Mini 1840: Watch Dogs Blitz [Game Over]

[Not Chara]

hello everyone. i didn't have a chance to read the full game before night ended, so i'm doing that now.
there's a bit to catch up on, so if anyone has any important events i should know about that they want opinions on, tell me so i can pay attention to them.

[Not Chara]

i still have no context for any of this, but that question looked to me like what Panther was reading it was. 'are you confident about your result, and should we listen to you?'
i don't see a problem with that, Varsoon.
also, hello! :>

[Not Chara]

^ i'll pay attention to the above as i read. i mean, i would have anyway, since Gamma has flipped town.

[Not Chara]

i wouldn't discount the possibility.
1821: why did this come to mind, Infinity? trying for a mislynch in such a manner is as dangerous as fakeclaiming a guilty.
still not caught up, don't have time. but i'm here during class, if you want me to look at specific things.

[Not Chara]

i've just requested a log of text messages between my slot and other players. hopefully they're interesting.

[Not Chara]

no reason to fakeclaim that one is able to roleblock phone actions. that'd be stupid.
Stargazers, you have what amounts to a guilty on SlySly. yet you're voting Creature because he got a guilty result on you? even though it's been brought up that redirection or framing could be possible? i don't buy it.
did i misunderstand something?
add the points earlier, that it would be ridiculous for Creature as scum to frame you in this manner when he would likely be lynched the next day.

[Not Chara]

oh. happy scumday, SlySly.
nice action claim there, but it had little to do with what i was asking Stargazers. the point is they claim to have roleblocked you on the night of a no kill and don't seem very suspicious of it.
Stargazers: why is a Creature/SlySly scumteam unlikely in your mind?
i can't point to any games i remember right now, but i'm sure i've seen those elements used on this site before. especially in games where (according to Creature's claim) results are given without player names.
'Not Chara visited no one last night' is a different result from 'your target visited no one last night'. one of them leaves the possibility for redirection or framing.

[Not Chara]

lane: i assumed that, if true, it would simply block phone use. including text-messaging, hacks, etc. why wouldn't it block hacks?

Sly: that's still a claim of what you did. it wasn't needed, is the point.
Maria: did you? maybe Nahdia said they thought they weren't on a team.

pedit: what the hell.

[Not Chara]

@stargazers You guys claim non-consecutive right?

If maria is town, slysly is scum 100%. I think a framer/redirector is more likely than creature suiciding to kill a non-consecutive roleblocker, but creature specifically doesn't have to be the rolecop. Scum just has to have a rolecop on their team.

i think their role is only non-consecutive if they do both types of blocking. not sure, that would be a good question.

pedit: what does that mean, Dunn?

[Not Chara]

...ok, Sly. so we just disagree. claiming no action is still giving information about your role, and i don't want to argue semantics with you. that's like claiming VT and defending yourself with 'oh, but i didn't claim a PR'. it helps scum narrow things down.
explain your self-vote. i can't see a reason for it beyond stirring the pot.
Dunn: oh, right. i'd forgotten the name of that action.

[Not Chara]

town don't normally volunteer to lynch themselves when they get guiltied. especially with talk of roles messing with night actions. i mean, really?
well, maybe Sly is just like that. considering his signature. i still don't like it.

pedit: but yes, that. a roleblock + a no kill is not irontight for a few reasons, but it's a solid guilty.

[Not Chara]

i want to catch up before we start deciding lynches. there are a few things at play here.

also, Sly might be town.

lane: there are other explanations. i'm having trouble keeping up with this discussion and reading at the same time.
i would lynch Stargazers, if i had to choose right now. but i want to read.

[Not Chara]

Sly: i looked at your Dunn case. i don't think pushing town on day 1 is particularly scummy by itself. did you find their reasons to be contrived?
also, i'm terrible, sorry. i've been busy and still have not caught up. but entirely based on day 2, i would still lynch Stargazers. and Panther is town.

Sly needs to stop voting himself.

[Not Chara]

Sly: i looked at your Dunn case. i don't think pushing town on day 1 is particularly scummy by itself. did you find their reasons to be contrived?
also, i'm terrible, sorry. i've been busy and still have not caught up. but entirely based on day 2, i would still lynch Stargazers. and Panther is town.

Sly needs to stop voting himself.

As soon as the votes are where they need to be, on Stargazers, my vote will move to the right place.

this post also had a question for you.

[Not Chara]

that wasn't really a response. town push town a lot. you have to tell me why Dunn wasn't misguided town, or else say why all (or most) of the other Gamma votes were towny ones.

[Not Chara]

2062. i like the pressing here and asking for clarification, it's something i find myself doing a lot.
i need to find time to read though, because at this point i'm missing a good portion of the game.
2079: i don't know whether to be flattered or annoyed, because i haven't put very much of myself into this game yet. :>
but seriously, what does this mean? it's not really a read so much as a statement of 'Chara isn't doing anything stupid'.

[Not Chara]

oh, right. Sly, when i reread i'll be paying attention to that. doing a quick check of your ISO, this scumread on dunn just seems to have come from nowhere with only the revelation that Gamma is town + a post involving a winking emoticon being factors to change it.

[Not Chara]

Sly: who did Dunn bus? Stargazers? or are you using bus to mean voting town?
yet, i do sort of like your answer. it doesn't make dunn look more like scum, but it makes you a bit more likely to be town.

pedit: wait, what? you just said they could be a team. does that not imply a scumread?

[Not Chara]

Sly: oh. my bad on missing that, thank you.
Infinity: my read on panther is mostly from tone right now. i know it's fakeable, but i like the way he asked. better stuff when i catch up.

[Not Chara]

i still have no context for any of this, but that question looked to me like what Panther was reading it was. 'are you confident about your result, and should we listen to you?'
i don't see a problem with that, Varsoon.
also, hello! :>

It reads more like lining up lynches to me.
No shit Panther's willing to deal with the consequences of what he said--trying to insist "Oh but it you're wrong we get to lynch you, too" is awkward. Like I said, it seems like setting up for a town v town where both get lynched.
[snip]
-V

i've found the 'lining up lynches' tell to be a bit weak. if scum wanted to lynch Creature for being wrong... why not accuse him after Stargazer's flips town?
speaking of, what are your reads on Creature and Stargazers? why do you think both of them are town?

[Not Chara]

A town roleblocker that isn't Stargazers that blocked the scum kill

Yea, Infinity explained it after I asked.

do you still think this?
it's kind of a stretch that this town roleblocker wouldn't try and get their guilty lynched.

[Not Chara]

Expedience: i keep forgetting about the Last Will mechanic. i should stop doing that. good answer.
and i agree with you regarding grapevine. that they saw a guilty and thought both the accuser and accused were town is a weird jump to make from the beginning.

[Not Chara]

not lynching anything over stargazers today.
actaully, when Expedience requoted infinity(?)'s post that started all of this, i found the wording odd. i remembered it as a normal question, but on the reread it was strangely casual, like he was expecting a town Stargazer lynch and to grab a Creature mislynch on the backhand.

especially now that it's been explained, grapevine shouldn't be getting votes for this. i've only read this page so i'm not sure if they have them, just a guess based on Varsoon's words on this page.
going to bed.

[Not Chara]

to add to the above: it wasn't a 'how confident are you' kind of feel, or a 'we'll lynch you if stargazer flips town, you know that'. it was more like 'hey there, if we lynch stargazer and they're town, can we lynch you?'

i'm likely not articulating myself well. if you want clarification, see you tomorrow.

this is more in relation to grapevine than infinity. mainly, i can see where varsoon is coming from.

[Not Chara]

i'm still swamped.
but there isn't any way i'll be replacing out here, so you're stuck with my low activity.

someone ask me a targeted question and i'll see if i have time to answer. i'll attempt to catch up more while Aquanim is doing the same. apologies. :<

[Not Chara]

alright. i'm finally,

actually

caught up. let's chat.

i have reads, of varying confidence. and i'm aware of the approaching deadline. but for a few reasons (having to do with information from my read of the thread), i'm going to wait for replies to messages first.
a bottom line is. i don't want Stargazers lynched.

[Not Chara]

and, Infinity is town.

good, because he was my top scumread.
Creature is scum. Aquanim is likely scum, and i'm inclined to think Stargazers is scum with them.

[Not Chara]

no, that's a lie. he was my top scumread as i was reading earlier. by the time i'd caught up, House-slot was my best guess for scum.

[Not Chara]

House-slot is nowhere near obvious town.
Creature's early play was terrible, and faking a guilty on a scumpartner is only another kind of bus.
your early play was also awful, but i find the likelihood of you immediately outing that i'd claimed traitor to you as scum to be really, really unlikely.

pedit: i was hoping you'd believe it. i knew you were scumreading me, so i thought there was a fair chance of it working. that, and this game having private communication makes traitor an enticing possibility for scum. it's

possible

scum would immediately not believe me due to knowing their own roles and numbers, but if we assume 3 scum in 13 players, traitor is possible.

[Not Chara]

for a while, i was toying with Stargazers being town. for some reason, i remembered Creature entertaining the possibility of a redirector/framer, and i thought he was possible he took a leap to do fake guilty town when popular opinion is 'no sane scum would do so'. when i'd finished catching up, i realized i was wrong about that. so i don't believe Creature is scum with Stargazers town. there's no way.

Maria looked vaguely town. but on Nahdia's side of things, i like them less.

[Not Chara]

summary of House slot.
i originally had him as town for his interpretation of lane's townslip. (for the record, i also agree that lane is very, very likely town)
then, 343 and 344.
it's true that it doesn't count as whiteknighting, what House did. he has good cause to read lane as town.

then 348 and the one directly after. House really felt like he needed to defend himself over defending lane, despite calling him town because of the slip. why would you need to point out that you happened to question one of lane's posts? House is definitely townreading lane here, so there's not really a good reason to say 'damn lane, didn't expect this defensiveness' in the first place. but it's fine on its own. then he calls back to it... i don't like it at all.

there's also his interactons with Gamma. more on that when i get a minute.

pedit: ok, i see where the difference lies. i should have specifically said power-bussing, the kind that assures your scumbuddy would be lynched.
pretty sure i said i wanted gazers lynched.
unless you're referring to what i said right after i said i was caught up? that was to see if i could bait an answer out of stargazers. i claimed traitor to them as well. you answered first, so it ended up being moot.

[Not Chara]

Either way you probably won't have to lynch me unless scum is confident I won't wreck their faction down with my results.

what does this post mean?

[Not Chara]

1161, i don't like at all.
for this:
1178 and 1184. there's really no consideration that Gamma is inadequately explaining himself, or even that he genuinely feels that way. House has to explain

to

Gamma why his thoughts don't make sense, which, really, you'd only need to do if Gamma was town, not scum. then. 'i don't get why'. if you don't get it, why would Gamma do it as scum, either? this isn't hindsight is 20/20. i'm not saying players who misread Gamma are scum. Mathblade, i'm pretty sure is town, they were just really off-base.

but the way House was pushing it doesn't feel like someone who thought that player was scum. i think he was fine with lynching Gamma because he was justified in following his townread on Mathblade. 1378. it gives him reason to start the push. this is difficult to explain, because Gamma's logic

was

flawed... but there's no accounting for mistakes being made, it all boils down to blindly trusting Mathblade.

[Not Chara]

i know that's why House did it. i'm wondering why he felt the need to defend himself. did he feel threatened by Dunn? it's like it's just there to be a token showing of House questioning lane. but it's not real questioning, it's just calling lane out for something House didn't even believe made lane scum. the whole way it fell made it feel fabricated to me.

the thing with Creature's bus is that, you're right. it's definitely much stronger than simply going through with a vote on your scumbuddy. the motivation is the same. murder your scumbuddy -> achieve towncred.
going to go grab Creature's posts when i have time, because my point here is that Creature was giving me bad feelings during my reread, and i don't think getting a guilty on Stargazers (assuming they flip scum) overrides that in the least.

i can't speak for how a lot of players have failed to consider scum motivation. but House ignored both scum and scum motivation and was purely using a logical error as a reason for scum Gamma. that's about as shallow as one can get. logical =/= town, and House should know that. (the same with the reverse)

as for everyone townreading my scumreads: i'd have to check again. now that i'm caught up, i can properly have conversations about this. it's difficult to look at today's scumreads due to the guilty hanging over us.
actually, speaking of: i don't like Creature outing his guilty immediately. there was no need for that at all. it just makes the day that much more useless for analysis. not sure if that's alignment indicative for Creature because i can understand

why

someone would out their guilty quickly.

[Not Chara]

Let's see what happens when I claim a guilty on my buddy:

As town, scum is very likely going to kill me because they don't want to have a high risk of being caught just to save a mislynch. As scum, town will worry about why I wasn't killed for the reason I said.

I also run the risk of being counterclaimed.

i really can't understand what you're trying to say with your 'as town' comment. rephrase?

as for the second. highly townread players survive to late game often. but i don't want to expand on this right now, there's no need. especially if i'm incorrect about you.
and your last point is another that is better to not be talked about.

[Not Chara]

lane: i'll happily vote stargazers as soon as Aquanim catches up and gives thoughts. are you caught up?

[Not Chara]

oh, that was bad wording. i meant to ask if Aqua was caught up.

[Not Chara]

i don't. he took that one point and compounded it.
if you have House as town, explain why, or quote where you explain?

and talk to me about your other scumreads. grapevine, Panther, Expedience?

[Not Chara]

Aquanim. what didn't you like about my gambit with Stargazers and Infinity?
though, i wouldn't call it a gambit. gambits need to be risky.

[Not Chara]

all of the scumteam at once?
how would these players know what i messaged to the others?
i'm pretty sure Infinity was the only player online.

it's possible Stargazers wrote a post in the scum PT about it, but... Infinity's reply was nearly immediate. i doubt he knew what i said to you and Stargazers. i'm very comfortable with that townread. i got good use out of it for that.

so, unless you're scumclaiming, (i mean, it's possible... haha) Stargazers is the only scum player i claimed to.
what i'm wondering is why, in 2379, you didn't say 'Chara claimed traitor to me as well'? did you assume that the rest of the thread would just figure it out?

[Not Chara]

If you want me to quote a ton of posts where people failed to consider scum motivation in this game, I'll do it. It's a very common mistake to make as town. There's a reason why my sig has to exist.

House town is a really strong gut feeling I guess. I might try to quote some posts that stuck out to me

Most of my scumreads are PoE. Every time varsoon talks it makes my gut squirm and it doesn't feel like he's gamesolving at all. But grapes looks town to me. Panther is because he kept arguing to lynch gazers after it was clear they were being lynched and because...he's not doing as much as I think he should given how he seems to me as a player. And expedience I think is town tbh but PoE. Now that I went over it again I kinda want to lynch grapevine...it feels like grapes may have been trying to buddy me

I hate to admit it but...your gambit looks town. And I don't want to have to go over this game once again but I really should

i thought i posted a response to this, but i guess i didn't.

i'd like to see you quote some town House posts, yes.
i'll take another look at Grapevine and Panther.

[Not Chara]

read Grapevine. i like them.
it actually made me like Expedience less rather than increase my scumread on Grapevine. why doesn't Varsoon feel like he's trying to gamesolve?

[Not Chara]

knowing your scumreads would be useful.
besides Stargazers.

[Not Chara]

well. that's one way to say 'i'm not committed to these reads'.
why is dunn scum?
why did Stargazers attempt to guilty their partner?

[Not Chara]

i'll rephrase. why did you put dunn in your list? why Panther? what put them there.

[Not Chara]

hm. that's weak.
not sure if there's a need to draw this out.

i'll hammer Stargazers before i go to bed.

[Not Chara]

Stargazers (L-3): Creature, lane0168, Dunnstral, SlySly,

so, this is the count.
VOTE: Stargazers
why they weren't at L-1 to begin with here baffles me.
you two, hammer.

[Not Chara]

oh. wait, why did i think Sly wasn't voting? he's right there.

[Not Chara]

Creature that's not an answer to my question dude.

which question? sorry, i don't feel like looking for it right now.

why aren't you voting Stargazers?

pedit: a number of posts in your ISO talk about why you're scumreading Expedience. i liked the points.

[Not Chara]

Creature that's not an answer to my question dude.

Do you want to pursue this before the lynch?

are you planning on voting Stargazers at some point?

grapes: and this would be why Creature is a good bet for scum.

[Not Chara]

i'm done.

[Not Chara]

i was originally just going to send one to Infinity. i decided to send the other two after thinking more about how a traitor would want to disguise their messages, so i framed it like i had multiple players i wanted to talk to about other things.
i also thought i might be able to learn something from how they each handled the different messages. if i could discern if two of them had private communication outside of the texting system, or not. the messages were tailored with that in mind.

it ended up only helping with Infinity. his day one play was really problematic, and i didn't like how it related to the Gamma wagon. but i can't see scum responding like how he did at all. there was almost no pause in his receiving the message and outing it.
his text reply back also goes hand in hand with that.

[Not Chara]

my claim didn't look fake. read my last post on the matter. the idea was to be as convincing as possible.
Infinity responded

immediately

, there was no hesitation. scum doesn't do that if there's a chance they have a traitor and they're actually making a reachout.
the text message back to me was essentially (not quoting): 'sorry bud, you messed up'. he actually thought i was a traitor.

i'm not sure if there's a vigilante. Mathblade is a weird vig kill, in my opinion.

Dunn, does your ability show all items that are/have been in the game, or just the ones that players are currently in possession of?

either Infinity protected Creature or scum killed Infinity.

[Not Chara]

i'm debating on hacking the Database as well, if it's possible. not sure. it's useful for trying to hack scum, but the Database possibly has a greater chance for success?

Aquanim needs to give concrete reads today. Infinity's bodyguard is a good reason for me to re-look at Creature when i have time, as well.

pedit: i see, thank you.
what's your read on Expedience?

[Not Chara]

what part of 'Infinity responded too fast to have heard from any scum PT' did you not understand?

Infinity's in thread reaction was also really town. you're willfully ignoring the thought i put into the claims.

[Not Chara]

Dunnstral, message me. i want to hack the Database, but i think i'll come up with nothing if it's the same slot.

i'm confident that lane, Dunnstral, grapevine, are town. SlySly is possibly town.
the rest, excluding Creature, i would lynch.

pedit: alright. i'm going to bed soon, in that case.

[Not Chara]

you're ignoring my words now.

you just said there's no way Infinity would believe the claim because i claimed to three people.

he wouldn't

know

that i claimed to three people because he would have had no time to check the bloody PT if one of his hypothetical buddies had posted about it.
how on earth would he have known what the other two texts said?

message back to me was towny, reaction in the thread would not have come from scum. i've explained this.

i can't tell if you're being deliberately obtuse in not considering this from my point of view, or if you really can't conceive an opinion outside of your own.

[Not Chara]

back home, catching up in a moment. ;>
i'm not used to the speed of blitz games, though i can't say i'm displeased with what occured while i was out.

pedit: good wagon.

[Not Chara]

Aquanim is the best bet for the last scum here.
no way Creature guilties his partners

twice

.

[Not Chara]

VCA is less useful here. both of the scum were caught with cop guilties. their team would have bussed.

[Not Chara]

yes, i just said that.
no scum would protect a guiltied buddy at L-1, and there was also no reason not to lynch Panther with that guilty.
look at House's play, and look at Aquanim's lack of play and reads. that slot is scum.

[Not Chara]

the only hangups i have here are Creature not being targeted by scum for the kill.

assuming Aquanim is the last scum (or second to last? i'm not clear on if one can expect 4 scum in a 13 player game), then grapevine was telling the truth about killing Infinity. so scum targeted Mathblade... that makes no sense, they didn't roleblock Creature, and they didn't try to kill him. why not?

[Not Chara]

throwing away that assumption, i still wonder why Creature isn't dead, if grapevine is telling the truth.
Aquanim is a 'he', by the way.

there isn't any reason

not

to hammer Stargazers there. Aquanim would have fallen under fire immediately for not lynching Stargazers, who was already doomed, at that point.
helping with a quick lynch on another guiltied partner is also nothing different from that.

so, at

best

, both of those actions are NAI. now look at Aquanim's play, and his lack of reads. he's asking questions to look busy, and that about sums up his play. the only reads he's given were ones that he put no weight behind, and couldn't answer me about when i asked. he just threw them together.

[Not Chara]

not that night. the night where Infinity and Mathblade were killed.

[Not Chara]

see 2606.
i want to get the items Aquanim has, if any, before the lynch.

[Not Chara]

if you believe there are more than 3 scum, it isn't suicide.
and even then: i don't think you understand how bad a choice it is to fight a lynch on a guiltied partner. they're

going

to get lynched whether you bus them or not.

[Not Chara]

that seems more useful for scum than town. i can't think of a reason for it to be used here.

why do you think Creature was able to make another investigation, Varsoon?
also, why did you kill Infinity after i made it very clear how likely he was to be town?

[Not Chara]

loved, not lovers. loved is the opposite of hated, it makes a player take one more vote to lynch.
unless i misunderstood. Varsoon?

if it's lovers, that's useful, yes.

[Not Chara]

forget it, you aren't listening.
both Stargazers and Panther were as good as lynched after they were guiltied. it wouldn't have mattered if Aquanim had helped or not. i'm not arguing about this anymore.

pedit: that is... literally exactly what i'm saying.

[Not Chara]

i said i wouldn't argue about this anymore. someone else explain this to SlySly, because i don't feel like talking in circles with someone who doesn't think. Aquanim is scum, and nothing about being on those lynches makes him more likely to be town.

[Not Chara]

ugh. Sly, not every scum player is you. you should know your own playstyle isn't standard. there's no reason for scum to sit around and wait for town to vote an inevitable lynch. not being on the lynch when they were online would have been suspicious.

[Not Chara]

sorry. i shouldn't have been that rude about it. especially when this is a playstyle discussion.

[Not Chara]

bad time to give up. it's one thing for scum to hammer themselves when they're not the last scum, but ending it at this point leaves a bad taste in my my mouth. fight until the end, next time.

[Not Chara]

ha.

VOTE: Aquanim

[Not Chara]

i wish the scum would have been informed that they had a traitor. i thought they would have figured it out. i all but broadcasted it. i thought, if they thought there might be a traitor... there was no way they wouldn't figure out it was me.

why oh why, was Creature not killed after his first guilty? did Infinity protect him while also being shot by grapevine?

[Not Chara]

it's disappointing to lose from two cop guilties and the last scum giving up. Creature

did

do an excellent job of finding both Panther and Stargazers. a really good job.

i tried to use my tracker shot to find a buddy, but i hit the only bloody ascetic scum. that's bad fucking luck.

i'm also pretty sure scum tried to kill me on the first night. i'd used my bulletproof that night and no one died. why the scum didn't wonder if perhaps they'd shot me and i'd lied about it.. i'll never know. did they assume someone had protected me? if that had happened, the doctor should have messaged me as their innocent.

someone with more experience, tell me what i did wrong here?

pedit: i see, thank you Firebringer.

[Not Chara]

when i was shot, i was very happy. i thought the scum would realize i was lying about not knowing why there was no kill... that's why i entertained the idea of SlySly scum from Stargazer's claimed roleblock on night 1. when a kill shot fails, it's BP or doctor. there was no evidence i was protected by a doctor.

i thought the town wouldn't suspect me of being the traitor if i told them so directly.. i didn't realize i would trick the scum too. i think i banked too much on the scum figuring they had a traitor. i brought it up specifically so i could be mildly scumread for my dumb gambit.

pedit: thank you, Fire. ;>
that's reassuring to hear.

[Not Chara]

the reason i talked about in-thread for it were my real reasons.
if i'd just picked one scum (and it would have Infinity, and i would have been wrong there!) then i ran the chance of hitting town accidentally and getting immediately lynched.
i really did try to disguise my traitor claims with other messages.

i wasn't expecting the scumteam to say 'oh yes, we've found our traitor' and message me back with a scumclaim and team names, i was mostly hoping to signal that i knew there was a traitor because i

was

their traitor.

[Not Chara]

there was also the day ending, then night being cut short, all while i was gone. i was gone at a bad time, and i'm annoyed at myself for that.
i was going to message Aquanim on day 3 and try again, but ran out of time.

[Not Chara]

Varsoon. i knew i was being very sketchy! it was on purpose. apparently my neon sign was so bright it circled back into the scum thinking i was town.

[Not Chara]

i wonder how differently things would have turned out if so many major events hadn't happened while i wasn't here. i suppose that's how blitz games go.

i put... a lot of stock into the scumteam figuring out there was a traitor. i mean, private communication lends itself really well to that, and i was excited.

i think an unlimited cop + a bodyguard is too much. very swingy, yes.

[Not Chara]

also thought about fake-claiming an item that would let me know if a player has access to a private thread or not. decided against it for a few reasons.

pedit: i wasn't sure if you were my partner. i was kind of hoping you weren't. i was wrong about Infinity, and i also thought PantherPunt was town. i wasn't going to trust my scumdar on my last buddy.
sorry.

[Not Chara]

what did the scumteam think about their failed night 1 kill? i was expecting messages about it that i never got. did you think i had been doctor protected?

[Not Chara]

i screwed up with the Aquanim scumread. i had good guesses for scum in Expedience, and grapevines was actually pinging me a lot, strangely. i was more convinced Infinity was scum than Aquanim/House when i decided to do my gambit and it really hurt me.

[Not Chara]

i don't disagree with your vig shot there, Varsoon.

losing the roleblocker to the cop was unlucky. if Creature had been roleblocked, things also would have been different.
and i did a bad job finding my team.

[Not Chara]

it's frustrating. first time playing traitor, obviously, and i don't have enough trust in my own reads. i should have gone all in on my best guess for scum, but i decided to play it safe and try and do something silly.

pedit: and... a town one-shot bulletproof would let the town run around in circles wondering about the lack of a nightkill because...?

[Not Chara]

i don't mind my phone logs being released.
too bad about the mafia chat. i would have liked to know what everyone thought about me, in case i ever roll traitor again. but i understand there are reasons for keeping it closed.

[Not Chara]

yes, i had thought the scum would either be hinted to the existence of a traitor, or would have some kind of demerit to clue them in that they weren't very strong.

to do well here, i would have had to scuumhunt to find the real scumteam, then try and lynch town... with the knowledge that i could be entirely wrong.
if day 3 hadn't ended early, i might have fakeclaimed a guilty to really drive home that i was lying. perhaps leading to a kamikaze mislynch on someone scummier than myself. i don't know.

does anyone have suggestions for what i should have done differently?

[Not Chara]

oh, right. thanks for modding!

i would have appreciated i few more votecounts, especially when you posted text messages and there were no recent votecounts. other than that minor quibble (and it is minor, it's easy enough to read back and count), the modding was very well done. i can't imagine how many private messages you had to juggle.

pedit: good idea, Sly. unfortunately, i wasn't here from the beginning. if i had been, i surely would have used my tracker on night 1. then again, i might also have decided to not use my bulletproof and have gotten killed... who knows?

[Not Chara]

i wasn't made aware that my power worked or not. just that my shot had been used up.

but, for future reference. it's bad form as town BP to mislead the town about the lack of a nightkill. if there was no kill, and you're a BP, and you were being townread going into night (makign you the target for a scumkill)... then the lack of kill was probably your fault. and the town should know about it.
mitigated somewhat by the existence of the Last Will mechanic.

[Not Chara]

you.. probably should have messaged me as i was going down, in all honesty. since i essentially scumclaimed near the end of day 2 when i was just spouting song lyrics instead of responding to anyone or putting in any effort.

i wasn't around for that. i messaged you, literally as soon as i got a chance to play the game, but that was after your scumclaim.

i did send a message to you in that three-message claim, but you were lynched before reading it, i imagine.

for reference, (i know Fire will post them, but still): this was my message to Aquanim.
"i'm 95% on you being scum. but i can't continue to play this game not knowing the team. i'm a traitor. send some sort of message back in reply, or this will look awkward. if i'm wrong, i've just fucked myself over pretty bad. but i really don't think i am. nearly caught up, now, so i'll be playing properly from this point on."

[Not Chara]

as for messaging you earlier, before your scumclaim. you were basically confirmed scum to me at that point.

unfortunately for my uncreative self, i couldn't think of a good reason to start privately messaging confirmed scum. i should have put more thought into it, or at least tried.

[Not Chara]

that was after i replaced in. not replacement timing, just 'Chara being busy' timing.

those three messages were me finally being caught up.

[Not Chara]

i wish i'd been here from the beginning. i would have been able to send out several more messages without looking suspicious on day 1. and if i hadn't been tied up with needing to catch up, i imagine i would have been more present.
just, ugh. very lucky. a series of unfortunate events indeed. this entire game will be remembered by me as 'missed opportunity'. it could have been so much

fun

.

well, it was fun. but you know what i mean.

[Not Chara]

actually, no.

i wish i had been with the main team. good gravy. i love private messaging as scum.

[Not Chara]

i completely understand where you're coming from there.

...and yet it makes me want to ask you to hydra. say no, obviously. it would be a bad idea.

pedit: oh. i just assumed i was attacked because GuiltyLion was widely townread. i didn't think he'd presented himself as a scary PR. even taking that away, town BPs should still claim because they have really good chances of messing with nightkill analysis if they don't.

[Not Chara]

Last Will is steroids for town investigations,

let me tell you

. it didn't end up affecting us, but it could have.

i should have gone all-in with the fake guilty, then attempted to coast on a refuge in audacity. curse my overly cautious nature. bad for traitor.

[Not Chara]

my way might have worked if the scumteam hadn't been plagued by replacements. it's all unclear.
but i think you're right. in this scenario, i should have done something crazier than just doing a (mostly) safe reaction test.

and thank you. it was changed to something a bit more optimistic due to a recent town win in Lucky's Auction Mafia. hurray!

[Not Chara]

oh. 2705 was to Nahdia. i can see the reason for confusion though.

[Not Chara]

i see. i didn't think they'd been informed, but i thought they would be open to the possibility.

claiming an informed role would have been very useful. i don't know if i'd have been able to put together a good fakeclaim for that. i don't have enough experience with this site. then again, i didn't even try to do so, so perhaps it would have worked...
either way, thanks for the information. armed with this knowledge, i will

surely

...

never, ever, roll traitor again.

[Not Chara]

i just like being scum. i always feel as an obstacle to the win when town. like... 'congratulations on the win, us, i'm certainly glad i didn't contribute to our possible failure more than i did!' haha.

[Not Chara]

that, and Firebringer wanted the sending of PMs to be made public. that would be just as annoying to do with private topics, which encourage rapid-fire messaging. (i'm referring to the posts announcing messages.)

i think this is the only way it could have been done.

[Not Chara]

entirely fair, though i thank you for the answer.

[Not Chara]

it was a very cool role. and i don't think anyone faults you for replacing out.

thank you! c=

[Not Chara]

how often are traitors seen in Normals?
i. want to play as a traitor again.

[Not Chara]

this is very true. i don't expect to run into one, but it's a nice thought.
that's certainly a weird one.

[Not Chara]

oh, this is really helpful! thanks. <3

[Not Chara]

and, surprisingly. they have a higher frequency in mini normals. neat.

with the annoyance from the loss all but gone, i'd like to say again: i really did enjoy this game. the mechanics were very interesting, and i liked the playerlist as well. all in all, i consider it a good experience.

[Not Chara]

i do appreciate that small lecture on setup and power role claiming, Varsoon! it will be very useful if i continue into more Normal games.