Large Normal 197: Wordplay Mafia OVER


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Post Post #53 (isolation #0) » Tue Oct 18, 2016 5:05 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Hey losers real sorry but im busy af tonight
Looking forward to this game tho wooooo
VOTE: Transcend
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Post Post #382 (isolation #1) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 9:41 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Literally just checked this last page but the above posts are scummy as heck
VOTE: drealmerz7
Catchup when im not dying look forward to my awesome reads
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Post Post #398 (isolation #2) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:02 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 383, drealmerz7 wrote:those ! are important, I think you're totallymissing my tone

awesome read though!
Nah i got your sarcasm just fine
I didn't think you were being serious, I dont scumread for naivete
In post 384, doomfeathers wrote:Nice observation, drealmerz, but MariaR is a LOT more experienced than me, so it wouldn't make sense for me to be pocketing her in this situation.
drealmerz7 wrote:or he's pocketing you!
drealmerz7 wrote:or he's fake pocketing you cause you're scum-buds

but, he could just really understand, too!
I think drealmerz7 is town. This paranoia would be hard to fake. These posts scream sincerity in my opinion.

Kamelot, what would you think of joining the wagon on Iraona instead?
Considering he's joking around here, i doubt it
Depends, what do you have on iraona? ill iso
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Post Post #399 (isolation #3) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:04 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Just checked iraon. Whats the reason?
If its tone theyre always like that
Gotta look at the wagons iraons pushing and why, dont feel like rushing into a low hanging fruit mislynch D1
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Post Post #405 (isolation #4) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:08 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Spyrex is saying that townblocs rule and its not scum indicative to want them
I agree
And yeah that was totally sarcasm,
Source: see drealmerzs lolish reply to my vote
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Post Post #406 (isolation #5) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:10 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 404, Gamma Emerald wrote:I'm on ira because I believe he hasn't read the game due to knowing what everyone is from his role pm
sheep me Kamelot
What indicates that? Looked like he gave reads from a partial catchup. He was like halfway through when he gave those townreads
No sheeping but ty for the offer
Are you scum
No defense attorneys im Imperial Droning your ass if you dont give me a better reason for iraon scum
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Post Post #407 (isolation #6) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:10 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

The above should be taken as a joke btw i dont mean to be all aggressive, like i want you to give me a better reason but the above might come off as slightly dickish
I just like Homestuck lmao
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Post Post #412 (isolation #7) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:16 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Ehhh, im not sold
He isnt usually a top scumhunter hes just iraon
Is lazy posting all that scummy?
If i didnt say so already, doomfeathers is town

And before anyone asks i dont do readlists, ill answer on individual reads though.

Pedit@Gamma: these guys
It was just a vague threat of violence/culling of the herd

Im not even caught up lol and i probs wont unless someone gives a good reason. i dont get good reads from catching up anyway i need to talk to people
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Post Post #413 (isolation #8) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:16 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 411, Gamma Emerald wrote:Yup scum have daytalk.
It's totally possible ira's buddies filled him in.
On what, who the town are? Scumavp would already know
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Post Post #416 (isolation #9) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:20 am

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In post 410, doomfeathers wrote:I was getting my information from MastinMD's article on townblocs, which states that the best way to create a faulty townbloc as scum is to form it early.
I love it when newer players read articles
Its just really nice like we're all excited to get better at the game
And less likely to get caught up in ego trips

Mastins a really good player, i often agree with her optimal town play positions
But i just dont see it as a scumtell, more like a playtell. Unless the player only tries forming townblocs as scum its NAI for me. But youre town also for bringing it up
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Post Post #418 (isolation #10) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:22 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

LMAO
Ill follow you on Bins lemme give em a look
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Post Post #421 (isolation #11) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:28 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Agree on that, townhunt ftw
VOTE: Bins
dont like the posts of theirs that have content
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Post Post #426 (isolation #12) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:37 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

sorry doom, didnt mean to say that you shouldnt scumread iraon on principle or something
its good to disagree and talk abt reasoning

If ya wanna vote Bins, thats coolio. i wanna see what she thinks about her wagon
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Post Post #429 (isolation #13) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:41 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

OH, i see ya
Tbh i wasnt even thinking about that
But yeah thats totally fair
Pseudo townblocks like the one proposed arent good into later phases either
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Post Post #432 (isolation #14) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:51 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

18 pages is teeny weeny. and more fun than homework
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Post Post #434 (isolation #15) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:55 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

i have an exam in a half hour but fuck that amirite
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Post Post #436 (isolation #16) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:57 am

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Nah let us know your scumreads i like stream of consciousness
Where is your anger at being unfairly wagoned
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Post Post #439 (isolation #17) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:01 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Not voting you for lurking
However i do like your vote, please talk about why its a good one
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Post Post #441 (isolation #18) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:05 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Not really that so much as me not liking her posts +
there are valid reasons to dislike townblocs but the voting of someone based on it is where i draw the line
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Post Post #443 (isolation #19) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:06 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

not vote, i meant calling a person scum for it
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Post Post #455 (isolation #20) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 12:18 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

yeah iraon im an alt
Dont bother trying to figure my main itd just be a waste of time

I actually really dont like that Gear post you just unvoted him for
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Post Post #652 (isolation #21) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 3:56 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Is Transcend takin a nice refuge in audacity rn y/n
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Post Post #655 (isolation #22) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 3:57 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

but on the other hand im almost tempted to lolhammer this mislynch myself
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Post Post #661 (isolation #23) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:00 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Bunch of neighbourhood kids with glasses dyed their hair blue and had a race on my street the other day
Id say they picked an interesting place to end the race but it was a run of the Mill House
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Post Post #665 (isolation #24) » Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:02 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

so youre worried about looking suspicious
And not about accidentally hammering a town PR?
Youve got your priorities crossed if youre town
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Post Post #811 (isolation #25) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:07 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Yo hey everyone
Iraonavp quickhammer sucked btw i just want everyone to know i totally called that kay thanks

Gamma's town, Yoshi's probtown, Dunn could be scum but eh
Chaos should really be the lynch i cant remember why Transcend would be scum here who wants to help ol Roadie out
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Post Post #815 (isolation #26) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:15 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Thatd be cause Dreamerlz is scum bro
Also whats different about that post in relation to my older ones i dont rly remember you having issues before
I want a votecount before i vote bc im the master at being shit at counting. or could someone do that for me
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Post Post #818 (isolation #27) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:21 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

LMAO
That was a joke bud????? I even called is a mislynch right in that post

Also @ drealmerz's last post i was wrong that shits town
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Post Post #820 (isolation #28) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:25 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 819, Transcend wrote:
In post 372, ChaosOmega wrote:VOTE: irao
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Hey, hey pot????
Yeah, yeah you. Did you know you were made of black cast iron
In post 654, Transcend wrote:
How to get saved by doc in one easy step. Replicate this post:


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VOTE: iraonavp
But kettle sir, you are just as dark....

Well fuck look at the both of us now huh
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Post Post #821 (isolation #29) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:25 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

I mean sure we agree to lynch Chaos for mechanical reasons but bringing up that single vote AGAIN (shits already been talked about) is just so bandwagony its laughable
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Post Post #824 (isolation #30) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:27 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Oh so your intentions were pure
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Post Post #827 (isolation #31) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:29 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Fun chat but none of these responses make me feel much better about you
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Post Post #829 (isolation #32) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:32 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

lolkay
Gonna wait for chaos prods i want to see him post
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Post Post #834 (isolation #33) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:35 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

What am i appearing to know more about exactly?
Scum is in Transcend and Chaos but Chaos only mechanically speaking because the fucker aint posting
Possible Dunn scum and thats all i got rn

Gamma Yoshi and dreal are town
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Post Post #835 (isolation #34) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:36 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 832, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 816, drealmerz7 wrote:Why am I scum, those who believe it?
Nobody called you scum
Lol i totally called him scum tho
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Post Post #838 (isolation #35) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:38 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Nice sarcasm bro but it doesnt help me sort ya

Also multiple people called dreal scum what game are you reading
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Post Post #839 (isolation #36) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:40 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Also its a pretty normal question to ask when someone calls u scum w/o context

Certainly townier than snark in response mr dunnstral ;;;;)
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Post Post #843 (isolation #37) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 2:15 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Sure but not lynching that
We can lynch the scum im not lynching town so we can shoot the scum
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Post Post #881 (isolation #38) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:24 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 870, gerryoat wrote:it would be nice if we lynched in: transcend, drealz, BigYoshi.
Nah dreal towntold a few pages back
totally w ya on Transcend tho kill that one

And bigyoshi isnt on a team with transcend i dont think
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Post Post #882 (isolation #39) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:25 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Btw dont lynch until we get content from Chaos or he gets replaced
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Post Post #884 (isolation #40) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:30 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Lol???
If that was your way of saying both of you are town im laughing bc i legit thought you were scumclaiming for a sec
What the hell was with that answer
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Post Post #886 (isolation #41) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 6:37 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Lmao
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Post Post #889 (isolation #42) » Sat Oct 22, 2016 7:05 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Nah Transcend is free to continue digging his hole and try to play off his unease w cool, chill, short posts
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Post Post #921 (isolation #43) » Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:12 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

ok Gear yall have to explain that Transcend townread
Dunn could still be scum but hes totally right in pointing out Transcends failure to give his reads
thumbs up Dunn

And yes we're waiting for Chaos to get replaced
If hes scum i want buddy hints
and if hes town i want the replacemwnts reads

Any quickhammer on Chaos ill be lynching immediately i dont even care if he flips scum i want the info
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Post Post #963 (isolation #44) » Sun Oct 23, 2016 2:03 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Yeah that would be considered a guilty
You can get a watcher guilty, a cop guilty, a tracker guilty, etc.

VOTE: Transcend
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Post Post #987 (isolation #45) » Mon Oct 24, 2016 5:42 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Nahdia if youve played w Transcend before please tell me if hes always this scummy or not ty
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Post Post #988 (isolation #46) » Mon Oct 24, 2016 5:47 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Ok Gear gets a pass on the Transcend read

Chaos needs to come up w some excellent reads and thoughts on his reread so we'll see what happens
Two town vig claims is bad for this and i wouldnt feel comfortable letting him stick around unless i think theres a really good chance he's town
So do your best Chaos
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Post Post #993 (isolation #47) » Mon Oct 24, 2016 6:29 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Ok your opinion on him would be appreciated ty,
Transcend whats up w you are you just dicking around or
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Post Post #1121 (isolation #48) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:13 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1110, gerryoat wrote:True story between me and Nahdia. We've played 2 games together in forum mafia. One game I was town, and she lynched me and she was also town. Another game when I was mafia and she town, I was her top TR and won the game. Taking these into consideration, you should all conclude that if she is indeed town. I am town.
Kinda hate posts like this for all sorts of reasons
Mainly bc it doesnt take into account the kind of rethinking that goes into reading a player that you accidentally top townread when they were scum
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Post Post #1125 (isolation #49) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:24 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

So Dunnstral is scum for the shitty reaction test
Like Dunn pls explain your many plans for the rest of the class bc damn if they arent doing much besides confusing us
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Post Post #1126 (isolation #50) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:25 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Also Nahdia drealmerz is a townread im super confident in can we talk about why hes scum 4 you
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Post Post #1134 (isolation #51) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:22 am

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Then explain the BP claim and why
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Post Post #1143 (isolation #52) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:38 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

So anyway Dunnstral is scum
Good puns PV
Nahdia I had drealmerz as scum for a while, ill wait til youve read day 2 and then we can touch base there bc i agree with you about him looking like scum earlier than that
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Post Post #1147 (isolation #53) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:44 am

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I dont know why
Why as town would he fakeclaim BP to get the other BP claim lynched
Only as a reaction test to see who jumps on
But apparently it wasnt that
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Post Post #1158 (isolation #54) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:59 am

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Town can do dumb things if I can see their thought process
Dunn hasnt explained shit theyve just been claiming bullcrap for most of the game

@Peregrine like im not sure what else it was besides doomfeathers being a p universal townread
I doubt scum would fearkill a newer player over their reads so???
What do you think abt the nk then

Pedit ok gr8 i dont mind chaos lynch but im gonna be on your ass for this tomorrow ok cool awesome <3
Chaos is still major ml material but also hes not gonna help us by staying here i can see that
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Post Post #1252 (isolation #55) » Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:42 pm

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First thing Dunnstrals done that ive liked
if youve a history of fakeclaims then i guess u get a pass esp if youre on the cool kid wagon
For now


Do u still want chaos lynched tho
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Post Post #1517 (isolation #56) » Mon Oct 31, 2016 7:57 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

OK im here and apparently narrowly avoided missing the goddamn lynch again
srsly u people
Are we killing Transcend? Time to read why he aint dead
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Post Post #1520 (isolation #57) » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:12 pm

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Ok gr8 theres a guilty
I mean. good job on us letting Transcend blatantly troll and lolhammer last night but at least we got a guilty out of it. can u say scum sacrificial distraction?

Still pissed bout missing both hammers but. wtf, im here now
So I just looking at Nahdia on transcend realy quick bc I was sorting looking at their read on transcend as a reason to not uber push there (+ i couldnt see us.. not lynching Chaos??? Just cause hed done fuck all + mechanics) so i hope we dont end the day yet cause id like to chat

Im thinking Nahdia is town for their reads involving Transcend bc a lot of them sort of just ASSUME hes town like the drealmerz scumread
BUT its not a hard and fast read and could possibly just be a good cover for transcend scum. plus nahdia didnt go out and try an convince me he was town i just asked and was given their opinion

So idk. still like drealmerz for town. Dunn played like a good rolecop I think and i wouldnt lynch there except 4 paranoia

I think Spyrex is a good Transcend buddy, gave him an ISO rundown
Like compare his treatment of Transcend to Nahdias and i think youll see why theyre town and Spyrex is not
Theres also really no hunting just setup discussion based ard bein an enabler and... thats it theres nothin else

I also have issues with Gear but not much concrete
Ok thats it for now ill see if i can muster thoughts on the rest of the playerlist
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Post Post #1521 (isolation #58) » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:13 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1518, Bins wrote:Dunnstral your logic for thinking I'm scum is fine but you're wrong
I protected Transcend cause I thought he was the even night doc or something and he was claiming it and I thought scum would buy it or something


Listen to yourself tho k tho there's a lot of vigs yeah but that's why it mAKES SENSE that I'm doc in this game as town but I agree scum LIKELY HAS a protective role too


Either way good job

VOTE: transcend


like yeah I will be protecting Dunn
Hey. Hey.
Fuck you in a jokey sense i aint mad
but srsly dont hammer when i said i was gonna read and complained bout not bein around for the hammer i mean really

And beyond that i uh. dont much like this post lol
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Post Post #1526 (isolation #59) » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:17 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1523, Bins wrote:My obvious misplay is not protecting my biggest townread but he was to obvious imo and I had a hunch and I was wrong

I've seen people eat lynched because of roles before and its sad but there's not much I can do dunnstrals logic makes sense

Idk why would I claim I protected Transcend?? Like I didn't need too and I'm more careful than that as scum. Especially if he was my buddy and that would incriminate me

I'm so drunk lmfao I'm somehow being coherent

Happy halloweeeeeeeeeen

If I have to eat a lynch tmmr there's really not much to sayv
See this is a weird af time to have this discussion
if yall are gonna be lynched tomorrow
wait til that takes off
instead youre reacting to the Dunnstral scumread as if its a death sentence lmfao
And continuing to defend your decision like anyone asked
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Post Post #1529 (isolation #60) » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:18 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1525, Bins wrote:Idk transcend played well it's more likely you were bussing than right lmfao
Lol what???? Transcend was scummy af

I called it refuge in audacity on day 2 and look i was right
literally the only reason to call transcend town would be the fuckin 'too scummy to be scum" bullcrap
Why dont u have anything to say abt my transcend read?
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Post Post #1534 (isolation #61) » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:24 pm

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In post 1533, Bins wrote:Have you ever played w Dunnstral imma try and talk to him about this ???? Not tryna act like it's a death sentence I'm just kind of like what do you want me to say


And I'm rambling but tjays cause of the whisky
Whats your read on me broski u didnt answer abt my transcend read rly
I havent rly played w dunnstral no
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Post Post #1560 (isolation #62) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:18 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

So my scumreads throughout the game keep proving themselves to be town but w/e
VOTE: Bins is a great wagon
And hey again Ari looks like this is the other life in which we have met
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Post Post #1567 (isolation #63) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:07 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1562, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 1560, Road Kamelot wrote:So my scumreads throughout the game keep proving themselves to be town but w/e
VOTE: Bins is a great wagon
And hey again Ari looks like this is the other life in which we have met
What do you think of gerrygoat?
Ehhh gerry's w/e. Was pushing Transcend which is points but not much besides. Dont really have a problem with him otherwise, besides the Nahdia read thing which i didnt like
Most confident about Gear and Bins, so id push one of em first

And also id forgotten but Yoshi is most probably town
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Post Post #1572 (isolation #64) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:18 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1569, Bins wrote:
Why did you think Transcend would be even night doc?
Because he claimed doc

Even in a joking manner I thought he was hinting at it to see if there were any other docs[/quote]
Why would a doctor doc-hunt
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Post Post #1573 (isolation #65) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:18 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1572, Road Kamelot wrote:
In post 1569, Bins wrote: Because he claimed doc

Even in a joking manner I thought he was hinting at it to see if there were any other docs
Why would a doctor doc-hunt
LOL fucked up my last post, nice
EBWOP
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Post Post #1575 (isolation #66) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:20 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1570, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 1567, Road Kamelot wrote:
In post 1562, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 1560, Road Kamelot wrote:So my scumreads throughout the game keep proving themselves to be town but w/e
VOTE: Bins is a great wagon
And hey again Ari looks like this is the other life in which we have met
What do you think of gerrygoat?
Ehhh gerry's w/e. Was pushing Transcend which is points but not much besides. Don't really have a problem with him otherwise, besides the Nahdia read thing which i didnt like
Most confident about Gear and Bins, so id push one of em first

And also id forgotten but Yoshi is most probably town
Actually Gerry scumread Transcend exclusively since post

And Transcend scumread gerrygoat since .

But never strongly enough to push the wagons.

And only leaving it for the lynches of iraonavp and chaos.

And I know that 99% of the mafiascum.net players are super amazing, but the other 1% are scum trying to weak bus their buddies.
Ok hm
When you put it like that
Ill give Gerry another look lmfao
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Post Post #1581 (isolation #67) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:39 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 816, drealmerz7 wrote:
In post 809, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 807, drealmerz7 wrote:why is transcend not dead?
Probably

Because

Of all that stuff that happened

That you ignored

Also Chaos is scum but for some reason everybody wants to get transcend instead
I didn't ignore anything. We don't even have word from Chaos that he was shot at. Why is chaos scum?

Transcend's bullying and manipulation was extremely scummy and it got a town PR killed. He should be killed for multiple reasons related to that. I find it disconcerting he's been allowed to live. He could be a BP scum because of all the 1-shot townies, feeling a bit invulnerable, and bullheading the game. He could be arrogant town who thinks he knows better than most and wants to bullhead the game, and has to a point, again, to get a PR killed. He needs to be dead.

Why am I scum, those who believe it?
Idk Nahdster i just cant spin this as scum in my head
It flipped my read
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Post Post #1582 (isolation #68) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:42 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1579, Nahdia wrote:RK I'm wondering if you had the same thoughts about Yoshi recently as I did. What's your reasoning for townreading them?
I was ISOing myself bc Im awesome at mafia and wanted to remember what my amazing reads were

found an earlier post abt Yoshi and remembered what prompted the thought that it was super unlikely that Transcend and Yoshi were on a team
Are we on a wavelengthhhhh here Nahdia
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Post Post #1585 (isolation #69) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:57 am

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Nah Nahdia i had dreal as a major scumread until that post i quoted. its funny theres actually a post by me calling him scum then that post then my next post being like 'lol nvm town'
It just doesnt look like a bus to me
Like if i was gonna rank players who could have bussed Transcend twould be gerry (most likely if a busser) or maybe Dunn cause of D2 (only if Bins is actually town)

Also on Yoshi it was their whole thing w the Chaos hammer (day 2) that made me think there was no way
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Post Post #1626 (isolation #70) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:00 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

@Dunnstral

Nah it doesnt not even a bit
dreamlerz talk abt your progression will ya

Also im having second thoughts on Bins as well so
UNVOTE:
For now and see yall tomorrow
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Post Post #1628 (isolation #71) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:02 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

*cracks party popper*
I believed in you this whole time, i swear
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Post Post #1630 (isolation #72) » Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:06 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Actually b4 I forget here's where Im at
Yoshi
Nahdia, Peregrine
Aristophanes
Dunnstral
Bins, gerry, drealmerz
Gear

From most/best reasons to think town to least/no reasons to think town
Ok gnight for real

Pedit Nahdia its the strange interactions w Transcend
But i wont explain bc i want dunn to
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Post Post #1644 (isolation #73) » Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:56 am

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Somehow i forgot Ari replaced Gamma
def wouldnt lynch that
Dunn is less confirmed to me for some reasons

Peregrine is rly town by play
dreal PLing on day 4 is a dumb idea pls stop
Id lynch Gear or Dreal rn

My issue is how a lot of players seem to have the same names on their shitlist
Id have to actually count tho bc it could just be the most recent lists ive seen
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Post Post #1646 (isolation #74) » Fri Nov 04, 2016 9:05 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1461, Dunnstral wrote:I'm a rolecop.

Bins is a 1-shot bp odd-night doctor

Transcend is a Night 5 Strongman
Bins claimed to have targeted transcend on day 1 while I said I had a guilty on her (she didn't know my role)

day 1 vig and day 3 vig (both odd-nights)

Bins and Transcend are scum.

VOTE: Transcend
I believe this claim but it doesnt make you town
It doesnt make me want to lynch you either but i dont trust it
I mean if Bins is scum then fuck me youre town for sure but thats all it is
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Post Post #1728 (isolation #75) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 3:04 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Just got prodded, whoopsy
Sorry Errant :P

Gerry I kinda agree (not caught up)
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Post Post #1730 (isolation #76) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 3:32 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

The list of players i could see as scum is too damn high

VOTE: gerryoat
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Post Post #1731 (isolation #77) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 3:36 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1677, PeregrineV wrote: Why can't I seem to wrap my head around this...

Explain to my thick skull the benefit to the scumteam of scum-Dunn hard-bussing claiming guilty on Transcend to lead to his quick-lynch, when previously the highest Transcend wagon was 4 votes.
i KNOW someone answered this and it was basically my answer but
towncred yo

Transcend wasnt playing the long game he basically admitted it himself after he was caught when he said his normal scum game wasnt like this
Im 100% sure he was bussed
And this was after Transcend had successfully played a part in mislynching two town
Players like that dont last long so there was no downside to scum deciding to bus
i dont rly wanna lynch dreal bc as scum his push is stupid and dangerous and attention-seeking
And i kinda see the logic behind it
But lynching Dunn today is dumb lol
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Post Post #1732 (isolation #78) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 3:41 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Hold on i got this game mixed up w something.
There should be like... ~3 scum left ya? This is our last mislynch?
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Post Post #1736 (isolation #79) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:07 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1735, gerryoat wrote:
In post 1730, Road Kamelot wrote:The list of players i could see as scum is too damn high

VOTE: gerryoat
"So many players I could see as scum! So let me vote the one person who tunneled the confirmed scum flip for 2 days!"
lol keep milkin that one bud

Dunn wtf why are Peregrine and Yoshi on your list
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Post Post #1737 (isolation #80) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:12 pm

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In post 133, gerryoat wrote:Lol, Transcend actually flipped maf this game. I was reaction testing earlier, but I think he's actually maf. I'll be back later tho
What about Transcends reaction to your tests made you think scum
I want receipts
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Post Post #1739 (isolation #81) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:18 pm

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In post 1738, Nahdia wrote:Kinda agreeing with the sentiment that dreal's latest bant makes no sense as scum. The frustration over not being townread for punishing Transcend feels genuine but it could just be genuine frustration that a buss didn't earn him any points I'm picking up on.

VOTE: Gear
I guess I've been partly hesitant to vote this just cause it's been weeks since their slot has contributed but there's high odds of it flippin' red at this point.
Ehhhh i dont disagree but
This would have been a great opportunity to push gerry w me
Esp after 'but it could just be genuine frustration that the bus didnt work'

Whats the point of voting this before we see their replacement? Plenty a time to powerwagon that after we see what tells the replacement drops
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Post Post #1742 (isolation #82) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:30 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Why is Gear so scum to you?
Earlier you said you didnt know who to vote

Also what are these other lynches
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Post Post #1744 (isolation #83) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:39 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

:P
Who are the other lynches

Are you counting happening to push/guilty Transcend as reasons for possibly being town
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Post Post #1752 (isolation #84) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:54 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 126, Transcend wrote:dreamerz gerryoat
iraonavp
and
mariar
are scum

game solved game over
Not that one dunn, this one
Been ISOing an no way is dreal w Transcend
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Post Post #1753 (isolation #85) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:55 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1751, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1736, Road Kamelot wrote:
In post 1735, gerryoat wrote:
In post 1730, Road Kamelot wrote:The list of players i could see as scum is too damn high

VOTE: gerryoat
"So many players I could see as scum! So let me vote the one person who tunneled the confirmed scum flip for 2 days!"
lol keep milkin that one bud

Dunn wtf why are Peregrine and Yoshi on your list
Why aren't they on yours, but you're pushing gerry?
What does gerry have to do with Yoshi obvs not bein Transcends partner
or Peregrine bein obvtown
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Post Post #1756 (isolation #86) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 5:57 pm

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In post 1748, Nahdia wrote:I don't really know now that I think of it. I guess that's just a thing I said. I think I'm just apprehensive about pushing gerry and ending up with that being wrong moreso than others.

I see what you're saying with Transcend being likely bussed. I'm kind of at the point where I feel like I should completely toss out my reads and start over from square one, really.
If u got the time, why not

Start by ranking dreal/gerry/Dunn/me/whoever else was pushing Transcend that i forgot abt in order of most likely bussing to least likely bussing
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Post Post #1757 (isolation #87) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 6:00 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1270, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 1262, Fire Assassin wrote:Actually PeregrineV might more sense since his logic is really out there...maybe?
Hmmmm is that a scum tell for him?
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p8037439

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 4#p8433979

Care to compare? Because all I see is SCUM
Is Pere scum because his game here looks nothing like the scumgame you just linked
Or is it bc he distanced w Bins (lol)
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Post Post #1758 (isolation #88) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 6:01 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1754, Nahdia wrote:
In post 1753, Road Kamelot wrote:or Peregrine bein obvtown
did i already ask you to explain this cause if not go for it
Cant find scum intent in his posting
I looked
Thats it

And Dunn do u rly not get why Yoshi isnt w Transcend
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Post Post #1777 (isolation #89) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 10:15 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1771, gerryoat wrote:HEY GUYS. SORRY FOR TUNNELING MAF. IDK WHAT I WAS THINKING. GOSH. NEXT TIME I'LL TRY TO BE LESS MISGUIDED BY NOT TUNNELING MAF
Lol
In post 1776, Gear wrote:I'm sure that I don't want to lynch
dreamers
Camelot
Dunnstral
Bins
Gerry
Aristo

But I can understand how people are reading Gerry as scum, since he and transcend both bussed each other while voting others.



7. BigYoshiFan
10. Nahdia
14. PeregrineV

I'll figure out who I want to vote later today.
Dude the one w the biggest chance of flipping scum there is Nahdia and im not even sure theyre scum
Granted i COULD be wrong on Yoshis performance but if pere is scum ill eat my socks
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Post Post #1779 (isolation #90) » Sun Nov 06, 2016 10:24 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1778, Nahdia wrote:go to bed
I can never go to bed
You go to bed
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Post Post #1834 (isolation #91) » Tue Nov 08, 2016 7:38 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Ok nvm Ill actually take Dunn off my could-lynchlist
The guilty is one thing but the progression on Transcend doesnt look like scum bussing

Wouldnt lynch is now: Peregrine, Ari-slot (love u its np take some time dude), Dunn, dreal, Yoshi

Kill gerry
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Post Post #1836 (isolation #92) » Tue Nov 08, 2016 7:51 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

I dunno, waiting to lylo/mylo might be a better idea
That way we have full role functionality right til the end
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Post Post #1837 (isolation #93) » Tue Nov 08, 2016 7:53 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

No actually youre referring to lynching conflicting claims
Could work, im not opposed but lets see what others think
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Post Post #1844 (isolation #94) » Tue Nov 08, 2016 5:49 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

dreal isnt scum im suddenly so sure
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Post Post #1848 (isolation #95) » Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:06 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1845, Nahdia wrote:you've been sayin' that all along girl
I wasnt sure before but now id never vote the guy
Idk if i wanna vote Gear gerry is so deliciously scum and useless and riding off his "tunnel"
In post 1847, Dunnstral wrote:if dreal is town today is lylo
What why
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Post Post #1910 (isolation #96) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 6:31 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

I like Gear more than Nahdia rn
But gerry still needs to die
dreal i getchu but gerrys progression on Transcend is worse while Dunns is fine
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Post Post #1914 (isolation #97) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 6:42 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1913, drealmerz7 wrote:
In post 1910, Road Kamelot wrote:I like Gear more than Nahdia rn
But gerry still needs to die
dreal i getchu but gerrys progression on Transcend is worse while Dunns is fine
Phewww, really? I've look at it I don't know how many times and gerry seems the genuine one in relation to transcend and dunn's seems staged. Gerry is just being what I'm going to call "being gerry" in relation to transcend, and dunn seems deliberate and subversive. They had plenty of time to stage an act with DC and transcend being not in the game almost from the get-go. Who knows how early the "let's plan a bus to victory" talk happened. It's just how I'm reading it. I keep trying to go at it afresh and that is what I get and nothing/no one convinces me otherwise yet, as open as I feel to it.
I had the same feelings abt dunn earlier but im pretty sure i was wrong
Both of them could have planned the early bus but gerrys pushes were weaksauce and he voted with Transcend anyway
And all hes done today is whine abt how his transcend tunneling didnt get him townread and talk abt how youre scum so
tbh im not sure how youre not reading gerry scum here

I think youre putting too much into tone which is IMO entirely the player and most ppl dont have blatant tone changes between alignments
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Post Post #1917 (isolation #98) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:04 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

The blatant thing was me making a point abt tone
But i get that youre not rly meaning tone you meant what you just explained
At this point i completely understand your position while simply not agreeing and that sucks but i cant see dunn acting this way with his partner

But i dont get your scumread on pV like at all hes my best townread
And GE/Ari being scum doesnt make sense bc we have near solid proof that they actually shot Chaos
Since chaos said hed used his BP shot on N1 when GE claimed to have shot him. Scum vigs dont exist and i doubt Chaos was rolecopped + scum guessing that he would have actually used his BP n1 + he was a great vig shot and i understand why GE went there

Your only non-dunn read i dont hate is Yoshi and i townread him too i could just see being wrong there but not for pere and DEF not for gamma/ari bc that slot is near conftown at this point

Id say to reevaluate your pool
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Post Post #1923 (isolation #99) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:26 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Nahdia is a player who usually wouldnt be stupid lurky and would contribute as either alignment
Its not AI for them

Odd night doc fits w night 5 strongman and it cancels out any scumminess Bins might have for being odd night w the odd night town vigs
Its a relevant observation

But why vote Nahdia when u can vote gerry bc if nahdia is scum so is gerry anyway
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Post Post #1930 (isolation #100) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:41 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1929, Nahdia wrote:It's almost as if someone I was townreading flipping scum caused me to re-evaluate.
You like PV but youre incredulously sighing at his read on you
Or you dislike me saying you arent that town to dreal

Which is it
Also you agree w gerry scum
In post 1901, Nahdia wrote:PV or gerry. Happy?
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Post Post #1932 (isolation #101) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:47 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

I guess they arent
So its both then i didnt think abt that but w/e
Why do u care abt my opinion on you when im trying to get players to vote gerry instead of you
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Post Post #1934 (isolation #102) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:56 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Yeppers
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Post Post #1936 (isolation #103) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:58 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1935, Nahdia wrote:Wow, uh... I really don't know how to answer that if it's not something you immediately comprehend just from the basic premise.
I dont think you get why Im asking the question
For one its not bc I cant comprehend why youd be concerned
I just want you to TELL me why
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Post Post #1942 (isolation #104) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 9:23 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 1941, Titus wrote:Wow, we got some conflict going on here.

Why doesn't everyone tell me what they think is important? Don't correct opinions of others.

Are we claiming?
Hey Titus!!!
Im an alt but weve played on my old acct
nice to see ya
We have decided whether to claim yet but im open to it, what do you think

Nahdia im dropping the questioning u haven't given me much either way

Titus imo gerry is scum who softbussed and is trying to coast on it
dreal is town but wrong abt a lot
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Post Post #1944 (isolation #105) » Wed Nov 09, 2016 9:42 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Hm take it back not wrong per se
we disagree
Only read that was "wrong" was the read on your slot but hes amended that
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Post Post #1984 (isolation #106) » Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:38 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

Sorry Titus, he's a quick recap of my reads rn. I can explain more, its in my ISO if you want it but i dont have time to go over my thoughts again atm
Super town: Peregrine, Titus
town: Dunnstral, Bins, drealmerz
eh: Nahdia, Gear (went from scum to unsure for recent goodposting, Yoshi (had as town but maybe the reason he cant be w transcend isnt as great as i thought)
scum: gerryoat

Need to better sort 'eh' but im happy w my townreads rn, busy in the next few days unfortunately
And no i dont think its lylo, there should be ~3 scum left so we have a mislynch
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Post Post #2038 (isolation #107) » Sat Nov 12, 2016 8:13 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

VOTE: BigYoshi
L-2

Dude whats up

if you hammer yoshi before he responds and hes town youre getting lynched next just a heads up
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Post Post #2044 (isolation #108) » Sun Nov 13, 2016 4:19 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2043, Nahdia wrote:actually hold up we're at 10 why did someone say this could be lylo/mylo
Bc dreal is town and scumreading dunn and apparently town scumreading town makes this lylo
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Post Post #2084 (isolation #109) » Sun Nov 13, 2016 11:37 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

UNVOTE:
Titus are you takin into account the claimed BP enabler that scum shot
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Post Post #2164 (isolation #110) » Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:27 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

VOTE: Gear
gerry's still scum but i dont have the downtime to push him rn

I only voted Yoshi for his weird slippish post and thats been resolved as far as im concerned
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Post Post #2288 (isolation #111) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 4:51 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Hey guys
Gear i dunno if u noticed but i was absent from the game in general there and you were firmly in my 'this person can go right ahead and ge lynched category;
but since its a new day and i now have time
VOTE: Gerry
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Post Post #2291 (isolation #112) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 7:51 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Were at odd numbers thanks to whoever so no to NLing
Why not argue to just lynch someone that isnt you so you can die if thats your angle
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Post Post #2298 (isolation #113) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:44 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2292, Bins wrote:that is my obvious main point i didnt think i had to state yeah
How was what i said in my last post anything close to what you said
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Post Post #2323 (isolation #114) » Tue Nov 22, 2016 8:12 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Yoshi i question what youre agreeing with in the above
what didnt you see that gear pointed out

I wasnt super confident in gear scum, still am not, would probs lynch Yoshi over gear if were hypothetically ignoring obvscum gerry
who apparently doesnt know why im scumreading him lol
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Post Post #2338 (isolation #115) » Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:03 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2056, BigYoshiFan wrote:
In post 2055, Nahdia wrote:ok so when i hear "slip" the immediate association is "alignment" and i guess yoshi doesnt think of the word in that way.
Scumslip, sure.
Just "slip" than, no.
Gear are you talking about this whole thing? Yoshi said something weird and i voted but it ended up not really being anything to press
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Post Post #2340 (isolation #116) » Wed Nov 23, 2016 8:26 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Not it wasnt w that post i just wanted to know if that issue is what you meant
I could care less abt his bins thing the post i took issue with was the 'sorry Bins' one bc it sounded like a weird slip
but it wasnt. thats what went down
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Post Post #2345 (isolation #117) » Thu Nov 24, 2016 12:00 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2326, BigYoshiFan wrote:
In post 2323, Road Kamelot wrote:Yoshi i question what youre agreeing with in the above
what didnt you see that gear pointed out

I wasnt super confident in gear scum, still am not, would probs lynch Yoshi over gear if were hypothetically ignoring obvscum gerry
who apparently doesnt know why im scumreading him lol
You're switching votes without, essentially, any reason. Also, what's your scumread on me for?
You talkin bout my gerry vote, which is a scumread i had yesterday?
In post 2327, BigYoshiFan wrote:Okay, last time I'm switching votes until this person starts talking.
VOTE: Nahdia
Yoshi thinka switching votes w/o reason is scummy
next post is yoshi being worried about switching too many votes

scum after gerry
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Post Post #2358 (isolation #118) » Thu Nov 24, 2016 2:44 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2351, BigYoshiFan wrote:RK, answer my questions.
Why youre scum, right

poe
No reason to townread you
The one i had i no longer consider a good reason
Thats really it
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Post Post #2360 (isolation #119) » Thu Nov 24, 2016 2:50 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2359, drealmerz7 wrote:RK you think it is gerry with yoshi though? hmmm

and gerry with transcend? I still don't see either of those
Idk whos with gerry i just know its gerry
Gear nahdia and Yoshi are all sorta equally valid there
Maybe Nahdia less so w the wagon there but im not sure

why couldnt gerry be bussing. Transcend was playing like scum whod get bussed and gerrys play this game has been to superficially vote transcend and then complain about not being townread for it so
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Post Post #2364 (isolation #120) » Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:11 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2363, drealmerz7 wrote:byf that is bogus reasoning seriously your last bunch of posts make me want to vote and push you

RK - ugh, I was so sure of gerryscum before...and then convinced myself not...
Howd you convince yourself out of it
Lay it on me
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Post Post #2366 (isolation #121) » Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:12 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2362, BigYoshiFan wrote:And yes, I am aware PV hasn't posted at all, but Nahdia has just been voting silently and it bugs me.
Inactivity is NIA unless youve got meta to prove something
P sure if they were scum theyd be working against this wagon here not falling into apathetic motions
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Post Post #2369 (isolation #122) » Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:24 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2365, BigYoshiFan wrote:Then do it. You guys are against lurking, and yet you look over lurkers like Nahdia and PV. If you're dumb enough to lynch me, then fucking do it.
Lurking is anti town but i dont remember going after anyone for lurking
PV hasnt been lurking hes on fuckin VLA
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Post Post #2370 (isolation #123) » Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:26 pm

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2368, drealmerz7 wrote:but just thinking back on it makes me blahhhh on him again

maybe he's laying back now waiting for the wagon(s) he wants

my first /earlier reads are more often correct than later switches too...it's something I recognize a lot in my game...hmmm

DAMNIT
He doesnt look like bull headed hyper town to me

If he was hed be more focused on lynching scum than in telling everyone how dumb they were for not townreading him for his bus
He never pushed Transcend strongly enough for it to matter
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Post Post #2385 (isolation #124) » Fri Nov 25, 2016 12:18 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2383, Gear wrote:Actually, Nadia posting about tone there makes me think that she is subtlety trying to appeal to dreamerz the tone reader.
*hour long fart noise*
Who comes to that conclusion

hey gerry what's shaking
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Post Post #2388 (isolation #125) » Fri Nov 25, 2016 4:19 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2386, drealmerz7 wrote:it's not totally without validity

but I'm TRing nahdia pretty hard compared to you gear, sooo, you see my dilemma?

why do you think bins is town after that? she seems to love to blatantly throw around suggestives
No its legitimately entirely w/o validity bc tone reading is something done in general by a lot of players and suggesting that nahdia brought it up specifically to appeal to you is either reaching or dumb
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Post Post #2481 (isolation #126) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:02 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Hoping I get replaced? Harsh Yoshi :(

Howd yall manage to make me the hammer vote.
I havent hammered bc i literally have not been here im not sure why this is bein argued
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Post Post #2482 (isolation #127) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:06 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

tfw u wanna lynch gerry and Gear

gerry over here doesnt give a shit who is lynched btw
I think youre both town tbh but Bins has the better role
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Post Post #2483 (isolation #128) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:13 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2461, Nahdia wrote:let's all flashwagon RK.
This is a weird thing for scum to say when im the hammer vote and

idk I wanted to lynch Nahdia over Bins but this shit is throwing me off
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Post Post #2484 (isolation #129) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:15 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

K im decided but if anyone has shit to tell me directly im here listening
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Post Post #2489 (isolation #130) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:52 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

See thats the thing I didnt want to lynch either of them
Nahdias lookin town and Bins role mechanically isnt one i wanna lynch today
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Post Post #2491 (isolation #131) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 5:55 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Not PV. Gears works good.
VOTE: Gear
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Post Post #2498 (isolation #132) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:39 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

K so i can see Gear is not actually happening thats cool to know

Tell me why scum Bins says no to Gear and to gerry as a wagon
Is it bc if she moves off of nahdia shes more likely to be hammered
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Post Post #2499 (isolation #133) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 9:46 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

In post 2495, Gear wrote:Titus, you've already worked out RK is probably scum, and of you think Nadia's town, its practically guaranteed, and there's nothing in it for her to bid right now if she and I were buddies, so you should screw your head on right and start town reading me.
Titus has an incorrect scumread on Road so lemme just capitalize on that to make sure Titus doesnt vote me

Extra points for using "if you think Nahdia is town" as a reason when youre voting nahdia
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Post Post #2501 (isolation #134) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 10:02 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

I said gerry not PV
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Post Post #2503 (isolation #135) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:36 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

Neither of them are in danger of being hammered or it would have happened already
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Post Post #2504 (isolation #136) » Tue Nov 29, 2016 11:39 am

Post by Road Kamelot »

BTW if Gear fails and we go back to Nahdia/Bins dichotomy id still sooner hammer Bins than Nahdia but theres a good shot both are town
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