Mini Normal 1827 - No Flavor Mafia (Game Over)
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Hello everyone,. I'm Naomi. I have a problem with my mindset in general. As both scum and town I fear getting lynched and sometimes that drives me to inaction. Additionally I doubt myself and never feel that my reads are very good and because of this i'm not the strongest arguer as in the back of my mind I'm always doubting myself. so.. I come off as unsure. My solution to fixing this has been to ask questions and being very open and honest wherever possible. beacuse even if I'm bad at scum hunting at least I can support town by keeping activity high. I like doing regular read lists as well so people can get an idea of what I'm thinking (every 10 pages or so) When I wake up I normally do a larger 'catchup' post followed by shorter reaction posts over the course of the day. Because of this I also tend to do lots of LAMIST moves beacuse Im always worried people will want me gone as I'm not very good. Scum tend to use this to there advantage sometimes.
The reason I'm opening with this is my mind set follows a more scum meta when, for me, its really NAI as I just havn't managed to get past the idea that by lynched and I don't want to die.. and thats a problem but.. as I can't really do anything about it I been taking to attempting to announce this when playing to help town out. I also find it helps if I'm honest about it early on as it's going to come out through my gameplay and its hard to defend this play style.
I expect this post will be a hot topic down the line for both Scum!Naomi and Town!Naomi but Thats just the kinda player I am. Also I normally get a handful of votes for this post from people who declare; "She is setting up for later" which is true. this is setting up for when people point and say I'm being LAMIST and for when people notice my unsure mindset and habbit of backing off because my meta is strange..Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I would like to point out that the fact scum have day talk is in the setup on page one encase anyone miss's it and thinks this is a scum slip.In post 25, light_ganski wrote:Yeah if the scum team are any good daytalk is more powerful than a PR so we probably have a fewNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Eh normally it devides town into 3 camps based on how people feel about it, so may not be the best plan for you. Those 3 camps beingIn post 49, Jordarrian wrote:Holy shit I found another me
Town - They appreciate my honesty and openness about it and think me townie for it.
NAI / WIFOM - they see the post for what it is and keep me as null though tend to also bare it in mind for later
Scum - They think I'm bullshitting and making up excuses for scummy behaviour and generally always think I'm kinda scummy.
Least thats my experience. Don't help that i also get defensive under pressure.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I have terrible read doubt, I know there are more town than scum, so I want to think as everyone is town and read them in the most townie way and thats not productive so I then pressure things that I think might be scum tells while at the same time thinking they might be town.. think about if someone as town thought everyone is town until such time as I get the feeling there not.. I tend to use Null for people who havn't said much.. but I still treat null as town.. I guess what I should do is go; Confirmed town, Extreme town, Strong Town, Town, Slight Scum, Scum. If that makes sense.. but This isn't good for my health I find as everyones like; why you think people are town and I'm like; Dunno? should I not. And then it just gets messy.
PEDIT; Yeah thats the 3 camps thing I pointed out a bit later. It is very much NAI but pointing out that its NAI is the point of the post so.. sorta works? I havn't tested yet but I think it would be an interesting theory to look at those people who do find it scummy as paranoid townies. Though there is also a scum chance.. also this time it was a good conversation starter, though its talking about an NAI post so not really much hunting ... but its nice to start to move out of a RVS cycle.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I know you know but someone might of missed itIn post 57, Creature wrote:
We know, you don't need to whiteknight him.In post 50, Naomi-Tan wrote:
I would like to point out that the fact scum have day talk is in the setup on page one encase anyone miss's it and thinks this is a scum slip.In post 25, light_ganski wrote:Yeah if the scum team are any good daytalk is more powerful than a PR so we probably have a fewNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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well was wasn't at the time. you commented it offhandedly so I thought I'd reinforce it a little :3 But now no one will make the mistakeIn post 61, light_ganski wrote:Pretty sure that, considering we were discussing how scum had daytalk, no one's going to think it's a scum slip. ...Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Why?In post 65, Vedith wrote:
No one caresIn post 63, Naomi-Tan wrote:
well was wasn't at the time. you commented it offhandedly so I thought I'd reinforce it a little :3 But now no one will make the mistakeIn post 61, light_ganski wrote:Pretty sure that, considering we were discussing how scum had daytalk, no one's going to think it's a scum slip. ...
Vote Blackstar...Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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a wuh?
Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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whats G and P?In post 69, Killthestory wrote:
no lol Naomi is a G and p decent.In post 49, Jordarrian wrote:Holy shit I found another meNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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So he is calling me scum? well.. thats okay, I sorta guessed someone would react like it. Whats the P mean?In post 72, BlackStar wrote:G= gangstaNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Seems reasonable, but I think the move would be WAY too high risk.In post 95, xyzzy wrote:putting someone that close to dead when we're like 8(?) hours in is irresponsible because, like, what if someone comes in and says "hey haven't read the thread yet but here's my vote" and hammers him out of nowhere? like, they would immediately become suspicious, but it'd be the sort of thing that would still be possible to play off as a mistake.
he freaked out a lot at a relatively quick wagon, more than is reasonable for a wagon out of nowhere day 1. I dislike that reaction.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Erm.. It wasn't white knighting... no one was attacking you or being suspicious of you at the time and I missed the comments on page 1 about the day talk.. it was meant to be just a small little expansion so no one got confused.. If I had noticed page one was more than just RVS I wouldn't of spoken about it.. Like.. you can't really white knight something thats not even a thing yet..In post 107, light_ganski wrote:Hmm jordarrian and naomi are null-scum leaning but it's too early to pin them down, naomi more for the subtle white knighting and buddying than for 48. Would say the same of vedith but I know from experience he's a scummy scumbag even as town but IGMEOY
Why am I toxic..? I thought I was at least helping out.. but there isn't much to talk about right now..In post 112, Transcend wrote:this just in kts and naomi are softclaimed masons
because i don't know how anyone could like the toxicity that is naomiNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I don't think its really a gimmick.. but okay we can put this aside for now. As the game picks up hopefully you'll find me less gimmicky?In post 116, Transcend wrote:I don't like your gimmick and the way you post.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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So Town to scum right ?In post 119, Transcend wrote:BS'd list of reads so far
{KTS}
{Naomi}
{Jord, BlackStar}
{massive, pistachi0n, Skelda}
{Io}
{Vedith, light, Creature}
{xyzzy}Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I checked the rules post, my role pm, the player que and his post for mod sign up. It currently appears as if we do not have this information. However Its likely to be 3 scum as there is 13 players.In post 122, Transcend wrote:is there a known ratio of mafia to town fwiwNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Well you can't really do that. Least not IMO as town we are always going to be unsure of who is town and not condensing would mean removing people that may be scum. I think you should open yourself to allowing more or less than 3 based on who is suspicious to you :3 Like right now I'm only just getting 1 read because everything is so light right now and that read isn't really strong enough to verbaliseIn post 126, Transcend wrote:ye every mini i've played has had 3 scum and 0 sks
just wondering if it's consistent
with that said, if there's 3 wolves, i need to condense my reads because i have 5 people below the null tier.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Erm.. I didn't think we was?
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Errr.. sure thing it happened around here;In post 132, Killthestory wrote:Right, so, uh, we need to lay down some ground rules.
I'm always right
If I'm wrong, then support your statement with stone cold facts and not opinions.
Even then, I'm probably right.
Because I'm always in my final form.
Always.
Right, no more TvTing you two.
your his best town read followed by me and the list continues down.In post 119, Transcend wrote:BS'd list of reads so far
{KTS}
{Naomi}
{Jord, BlackStar}
{massive, pistachi0n, Skelda}
{Io}
{Vedith, light, Creature}
{xyzzy}Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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true you also said; "If I'm wrong, then support your statement with stone cold facts and not opinions." which I did~In post 134, Killthestory wrote:I said I was always right.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I just noticed... this is the most frilviously 3 way TTT conversation that has probably ever existed and all 3 of us should probably not continue it on.. like all 3 of us are town reading each other and this conversation was so pointless that it might as well been a bubble shaped sphere.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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In post 143, Creature wrote:lol if I were scum I wouldn't simply join the wagon like this.
NAI/Wifom; Hey you remember that post I made, my second post. yeah for the same reasons thats NAI/Wifom so's this one. It shows you thought about what scum wouldn't do and then did it. Which is pretty much what I did earlier Because of this, its entirely Wifom/NAI Depending on use. The way you structured it is more WIFOM while I feel my one is NAI. Either way though, you cannot determine anything from it..In post 147, Transcend wrote:
scumclaimIn post 143, Creature wrote:lol if I were scum I wouldn't simply join the wagon like this.
Additionally; If you feel XYZZY is not scum you should expand why you feel that way else your just saying words. Its why when I said I was starting to get someone I felt was scummy I purposely left out who because I don't really have more than GUT on that side as there isn't that great of stuff going on.
Speaking of that though
At the time I didn't question this list, but now I am so.. yeah; Can you explain each of these reads other than the Null line; {massive, pistachi0n, Skelda} Unless you wish to say stuff about them in which case feel free (but those are really low activity people so far) This will allow more conversation hopefully and get some momentum as I feel we are running kinda slow on the conversation front. For the same reasons for wanting his vote expanded apply to this list; Without knowing why on these things we will be unable to look into them deeper and a quick summery on each is great for helping discussion some of the time. More is better but a couple sentances is good too this is D1 and only a few pages in after all.In post 119, Transcend wrote:BS'd list of reads so far
{KTS}
{Naomi}
{Jord, BlackStar}
{massive, pistachi0n, Skelda}
{Io}
{Vedith, light, Creature}
{xyzzy}
I'm kinda slow to make my own reads, but I'll aid to get the first list up around page 10, (or as soon as im awake post page 10)Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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On your lurk statement I reviewed there activity in an iso and its not that great. No better than mine though so eh? But anyway they seem to ask pretty okay questions. but this wasn't the focus of my iso. It was to check your statement and tbh I'm not seeing it from your perspective. They have done 8 posts so far 2 of which was RVS (which arguably we are still in kinda?) some stuff talking about general game meta (the day talk, Putting people L-2) but when it comes to your statement I find it rather perplexing. Not sure what else to say on this topic.In post 154, Creature wrote:
Either, I don't have anything more than say other than "was there when she could lurk"In post 152, Naomi-Tan wrote:Additionally; If you feel XYZZY is not scum you should expand why you feel that way else your just saying words. Its why when I said I was starting to get someone I felt was scummy I purposely left out who because I don't really have more than GUT on that side as there isn't that great of stuff going on.
PEDIT; Hey looks like my activity stimuli has kicked in! but can you cover your scum reads as they are most important to game flow? (I know you said 3 but Scum reads are the important ones as it allows to cross check for fake reasoning)
PEDIT2; I haven't been asked for explanations on anything because so far I haven't given out many reads As far as I'm concerned I like Transcend for his early read list (though I'm currently squeezing it for more information to assist town and to try and get a more active scum hunting // create discussions over stuff to get the ball flowing a little better.) and KTS ...... And then KTS was moved back to null.. just noticed the entire game he has been using friendly terms and acting like I'm town which is extremely strange as we are not linked in a role (aka we are not masons//lovers) and I don't think I've done anything too townie yet. I guess this is a strange case of me thinking he was being too friendly? he also uses terms like I'm always right.. so i'm kinda suspecting psychological tactics are at play there, or he is just being really friendly and nice and reads me as town and I'm being paranoid.. Could I get some 3rd party opinions on this matter in relation to his interactions with myself?
PEDIT3; Give me a chance to type XDNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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You know what they say about people in glass houses... Yeah I saw this and then read the ISO on IO followed by yourself. your about equal.. so yeah..In post 161, BlackStar wrote:VOTE: io You haven't done anything useful so far and you haven't even laid down a vote yet after all this timeNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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In post 164, Creature wrote:Let's go, 81 is a huge filler.
Quoting so we can see the post (and so I can write with less tabs open)In post 81, Io wrote:
Ew friends are gross.In post 30, Killthestory wrote:o and Light, Vedith, Naomi, Creature, Black, and Io.
All wagon this with me friends
Doesn't make it less believable I fake town slipped in my first newbie game which had day chat. But really any scum 'sliping' town is fake no matter what, daytalk just means they could do it earlier and maybe a bit easier, though in that game I posted that 'slip' was before my partner got on.In post 19, Killthestory wrote:If scum use daytalk right, any interaction or 'slip' can be fake.
Also a side note I haven't played a closed game before so is this right, and is there any general things to note that are very common to see in closed games? I've read the link provided by Dunn in the OP, and looked at setups for a few games, but that doesn't really get a very good feel for what is common.In post 18, xyzzy wrote:I'm just an eager beaver! I'm first on the list because I was the first one to sign up for the game, and I refreshed the thread like 20 times today waiting for it to unlock.
the fact that the scum have daytalk is interesting. it implies a higher than average power level among the town, or a lower than average power level among the scum.
P-edit:
I'm pretty sure Kill didn't say everyone other than Jord was town. Not as scummy sure, but not scummy on page 3 wouldn't be a town read for most people.Creature wrote:Does this mean everybody who has posted besides Jordarrian is town?
Okay so First part is filler!
Second part; Shows he thought about if it was a scum slip or a town slip and decided its too much WIFOM to go off of and explains that
Third part; is an inquirey into normal setups for these mini's
Fourth part; is confusing and I'll need to look up what you was talking about at the time, Sec!
Fortuh part take 2; Okay so.. looked it up this post just makes no sense and is entirely backwards given at the time and statements I looked like KTS was scum calling Jord while town calling myself. This is a pretty freaky misunderstanding that I dunno how it came about.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I broke down IO's post 81 to filter out content?In post 169, Transcend wrote:What did i just readNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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its cause or poor quoting. I starting looking at it. Then I found I was missing vital information namely KTS's reads at the bottom of page 3. So I had to look those up and created a new line to analyse it properly. I could of redacted line 4 take 1, but I wanted to have my thought process down.In post 172, Transcend wrote:I don't think it's fake, but you completely lost me on the part 4 analysis
PEDIT: Thanks missed it. not really nor have I.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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correction to 168 : Fortuh part take 2; Okay so.. looked it up this post just makes no sense and is entirely backwards given at the time and statementsItlooked like KTS was scum calling Jord whilecalling metowncalling myself. This is a pretty freaky misunderstanding that I dunno how it came about.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I disagree with this breakdown. Which is why I provided my own. Yours seems to ignore the content that is there.In post 179, Creature wrote:First part is filler
Second part is fluff, no opinions on who townslipped.
Third part, no actual scum hunting.
Not sure on the Fourth Part.
In post 181, Creature wrote:1. xyzzy
2. Transcend
3. light_ganski
4. massive
5. Jordarrian
6. Killthestory
7. BlackStar
8. Creature
9. Skelda
10. Vedith
11. pistachi0n
12. Io
13. Naomi-Tan
Okay... I'll come back to this 2 posts but for now. Great job explaining these reads! (that was sarcasm btw)In post 189, Vedith wrote:Calm down guys, Creatures not scum!
Neither do I~In post 209, Io wrote:
Yes I know what you are saying and what you are claiming, but I don't believe that is your intent.In post 208, Creature wrote:Io
I already found your post weird, but I wanted someone to see what others thought first.
Wut?In post 216, Transcend wrote:Creature has moved up in my books.
Okay then! Good now your back on the same page as me. Right onto part 2/3In post 225, Transcend wrote:What.
Massive hasn't even posted and you scum read him?
Forget about you moving up in my books.
VOTE: CreatureNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Read List 1.0
1. xyzzy - Null, there activity has been lacking and I havn't gotten a strong enough read to move them either way
2. Transcend - Likely town given there content thus far
3. light_ganski - Unsure, some of there activity seems scummy while other bits seem townie. Probably have a better read on this slot in my next read list
4. massive - Who? They havn't spoken yet. Most likely to be replaced by the gm shortly because of this.
5. Jordarrian - Firstly Anyone I have to ISO to try to remember really needs to pick up the pace, secondly Null? they haven't really DONE much of anything so.. Null.
6. Killthestory - Dunno, I find him budding me too strong to not recolonise that it influenced my perspective on things. I'm not really going to go either way because of this
7. BlackStar - Minor scummy reading, as the first person to focus on IO I iso'd there content in relation to his and found he wasn't doing much more content seems to me that he focused on a weaker town player who may been an issue once momentum picked up choosing to place the easy vote while it was easy. This said he could also believe what he was saying so yeah
8. Creature - My number one scum read right now. I'll talk about this in my next post, but feel free to run an ISO on him while I get that one ready.
9. Skelda - Firstly Anyone I have to ISO to try to remember really needs to pick up the pace, Secondly Null They literally done one post saying there gonna post later seems like a mod poke dodge.
10. Vedith -Minor scummy, Just not buying the roleclaim really. like no one really has to RC day one and he just sorta did it and that seems to be his major focus.
11. pistachi0n - Firstly Anyone I have to ISO to try to remember really needs to pick up the pace, secondly one post with a vote on myself at 104 posts with no reason given is sorta shitty. Still a Null though because what can you make of that?
12. Io - Might be town. Though there content at the start of the train on them was lacking they seem to have started forming well though out arguments and that seems likely to be townie.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Okay and now for the creature post 3/3
I currently suspect him of being scum due to his play style. but anyway breaking down this iso.
his first 9 posts was RVS / had no scum hunting so I'm ignoring Iso 0 - 8 or upto 43 and they can just be pushed aside. as the scum hunting only recently took an upshoot
First post I take as a scummy thing is here;
In this post they accuse me of whitekingting baring in mind at the time no one was pressuring light and that was what made me kinda suspicious. Without a lynch train going on and no one pressuring them on the comment I made there was no reason or way I could be whiteknighting however after this post light started thinking I was for a couple of posts till I explained this at the time. now I'm interrupting this as him trying to make me seem worse at the time and maybe get a train my direction but i'm not done on creature yet.In post 57, Creature wrote:
We know, you don't need to whiteknight him.In post 50, Naomi-Tan wrote:
I would like to point out that the fact scum have day talk is in the setup on page one encase anyone miss's it and thinks this is a scum slip.In post 25, light_ganski wrote:Yeah if the scum team are any good daytalk is more powerful than a PR so we probably have a few
Also this;In post 70, Killthestory wrote:dude Jordarrian is p obv scum we should be voting him.In post 69, Killthestory wrote:
no lol Naomi is a G and p decent.In post 49, Jordarrian wrote:Holy shit I found another me
Here we can see him taking KTS's words and pretty much ignoring them. This also lead to IO posting about it in 81 and myself a few pages back.In post 78, Creature wrote:Does this mean everybody who has posted besides Jordarrian is town?In post 143, Creature wrote:lol if I were scum I wouldn't simply join the wagon like this.Then we have this bit of WIFOM / LAMIST stuff. where he goes Scum won't do this and then votes with no reasoning for IO and states his veiws on someone else. At the time I pressured his XYYZY view and took the time to explain how its kinda bad to do stuff without reasoning with it. Here I'd like to expand on my thoughts on that subject slightly mid post you can skip this part if you like but It may also help you understand my read here; Just like how its super easy for scum to RoleClaim VT Its also easy for them to give votes and lists without reasoning. It comes off and looks like activity however anyone can give a list of names like that, you may do it strongest to weakest player or how you think generally town is but votes with no data are just that no data nothings that cannot be used to either find your alignment or read your true views other than eliminating other targets. This'll come up again in his read list.
Here we see another example of; What would I do if I was town. Much like the quotes above it shows that creature has been thinking about what is 'townie' and then doing things based on that while trying to avoid 'scummy' acts this stateing of stuff when he does it just makes me think that he is scum thinking about what he should do as town and then doing that. in contrast to my own post which I made just declaring as a blanket I'll do certain things, his posts are always followed by doing what he feels is a 'townie' action while myself as town put it at the start and then only did those things slowly over time as they came up, as once I posted my intro post I don't think about what is scummy or townie and just post what i'm thinking at the time (and sometimes my thoughts mid post)In post 153, Creature wrote:Let's see:
Scum would want to make their posts less awkward.
Town is usually awkward at beginning.
Then there is this weird thing. Where he defends XYZYY pretty much because I asked him how he got his read. If you look back at the ISO of XYZYY upto creatures post of 154 you can see there isn't much going on that would be considered active scum hunting to make this read in the first place. Making me think he didn't take the time to construct why XYZYY was not scum and when asked panicked and said something that came to mind (his activity) however, upon research this shouldn't been the case.In post 154, Creature wrote:
Either, I don't have anything more than say other than "was there when she could lurk"In post 152, Naomi-Tan wrote:Additionally; If you feel XYZZY is not scum you should expand why you feel that way else your just saying words. Its why when I said I was starting to get someone I felt was scummy I purposely left out who because I don't really have more than GUT on that side as there isn't that great of stuff going on.
Now we get to the blackstar IO vote;In post 161, BlackStar wrote:VOTE: io You haven't done anything useful so far and you haven't even laid down a vote yet after all this time
Upon having blackstar join his wagon he declared that post 81 was nothing but filler over simplifying to point of irrelevance. having this pointed out I decided to look into post 81 to see if it was just all filler before I accepted what he said. I read the post quoted below as followed;In post 164, Creature wrote:Let's go, 81 is a huge filler.In post 81, Io wrote:
Ew friends are gross.In post 30, Killthestory wrote:o and Light, Vedith, Naomi, Creature, Black, and Io.
All wagon this with me friends
Doesn't make it less believable I fake town slipped in my first newbie game which had day chat. But really any scum 'sliping' town is fake no matter what, daytalk just means they could do it earlier and maybe a bit easier, though in that game I posted that 'slip' was before my partner got on.In post 19, Killthestory wrote:If scum use daytalk right, any interaction or 'slip' can be fake.
Also a side note I haven't played a closed game before so is this right, and is there any general things to note that are very common to see in closed games? I've read the link provided by Dunn in the OP, and looked at setups for a few games, but that doesn't really get a very good feel for what is common.In post 18, xyzzy wrote:I'm just an eager beaver! I'm first on the list because I was the first one to sign up for the game, and I refreshed the thread like 20 times today waiting for it to unlock.
the fact that the scum have daytalk is interesting. it implies a higher than average power level among the town, or a lower than average power level among the scum.
P-edit:
I'm pretty sure Kill didn't say everyone other than Jord was town. Not as scummy sure, but not scummy on page 3 wouldn't be a town read for most people.Creature wrote:Does this mean everybody who has posted besides Jordarrian is town?In post 168, Naomi-Tan wrote: Okay so First part is filler!
Second part; Shows he thought about if it was a scum slip or a town slip and decided its too much WIFOM to go off of and explains that
Third part; is an inquirey into normal setups for these mini's
After putting my views out where I think I summed up nicely what they said he put this over simplification out trying to make his stance betterIn post 176, Naomi-Tan wrote:Fortuh part take 2; Okay so.. looked it up this post just makes no sense and is entirely backwards given at the time and statements It looked like KTS was scum calling Jord while calling me town calling myself. This is a pretty freaky misunderstanding that I dunno how it came about.
I strongly disagree with this break down as it ignores certain key points such as the second part being all fluff with no comment on the slip is untrue as they was saying its too much WIFOM to speculate and the 3rd part being no actual scum hunting doesn't matter as they was trying to work out the game. Then there is the fourth part which he didn't comment on.. (the 4th of his post is NAI)In post 179, Creature wrote:First part is filler
Second part is fluff, no opinions on who townslipped.
Third part, no actual scum hunting.
Not sure on the Fourth Part.
You remember his read list.. I told you I'd come back to it
Right lets quickly go through the people he eliminated from this list. theres himself (which is bad. You shouldn't need to include yourself in a read list and its a little tacky. LAMIST ) Next Thing I notice is he crossed out all the most active towny players. myself KTS and Transcend. then there is xyzzy not crossed out despite him thinking he was town earlier and all the weaker town left in with two acceptations; Blackstar and Jordaman. Now if I had to guess he included one scum buddy in his town list and didn't include another. the XYZZY elimination could been done for distancing and as for the scum left in I'd suspect blackstar for the IO vote this of course is speculation on my part. but my veiw stands that a few of these reads are really off hilter and reads that I really cannot see. for example black star and XYZZY's play is pretty close but one posted more recently and moving on.In post 181, Creature wrote:1. xyzzy
2. Transcend
3. light_ganski
4. massive
5. Jordarrian
6. Killthestory
7. BlackStar
8. Creature
9. Skelda
10. Vedith
11. pistachi0n
12. Io
13. Naomi-Tan
Finally this flip flop changing from trying to get an IO train started to considering to protect them, normally speaking when you think someone is scum you don't rotate on a dial as it is. as im Scum reading them I'm seeing this as them trying to backtrack after biting off a bit more than they can chew.In post 230, Creature wrote:
Hard defend someone.In post 228, Io wrote:
I don even know what that means.In post 223, Creature wrote:I am actually tempted to whiteknight Io.
My scum veiw on creature is not comprised of a single post but multiple posts as you can now see. It wasn't any one of these things that made me veiw them as scummy but the composition of the whole each I found to move them slightly closer to being scum and it wasn't till I looked at this full picture that I decided to make them my number one pick. and without further ado time for my first vote of the game VOTE: Creature
well I've said a lot and I expect others will want to respond and may add or subtract from this list. its pretty sizeable though so sorry about that, its kinda what happens when you compile like this.
PEDIT; @Creature I think she is saying that I was scum read on page 5 but i'm not nowNaomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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6 complete games.
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Maybe but I'd rather put everything else at once.In post 250, Transcend wrote:Mother of God Naomi, no one is gonna read that whole thing. I bet you ten bucks that you could've said less than you did.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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I warned you about glass houses bro I told you dawg.In post 254, pistachi0n wrote:
None of your posts have...contentIn post 246, BlackStar wrote:
Why am I your top scumread?In post 240, pistachi0n wrote:
Yes! Killthestory hasn't lived up to his promises at all, what a disappointment. Creature who thinks me naked voting someone in my first post is scummy has probably never played with me before. I was weakly scumreading Naomi after reading the first five pages because I thought her posts were fluffy. Now my top scumread is BlackStar, VOTE: blackstarIn post 105, xyzzy wrote:care to offer anything else, pistachi0n?Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Fun Facts about my mega vote post;In post 257, Io wrote:
Why not? It's only a few paragraphs. Plus I read it.In post 250, Transcend wrote:Mother of God Naomi, no one is gonna read that whole thing. I bet you ten bucks that you could've said less than you did.
Words; 1,183
Characters; 6,081
Sentences; 25
Paragraphs; 20
Top 3 most used words; Scum(16), Post(15), Read & Time(9)Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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No its really not. If you look at the time stamps (as I worked non-stop) it took about an hour to create that and though its easy just to put the flaws out its harder to think about each post critically and construct a post displaying why you think someone is scummy.In post 261, Creature wrote:Isn't that enough games to know it's easy to make a huge post containing all flaws someone made?
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yeah but its post like this one that makes me think your scum more than anything where you show your purposely looking at what town would do and do it. Town don't normally think what town would do not like this .. It also makes me think your purposely looking at your own meta as town and trying to duplicate it as scum.In post 271, Creature wrote:Sheeping isn't scummy (specially this early), it can be town-motivated or scum-motivated.
If you notice, my posts have some reaction tests and jokes inside. Common for town that wants to push the game earlier. Uncommon for scum that's concentrated to not get attention.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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This is also the view im coming from. I took so many posts and put them together not because one thing stood out but it was a slow slide of mounting things that piled up to make me think this way.In post 278, Io wrote:
Well not to prove your point, but everything can be faked. The thing is that you really can't take everything at face value and say that every town slip must be from town and you can't be skeptical of every single thing posted. The point where the "everythign can be faked" comes in is when looking at a person as a whole through their ISO and interactions with others to reach a conclusion of "OK they are likely not to be faking this town slip because they've done this and that which x number of coincidences means it's more likely to not be scum faking a slip," or "OK they are likely to be faking this because of the way they approached it and this and that makes them look more consistently scummy even in smaller amounts so it probably is indeed scum faking it."In post 275, Creature wrote:I don't like when someone acts like "everything can be faked", how would the game work? Stay in the shadows and wait someone make a flaw?Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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That was a long enough awkward pause. The point of the post was to show how I was thinking trying to explain it to creature. I don't think it took an expert to explain that. It matters not if its textbook stuff Its just what needed to be said and your post make me pause in shock for a while.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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the utter oblivious nature of it.In post 283, pistachi0n wrote:Wait, my post made you pause in shock?Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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This means it was NAI but just took me off balance like a swing I wasn't expecting, to use a fighting metaphor.In post 284, Naomi-Tan wrote:
the utter oblivious nature of it.In post 283, pistachi0n wrote:Wait, my post made you pause in shock?Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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you can't interact with someone saying "hey give more content" without just ignoring them and giving contentIn post 308, xyzzy wrote:my issue is that his complaints don't offer any way to interact with them. I'm not saying that I don't understand his arguments, I'm saying that his arguments are constructed in such a way that trying to counter them in any way is futile because of how subjective they are. things like asking questions and referring to specific statements show a good faith effort to make sure that if I'm not scum that I have a chance to show it, and I feel like Transcend is going out of his way to make that impossible for me.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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If I wasn't voting you before I'd do it now... Lych all Lairs (saying he doesn't find them scummy when he literally just said he did 9 posts ago)In post 330, Creature wrote:
massive is null.In post 326, BlackStar wrote:I can understand why you said light and Vedith, but not the other two. Can you explain your reads?
I didn't decide on pistachi0n yet.
Everybody else has done something that I find town.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Null =/= Scummy Null means nothing no read as in neutral NIA neither good nor bad, Balanced, Ect. This is not even good. I can't believe this to be a thing thats true! Null is just too clear to mistake It feels like your just making stuff up now to cover your assIn post 334, Creature wrote:I scumread nullreads and I believe town!massive would've done something.
Also, don't come with "Lynch all Liars"Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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yes it is. Looks like I've slept off the worst of it now so I'ma go back over the posts I skipped because Of being bleh. One sec.In post 420, massive wrote:pssht nice q+, jeez
Naomi, don't take this the wrong way, but is English your first language?Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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Wow, yeah reading that is a little bit terrible I should really keep things more condense and not try to reference Monty python sketches. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npjOSLCR2hEIn post 340, BlackStar wrote:
I'm not saying that you're scum, but the wording of your posts feels very awkwardIn post 339, Naomi-Tan wrote:
Null =/= Scummy Null means nothing no read as in neutral NIA neither good nor bad, Balanced, Ect. This is not even good. I can't believe this to be a thing thats true! Null is just too clear to mistake It feels like your just making stuff up now to cover your assIn post 334, Creature wrote:I scumread nullreads and I believe town!massive would've done something.
Also, don't come with "Lynch all Liars"Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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In post 340, BlackStar wrote:
I'm not saying that you're scum, but the wording of your posts feels very awkwardIn post 339, Naomi-Tan wrote:
Null =/= Scummy Null means nothing no read as in neutral NIA neither good nor bad, Balanced, Ect. This is not even good. I can't believe this to be a thing thats true! Null is just too clear to mistake It feels like your just making stuff up now to cover your assIn post 334, Creature wrote:I scumread nullreads and I believe town!massive would've done something.
Also, don't come with "Lynch all Liars"
I still don't understand this gimmick thing and find it confusing that you say I stopped something.. What even was the gimick you was refrencing. as for the other stuff only the IO vote sticks out as kinda wrong here as If you thought it looked weird you should of looked up the ISO and decided if they was scum or town before nailing down a vote. But I guess reactions based on one thing can be quite common so its okay there.In post 344, Transcend wrote:all of it is solid, just the part where you concluded i was scum is wrong.
i'll defend myself in full detail.
I was willing to bw with KTS on Jord to generate reactions, which we got.
Creature's posts are awkward and in a scummy way, not in a towny way. He also WIFOM'd a bit. And finally I don't agree with the reads he has.
Io's response to Creature/BlackStar vote was pretty bad. Didn't see the self vote as towny so I threw her a vote and gave Creature BOTD until he tried to push on inactive slots.
I did complain about Naomi, which I probably could've done without, but it is what it is.
Voting xyzzy was lightly pushing her, and encouraging others to vote her as well to add pressure.
And last but not least, I never said that I scumread Naomi at all. I only said her posts and gimmick were annoying and I was okay policy lynching her for a bit. But then she dropped the gimmick. I hate third party gimmick accounts.
could you explain what bw is and what kinda reactions your talking about? I'm not very good at reading reactions.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ §- Naomi-Tan
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and gimmick were annoying and I was okay policy lynching her for a bit. But then she dropped the gimmick. I hate third party gimmick accounts.[/quote]
... are these not the same things?In post 349, Creature wrote:Not doing anything scummy is easy, being towny isn't.Naomi ~ ☠ ♠ ♣ ⦿ ✿ ♡ § - Naomi-Tan
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