Open 665 - Friends and Enemies - Game Over! Town Victory!!!

[-Grey-]

VOTE: Alisae

Obvious scum is obvious.

[-Grey-]

Don't mind my Ego post.
I'm not actually here...

There's a fucking subscribe button at the bottom of every page.

Why do people do this bullshit when it's against the rules?

[-Grey-]

Hey guys.
I'm masons with Transcend.

I don't see how this is pro-town.

I don't see how it's pro-scum.

[-Grey-]

What Uzi said except it's not terrible, it actually got a good reaction coming from Uzi.
The way I see it there really isn't any reason to ruin a reaction test like that.

How does that make his reaction good instead of null, then?

[-Grey-]

Good as in scummy Grey.

I still don't get why his reaction isn't null if there's no reason to do what he did.

[-Grey-]

No reason = no purpose = no trajectory = no strategy = null.

[-Grey-]

Nah the reaction test was that the person I mentioned wasn't on the playerlist and scum are more likely to be aware of that then town are.

That's not at all what you stated out saying.

Moving the goalposts?

[-Grey-]

Started*

[-Grey-]

Hi everybody!! Sup Uzi, Alishe, Grey. Speaking of grey.

I'M NEVER TRUSTING YOU AGAIN AFTER THAT LAST GAME!!!

VOTE: grey

Rofl

[-Grey-]

Hey Hawk!

scum!Grey is a slick one indeed!

Why do you say that?

I understand Hawk, but you weren't in that game, so...?

[-Grey-]

Hey Hawk!

scum!Grey is a slick one indeed!

Why do you say that?

I understand Hawk, but you weren't in that game, so...?

I read it and felt you played well.

When did you read it?

[-Grey-]

Don't mind my Ego post.
I'm not actually here...

There's a fucking subscribe button at the bottom of every page.

Why do people do this bullshit when it's against the rules?

He's my backup mod, he's saying hi, just chill.

[-Grey-]

but yeah, I don't like LUV
I also don't like Grey.
I have an idea,
Let's vote Grey
FittyShadesofVOTE: Grey

Spite votes are unbecoming.

[-Grey-]

I like LUV.

I don't see what was scummy about Grey before, but that reaction was interesting.

VOTE: -Grey-

Not really.

There's a dynamic between Alisae and I that you know nothing about.

I scumread him in every game we're in together. He usually townreads me for it.

This game, he's spite voting me instead. I don't trust his reaction.

[-Grey-]

#Research

Alisae, you think LUV and I are both scum, right?

How did pregame play out in your mind, if you are right?

LUV: I need a way to read you.
Me: Read {this game} that Hawk was also in because he might mention it
LUV: Okay, I'll agree with whatever he says about you
Me: Sounds good, then I'll put you on the spot over that amazing coincidence.

That's what you're saying happened, right?

[-Grey-]

Nah I don't think you two are teamed.

So you caught a merger of group scum and the SK that nobody knows exists yet on d1?

Amazing, boo.

[-Grey-]

Member*

Sigh.

[-Grey-]

SK isn't in the set up.

How are you scumreading both of us if we aren't teamed, then?

[-Grey-]

SK isn't in the set up.

How are you scumreading both of us if we aren't teamed, then?

Gut tells me one of you is scum but not both.

Well, if you've eliminated S&S as a consideration, T&S is obviously one alternative, but so is T&T.

Why are LUV and I not both town?

[-Grey-]

And when one of us flips green, that just means you can go right on scumreading the other, right?

[-Grey-]

And you wonder why I scumread you.

[-Grey-]

Yup, Ali is scum.

I don't see him scumreading me as town.

[-Grey-]

Just look at his votes. I already ran him off my wagon once, but now that he has a little support he comes slinking back onto it.

[-Grey-]

The Grey read needs more time to develop but right now they seem a lot more careful then how I remember him playing hence why I scumread him.

And this is bullshit.

Not every game is the same, Ali. In this setup, there are three Masons that I have to be on the lookout for as well as the scumteam.

I don't want to prematurely out our Masons, so he'll yes I'm being more careful.

You are shit at reading me, so gtfo.

[-Grey-]

^ fair point

[-Grey-]

What does 'awfully coincidental' mean in relation to alignment?

Coming from me, and most others I would assume, that phrase would indicate some level of disbelief...or suspicion. So reason to suspect. It caused me to question the veracity of LUVs explanation to Grey. It was not scum indictment worthy...so he did not become a scum read for it.

Is this topic important to you? FYI - if at some point in this game I do begin to scum read LUV I'll be sure to bring this point up and say he was probably full of shit.

That makes sense, but at the same time I also understand BBT to nail down your thought processes here.

[-Grey-]

VOTE: fitz

Can we lynch this please?

No.

Stop trying to distract from the Alisae wagon.

[-Grey-]

Alisae claims I must be scum because I'm not aggressive, right?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=69550

An aggressive scum game.

Aggression is NAI.

Alisae is making a fucking terrible push that has no basis in reality.

[-Grey-]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=69444

Non-aggressive town game. 27 fucking posts total.

[-Grey-]

Vote Alisae or I dare you to defend him.

[-Grey-]

mozamis, don't think I will let you slide on not taking a stance on the Ali vs. Grey 1v1.

[-Grey-]

Just look at his votes. I already ran him off my wagon once, but now that he has a little support he comes slinking back onto it.

You have to be ballsy scum to do that. The fact that Alisae keeps changing her mind suggests "flexible town" to my mind. Open minded. Scum prefer to slap down a vote and then slip away.

Bullshit. Keep reading.

[-Grey-]

Gut is telling me town on town.

Scummy ass copout.

Scum mindset: I don't want to bus, but how can I defend my buddy when his case was torn to shreds? Ooh, TvT!

[-Grey-]

@ grey NO. So ften i see these massive fights on day 1, and they are nearly always TvsT. Scum dont normally want to get so involved. They want to blend in, not have some epic fight. Stop OMGUSing and try and be open minded.

Bullshit.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=69704

I started out the game the same damned way as this one.

Bonus: Alisae WAS IN THAT GAME TOO.

I'm powerlynching your ass d2 when Ali flips red.

[-Grey-]

Grey, I'm flipping Green.
I was also town in that game.

My point is that YOU KNEW BEFORE THIS BULLSHIT PUSH that it was bullshit

[-Grey-]

Grey, I'm flipping Green.
I was also town in that game.

My point is that YOU KNEW BEFORE THIS BULLSHIT PUSH that it was bullshit

And THAT is why Alisae is scum.

[-Grey-]

Lol, you're going to have to try harder than that.

I destroyed your case against me and instead of reevaluating your read & considering that you might have been wrong, you simply double down.

Scum.

[-Grey-]

I'm not sure who this was directed toward, but false dilemmas are unproductive.

Not when I've only destroyed his case, bit shown how he knew better than to think what he was saying meant that I was scum in the first place.

He saw firsthand that I'm not always gung-ho aggressive right out of the fucking gate, but turns around and says it must mean I'm scum when I'm not.

[-Grey-]

I'm not sure who this was directed toward, but false dilemmas are unproductive.

Not when I've only destroyed his case, bit shown how he knew better than to think what he was saying meant that I was scum in the first place.

He saw firsthand that I'm not always gung-ho aggressive right out of the fucking gate, but turns around and says it must mean I'm scum when I'm not.

AND doubles down after I destroyed his case on top of it.

He's fucking scum.

[-Grey-]

Hey Grey Bae.
You defeated my case. Congrats.
/me throws Confetti.
I'ma give you more time.

I won't be wooed by your sweet words, scum senpai.

[-Grey-]

How sure are you about Alisae being scum? Is it just that he was wrong/irrational? Is he annoying the tiddlywinks out of you, or do you genuinely see scum motivation?

Yes.

I can't imagine a world where Town!Alisae sees my play and even entertains the notion that I'm scum when he's had first-hand experience that contradicts his case.

He knows that I'm a very easy person to run up because I play in a very idgaf manner, and I think he tried to exploit that.

[-Grey-]

Tho the senpai part made me blush.

I suck as scum, so I'm sure you're scum senpai to me.

[-Grey-]

You seem to know Ali well so I'm surprised about your reaction to him voting for you. I think it's fair to say he overvalues meta a bit and you shouldn't really read into him using the method as a base for a scum read no?

You don't pay very close attention, do you?

He didn't

use

meta, he completely

misrepresented

it.

[-Grey-]

Being too aggressive and drawing the attention of Masons as town can lead to easy misLynches if the Mafia are coordinated.

It's not even that. Mafia coordinating to Lynch Masons will simply out themselves.

The danger in exposing the Masons is that it allows the Mafia to target them for the NK.

As long as they have to shoot in the dark, it gives town better odds to have conftown later in the game.

[-Grey-]

UNVOTE:

Meh.

[-Grey-]

LUV possible Ali buddy. Idk why town would bend over backwards here to speak for someone else.

[-Grey-]

UNVOTE:

Meh.

Just meh?

I don't think UZI is bending over backwards but I'm noting you said that.

VOTE: Snowman

I don't think Alisae is that hard to read nor do I think that the ISO takes that long to skim. Either unconcerned town or coasting scum either way not the best.

What color is your t-shirt?

If it's anything besides the word that rhymes with shmorange, it's a scum claim.

[-Grey-]

Must be town.

[-Grey-]

Been spending more time cheerleading Open 661 from the sidelines than playing my active games.

I need to fix that. Will be reading this game to get a better feel on my reads but I'm still not overly enthused by Ali's play.

[-Grey-]

I was going to comment on Grey's questioning towards LUV with the point that just because LUV said "scum!Grey is a slick one" doesn't mean he was referring to a specific game. I've been in games where Grey was scum and therefore could say the same thing.

The scum game I have shown any actual competence in is the one in my signature.

Aside from that game, my only other scum win was me buying time with catch up posts until I quickhammered for the win. Hardly any skill in that.

So yes, I knew which game he had to have read if he was making those comments.

[-Grey-]

LUV reading the Hawk and Grey game last night where Grey was "slick scum" seems awfully coincidental.

Not that coincidental considering it was one of two completed scum games, and the second one was nothing but catch up posts.

A rudimentary check of my completed games would have shown this.

[-Grey-]

To clarify I find it highly suspicious that Snarky found the thread but hasn't bothered to interact with it - feels like he's trying to lay low and as for ConManMick, I see nothing but fluff and absolutely no desire to catch scum.
Combined with PoE from town leans I'd say those three are a good shout.

Fancy, I was liking you for town until you made that post.

Well, I still like you for town... just a little less so.

[-Grey-]

In short I do think activity is town tell and inactivity is a scum tell.

It's obviously doesn't apply to every player in every situation, but I would say that it is at least statistically significant for the reasons I mentioned.

Townies can be inactive because they are busy, scum can also be inactive because they are busy, but on aggregate scum have more reason, and incentive to be inactive.

Ew.

The bolded sounds like scum think because it would allow them to appeal to the active players and justify lynching inactive town.

[-Grey-]

Reads as of reread up to page 8:

{boring, Alisae}
{BBT}
{FancyPants, havingfitz, Hawk}
{SnarkySnowman, Antihuman, Empking}
{mozamis, ConManMick}
{LilUziVert}

Not getting the townreads on ConManMick. Somebody please explain?

[-Grey-]

Grey, I'm flipping Green.

I believe you. That push is embarrassing.

[-Grey-]

Ranger style reads!

Not the first time Ranger reads have been posted.

249

[-Grey-]

{Boring, Fitz, AH}
{Moz, Facy}
{Hawk, Snowman, Mick}
{BBT, Uzi, Empking}
{Grey}

@MOD Update the OP to show replacements

Why is BBT so low?
Why is Moz so high?

[-Grey-]

Why Grey here? It feels like you should voting for Fancy or Fitz right now.

Why would he be voting for Fancy when he was agreeing with them in the post you quoted?

[-Grey-]

VOTE: fitz

Can we lynch this please?

No.

And I'd imagine that's why he didn't vote fitz, lmao.

[-Grey-]

UNVOTE:

Meh.

Just meh?

I don't think UZI is bending over backwards but I'm noting you said that.

VOTE: Snowman

I don't think Alisae is that hard to read nor do I think that the ISO takes that long to skim. Either unconcerned town or coasting scum either way not the best.

Do explain this vote, please.

I ain't seeing it.

[-Grey-]

{boring, Alisae}
{}
{FancyPants, havingfitz, Hawk}
{SnarkySnowman, Antihuman, Empking, LilUziVert}
{BBT}
{mozamis, ConManMick}

[-Grey-]

Since ConManMick has my other scumread voting for him, I think I'll

VOTE: mozamis

[-Grey-]

Sheeping a vote to get more content from Snowman. I don't nesscarily scumlean him just wanted more content from him since he has posted literally two posts all game. 3 if you count the double post...

So, you've decided to just throw your vote away for some reason. Got it.

If he ain't reading the thread, he ain't feeling any pressure.

Leave lurksacks alone and do something useful with your vote.

[-Grey-]

Moz's vote on CMM was bad but that's the only thing really. I've liked everything else I've seen from him.

Why? Everything he's posted until his ConManMick vote was just reasons to townread people.

Then a naked vote out of nowhere?

Nah. Not buying it.

[-Grey-]

Hey Grey, if I said BBT was scum, would you buy it at all?

Why would you say he's scum?

[-Grey-]

Since ConManMick has my other scumread voting for him, I think I'll

VOTE: mozamis

Huh?

Rephrase the question.

[-Grey-]

Since ConManMick has my other scumread voting for him, I think I'll

VOTE: mozamis

Huh?

Rephrase the question.

Why you scumreading Moz or voting Moz?

Moz's vote on CMM was bad but that's the only thing really. I've liked everything else I've seen from him.

Why? Everything he's posted until his ConManMick vote was just reasons to townread people.

Then a naked vote out of nowhere?

Nah. Not buying it.

You might want to reread his ISO.

It's like reading a primer in "go along to get along".

[-Grey-]

I saw something that made me believe that Alisae is town that I had written off on the initial read through.

Seems pretty obvious.

[-Grey-]

I saw something that made me believe that Alisae is town that I had written off on the initial read through.

Seems pretty obvious.

And that something shuffled him from top scum read to top town read that quickly? It must have been one incredible something. I suppose that means we can look to you to help defend Alisae, should he find himself under serious fire any time soon.

Pretty much.

[-Grey-]

Yeah the last two pages are really making me concerned about Ali but you just can't tell with him. It would've been nice if we had a cop in this setup.

Eh, I can imagine a world where Ali has that kind of theory as town.

Can't imagine why I'd want to discuss it, though.

[-Grey-]

And no. In fact, I've yet to find any confident townread at this point. It's kind of a problem.

If that's true,

Lazy would be sheeping LUV. Like we're doing.

That makes no sense.

Why would you actively sheep someone that you aren't confident is town?

[-Grey-]

I've never played with Alisae. My first instinct was that his entrance was a clever way to expose some knee-jerk cc from a derpy player with a Mason roll while pretending to be early scumhunting. At least that sounds like something I'd do as scum.

This indicates a scumlean on Alisae, but

I don't see what was scummy about Grey before, but that reaction was interesting.

VOTE: -Grey-

15 posts later, this happened.

Tell me, are you entertaining the notion of scum theater here, or do you think Ali is town here?

[-Grey-]

If Alisae's opening behavior is normal, it suggests that he likes to actively scumhunt.

What did Alisae post to make you abandon your theory from post 65?

[-Grey-]

@LUV, the last time I played with you, your reads won the game for us. I'm interested in your ongoing opinion of the gamestate. (by the way, I know you're V/LA now, but you have a habit of "forgetting" you're in games. Please don't forget about us.)

This looks to me like you are talking to a townread.

Talk to me about the progression of your read on LUV.

[-Grey-]

@Toffee, I don't like summary posts from people who aren't sub-ins. It creates an illusion of participation, and it's pretty close to solidifying as a scumtell for me. So is an immediate "yup, you're town" when you voice concern about that player. It seems aimed to appease.

You sure lobbed some softballs at me after my reread and flipped opinion of Alisae, if this is true.

Why? You don't strike me as the type to handle scumspects with kid gloves, so your behavior isn't matching up with this post.

[-Grey-]

I saw something that made me believe that Alisae is town that I had written off on the initial read through.

Seems pretty obvious.

And that something shuffled him from top scum read to top town read that quickly? It must have been one incredible something. I suppose that means

we can look to you to help defend Alisae

, should he find himself under serious fire any time soon.

After all the questioning you've done of Alisae, the bolded doesn't fit.

[-Grey-]

There's a reason I didn't wall post, boring. My phone can't handle them. The browser freezes up for some weird reason.

If you want me to address something, give it its own post, please.

[-Grey-]

I'm pretty sure I explained my vote on you in detail.

That's an evasion. I was addressing your behavior in regards to Alisae.

[-Grey-]

I'm seeing something new from LUV, and I don't know yet whether I trust it. When we were scum together, he was obvious scum. So was I. He made summary posts, and followed moon logic. I've seen him play vig where he hung back, and killed the scum for us. Now, he's acting really towny. He's making pushes, he's confident, he's arguing, and he's participating. I want to say "LUV is def. town", but I also know he's clever. Cleverer than he seems to get credit for. He's been reading games, and it's possible that he's scum with a great learning curve. It's a meta WIFOM that I want to ignore, but can't entirely.

So, he's obvious as scum, but he's also "cleverer than he gets credit for".

Yeah. That's not contradictory

at all

.

[-Grey-]

By all accounts, he's acted incredibly scummy, but why would scum be so painfully obvious? His reasoning has been simultaneously stiff and moony, which tells me it's just him (regardless of alignment). So clumsy scum or derpy town? You tell me.

He always strikes me as scum, especially so on d1.

It makes no sense, though, that you'd be thinking he was Scum AND voting on the same wagon he was.

[-Grey-]

That quote you quoted was lobbed at FancyPants, by the way.

Are you suggesting that your treatment of non-replacement catch-ups depends on the person rereading the game? Because that's not the way your post originally read.

[-Grey-]

By all accounts, he's acted incredibly scummy, but why would scum be so painfully obvious? His reasoning has been simultaneously stiff and moony, which tells me it's just him (regardless of alignment). So clumsy scum or derpy town? You tell me.

He always strikes me as scum, especially so on d1.

It makes no sense, though, that you'd be thinking he was Scum AND voting on the same wagon he was.

Cool beans. I'm glad we've cleared that up.

Not really?

[-Grey-]

That quote you quoted was lobbed at FancyPants, by the way.

Are you suggesting that your treatment of non-replacement catch-ups depends on the person rereading the game? Because that's not the way your post originally read.

I'm not sure what you're saying I'm saying.

I was saying that I've never seen town summarize a game they're already in unless prompted by request. I've definitely seen scum do it, though. From a scum buddy, I've had it explained that it makes you look like you're trying to solve the game.

So, why does it make any difference who you were directing that comment to, then?

[-Grey-]

Speaking of FancyPants...

@mod

: please prod

[-Grey-]

I guess it doesn't. I had him in mind when I said it, so in my head, it was directed at him. It's curious that you took it to heart as being about you *queue Carly Simon*.

That's a misrepresentation of my posts. I never "took it to heart as being about" me. I was asking why you had behavior that is inconsistent with your stated belief.

A question you've never really answered, btw.

[-Grey-]

So is this a tunnel? I feel like you're not asking really productive questions. I mean, sure, we're interacting, but it just seems like you're asking the wrong questions for someone trying to get a read. It's more like you're trying to find chinks in my armor. As if I'm some huge townread that you need to knock down a little.

It's not a tunnel. It's an examination.

I townread you quickly on my initial read through because of a theory. That theory was undermined after my reread which suggested a different, conflicting theory that makes it impossible for both theories to be true.

So, I have to figure out not only which theory is more likely to be true, but what that means about the players involved in the faulty theory.

[-Grey-]

@Toffee, I don't like summary posts from people who aren't sub-ins. It creates an illusion of participation, and it's pretty close to solidifying as a scumtell for me. So is an immediate "yup, you're town" when you voice concern about that player. It seems aimed to appease.

If this is true, I don't see why you'd keep such a non-committal vote on Empking after I, a player you were already suspicious is, not only reread the game but came back from that reread with a totally different read on my former top scumspect.

If post 194 was true, I'd have expected more than a couple half-hearted questions.

Ergo, your actions are not in sync with your stated beliefs.

[-Grey-]

Spoiler: The interaction in question

Reads as of reread up to page 8:

{boring,

Alisae

}
{BBT}
{FancyPants, havingfitz, Hawk}
{SnarkySnowman, Antihuman, Empking}
{mozamis, ConManMick}
{LilUziVert}

What the fuddruck happened here? I'm going to need you to walk me through your process going from this:

Grey, I'm flipping Green.
I was also town in that game.

My point is that YOU KNEW BEFORE THIS BULLSHIT PUSH that it was bullshit

And THAT is why Alisae is scum.

to Alisae being your top town read

as of page 8

.

This just isn't cutting it:

Grey, I'm flipping Green.

I believe you. That push is embarrassing.

I saw something that made me believe that Alisae is town that I had written off on the initial read through.

Seems pretty obvious.

I saw something that made me believe that Alisae is town that I had written off on the initial read through.

Seems pretty obvious.

And that something shuffled him from top scum read to top town read that quickly? It must have been one incredible something. I suppose that means we can look to you to help defend Alisae, should he find himself under serious fire any time soon.

I saw something that made me believe that Alisae is town that I had written off on the initial read through.

Seems pretty obvious.

And that something shuffled him from top scum read to top town read that quickly? It must have been one incredible something. I suppose that means we can look to you to help defend Alisae, should he find himself under serious fire any time soon.

Pretty much.

[-Grey-]

Hey Grey, if I said BBT was scum, would you buy it at all?

Curious for other people's opinions too.

Curious for your answer to my question

[-Grey-]

I saw something that made me believe that Alisae is town that I had written off on the initial read through.

Seems pretty obvious.

And that something shuffled him from top scum read to top town read that quickly? It must have been one incredible something. I suppose that means

we can look to you to help defend Alisae

, should he find himself under serious fire any time soon.

After all the questioning you've done of Alisae, the bolded doesn't fit.

I'm not sure what's not to understand. I want to lock you into your statement.

Sweet, I managed to cut the wall before my browser froze.

I'm not getting your use of the collective "we" because according to my understanding of the game, there is no "we" between you and Alisae and I don't get why you'd use that term in that situation otherwise.

[-Grey-]

It's just the way I speak when I'm being a touch condescending, I suppose. Like "are we feeling well?" and "we're going to need you to sit down, now, sweetie." I think it's pretty normal for old ladies like me.

Maybe

, except... why would you look to me to help defend someone you've been questioning?

Why do you assume that I would defend someone simply because I townread them? What gives you the basis for that belief?

[-Grey-]

What is the scum motivation for giving such an obviously safe and easy answer then?

Dodging the need to justify your choices based on the player's content.

[-Grey-]

If we're going to 1v1 Hawk vs BBT, I'm more likely to vote BBT.

I'd rather Lynch mozamis, though. He's done nothing to change my read since I voted him.

[-Grey-]

Grey why BBT over Hawk?

Read my ISO before asking superfluous questions.

[-Grey-]

Ah please just screw right off. If he didn't respond, you would've said he's scum laying low waiting for things to blow over. It's perfectly understandable to get angry about getting wagoned for not being active enough and imo he's responded well.

#goodposting

[-Grey-]

What is Hawk being lynched for?

Idk, ask scum

[-Grey-]

BBT, what is your read on havingfitz?

[-Grey-]

Lol.

[-Grey-]

Lel

VOTE: BBT

[-Grey-]

VOTE: BBT

[-Grey-]

Lol.

[-Grey-]

What's stopping you from looking at him today?

[-Grey-]

Nobody ever follows the votes.

[-Grey-]

Oh yeah.

UNVOTE:

BBT is town from his post-fakehammer posts.

[-Grey-]

Where is the mod? We need a VC!

BBT is L-2.

I was already voting him when I "hammered".

[-Grey-]

Anti-town != Pro-scum

BBT not being super concerned with helping find scum in his last moments doesn't make him scum. It makes him petulant.

Why would scum feel petulant over being lynched? They wouldn't.

Scum does a lot of things when they think they're hammered, but I don't really see them sulk.

[-Grey-]

Where is the mod? We need a VC!

BBT is L-2.

I was already voting him when I "hammered".

I forgot who but I think someone said he was at L-2 before I voted.

I counted the votes.

All is well in the universe.

[-Grey-]

@Grey do you always use Fake hammers as reaction tests cause I swear to God I saw it this time, but last time and if this is your MO imma never be able to take you seriously when we play lol. Also side note. Considering LUV said he read up on our game don't you think it's a bit strange he kinda fell for the fake hammer?

Not always.

Just when people aren't paying attention.

[-Grey-]

Nobody has ever seen a double rainbow

before

.

You can only see a double rainbow

during

.

[-Grey-]

Logic.

You can't argue it.

[-Grey-]

Did Con townslip or was that fake?

That wasn't a townslip. It could have been surprised scum wondering why nobody flipped when there are no protective roles.

[-Grey-]

I'll focus more on this game in the not too distant future.

I have a lot going on right this second.

[-Grey-]

The only way Alisae's d1 play makes any kind of sense is from the perspective of a mason trolling for reactions. That's why I flipped my read so hard yesterday.

His little "Masons with Transcend" gambit makes perfect sense if the real Masons knew he wasn't fishing them out... which they would if he was one...

Also, his whole attitude yesterday was "fuck you, I'm untouchable".

Get the fuck off Alisae and find scum.

[-Grey-]

VOTE: Uzi

Get off the mason.

[-Grey-]

Wtf is going on?

[-Grey-]

We're flipping Snowman

Okie doke

VOTE: Snowdude

[-Grey-]

Can we get some reads to go with that analysis?

[-Grey-]

I was mostly wondering what your recent analysis of Alisae did for your read on him.

Not much, I presume.

I don't get why he has so many votes. The wagon on him feels anti-town as fuck.

[-Grey-]

Your Snarky vote makes a little more sense, now.

[-Grey-]

@Grey

I probably would have voted Antihuman over snow if Anti wasn't on V/LA.

Not much point in voting somebody if they aren't around to engage me.

Why vote Snowman over Moz? They're not VLA.

[-Grey-]

Why Snowman over Moz then?

Ohai.

[-Grey-]

Eh. I'm not feeling a Grendel wagon.

His reads look good, and he's explained himself pretty well.

[-Grey-]

What wierds me out is that he feels like he needed to explain said reads.
Not to mention I need to see him start scumhunting cuz he's hiding behind me and you to lynch scum.

He answered questions.

Didn't see any overexplainy stuff, but maybe I missed it.

Also, it's kinda hard for me to dis the guy for sheeping when I sheeped you onto Snarky.

[-Grey-]

I've seen a lack of lack of scumhunting from him.

Have you been reading his posts? There's a good amount of analysis from him.

[-Grey-]

ITT: We learn that Alisae uses AIOQ tell (Analysis Instead of Questions)

[-Grey-]

Also I used wierd mostly because it's part of my personality.

How weird.

FoS

: Alisae

[-Grey-]

Oh?

Well, that certainly explains the wagon. And it destroys every reason I was townreading you.

All in one fell swoop.

VOTE: Alisae

[-Grey-]

Hence my 875.

[-Grey-]

[-Grey-]

I'm okay with becoming a Lynch All Liars PL if people are still holding that page 1 reaction test against me.

This is me confirming I'm not a mason.

Looked like you bullshitting just like you did all day d1, to me.

[-Grey-]

I'm okay with becoming a Lynch All Liars PL if people are still holding that page 1 reaction test against me.

A Mason could easily say this to fish for Scum to vote them because they know they'll never actually be lynched.

Fucking duh.

Quit assuming that I'm not reading simply because you don't know my thoughts.

[-Grey-]

You guys need to make up. I think you both town.

Seriously?

How can you VT read his d1?

[-Grey-]

Um, my read isn't based off meta.

It's based off "that shit don't make sense coming from a VT"

[-Grey-]

Ehhh, let's not leave that lying around.

UNVOTE:

[-Grey-]

Is Grey just _shockingly_ less observant as mafia then he is as town? Do you really think that Town!Grey is more likely to pick up on things you're saying then Scum!Grey?

Imo, most players are as observant as one alignment as another. I'm pretty sure you're just seeing what you want to see and not what's there.

Dude, it's not even that.

I DID read the post Ali pointed out, and we BOTH stated my take on that post.

He's fabricating his read on a lie about what I was doing.

Why would town make that kind of assumption instead of ask my opinion of the post before going all ham?

[-Grey-]

Idgaf what you have to say, scum.

[-Grey-]

Why would scum!Alisae assume what you are going to do/act where as town!Alisae wouldn't, or not to this extent?

Why would town push a case on bad assumptions instead of seeking clarity on questionable points?

[-Grey-]

Why would scum!Alisae assume what you are going to do/act where as town!Alisae wouldn't, or not to this extent?

Why would town push a case on bad assumptions instead of seeking clarity on questionable points?

Look who you're talking about.

Yeah. Scum.

That's why it makes sense.

[-Grey-]

I was distinctly getting a "how dare you", plus a hint of smug, "I should've known" from that post lol.

And I'm not. That's one hell of a reach there mister.

New townbloc: Fitz, Uzi, Moz, Snowman, Empking, Hawk, AH
Scumbloc: Mick, Grey, Grendal.

Yes, scum clearly hard defends scum here.

[-Grey-]

I'm not SRing him for his hard defence on you.

Doesn't fucking matter.

Scum doesn't hard defend their buddy the way he's been defending me.

Grendel/Grey can only either be T/T or T/S. Your reads are bullshit.

[-Grey-]

I like ff tactics too man! Its a classic tactical rpg!

QFT

[-Grey-]

HERE IS AN ALL CAPS POST.

CAN YOU TWO KNOCK THIS SHIT OFF NOW?

[-Grey-]

HERE IS AN ALL CAPS POST.

CAN YOU TWO KNOCK THIS SHIT OFF NOW?

This looks so fucking town.

Nah.

I could see me doing that as scum.

What makes it look town?

[-Grey-]

What are your thoughts on Grey again?

Haven't been scum reading him. If I had to pick I'd guess he was town. Not a fan him following around Ali today despite maaaybe suspecting that slot. Not interested in voting him any time soon.

Alisae is my top scumread atm. I only unvoted because the day was young and the wagon was big.

[-Grey-]

Keep reading.

Alisae said he wasn't a mason, which flipped a bitch on my reads.

[-Grey-]

@MOD not feeling this game, replace me out please

[-Grey-]

I wanted to NK Uzi n1, but nooooooo.

Don't listen to Grey!

[-Grey-]

Boo..This post reeks of buddying. Why the fuck would I care about looking Town? I am Town. That is all I need.

Moz reads ?

I don't like how ConMickMan and Fitz both have to re-evaluate. Seems like Moz is a planned mislynch of ConMickMan/Fitz but then because I pointed out they are hunting they have to readjust.

mod: Do scum have daychat?

If you do, I'm concerned.

Mod confirmation of Math!Scum.

I pmed him when it happened.

[-Grey-]

Even if it had been a joke, it impacts the game.

[-Grey-]

Yeah like I had four gambits destroyed by that.

Couldn't fake claim mason in LYLO had to bus Fitz I couldn't risk people thinking it was just a joke :/

Sorry scumteam.

Not your fault, you did great with what you had to work with.
Sorry I replaced out, but 1769 took a lot out of me.

[-Grey-]

Math you should have taken my advice from n1 on n2

[-Grey-]

i never read the game btw

just like really isolated bits and pieces

so i dont even know what happened with bbt and alisae lmaoo

You should read d1, I was godawful.

[-Grey-]

Math you should have taken my advice from n1 on n2

I replaced in with literally hours left on D2 and not having read and no extension.
Did a quick skim.

Thought your replaceout meant bad stategy so I put Uzi as VT.

I don't do strategic replace outs.

I was drained after 1769 and didn't have the energy to play as many games so I had to back off for a bit.

[-Grey-]

We were bad at mason hunting, and that cost us the game. ALTHOUGH ME AND EMP BOTH WANTED UZI FOR THE NK, AND WE SETTLED ON GRENDAL DOH! That was the turning point, killing grendal was a big mistake.

Excuse me?

I wanted Uzi NIGHT ONE.

[-Grey-]

Math you should have taken my advice from n1 on n2

why are you posting now? Its a bit late...

I wasn't listened to during the game, so you can gtfo with your criticism.

[-Grey-]

Soooo.... Did we win?

WHY WAS I THE FIRST NK?!

You scared Moz.

[-Grey-]

I wanted Uzi NIGHT ONE.

You said about Boring and Uzi "i'd bank on the first two" .
You didnt push uzi very hard.
I dont want yet another pissing contest with you. You played really well. You shouldnt have bailed on us though. Poor show.

I left the game for reasons that had nothing to do with the game.

[-Grey-]

Pedit: I don't think you played d1 poorly Grey I do think in hindsight the play was easy to scumread.

That means I played poorly.

Good scum play doesn't stand out on review.

[-Grey-]

Actually I disagree. It only has to be effective in the moment. Sometimes someone's scumtells are obvious in hindsight but you'd never be able to figure it out during the game.

Actually your agreement is unnecessary because I don't require validation.

Scum play that can be spotted on review is why replacements are dangerous to Scum.

The replacement is reading that content without the biases and assumptions that were in operation during the real time operation of those earlier days.

[-Grey-]

Actually I disagree. It only has to be effective in the moment. Sometimes someone's scumtells are obvious in hindsight but you'd never be able to figure it out during the game.

Actually your agreement is unnecessary because I don't require validation.

Scum play that can be spotted on review is why replacements are dangerous to Scum.

The replacement is reading that content without the biases and assumptions that were functional during the real time operation of those earlier days.

Brought to you by the department of redundancy department.

[-Grey-]

Don't get too down on yourself Grey. Scum play is hard.

It really is. =/

[-Grey-]

It's almost impossible for your Scum play not to become obvious the longer the game goes on.

If that were true, town would have a higher win rate.

[-Grey-]

Good GG game gigabyte gT Troubadour

[-Grey-]

oh my omg god ur killing me my dude

I'm killing you... WITH MY LOVE!

[-Grey-]

Mods are overrated.

[-Grey-]

She's awesome.

[-Grey-]

Don't get too down on yourself Grey. Scum play is hard.

It really is. =/

Shhhhh I find scumplay easier than town.

*hides from barrage of wtf Math*

Eternal Townie no more, eh?

[-Grey-]

Thanks for modding, tojam.

Mistakes happen, that's the joy of living, the opportunity to learn from them.

I wish you the best in your future games!

[-Grey-]

-Grey- had gained my trust

I'll take that as a compliment. Thank you.

[-Grey-]

Thank you for keeping the Dead PT sealed.

Things got nasty in there.