Mini Normal 1775 END!

[Titus]

VLA today

[Titus]

Lowell really was my best guess.
Among other things, this means that the interaction around the Knightmare and Sakura's vote (starting in 23) is Town/Mafia, and one of the interactions with Boonskiies (his vote on Knightmare in 35 and subsequent argument about whether it was RVS or his explanation to Sakura in 197) is fabricated. I thought that both of those interactions worked better from Town players, so now I have to dig around and try to find something that distinguishes them.
I've a lot of work to do, and as we've been given a generous deadline (and further as the lynch is not imperative), I'm probably going to take some time with this one.

True, the lynch is not imperative but if mr smith is conftown, then we should lynch today.

Assuming mr smith has a cop clear (who would lie about that?), then the only scenario that wouldn't make him town is godfather + shoot the BG and that seems far fetched to me.

[Titus]

Spoiler: Selected VCs for me

VoteCount 2.7

With 12 players alive, it takes

7

votes to lynch.

Maestro (0):

Almost50 (0):

Sakura Hana (2):

Boonskiies, Expedience

Lowell (1):

texcat

mhsmith0 (0):

texcat (1):

Maestro

Garmr (2):

Lowell, chilledtea

Boonskiies (3):

ToastyToast, Sakura Hana, Garmr

Dierfire (0):

ToastyToast (0):

chilledtea (0):

Expedience (0):

Not Voting (3):

Dierfire, mhsmith0, Almost50

The deadline is in

(expired on 2016-04-05 12:00:00)

NOTES:
Maestro replaces Sayaka Maizono immediately.

VoteCount 2.9

With 12 players alive, it takes

7

votes to lynch.

Maestro (0):

Almost50 (0):

Sakura Hana (3):

Boonskiies, Lowell, Expedience

Lowell (0):

mhsmith0 (0):

texcat (0):

Garmr (0):

Boonskiies (6):

ToastyToast, Garmr, chilledtea, texcat, Almost50, Sakura Hana

(L-1)

Dierfire (0):

ToastyToast (0):

chilledtea (1):

Dierfire

Expedience (0):

Not Voting (3):

Maestro, mhsmith0

The deadline is in

(expired on 2016-04-05 12:00:00)

NOTES:
None

We have a verdict. Boonskiies has been lynched.

Day 2 End

Boonskiies (6):

ToastyToast, Garmr, texcat, Almost50, Sakura Hana, chilledtea, Expedience

LYNCH!!

Sakura Hana (2):

Boonskiies, Lowell

chilledtea (1):

Dierfire

Maestro (0):

Almost50 (0):

Lowell (0):

mhsmith0 (0):

texcat (0):

Garmr (0):

Dierfire (0):

ToastyToast (0):

Expedience (0):

Not Voting (2):

Maestro, mhsmith0

Boonskiies Role PM

You are a treacherous

Mafia Encryptor

.

Abilities

You have your voice and your vote. Use them well to confuse town and distort truth.

You may communicate with your

{REDACTED}

each night here.

You are the Mafia Encryptor. You are skilled in hidden messages, secrete communications and encoded messages. As long as you live, you and your

{REDACTED}

will be able to communicate during the day as well as each night. Should you be killed the mafia thread will be closed each day phase.

Win Condition

You win when town has been eliminated or nothing can prevent this from happening.

Here is the game thread. Please confirm via PM with your role name and in thread by posting /confirm.[/area]

VoteCount 4.3

With 8 players alive, it takes

5

votes to lynch.

heuristically_alone (0):

Riabi (0):

Lowell (3):

texcat, heuristically_alone, Garmr

(L-2)

mhsmith0 (1):

Riabi

texcat (0):

Garmr (3):

Lowell, mhsmith0, Dierfire

(L-2)

Dierfire (0):

ToastyToast (0):

Not Voting (1):

ToastyToast

The deadline is in

(expired on 2016-05-03 17:00:00)

NOTES:
Prodding mhsmith0

Day 3 End

Garmr (3):

Lowell, mhsmith0, Dierfire, heuristically_alone, Garmr

LYNCH!!!

Lowell (1):

texcat

mhsmith0 (1):

Riabi

heuristically_alone (0):

Riabi (0):

texcat (0):

Dierfire (0):

ToastyToast (0):

Not Voting (1):

ToastyToast

The deadline is in

(expired on 2016-04-30 23:30:00)

NOTES:
None

Garmr's Role

You are a treacherous

Mafia Goon

.

Abilities

You have your voice and your vote. Use them well to confuse town and distort truth.

You may communicate with your

{REDACTED}

each night here.

Win Condition

You win when town has been eliminated or nothing can prevent this from happening.

Here is the game thread. Please confirm via PM with your role name and in thread by posting /confirm.

[Titus]

Yeah based on the VCs, I am leaning Dierfire.

1) Toasty makes less sense as scum during 2.7 unless it's a planned bus.
2) The only time Dierfire voted scum was on the Garmr wagon which Garmr self hammered. That suggests the buddy is on the wagon.
3) 1801 seems like pure posturing. With Mr. Smith pretty close to conftown, the only lynches open for him are me and Toasty. Suddenly he thinks the last two are having a t v s interaction but fails to take a side.

[Titus]

Hey, Toasty, I'm leaning town on you. You said you want my insight... yet ignore my post about 1801 seeming like posturing. Like the whole thing about Dierfire reads like he's trying to set up 3p lylo.

[Titus]

We're essentially already in 3p LYLO, except that we need mhsmith0 to certify the result or send it back to us for reconsideration.

Yeah, no.

There's a big difference in 3p lylo versus 4p. In 3p, conftown is dead and you can make wifom style based arguments that you cannot make in 4p. Conftown can give the opinions and check for validity without it being suspect. This is why you don't no lynch with conftown alive.

Second, if you were so sure on no lynch being the right play, you would have voted for it rather than seeking permission, since a no lynch doesn't likely lose the game.

[Titus]

Hey, Toasty, I'm leaning town on you. You said you want my insight... yet ignore my post about 1801 seeming like posturing. Like the whole thing about Dierfire reads like he's trying to set up 3p lylo.

You'll have to clarify what you mean by posturing. I don't particularly like 1801, if only because a) it was clear from yesterday that Lowell wasn't the only option and b) I think everyone has pointed to that interaction between Boonskiies, myself, and Sakura (Titus). Dier would have to say one of me/titus is scum regardless of their alignment; just as I have to decide between Titus/Dier and you have to decide between Dier/myself. I hardly think stating this is an attempt to set up a 3p lylo.

I think we're getting towards the same wavelength. Dierfire has to say it's one of us. So picking an interaction in the game and stating it must be scum/town is posturing. He wants people to see things that way when it's not true if scum. It's one thing to say scum must be in us. It's another thing to say scum is in a pile, go find which one. It sets him up.

Second, why bother stating the lynch isn't mandatory unless positioning for 3p lylo. It's much easier to fool one person than two. And with conftown dead, the job is easier.

That's what I mean by posturing.

[Titus]

Mhsmith, Can you color in the VCs and post them? I did a rudimentary VCA but I want to check my work.

[Titus]

Thank you. I will put my VCA in your format in a day or two.

[Titus]

Meh will read later.

[Titus]

Ok I looked at D3, and Dierfire got to L-1. His wagon was full of town and Dierfire then immediately threw out Lowell, who got lynched. I still don't get why Lowell was lynched at all after reading that. The NKs benefit him. The VCA points to him.

I'm just ready to fight this out at this point.

VOTE: Dierfire

[Titus]

Why do the NK's benefit Dier in particular, and what specifically about VCA points to Dier?

Yeah based on the VCs, I am leaning Dierfire.

1) Toasty makes less sense as scum during 2.7 unless it's a planned bus.
2) The only time Dierfire voted scum was on the Garmr wagon which Garmr self hammered. That suggests the buddy is on the wagon.
[removed point 3 about 1801 since it's not VCA related]

Chilledtea was a PR kill. He died highlighting Boon trying to imply that SH was counterclaiming CT to save himself.
Almost50 died believing Smith could be scum (frame kill) + said Dierfire needed to talk more.
Texcat dies believing Dierfire needs to talk more.
H_A has to be excluded from NKA because of bodyguard likelihood.

[Titus]

Texcat wants Dierfire townreads explained. He dies.
964, Almost says Dierfire needs to talk. He dies.

Basically Dierfire is killing the people who are gradually starting to suspect him.

[Titus]

@Mrsmith, and maybe you think tenous is why you have been mislynching town instead of hitting scum. Dierfire as scum isn't a textbook kill the people who are suspecting me. He murders the people who support those to make those who suspect him look looney tunes. The people who wanted to actually discuss Dierfire died in a pattern is not just a coincidence. Scum don't want to be the focal point.

There's also the vote pattern pretty much clears Toasty Toast. So Dierfire is scum by PoE there too.

[Titus]

Maestro (0):
Almost50 (0):
Sakura Hana (2):

Boonskiies

,

Expedience
Lowell (1): texcat

mhsmith0 (0):

texcat (1): Maestro

Garmr (2):

Lowell, chilledtea

Boonskiies (3):

ToastyToast, Sakura Hana,

Garmr

Dierfire (0):
ToastyToast (0):
chilledtea (0):
Expedience (0):


Not Voting (3): Dierfire, mhsmith0, Almost50

The deadline is in (expired on 2016-04-05 12:00:00)

NOTES:
Maestro replaces Sayaka Maizono immediately.

I'm not buying two scum on the Boonskiies wagon when there's quite a few town options available.

[Titus]

VLA today. Under the weather

[Titus]

@Mrsmith, Even if that's so, why would scum be the last to leak and not leak onto me (Sakura).

[Titus]

@Toasty, are you seriously thinking a Godfather when the cop that flipped is one shot?

P-edit, is there anything that you have a question for me directly? I can't do anything about the slot's behavior before me, but I can answer things and how things work. I'm pretty sure by just how things laid out that it's Diefire?

[Titus]

Godfather is explicitly not normal at the moment, ftr.

[Titus]

Roles which are explicitly Non-Normal include:
Non-Sane Cop, Blank Vig, Non-Sane or Quack Doctor, Janitor, Survivor, Lyncher, Cultist, Jester, Mafia Mason, Bus Driver, Lightning Rod, Nexus, Redirector, Framer, Vanillaizer, Beloved Princess, Arsonist, Governor,

Godfather

From the wiki.

[Titus]

Godfather is explicitly not normal at the moment, ftr.

True but this game started before the switch (I believe). That said, it's IMO a pretty big reach for that to be in the game, and I suspect unbalanced.

Town: JK, UB, JOAT
Mafia: Encryptor, Goon, Godfather

I mean, I guess it doesn't matter quite as much given that the cop shot was one-time anyway, but that feels a bit scum-sided IMO. That said I haven't played many normals, so I could be wrong.

That's pretty much my point. I don't see you as GF. I don't see Toasty as scum due to the VCs. So that leaves Dierfire. Then it's just checking to make sure it's a viable team. When I saw the VC patterns and the kill choice, it's not the most ZOMG scumclaim but it makes a hell of a lot more sense than Toasty being scum.

[Titus]

Who are you uncertain between? Why is "not having a compelling case" against someone the same thing as voting in MYLO? I'm only voting you because I'm confident that Mhsmith and Toasty are town. Here, you still seem to be allowing yourself an out. Why?

[Titus]

P-edit, is there anything that you have a question for me directly? I can't do anything about the slot's behavior before me, but I can answer things and how things work. I'm pretty sure by just how things laid out that it's Diefire?

Ok, well part of my hesitance to agree with your case on Dierfire is that it sounds like confirmation bias. Looking mostly at the night kills and motivations for them is somewhat limiting. I tend to vote based on actions I see during the day phase. Is there any particular posts from Dier himself--not other people talking about Dierfire--that you find suspicious? Also, there is a reason I'm asking you about your thoughts on Day 5 + the Lowell lynch so I'd still like to see something about that. Kind of hard to do in hindsight but that entire day I kept thinking about Riabi's absence and if it was wrong to lynch Lowell when one slot was giving even less information.

Ok, that's not how I approach the game generally. I still haven't fully read on replacing in. I look more for indicators of what scum would NOT do and identify town. Then, fill in with what looks supsicious. Only during the early game where there's less information do I go for what's more suspicious and go that way.

I believe I did comment on the lynch there. The only reason I feel Dier wasn't lynched and the game wasn't over is because Dier flipped the lynch onto the only other viable poster in the game. If he picked my slot, people would claim it's a lurker lynch. Dier has been all about his perception here and leaving his options open today, and from what I read yesterday too.

I can go find specific posts though that demonstrate that mentality if you want.

[Titus]

Hi. Still think it's Dier. Not voting because lylo.

[Titus]

The latter and from Toastytoast.

Why would you act as if you couldn't scumhunt if Toasty Toast was mafia?

[Titus]

VLA this weekend.

Urgent work matter.

Sorry I forgot to post in this one.

[Titus]

Then we wait until then. I am trying to pound out work as well.

[Titus]

Prod dodge...

Dierfire, if you're wanting to try and convince me TT is scum, you'll need to actually case him. Right now, my read says its you. You don't get to sit on the sidelines.

[Titus]

Hey, I am getting old and wrinkly. If you haven't "reached a conclusion" by Saturday, I am voting you. If Toasty is scum, gg to him.

[Titus]

VOTE: Dierfire

Dierfire claims he's doing research but does nothing towards determining Toasty's alignment. He just spoilers a post talking about how Garmr wagon didn't take off while ignoring he had an all town wagon.

He says my actions are fair, then immediately threatens me in lylo.

[Titus]

Gg.

We win.