STEVEN UNIVERSE 2 - GAME OVER

[mastin2]

So...I still don't see alliances being set up.
And I'm not voting until we have those worked out for sure.

[farside22]

I keep seeing “Scum Vig” floated without addressing that scum already had additional kill abilities via Events. Why is this happening? Yes, a scum Vig is not impossible. Frankly the only way I think that would actually be in this game is as a 1-Shot. This is why I want Fuzzy to shoot one of Shiro / Shadow / Creature (those alive after today’s lynch) to confirm his shot was not only a one-off.

I agree with this.
I'm going to copy and paste and make sure fuzzy doesn't miss it.


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[TheFuzzylogic99]

Got it....... what if I miss tonight
I don't want to get lynched tomorrow bc I was pressured into making a shot that was poor. I only get 1 shot per season.
I will take the shot if yall really want but I rather wait till I get a better chance to hit my target

[TheFuzzylogic99]

I need atleast a guarantee if I use my shot tonight that I wont get roped tomorrow if I miss..if not I am going to wait till my chances are better

[Creature]

If I lived, I wouldn't let you get roped tomorrow, though, taking a look at the rest of the town, I wouldn't be surprised if they ended lynching mastin2.

[MagnaofIllusion]

I wouldn't object to A50, Shiro, or Random being privy to everything I have to say.

-Cerb

Well let’s make it Almost if he is agreeable. I don’t particularly want Shiro alive long term and Random makes sense getting info from others and eventually cycling it to me if we live that long.

@Almost

– agree with a RR / MoI / Almost alliance submission tonight?

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Fine, I'm not gonna face the music end game if we just didn't lynch scum tfl cause lol not so reliable setup spec and he shot a lynch bait he can't be scum.

Well this post makes me think you are either being terrible Town or disheartened scum. Fuzzy does not have a pass to endgame. He currently only has a short-term pass to surviving until the Must Die pool is exterminated.

I honestly can’t tell which and don’t want to spend tons of time re-reading you when you make a great Vig shot.

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I don't replace out that frequent (maybe just 1 in 5 games).

As an aside completely separate from the game -

Having a 1 in 5 replacement frequency is fucking terrible. It’s not something to be proud of.

I don’t know how many games I’ve played on MS. I estimate between 80 and 100 as a safe guess. I’ve been replaced in a whopping total of three game. Two when I had a major accident and was hospitalized for six months back in 11 or 12 (forget which). That’s it. And I’m not thrilled about those three.

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take nothing for granite

As another aside – you either need to spend less time on TvTropes or proof-read your posts better. I did get a chuckle out of this either way so kudos.

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Got it....... what if I miss tonight
I don't want to get lynched tomorrow bc I was pressured into making a shot that was poor. I only get 1 shot per season.
I will take the shot if yall really want but I rather wait till I get a better chance to hit my target

I don’t think you quite understand the situation. You are more likely to be lynched for not trying to shoot tonight than for shooting Town in the pool of Creature / Shadow / Shiro.

Think about the game-state. We are looking for 2 scum in a pool of unconfirmed players. Town gets to lynch 1 per day. Scum get the chance to kill 1 per Night. Right now the pool of players who are unconfirmed is larger than the pool of players who are confirmed. Sticking to a 1 to 1 exchange doesn’t necessarily mean Town is screwed but it does mean it isn’t leveraging its information well.

You killing one of Creature / Shiro / Shadow is very Pro-Town even if they are Town.

This creature lynch feels forced and apathetic as fuck.

Honestly given what you have posted in our PT I find this an odd response.

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If I lived, I wouldn't let you get roped tomorrow, though, taking a look at the rest of the town, I wouldn't be surprised if they ended lynching mastin2.

Scum posting to a tee …

[Shiro]

MoI

You and random won't die, ever.

Scum will waste a turn if they kill you since they can endgame both of you.

[Creature]

Having a 1 in 5 replacement frequency is fucking terrible. It’s not something to be proud of.

Though, most of the games I replaced out when I initially played here, and I'm not sure if I replaced out that much.

[Creature]

6 times I replaced out of 51 completed games vs 5 times I replaced in from these games.

[Reasonably Rational]

Acutally ...

@Almost50 and @TheFuzzyLogic - We would like to ally with you two tonight. We have a specific reason for this, and I believe all parties (except scum) will be happy to have this adjustment.

Off the top of my head that leaves: Shadow, Farside, MoI, Random, Grapes, Mastin and Shiro. My suggestion would be to leave Mastin out of the alliance mix since we will have one person left out, unless she objects. Since MoI and Random can talk to each other separately, it makes sense for them to be in two different alliances, so I would suggest something like MoI, Farside and Shiro as one and Shadow, Random and Grapes as the other. Those specific groupings also have a reason. I'll make sure to relay that to Random so he can share with you MoI why I suggested the groupings I did.

If people will please confirm so we don't end up clusterfucked, that would be peachy. Thanks in advance.

~Drixx

P.S. - Cerb was doing upgrades to his computer yesterday and while attempting to solve a problem with getting his new hotness GPU to stop conflicting with his on chip GPU, his primary hdd somehow bricked. Won't spin up or anything, so he's restricted to phone until he can work it out. He asked me to say something.

[Reasonably Rational]

There's one better pairing option, but we need to know if the larger alliance grouping with Mastin would allow the not-mastin people to talk to each other. If they can, I would adjust it to the following:

Almost50, Fuzzy and us

Mastin, Shadow and Random

MoI, Shiro and Grapes.

Farside would be left out so as not to be able to blow up a finale alliance. This actually seems a little better and would still result in what we have in mind and I'll fill Random in so he can comment.

~Drixx

[Reasonably Rational]

Sorry for the multiple posts: Assuming everyone is good with the alliances in #11,085, I would like the propose that Fuzzy NOT shoot tonight. I have two reasons for this and I'll explain them to Random and he can confirm to the game at large that the reasons exist and are good reasons.

~Drixx

[mastin2]

I am reasonably certain a three-person alliance with me still does not grant alliance chat: my role PM specifies that the alliance I form does not grant an alliance PT. A three-person alliance is still an alliance with me, so it shouldn't give an alliance PT.

[TheFuzzylogic99]

@RR
sure why not......

[Reasonably Rational]

I am reasonably certain a three-person alliance with me still does not grant alliance chat: my role PM specifies that the alliance I form does not grant an alliance PT. A three-person alliance is still an alliance with me, so it shouldn't give an alliance PT.

Okay so do we want to keep shadow and stick Farside with you on the assumption that she's 3P and we want her to exit the game before doing so adjusts the numbers in a way that costs us the game? She gets an extra point if Shadow is there right? If my math is correct, that should mean according to her earliest claim that she can get a personal win and exit, which has less impact the sooner it happens.

@RR
sure why not......

Okay. So we have one alliance firmed up, and waiting for Mastin to answer:

Confirmed:

Almost50, Fuzzy, Us

Tentative:

Mastin, Shadow, Farside
MoI, Shiro, ?
Random, Grapes, ?

If we stick Mastin with anyone, at least one alliance won't be full. If we put two with her because that puts Farside's claim to the test, that would leave two alliances of two, but MoI and Random can talk to one another so there's not a strong downside to that? Also ... how did I end up sorting alliances? There's a reason I avoided this all game. This is a pain in the arse.

Even if we have consensus on the above, please give Random time to pop in. I've dumped some info on him and I would like him to confirm here. I also need to finish giving him paraphrased info from our times with Titus because he will be infodumping to MoI.

~Drixx

[Almost50]

@Almost – agree with a RR / MoI / Almost alliance submission tonight?

Sure. I have no problem with that at all.

[Almost50]

@RR:

Hmmm.. I can relate and do understand your reason. It's for that same reason that I wanted to ally with Mastina.

Oh, well.. if MOI doesn't object then I will submit RR & Fuzzy.

[Almost50]

@Fuzzy:

I think I was told somewhere sometime ago that refundable 1-shot abilities get refunded at the START of the Season Finale. (Please check with Varsoon to be utterly certain).

If this IS the case, then it's your last chance to use your current shot tonight. Tomorrow IS the Season Finale and whether or not you have used your current shot it becomes unusable and you get a new one for the next season. (Again, please do check with Varsoon about this, as I don't have your role PM to see how it was worded and decide for myself.)

[Almost50]

I fail to locate where I got that from. I'm too lazy to go through all my previous alliances PTs to get the exact phrasing. If i was RR/MoI/grapes then they can confirm. If it was Xf then he's dead anyway, and so SC (but I don't think it was SC).

Anyway, confirmation or not.. FUZZY should as k Varsoon for his specific role/ability.

[Reasonably Rational]

@Fuzzy:

I think I was told somewhere sometime ago that refundable 1-shot abilities get refunded at the START of the Season Finale. (Please check with Varsoon to be utterly certain).

If this IS the case, then it's your last chance to use your current shot tonight. Tomorrow IS the Season Finale and whether or not you have used your current shot it becomes unusable and you get a new one for the next season. (Again, please do check with Varsoon about this, as I don't have your role PM to see how it was worded and decide for myself.)

I fail to locate where I got that from. I'm too lazy to go through all my previous alliances PTs to get the exact phrasing. If i was RR/MoI/grapes then they can confirm. If it was Xf then he's dead anyway, and so SC (but I don't think it was SC).

Anyway, confirmation or not.. FUZZY should as k Varsoon for his specific role/ability.

Because of the numbers and the fact that Farside is likely to reach her points and exit the game (I'm assuming that part of her claim is true and the 'town changing to 3p' part is the lie, fwiw), there are two really strong reasons for Fuzzy to hold the shot tonight. One of which you know. The other you don't but that's how it needs to be. I'm being really careful not to even come close to leaking the thing I'm worried about.

Umm... it isn't quite as bad, but think Space Dandy 2. There's a disaster scenario that we're worried about and a fuzzy shot gone wrong is part of it.

I think the best way to handle Farside right now is to let her break the current alliance she has (with Fuzzy's consent) and let her break the proposed Mastin/Shadow/Farside alliance tomorrow, which I believe according to her claim will give her the points to leave the game with a personal win. That removes a gigantic unknown and will put us on even numbers if scum succeed in killing tonight which simply turns LYLO into MYLO.

There's also some question about Fuzzy's alignment, and if he complies with this AND he passes the test Cerb and I have in mind for him tomorrow, AND he shows that he's a vig, we can be reasonably sure he's probably town. MoI's point that a scum vig given what we've seen from scum flips would either not exist or just be a one off thing seems much more likely than a scum vig who refills is valid. And add to that the fact that scum have had so many kills fail at this point that I don't think a scum!fuzzy could afford not to use his shot if it does indeed refill, so that in and of itself is a test.

That make sense?

@Farside - Am I right about your points?

~Drixx

[Almost50]

No, that doesn't make much sense to me. Why would we want to lose a TOWN vote (farside) for nothing? It's like giving scum a 2nd kill for free.

If this is going to be the case then -at least- Fuzzy have Fuzzy shoot her, and she comes tomorrow confirming that she got points for it. That would be better than her breaking the alliance and him holding his shot.

[Reasonably Rational]

No, that doesn't make much sense to me. Why would we want to lose a TOWN vote (farside) for nothing? It's like giving scum a 2nd kill for free.

If this is going to be the case then -at least- Fuzzy have Fuzzy shoot her, and she comes tomorrow confirming that she got points for it. That would be better than her breaking the alliance and him holding his shot.

I thought of that plan, but the problem is if the plan is to have Fuzzy shoot her, she just breaks the alliance right? What if she had only limited bulletproof and a whole heap of her claim is bunk?

There's also something incredibly disastrous that you haven't thought of. I outlined it in detail to Random and hopefully he'll be active enough to read it and report that I'm not kidding.

You were in Space Dandy 2 right? You recall how we knew right away from day one that scum could have won that game literally on day 2? Well ... there's a logically plausible scenario where tomorrow could give scum the win, and fuzzy holding his shot until we can talk to him and you is one simple way to ensure that the scenario cannot happen, with an exception that I'm not going to point out to anyone.

Besides... I really would rather Farside just get her win as long as it doesn't end the game and screw us. I know that my view on neutral/3P is way more generous than 99.99% of the site, so I understand why you're like "just shoot her" but if she's willing to come clean and admit the obvious (that her claims as she has made them simply cannot be), I don't see why we have to be spiteful and deny her a chance to win. I'm not going to fight you over it... just asking you to consider what I'm saying.

~Drixx

[Reasonably Rational]

EbWoP: A50 you're too smart to view Farside as town at this point. A lynchproof (claimed 1x only, but this is SU and finales refill shots so... you do the math), bulletproof, reflexive and active roleblocker, multi-voting alliance destroyer who is town but can swap to being third party and exit the game with a personal win that doesn't impact the other win conditions (except that it lowers the players alive count by 1)? That's absurd. I would actually assume that a role with those abilities (all of which I think have been demonstrated?) was a role intended to be last person standing and win that way, except there are no unexplained kills, and such a role would have to have some way to take people out. There's no way Farside would survive a 3-player final day with that list of proven abilities, so she would have to be a non-compulsive SK who has never yet shot and is hoping to stay around long enough to use that shot at just the right time to get her win.

Given that I've put the thought into it and come to the conclusion that it only makes sense for Farside to be a 3P who needs to break alliances and be targeted to earn enough points to get a personal win OR that she's a neutral with a lot of tools in the toolbox but has to win as a last player standing, my thought is that we test her points thing. Give her the points and let her get her win. If she gets those points and doesn't exit the game with a win, we know what we have to do. And you know exactly what I mean and need say nothing more.

~Drixx

[farside22]

Can some one that is not RR explain to me why they think rr bringing up that I can disband alliances as a thing to be concerned with makes sense at all?
Because every time he says it just reads as fear mongering for no reason to me.

[Varsoon]