Micro 662: ArcAngel's Twin Trap Mafia (Ended)

[Spade_Ace]

/Confirm

Hi all. Am the replacement for Tyler and thanks for the welcome. Will post my thoughts as soon as I have read the content so far. Lets have a good game.

[Spade_Ace]

The main thing that has happened so far is SA's post 53 and the interaction it generated. I liked SA's style of scumhunting (analyzing each sentence and deducing possible intentions). But his conclusions seemed, quick, far fetched and a bit paranoid. Misa's "interesting exchange" comment was at the most a means of applying pressure on players at RVS.

@pine, I disagree with you at multiple places. One, I don't think scum (SA) would be eager to "fabricate reasoning" so early in the game. Two, how are you so confident SA-Misa can't be Town vs Town? Just because their initial arguments sound "contrived and forced", is that enough to rule out that possibility? Three, I doubt whether bussing and thereby attracting maximum attention is a good strategy for a scumteam, esp in a game that revolves around Tracker and Watcher. Fourth, "undue defensiveness" is a scumtell only with experienced players. There are times when newbie players get flustered and defensive when they feel that the pressure on them is unjust and they start attacking the player who applied the pressure.

@milkshake I don't understand why "pro-lynching" is the best stance. What if the person you bring to L-1 is a PR? What do we gain with a PR claim on day 1? I understand why and how a pressure wagon works, but random wagons serve no purpose according to me and I don't like the one being built on SA to be honest. The wagon would have served its purpose better on players who haven't contributed much like Kop and ThinkBig. Your, "i recommend everyone board on the wagon" comment is something scum would probably not say, I guess.

VOTE: ThinkBig
You said you would post an analysis and then didn't do it. But you had the time to welcome me. (thanks for the welcome btw )

[Spade_Ace]

This is a silly idea! Ignoring what is in your role PM and posting your true thoughts anyway is not hard at all! Under the one scenario when there is a possibility of your scum partner getting lynched, THEN you have to go through contortions, because you are the only one with motivation not to vote him. Town players have no information about him, and are as happy to participate as anyone else. Of course, if town players frequently refuse to participate based on "reads," then scum can just say they have a "read," and we have lost any hope of

true

scum hunting.

@milkshake your basic premise is that on day 1 without any flips it is easy for mafia to blend in as a townie and also that game changing activity happens only when someone is at the risk of getting lynched. Therefore it is best to create a situation where a random person is at the risk of getting lynched.

I feel you are assuming multiple things.

1. That all players are experienced in the role of a scum and know how to ignore their PM designation. Isn't it possible there are players who could scumslip under the pressure of quality questioning?

2.You are assuming the partner goes through contortions on voting or not. If the players are as exp as you claim to be, then they won't think twice in bussing their partner. In fact their primary motivation would be to provide as many facts that could support the lynch.

3. "Town players are happy to participate". Why should they be happy to participate when there is a possibility of a townie being lynched. If you take a townie to L-1 and he/she claims a PR role, won't mafia just kill that player at night? Again am not suggesting 'Not lynch', as you previously assumed. But it is better to take a person om whom we have genuine reads to L-1.

4. Also discussions that happen on day1 always supports day2 proceedings.

5. Something else that I realised. In this format, the person with the highest vote gets lynched, whether or not they are hammered. Suppose a person is at L-2. The mafia just needs to be quiet and wait for the deadline. So it's imp that we apply pressure on players who appear to be lurking.

[Spade_Ace]

UNVOTE:

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Kop

I realized if we kill Pine, this game might be even more stale.

Does that make him town though????

Or ah, scum for that matter.

@arnold you still haven't explained your vote. Was the vote against Kop a way of putting on pressure or was there some other reason?

[Spade_Ace]

Spade_Ace, yours is the only vote on Vedith. I think you should change your vote to me or Sleepless Assassin or Kop. Personally I think Sleepless Assassin over Kop.

Have already removed my vote. I had voted for ThinkBig, since he was inactive. But now as his slot, Vedith, is active I removed it.

Am voting for Kop. I didnt like his catch-up. His posts seem as if he is commenting on multiple things. But they lack content.
VOTE: Kop

[Spade_Ace]

@milkshake also what exactly is your reason for wanting to stick on with SA??

[Spade_Ace]

Spade_Ace, yours is the only vote on Vedith. I think you should change your vote to me or Sleepless Assassin or Kop. Personally I think Sleepless Assassin over Kop.

You and Ace are scum anyway.

@Vedith why do you think we are the scum team??

[Spade_Ace]

Wow. I guess you have solved the game then. Good going.

[Spade_Ace]

Ok, I will join the Kop wagon.

VOTE: Kop

This will help things happen I think.

My heart wants Pine to be scum, because his play is based on such incorrect understanding of the game from my viewpoint, but I think that just because he disagrees with me doesn't make him scum. However he does seem to think I am scum, ha. I do think there's a chance he's scum, but anyway there's no votes on Pine. So it's a moot point.

Wow. Are you building a case against yourself??

[Spade_Ace]

I did. But he isn't listening. What to do?

[Spade_Ace]

Ohh great Mafia lord Vedith. Your humble devotee is in need of some towncred. Please accept 'milkshake' as a sacrifice and help me survive day2.

VOTE: Milkshake

PS: Do you also have the power to help me survive night 1?

[Spade_Ace]

UNVOTE: Milkshake

Yeah he's town,
Lets go for the next scummy person.

VOTE: Spade_Ace

Great lord Vedith. Why have you forsaken me?

[Spade_Ace]

Why not Spade? Is Spade town for you?

The same reason that he didn't vote for Pine. Get two more votes against me and am sure he wouldn't mind joining my wagon.

[Spade_Ace]

@Spade - they know we're scum.

Dammit Vedith. Why did you have to go and spell it out? The gig is up now. So who's leaving town first, you or me?

[Spade_Ace]

@pine what do you make of the 'must kill kop' comment?

[Spade_Ace]

@milkshake: and yet no addressing of the fact that everyone has a chance of rolling scum, and I don't really get the point of Pine having an incorrect understanding of the game, you opting to discuss your suggestion of 'random lynch' post game implies that it's more of a matter of play style and doesn't need to be addressed

I kind of want to vote milkshake but I don't want to derphammer. Where's she at in votes to lynch?

Also rereading milkshake's iso,

I'm starting to think the people who bandwagoned them are scum

, minus Vedith.

Hmm.

VOTE: Spade_Ace

@misa you too were ready to join the Milkshake wagon, so does that make you a scumsuspect as well? Your comment seems quite opportunistic.

On the other hand, I believe people who joined the Milkshake bandwagon are probably town. There was a legit reason to vote against Milkshake. His comments seemed Anti-town (scum or otherwise). So as town, it initially made sense to lynch Milkshake. Scum on the other hand would not want a person who takes all the attention and spotlight to be lynched. For that matter they would not even kill such a person at night. If milkshake is indeed town, then they probably knew it would be a mislynch. So I suspect people who were on other bandwagons.

Vedith's vote against me makes sense logically. He had already mentioned that he finds milkshake and me scummy. He just decided to go for the next person in his list.

But your vote against me makes no sense. You were suspecting SA for 3/4th of the day. You come in just when Milkshake is at L-1. You say you kind of want to vote for milkshake. Then when Vedith and Pine removed their votes, you conveniently sheep them. And then you vote for me cos I was in focus at that time. How come you didnt vote for the other people on the wagon: Pine and Kop. What about them? Please give some justification for your vote.

Am not entirely convinced Milkshake is town (esp cos of the 'must kill Kop' comments). But right now you appear as a bigger suspect for me.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: MisaTange

[Spade_Ace]

@Vedith if you seriously suspect me. You should probably give your reasons now. We have less than two days. I and Kop each have two votes.

@SA and Arnold. Please give your thoughts. It would be a shame if this day ends in autolynch instead of a hammer.

[Spade_Ace]

@Pine please vote for someone. Lil uzi hasn't voted for anyone. And am not sure we can get a replacement before the day ends.

[Spade_Ace]

@Pine please vote for someone. Lil uzi hasn't voted for anyone. And am not sure we can get a replacement before the day ends.

I think Lil voted for Sleepless Assassin.

UNVOTE:

Seriously struggling to get into this game.

@Kop: Why the OMGUS vote? No one was discussing policy lynching at a length that required such a reaction.

This was lil's last vote. His slot isn't voting for anyone currently.

[Spade_Ace]

Ugh no

But I'm sure he has a

REALLY

good case!

My case is if I don't get to lynch Pine I will settle for Kop.

I think the Pine and Vedith were referring to Milkshake's no lynch case.

[Spade_Ace]

Ugh no

Can you explain why?...cos I didn't understand
But I'm sure he has a

REALLY

good case!

My case is if I don't get to lynch Pine I will settle for Kop.

You believe you won't get to lynch pine, let me be clear, your case isn't good enough.

VOTE: Arnold

Thanks for confirming you're scum.

[Spade_Ace]

@Arnold can you explain why???...cos I didn't understand.....

[Spade_Ace]

The current VC:

Kop: Arnold, SA, Milkshake
Spade: Vedith, Misa
Arnold: Pine, Kop
Misa: Spade

[Spade_Ace]

5) If players don't make a lynch by the end of dead line, on dead-line the player with the maximum votes or the one who reaches the first maximum votes will be lynched accordingly.

@SA this game cannot have a 'no lynch' unless people vote for a no lynch. Even if two people have the same number of votes the person who reaches it first will.be lynched.

[Spade_Ace]

@SA I just want people to be clear on their reasons for voting. You haven't updated your case against Kop. Your initial case was that you were unhappy with how Kop was responding. I used to feel the same way. But then Kop started to contribute more. Do you still feel Kop's responses are shallow?

On the other hand, am not satisfied with Arnold's contribution to the game. He hasn't explained his thought process at all. He still hasn't explained his vote on Kop.

People I wouldn't mind lynching at this point. Misa and Arnold. Considering there is no traction for Misa, am going with Arnold.

VOTE: Arnold

[Spade_Ace]

Latest VC:

Kop: Arnold, SA, Milkshake
Arnold: Pine, Kop, Spade
Spade: Vedith, Misa

As things stand Kop is getting lynched though the number of votes on Kop and Arnold are the same. As he reached the maximum vote first.

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Vedith
Consider it an OMGUS, if you will. Cos you literally suck. This is no longer the RVS stage and we have already lost a PR, yet you resort to baseless accusations. Twice in the game I asked you, your reasons for suspecting me and all you could muster was 'you are scummy'. Screaming 'Spade is a scum' 100 times from the rooftop doesn't get my role converted to a scum. If you have a case present it.

[Spade_Ace]

And am gonna try and ignore you.

[Spade_Ace]

@Mod:

Replace me. I don't feel like I'm doing my best and I'm hurting more than helping. Also this game as a whole disinterests me.

@Everyone:

Good luck!

Is it safe to assume BTD6 is a townie for now?? Cos i dont think a scum would want to be replaced because of disinterest esp with just two days remaining for night.

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Arnold Schwarzenegger

Honestly, this vote is based on a "read."

No idea why I'm suddenly voting based on a read when I have been arguing the whole time how stupid Day 1 reads with no information are.

@milkshake i know the Arnold ship has passed. But can you tell us again what those reads were??

[Spade_Ace]

Misa yes i did find you scummy on day1 and i gave my reasons for that. When Arnold turned up Town, i was certain you and Kop were the scum team cos your vite prevented kop from getting lynched and that too you changed your vote almost at the end of the day.

The only reason i am not pushing for your lynch ryt now is cos 'Sleepless' was the one who turned out killed. If it was anyone else, i would have focused on you.

Reason being.
1) SA was not threatening you at all. His focus had changed completely towards Kop. You had no reasons to kill him
2) In your last post,

I prefer Sleepless but that vote was the stronger scumlean between the two wagons

You explicitly mention you prefer sleepless as the lynch. It would be extremely stupid for a scum!misa to go and kill someone who she just said she wanted to see dead.

With Kop too the same issue arises. Why choose Sleepless as the target? There were two people suspecting him, Arnold and Sleepless. Would a scum!kop do something so stupid as lynch the only other person in his wagon?

You say Vedith's accusations are not baseless. Can you list them out?

[Spade_Ace]

Has everyone lost interest in the game or what? It's been a day since anyone has posted.

@Kop You seem to post only when someone is accusing you. Why are you not doing any active scumhunting?

@BTD6 can you post your opinion on people other than Misa.

[Spade_Ace]

I townread pine for the entirety of day1. But in day2, I didn't like the way he concluded Misa was a certain scum and then changing the vote to Kop.

Top town reads - BTD6, Milkshake
Neutral - Kop, Misa (neutral only cos I don't see either of them opting for a SA kill)
Scum suspects - Vedith (way in which you seem certain am a scum but refuse to give reasons), Pine (for reasons mentioned above)

[Spade_Ace]

I can lynch Pine over you today.

As things stand i am okay with lynching either you or pine. Preferably you.

[Spade_Ace]

@Mod Can we get a prod on misa, pine and milkshake

[Spade_Ace]

I can lynch Pine over you today.

As things stand i am okay with lynching either you or pine. Preferably you.

"Pine is my scumy buddy, I don't want to lynch there".

Ha. Just when I thought you were over me. We have three more players left in the game whom you haven't claimed is my scum buddy. You can do it. Am rooting for you.

[Spade_Ace]

I can lynch Pine over you today.

Also if am your main scum suspect why do you prefer pine over me?

[Spade_Ace]

I so wish there were other players active.

[Spade_Ace]

I so wish there were other players active.

Me too, quiet town = scum advantage.
You for, quiet town = more focus on you.

Atleast something we can agree upon. Yeah quiet town with such 'lynch rules' are a huge advantage for scum.

If i cared about focus, I wouldn't bother posting.

Haven't played with pine before. So I don't know his typical town game. In fact, this is just my 3rd MS game.

[Spade_Ace]

Yo Vedith. Any idea how to pace up this game?

[Spade_Ace]

@Kain it looks as if you came in, read the thread and decided to make a case against the second most scumread person.

[Spade_Ace]

No one cares what you think, Spade.

And am gonna try and ignore you.

you OMGUS in that thats the meaning that you vote VEDITH EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE NOT SEEING HIM AS THE SCUMS..................... and then AFTER WARD EVEN THOUGH YOU TOWN READ HIM YOU IGNORE HIM............ TOWN DO NOT IGNORE TOWN,, only SCUM IGNORE TOWN.........

scum DETECTED,,

I AM KAIN TEPES

This is a clear misrepresentation as you can see. The 'ignore' statement was in reply to the 'no one cares' I meant am gonna try and ignore his 'insults' if that wasnt clear for you. If i wanted to ignore him completely i wouldn't have responded to his qs.

[Spade_Ace]

This sums you up.

Anyway, I would rather not join the Spade Ace wagon, as both Spade Ace and Vedith are nullish.

WAGON?? there was only ONE VOTE before I voted for SPADE ACE......................

how is that a WAGON??? explain.......................!!!!!!!!!!!

Also BTD6 comment was written before your vote against me. I think you got things mixed up.

[Spade_Ace]

@Kain if you can, please avoid using caps too much. It seems as if you are shouting.

[Spade_Ace]

that makes sense..... but are you telling a TRUE STATEMENT though,, or is it just a SCUM TRYING TO HIDE....BEHIND A SMOKE SCREEN.........??? because i am a very aggressive player,,

kain

TEPES...............!!!

Aggresion with logic and evidence makes impact otherwise it just sounds like childish.

You have a clear reason to make a case against me as you are getting autolynched the way things stand.

[Spade_Ace]

Am not sure whether you are stupid or pretending to be one. And am getting pissed off seeing so many caps. But ill try to ignore them.

If am not mistaken you replaced 'Kop'. Kop had milkshake and Pine voting for him. That makes him the most scumread person and he is getting autolynched in case the town doesnt hammer. That being you who is getting lynched.

When i say am the second most scumread. It means Vedith had been shouting throughout the game and now BTD also expressed that thought.

[Spade_Ace]

Scum may not want to hammer as it draws attention to themselves, though, and it looks as though they want to put the wagon on L-1 and then simply wait for a Townie to hammer. Currently MisaTange looks worst from this wagon, followed by Spade Ace.

For now, this will do.

VOTE: MisaTange

@BTD i don't agree with your reason for voting misa. Misa vote was the 'hammer' based on the rules of the game. Based on your reasoning am the one you should be voting against as mine was the vote before the hammer. But i gave my reasons for voting. I had no way of knowing misa and milkshake would join the wagon just few hours before deadline. If i was scum wouldn't it have been easier to join the kop wagon?

[Spade_Ace]

5) If players don't make a lynch by the end of dead line, on dead-line the player with the maximum votes or the one who reaches the first maximum votes will be lynched accordingly.

@SA this game cannot have a 'no lynch' unless people vote for a no lynch. Even if two people have the same number of votes the person who reaches it first will.be lynched.

@Kain please read the rules again. You reached the max number of votes first.

[Spade_Ace]

I gave my reasons for not voting the 'Kop' slot cos i found it improbable that Kop would kill SA. But maybe I was wrong. Everyone seems to be playing quite random.

[Spade_Ace]

When did I say that i thought you were scum?? The post above yours clearly mentions my apprehensions on voting against Kop. What is wrong with you?

[Spade_Ace]

Are you trying to get me to vote against you??

[Spade_Ace]

Ohhh man!! This game is going from bad to worse.

[Spade_Ace]

@mod are we getting a replacement for misa? Its been more than a week since she was last active on MS.
Can you also prod milkshake.

[Spade_Ace]

Hey BTD6, I didn't see your comments on Post 399.

[Spade_Ace]

Replace me

Nice try. More votes on Vedith.

[Spade_Ace]

BTW no CC coming from me.

Either way, I think I'm okay with lynching this:
VOTE: Spade_Ace

Well I guess I shouldn't expect any reasons from 'Vedith's' slot.

[Spade_Ace]

I finished reading this snore fest
Kain Tepes is exactly what this game needed

VOTE: Pine

L-1

@TTTT can you explain your vote again?

[Spade_Ace]

I guess I have the hammer on Pine. Claim? Or?

Honestly I still think Kop/KainTepes is scum.

If you don't believe someone is the scum why are you even discussing about hammering that person??..ESP since no one is asking you to hammer.

[Spade_Ace]

Hey BTD6, I didn't see your comments on Post 399.

@BTD6 am still waiting for your response. Since your reason on Misa doesn't hold on anymore, why are you still voting for that slot?

[Spade_Ace]

@Alisae How about instead you answer 'Why a Spade lynch'?

[Spade_Ace]

Sorry didn't get you. Could you explain it further.

[Spade_Ace]

When did I ignore Vedith??

[Spade_Ace]

No one cares what you think, Spade.

And am gonna try and ignore you.

you OMGUS in that thats the meaning that you vote VEDITH EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE NOT SEEING HIM AS THE SCUMS..................... and then AFTER WARD EVEN THOUGH YOU TOWN READ HIM YOU IGNORE HIM............ TOWN DO NOT IGNORE TOWN,, only SCUM IGNORE TOWN.........

scum DETECTED,,

I AM KAIN TEPES

This is a clear misrepresentation as you can see. The 'ignore' statement was in reply to the 'no one cares' I meant am gonna try and ignore his 'insults' if that wasnt clear for you. If i wanted to ignore him completely i wouldn't have responded to his qs.

If you are going to make a case on me at least do a proper ISO. I have already explained the exact same thing to Kain.

And Vedith was the one who was not answering my questions. I replied to his question on Pine and gave my reads. Go check.

[Spade_Ace]

This is what makes me certain you are scum. If you were a town player who got replaced, you would have formed your own opinions. Instead you resort to exactly what your predecessor was saying, thinking that is the safe option. You vote without giving reasons. When forced to give a reason, you respond with something that has already been answered. This shows that you haven't even read the thread.

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Arnold

This will do

(I'll be sleeping after this)

What I was trying to say was Misa vote though technically not a hammer ensured that Arnold was getting lynched. Cos you don't need a hammer to lynch a person. The person with max votes is lynched when the deadline expires. So irrespective of Milkshake's final vote Misa's was the decider.

[Spade_Ace]

I understand your reasons for suspecting her, but saying she brought it to L-1 hoping that someone else would hammer is wrong. You could say you suspect her cos she changed her vote at the last minute.

[Spade_Ace]

I know it makes me bad. Which is clearly what I explained in post 399. Please read.

[Spade_Ace]

And if am a scum do you think am dumb enough to explicitly point this out.

[Spade_Ace]

Am VT. Am going to sleep right now. If someone hammers me in between lynch Alisae the next day. Her partner probably is either TTTT or Kain.

BTD6, milk and pine are town.

[Spade_Ace]

Alright I have nothing more to say. This just feels shitty. None of the replacements are either reading the rules or the thread. I pointed out a logical error knowing I look bad. Why would I need to even attempt to do that. I just have a request. Just do an ISO of my posts. If you feel am scummy. Go ahead. I don't want to justify myself any further.

[Spade_Ace]

All the best town!!... It's a LYLO tmrw..

[Spade_Ace]

KainTepes!!!