidates are scummy, but droog just jumping between people as it serves him best is so scummy.

[itlepip]

Its like people can change reads when you shitpost and act scummy !!!!!!!

[itlepip]

Also the fact is that the competing deadline wagon, beeboy is probably scum exactly with droog and someone between AP, abinthe and ari. With AP being the most likely. Wow I think I might've just solved the game.

But the point is that there is that if beeboy is scum he thinks that droog has a much better chance of doing well this game (which he does) so he is refusing to do even the normal town survivalism that you would expect at deadline.

[itlepip]

Also the fact is that the competing deadline wagon, beeboy is probably scum exactly with droog and someone between AP, abinthe and ari. With AP being the most likely. Wow I think I might've just solved the game.

But the point is that there is that if beeboy is scum he thinks that droog has a much better chance of doing well this game (which he does) so he is refusing to do even the normal town survivalism that you would expect at deadline.

Preflip association tells make the droog wagon impossible for me to join. It is a weak reason especially since I know I am town.

Its not why either of you is getting lynched here, both of you are independently scummy. The question is between the two of you who which lynch helps town more and which lynch is likelier to flip scum. Just from post quality beeboy may be more likely to flip scum here, but now we can look at interactions and say that assuming beeboy is scum droog is certainly scum, and beeboy feels the need to try to deflect off the droog wagon which could indicate that droog has a very powerful scum role. + even if beeboy is playing a really bad town game here droog still could independently scummy. I think we always lynch droog here.

[itlepip]

You guys do know that just because something is considered bad in certain situations it doesn't mean that anytime it is used it is wrong. The short story is that droog, beeboy and AP should all die and at the very least there will be 2 less scum. So honestly I don't really care what happens today between whether or not beeboy or droog dies. However the amount of BS that Beeboy is pulling to not join the Droog wagon is incredibly suspect. Now if beeboy is town that tells you nothing and it is just him acting really weird for no reason, but if he is scum, which I think is very likely at this point, yeah you start wonder why he would act that way in regards to Droog and is protecting droog. According to you guys, given all of this weird behavior, I should just ignore it because I'm not 100% sure of Beeboy's alignment, the in you face obvious way that beeboy is trying to save droog

[itlepip]

(shit I hit submit midpost) Here's the full post, ignore the previous post
[rant]
You guys do know that just because something is considered bad in certain situations it doesn't mean that anytime it is used it is wrong. The short story is that droog, beeboy and AP should all die and at the very least there will be 2 less scum. So honestly I don't really care what happens today between whether or not beeboy or droog dies. However the amount of BS that Beeboy is pulling to not join the Droog wagon is incredibly suspect. Now if beeboy is town that tells you nothing and it is just him acting really weird for no reason, but if he is scum, which I think is very likely at this point, yeah you start wonder why he would act that way in regards to Droog and is protecting droog. According to you guys, given all of this weird behavior, I should just ignore it because I'm not 100% sure of Beeboy's alignment, the in you face obvious way that beeboy is trying to save droog totally isn't indicative of anything and tomorrow when whatever bullshit droog bulls on town happens its okay because pre flip assosciations are bad. Look there are 8 votes slip between droog and beeboy. 1 between those two are probably going to be lynched, and neither of them are voting each other. Beeboy is hard refusing to vote the only other likely lynch for today. Now the question is why? If Beeboy is town he would be conftown to himself so anyone else is by definition a better lynch since they at least have a chance of getting lynched. (unless they are masons but if they are masons and haven't outed yet I'm going to have a completely different rant) so by not voting droog townBeeboy is making the wrong play. Scum beeboy would be making the wrong play for the exact same reason unless in the exact scenario that I have described where beeboy and droog are scum together and droog's role is equal or better than beeboys. Like there is a huge diference between preflip associations and figuring out play. The assumption I'm making here isn't anything to do with beeboy's alignment, but that I expect beeboy to make easy optimal plays which are the same for either alignment so no accusations of WIFOM are present.
[/rant]

[itlepip]

Nothing recent has changed much of my reads ftr (nice to know I'm an insane town btw).

Pedit: AP by selfvoting you are either scum or you are voting conftown, both of which are good reasons to lynch someone.

[itlepip]

itlepip

that is not what that means at all lmao

Yes it is. It is saying that you are your top lynch right now. That isn't towny.

[itlepip]

I'M VOTING DROOG Yeesh.

[itlepip]

hammering scum is against your wincon since it decreases the amount of scum available to be loverized.

[itlepip]

dwlee, its just that someone who we know doesn't want a scum lynched right now shouldn't be voting. It doesn't matter who you are scum/town reading or who you are saying you are scum/town.

[itlepip]

We should no lynch.

Its not like the leading wagon is on SnarkySnowman or anything. We have a ton of targets, beeboy, Dro0g, AP are all completely available to be lynched. Also you are 3rd party and don't get to say anything.

[itlepip]

Beeboy lynch is now half policy for lynch all stupid D1

isn't that a bad reason to lynch me o.o

yeah, but policy lynching scum isn't that bad.

[itlepip]

have you explained why a max lynch is good here?

[itlepip]

MaxwellPuckett - I want this scum dead.

35 - Right out of the gate he does something that I don't like. Rather then pressuring a player who he thinks he is scum he takes the easy route of questioning someone's town read which doesn't really indicate alignment in RVS and you aren't actually committing to anything.

127 - First wall post of the game is entirely defensive which seems incredibly scummy as town tend to not worry about having walls to defend themselves

269 - Continuing to poke at Abs reads without actually declaring she is scum.

Then some yelling with LLd which is fairly towny actually even if I do disagree with it. My problem is that he never commited a vote to this argument, not even to apply pressure which is fairly fishy.

621 -

This sets off all my alarm bells

. How do you manage to only place your first vote of the game. If this isn't screaming safe scum play I am not sure what does.

711 - As soon as the completely safe snarky wagon falls through due to a Mason claim he decides to vote me even though his #1 scum read after Snarky was almost off the wagon.

1111 - He admits not voting scum / not making a stance on reads is a flaw despite doing it all game

1445 - Another safe vote without actually having to commit to anything. Although this is my fault for being uncooperative.

meh, its decent, but none of it is especially alignment indicative and it feels like you decided that Maxwell is scum before isoing him and used the iso for evidence as opposed to the other way around.

[itlepip]

VOTE: AP

[itlepip]

hmm?

[itlepip]

who are your lovers?

[itlepip]

Yes you are.

[itlepip]

Why spiffeh? The reason you weren't the auto lynch d1 is because you give town 2 kp with lynches as opposed to 1. If you don't out who you hit we don't have that and then we will lynch you.

[itlepip]

Why!

[itlepip]

VOTE: Droog

[itlepip]

I am the only one who thought AP had a good chance of flipping scum?

[itlepip]

alright, I think we kill droog or dwlee here. Droog is basically outed scum based on his actions this day. So if dwee survives today he is going to loverize the outed mafia with the most towniest person and then leave the game. So we lynch someone today and then someone towny dies when we lynch droog tomorrow. We can either stop that by killing Dwlee here or by killing droog regardless.

Also whoever roleblocked me should probably out.

[itlepip]

I explained this already, its probably the best play right now to kill you. Sorry you should have played better.

[itlepip]

I was talking to ari/droog

[itlepip]

DWLEE WITH ALWAYS NEIGHBORIZE THE EXACT SAME PEOPLE SINCE THEY ARE CONFIRMED DIFFERENT ALIGNMENTS

holy shit people.

[itlepip]

Actually yeah VOTE: Dwlee This is probably best for town, keeps a conftown alive.

He just has to make them.

[itlepip]

Titus and the mason!

[itlepip]

VOTE: TheLoneWolf
screw you man.

[itlepip]

TLW, for someone attacking people you seem to forget that A DROOG WAGON WILL KILL CONFTOWN YOU VI!

[itlepip]

I see it. Dwlee only leaves the game if he pairs 2 scum and town lover pairs. The only way beeboy and anyone else would ever cause dwlee to leave the game is for Titus to be mafia, meaning that beeboy knows that Titus is mafia.

[itlepip]

That was a good recovery.

[itlepip]

Titus is town wtf.

[itlepip]

If spiffeh confTown, why is Dwlee just sheeping Spiffeh?

[itlepip]

got it, good VOTE: Dwlee

[itlepip]

I already went over this shit spiffeh. Scum sheeping me doesn't change what I think is optimal here for town.

[itlepip]

A Titus and Maxwell lover pair would be amazing.

The problem is that Dwlee would never make it. We basically have confirmed that Dwlee is now a cop, but there is no reason for him to make that lover team to the extent that it is against his wincon. If he makes those two lovers and he doesn't leave the game, the most likely scenario is that Maxwell is also mafia. We lynch both, kill two scum which is great for us but now Dwlee has to find the 1 last mafia before all of town does. On the other hand Dwlee can just loverize Titus and someone like GM who is never mafia, leave the game and completely screw town over.

Beeboy went over the instant loss that happens if Titus is town here, but we also lose except in the exact world of TLW, Titus and Maxwell which I don't think is likely. We end up sacrificing 5 town just to kill 1 mafia which is fairly close to an instant loss for town.

When we keep Dwlee alive: So if we lose if Titus is town, and we also lose if Titus is scum, than we should probably not go down this road.

[itlepip]

You're wrong that the pair is against his wincon, though. Dwlee is townreading me.
I'm in favour of the pair. If Titus is scum it confirms me as town.

Even if he is townreading you, Dwlee doesn't make the pair expect between his strongest townread (that isn't ari) and Titus, which I doubt you are.

[itlepip]

loverize yourself and Titus.

[itlepip]

But...I'm not voting him myself?

Vote him then o.o

But if you guys are all correct on Titus being scum he'll leave the game tomorrow anyway!

But who knows what confirmed towny will die tomorrow when we lynch Titus? This way we get rid of 2 people who both when they die give us an extra lynch.

[itlepip]

Its the right play spiffeh, yeesh. I liked spiffeh d1 much more than today.

[itlepip]

Fine I will let itlepep save this town from self destruction.
Honestly no one here will listen to me no matter what I say.

gah wtf Beeboy.


Okay so the absolute best scenario (TLW and Titus are both scum together) has us enter a 6v1 tomorrow which when considering all of the roles is probably a great spot for town to be in.

The worst case scenario if both TLW and Titus are town town loses today almost 100% of the time.

If we lynch Dwlee today in the first scenario we end up in

the exact same world of 6v1

but we don't lose if they are both town.

[itlepip]

First scenario where scum is TLW, Titus and someone else. So Titus dies d3 and TLW dies d4.

[itlepip]

Strong scumreads: Spiffeh, TLW
Light scumreads: Titus, Beeboy, Maxwell

[itlepip]

Nice "People that try to do the objectively better play for town are scummy for trying to make a good play for town instead of pushing their scumreads"

Spiffeh is trying to go for an easy win here with a TLW lynch. We can't lynch anyone but dwlee here without losing if both TLW and Titus are town. If we lynch dwlee first we get an extra lynch + more time for town PRs to do stuff.

[itlepip]

abinsthe, what I'm describing is the current gamestate based on present claims. Unless you think Dwlee is lying about his role my analysis should be right.

[itlepip]

not that I'm aware of.

[itlepip]

wtf.

[itlepip]

That was scum hammering for the win. All protective townies need to be on Ari and Titus. Scum have a confirmed roleblocker so don't claim that you are saving people. If we don't either kill scum tonight or save townies, we have 4 town versus 3 scum and 1 third party

WHO DOESN'T WIN WITH TOWN IN ANY WAY

scum will probably just make a deal with Dwlee tomorrow, get a no lynch, dwlee makes another scum town lover pair in the night and both dwlee and scum will win the next day. Spiffeh and Beeboy are confirmed scum now if town have a vigi shot.

Holy shit guys wtf.

[itlepip]

Yes Spiffeh, Beeboy just lolhammered his partner.

@Titus, yes, you are pretty close to confirmed town now unfortunately. IMO there never was a solid droog case and I didn't ever really have a hard scumread on that slot, but because they were lovered with confirmed town the only way we could stop scum from getting 2kp in the night is to try to paint droog as confirmed scum so they would get a mislynch the next day.

Spiffeh is spewing absolute nonsense right now. Beeboy's hammer doesn't make any sense from town. If we can survive tonight we have 2 outed scum, but I really doubt it right now.

Beeboy is never a doctor here though btw.

[itlepip]

JK is just as fake a claim btw.

[itlepip]

Nobody counter claim though, really important.

[itlepip]

You just said I'm spewing nonsense and then proceeded to agree with me about beeboy

You said that TLW and Beeboy are scum together. Explain why beeboy just lolhammered his partner in a basically lylo situation?

[itlepip]

if my action had worked Beeboy would not be alive right now.

[itlepip]

I'd like everyone to take note that beeboy was townreading me all the way up until he confirmed himself as scum

Bye!

Its almost like he is distancing from his partner

[itlepip]

Look at all of this BS "shit we got called out let's try to interact to make our scum team look less likely" that beeboy and spiffeh are doing.

[itlepip]

ggs spiffeh. Dwlee who did you loverize?

[itlepip]

how so? who did you target?

[itlepip]

How does that make you jailkeeper confirmed, since we know mafia has a RBer

Rob are deaths in order IE did Ari die first?

[itlepip]

beeboy is in love with himself?

[itlepip]

dwlee when did you say your night action activated?
Beeboy who are you loverized with

I charioted titus and spiffeh last night, but I'm not sure it affects loverizing.

[itlepip]

yeah beeboy is talking out of his ass right now. I was probably rbed last night. I don't know what's going on right now.

[itlepip]

yo, I'm back. Yeah I'm a busdriver but for flavor it is called a chariot driver. I switch player A and player B during the night and actions that would affect one would affect the other
n1: Snarky and Beeboy
n2: Spiffeh and Titus

So either Beeboy is lying about his role and he Rbed me instead of ari, or beeboy and spiffeh are lovers today but since they are both scum they are scared about getting lynched given how good of a position scum is today

Just for the record, if dwlee doesn't townside town loses the game here, so Sorry Dwlee about trying to lynch you yesterday, No hard feelings? <3

[itlepip]

Does anyone actually believe Beeboy's claim?

[itlepip]

Also <3 dwlee for townsiding even though you win tomorrow.

[itlepip]

We are past lylo, a massclaim is probably okay today.

[itlepip]

I am pretty sure the scumteam is exactly Spiffeh/Beeboy/Maxwell right now

Also Dwlee nice try not killing the confScum, but town wants him dead today

(actually we do need dwlee to hammer if no scum bus, fuck this might be over for town)

[itlepip]

Spiffeh is outed scum at this point, beeboy is too me and I'm pretty sure its fairly obvious to everyone else.

[itlepip]

He's the one that was jard pushing for a TLW lynch, he picked the targets for the loverizing d1, ignored the advantages to killing Dwlee yesterday (Ie we would have 1 more lynch).

[itlepip]

^scum giving up.

BTW why beeboy not having a partner is possible. I claimed early d2 (I also had a d1 crumb if anyone wants to see that) that I was rbed n1 (so did beeboy at deadline when he made his JK claim). Yesterday I said that if I hadn't been RBed Beeboy would be dead. Now since Spiffeh was my top scum last night scum figured that whatever my killing ability was it would target spiffeh since I correctly called that town basically is lost if we mislynched yesterday which is why I was advoating for a dwlee lynch. If dwlee made an agreement with scum or had an alive town paired with Beeboy, scum just wins outright unless last night either we saved the lovers or a mafia was killed. So it makes total sense that I got roledblocked there so scum could save spiffeh. If Spiffeh was town mafia would probably just roleblock some random guy and let him get shot (from their perspective) which is why I am super confident spiffeh is scum (+ all the super scummy thing he has done).

[itlepip]

Its also possible that the way the night actions work loverizing and all that stuff happens at dawn so the busdriving doesn't affect it.

[itlepip]

(lol at that last post, it only matters if beeboy is scum, if beeboy was actually town it doesn't matter what resolves first cause it wouldn't count towards Dwlee no matter what).

[itlepip]

Spiffeh, busing Beeboy is probably a good strategy given that you are calling him scum.

[itlepip]

Why is no one talking about how beeboy selfvoted in lylo?

[itlepip]

how would spiff lying affect any of this?

[itlepip]

We are in lylo not mylo

[itlepip]

His role is fake, it doesn't matter whether or not it is real confusion or not about that fake role.

[itlepip]

There doesn't seem to be any evidence that Dwlee is lying about his role.

[itlepip]

We have 4 town 1 third party and three scum. The third party has a fair chance of leaving the game tomorrow.

[itlepip]

13 man setup you always assume 3 scum. Dwlee is a townsided PR since it gives town 2 lynches. Likely Town has better PRs than scum but 2 scum with a loverizer is super bad because scum could just lose to getting a bad loverize.

[itlepip]

Dwlee could be going for an amazing scum gambit though, not entirely out of the picture but shouldn't be visited today.

[itlepip]

I don't think so, I think the assumption of lynching third party makes it really dangerous given how powerful your role is but if town gets to 3p and you are one of them I think there is a good chance Dwlee is the lynch.

[itlepip]

I switched snarky and spiffeh, hence the 'who rbed me' and 'if I hadn't been rbed spiffeh would be dead'

[itlepip]

That's who I switched n1, n2 I switched you and Titus

[itlepip]

My switches are snarky and beeboy and titus and spiffeh

[itlepip]

It was just a mistake. In my mind beeboy and spiffeh are both just confirmed scum at this point based on their actions yesterday - Why are people forgetting that beeboy just jumped off the dwlee wagon with no explanation to lolhammer TLW which put town is this awful spot- so I mentally probably just accidently switched which scum I switched snarky with.

[itlepip]

First explain how that is a scumclaim. Cause it doesn't look like one to me.

[itlepip]

I am Nick Bottom, Athenian Chariot Driver

[itlepip]

Spiffeh, why do you think beeboy hammered TLW like he did yesterday?

[itlepip]

I guess we have the full scum team now: Beeboy, Abinsthe, Spiffeh.

[itlepip]

nononono. Pairing me and beeboy is super super bad for town. Like Dwlee I know it will probably proc for you but its a super bad idea.

Actually guys we have to lynch beeboy today so that Dwlee can't just pair beeboy with someone really towny tomorrow and leave the game. Because then beeboy is confirmed scum but we can't lynch him because town loses.

VOTE: Beeboy

Spiffeh loverizing is a super antitown right now. If the two people are both town scum wins, and if Dwlee does hit and leaves the game, we can't lynch the confscum because then a town will die and scum win.

[itlepip]

So we both agree that abinthe is probably scum here and there is 1 between me and beeboy (hint it is beeboy). If we lynch abinthe today and he flips scum, then scum get

any successful scum kill outside of me or dwlee

Dwlee leaves the game tomorrow and we can't lynch either me or beeboy since after the NK scum wins. So therefore we would have confirmed scum and we have to kill exactly scum tomorrow outside of confirmed scum beeboy.

See the issue spiffeh is that I'm fine lynching abinthe here, but I'm pretty sure that GM is town here so we would lose tomorrow. Why not just kill the confirmed scum beeboy today and then the other confirmed scum abinsthe tomorrow?

[itlepip]

Yo spiffeh, one thing to consider here. I have claimed that I am a busdriver. So do you really think that I'm going to get loverized tonight outside of getting RBed by scum?

[itlepip]

Yeah I'm fine moving to abinthe now.

[itlepip]

Honestly this is the first game I have ever played where a busdriver is present. According to the wiki it could be available for either alignments but to me it seems potent for town and downright broken for scum.

[itlepip]

You do know that scum are allowed to lie about what powers they have right? We haven't confirmed any parts of either of their claims.

[itlepip]

Tfw when I am the only vote on claimed scum and you guys wonder why I can't muster the energy to read this game.

Beeboy there is a reason abinsthe is a null read for me, and that is that he actually hasn't claimed scum. I don't mind exaggeration, but holy fuck shit you have to actually try to make any sort of case. This feels like scum knowing that they need reads to seem towny, but don't actually have much to go on so they just make one up and hide how weak it is by saying that abinthe claimed scum when he objectively hasn't. I am going to reiso beeboy soon and depending on its contents there is a fair chance my vote will move there.

@Everyone can someone explain to me why a town who has received no pressure would say they are fine with being lynched? I have yet to see a good reason to justify that post by Abs'.

p-edit: beeboy, like 3 people, including myself, have already answered it. deal with it and move on already ffs.

I haven't heard a real reason they have all just been excuses based on the fact you guys where previously reading her as town. I don't feel like moving on because Abs can't be town this game.

beeboy what are some of your reads other than abs?

I haven't been following this game enough to have relevant established reads.

Just here to remind you that coming into the game apparently without reading at all Beeboy started out with this whole 'abinthe claimed scum' thing and that was his entire play yesterday until deadline stuf happened. Just prodging and calling abinthe scum.

I don't think I have a point here except for how shitty beeboy's d1 play has been. Maybe that beeboy did that read because he never actually tried pushing abinthe so he could get credit for bussing while not having to put in effort to get reads to somehow find scum?

I'm okay with an abinthe lynch here, I figured out a night action that saves town from most dwlee actions (expect one really really shitty action but I really doubt it). I will say though that I won't be switching myself tonight.

VOTE: abinthe

[itlepip]

you will submit night actions to me and dwlee.

[itlepip]

no, my point is that I get veto power over who gets loverized.

Also beeboy unvoting there is pretty telling.

[itlepip]

Do I need to go through the math?

4-3-1 Today
4-2-1 Tomorrow morning
3-2-0 After NK + Dwlee leaves
2-1-0 After lynching me and beeboy
1-1-0 After NK

TOWN LOSES

[itlepip]

Alright, so the way the math works after the abinthe lynch we can't lynch me or beeboy tomorrow. I'm okay with this plan.

[itlepip]

I will say that in the instant that scum isn't bussing absinthe here (assuming that absinthe is scum which obviously I am pretty convinced about) all of town + Dwlee need to vote on that person in order for that person to get lynched. Like the reason absinthe isn't getting run up super fast after all of the bullshit and stuff that he has spewed and why beeboy unvoted as soon as absinthe got to L-1, is that its pretty close to impossible for us to pull this lynch off. So if you are town, either make a god of a case on how absinthe is town here or vote vote vote vote vote vote.

Also Dwlee, like I know that unlike the rest of us killing scum here isn't really necessary to your wincon, but it would be really really nice if you could help us with that and it should increase you changes of getting more succesful lover pairs. We need your help for this day to not just end in a no lynch and then scum wins tomorrow. (Also why I voted absinthe here even though beeboy is more confScum in my eyes is that leaving a protective alive seems reasonable and this wagon seems possible to lynch.

[itlepip]

pip I ne\/er said she was town I just like waiting things out :)

until after deadline hits and then oops we have a no lynch ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ guess scum wins this one guys.

[itlepip]

shit sorry. For whatever reason the name abinthe sounded male to me so I forgot to check sorry.

[itlepip]

No I know what absinthe is (I've tried a tiny bit - holy shit).

[itlepip]

Or you are scum ;)

[itlepip]

I think that people claiming when we have outed mafia only helps scum find the best NK target. Like we have 2 100% 1v1s between me and beeboy, you and FS, and possibly a bonus one between GM and Beeboy since a JK and a doctor in the same setup is insane.

[itlepip]

that one is bad since I'm a busdriver dwlee.

Still absinthe is flipping scum here. Him talking about what is going to happen after he flips is because he isn't looking at the game from the standpoint of town in lylo

[itlepip]

How should I put this, I've drawn a bunch of potential driving combos, and very few of them don't involve either me or beeboy to try to take NK. I haven't looked at what happens if she flips town but it will still probably include beeboy or me in some cases.

(really sorry)

[itlepip]

little too late for distancing now absinthe.

[itlepip]

I think that game may have been pretty mafia-sided

I'm still really really happy with my play that game I think our team could've won against a much larger town which is awesome.

cause I didn't trust you.

[itlepip]

Like I am proud as fuck of that fakeclaim. Like town could've had a cop and we would still be okay.

[itlepip]

damn it if the setup wasn't so mafia sided this might've been a scummy. I am so happy with this game.

[itlepip]

damn it if the setup wasn't so mafia sided this might've been a scummy. I am so happy with this game.

psh, what?

scum p much had nothing in terms of power.

town had 2 masons and a full blown doc and a 3p that could've potentially royally fucked scum over. just b/c the person who happened to draw puck REALLY misplayed doesn't mean this was "scumsided"

well then... :P

No I think the reason I thought it was scumsided is that I was really really scared about an investigative and the fact that there was none made me think the game was more scumsided than it was. I remember d1 when the masons claimed and dwlee townsided I thought we were screwed. <3 Beeboy and Hippy

[itlepip]

I mean I claimed busdriver just because of how well it counters invest. I will say though that scum messing with the PR balance of the game is amazing and something I need to remember to consider.

pedit: yes, to an extent. but they got deaded so it doesn't matter.

[itlepip]

I probably should stop patting myself on the back for this, but the game was fun and I really enjoyed it. Rob I think the setup was good, I would have like to see post restrictions and some more flavor stuff but it was a fairly solid game.

[itlepip]

<3 you hippy.

[itlepip]

wait what? Abinthe?

[itlepip]

I mean 3/5 lover pairs were scum

[itlepip]

So did I