Open 665 - Friends and Enemies - Game Over! Town Victory!!!

[Empking]

Vote: Having

- I laughed at con's joke.

[Empking]

Unvote

Reading Having as town.

Vote: Mozamis

- Hi.

[Empking]

Unvote

Reading Having as town.

Vote: Mozamis

- Hi.

Well, thanks for that.
Why and why?

He looks like he's genuinely scumhunting.
Have a go at guessing why.

[Empking]

NV (5) - BlueBloodedToffee, Alisae, Antihuman, SnarkySnowman, Lil Uzi Vert

FOS: Everyone n this list

[Empking]

UnFOS: Blue, Anti

Unvote
Vote: Alis

[Empking]

NV (5) - BlueBloodedToffee, Alisae, Antihuman, SnarkySnowman, Lil Uzi Vert

FOS: Everyone n this list

Why?
I unvoted so that I could reread and re-evaluate the game.

That's no excuse. Throwing away pressure is only pro-scum.

Why Al over LUV? Gut or arbitrariness, it could have gone either way but I leant a little to Al. I didn't even notice the wagon, as hard as that is to believe, as the huge numbers of not voters stood out to me and I immediately reacted.

I usually prefer joining wagons - all else be equal - but my priority with two weeks to go is my biggest scum read.

[Empking]

Grey's thought just made me think of something. If scum claim Mason ought a Mason immediately counter-claim, or should they wait and let him drop association tells for some Day(s)?

[Empking]

Join me on King.

Sure, Empking hasn't done anything to leave the bottom half of my nebulous read cloud yet.

VOTE: Empking

Why are we voting him in particular? I saw you mention the jump on Alisae and shade-throwing. It's kind of meh. I suppose those are things that happened, but surely, other people have been scummy too. Who's your second highest read?

Just for those reasons. It's a better wagon than what we had before.

Anti is my second. A lot of his questions feel like busy work and I don't like how he got his TR on Ali.

What is wrong with my 'jump on Ali'? And what's 'shade'? As in the Ru Paul sense?

[Empking]

Join me on King.

Sure, Empking hasn't done anything to leave the bottom half of my nebulous read cloud yet.

VOTE: Empking

Why are we voting him in particular? I saw you mention the jump on Alisae and shade-throwing. It's kind of meh. I suppose those are things that happened, but surely, other people have been scummy too. Who's your second highest read?

Just for those reasons. It's a better wagon than what we had before.

Anti is my second. A lot of his questions feel like busy work and I don't like how he got his TR on Ali.

What is wrong with my 'jump on Ali'? And what's 'shade'? As in the Ru Paul sense?

I found your vote on Ali the most suspicious.

That's not an explanation. That's repeating yourself.

You FoS'd everyone not voting and didn't apply any pressure there. That's shade.

Ali was one of the people not voting. I voted for Ali. That's applying pressure there.

[Empking]

boring, since you're partly sheeping LUV, but LUV can't provide an answer: What's wrong with my 'jump on Ali' other than it being '' the most suspicious'?

[Empking]

Join me on King.

Sure, Empking hasn't done anything to leave the bottom half of my nebulous read cloud yet.

VOTE: Empking

Why are we voting him in particular? I saw you mention the jump on Alisae and shade-throwing. It's kind of meh. I suppose those are things that happened, but surely, other people have been scummy too. Who's your second highest read?

Just for those reasons. It's a better wagon than what we had before.

Anti is my second. A lot of his questions feel like busy work and I don't like how he got his TR on Ali.

What is wrong with my 'jump on Ali'? And what's 'shade'? As in the Ru Paul sense?

I found your vote on Ali the most suspicious.

That's not an explanation. That's repeating yourself.

You FoS'd everyone not voting and didn't apply any pressure there. That's shade.

Ali was one of the people not voting. I voted for Ali. That's applying pressure there.

It is, you just aren't satisfied.

It isn't. Why am I suspicious? Voting Ali. What's wrong with voting Ali? Its suspicious.

Its not an explanation. It simply isn't.

Naked voting without a follow up isn't pressure. You aren't doing anything to get people to see why we should join you on Ali and you aren't engaging with him in order to see if your read gets stronger or goes away.

I have spoken a lot with Ali. A vote - particularly when its the third vote - is pressure by itself.

You can also focus on more than one person at a time.

You have your vote parked, you aren't making anything happen despite having plenty of time to do so, and have resorted to arguing semantics. You're scum.

Where have I argued semantics? That acusation has simply come from nowhere.

[Empking]

King, I didn't say you were suspicious, I said your vote for Ali was. I found it suspicious because you had FoS'd everyone who wasn't voting before you casted your vote without giving them a reason to engage with you or the game itself. It looked like you did a quick skim of those same people and picked Ali because you thought he was low-hanging fruit and you wouldn't get too much flak for jumping on his wagon. You even tried to justify it by siting your meta when no one had asked you why you were joining his wagon.

Where did I "You even tried to justify it by siting your meta when no one had asked you why you were joining his wagon"? That's another lie.

If you were Mason-hunting, I'd have moved my vote to you, by now.

"Why is is scummy?" "Its suspicious" is not an explanation. I'm not arguing semantics. You're lying.

[Empking]

He's just said he'll post some insight tomorrow though.

UnFOS: Blue, Anti

Unvote
Vote: Alis

Is the basis for your vote her not voting?
If so, why did you choose her and not LUV?
If not, what are the other reasons?
Do you usually prefer to join existing wagons or create them?

NV (5) - BlueBloodedToffee, Alisae, Antihuman, SnarkySnowman, Lil Uzi Vert

FOS: Everyone n this list

Why?
I unvoted so that I could reread and re-evaluate the game.

That's no excuse. Throwing away pressure is only pro-scum.

Why Al over LUV? Gut or arbitrariness, it could have gone either way but I leant a little to Al. I didn't even notice the wagon, as hard as that is to believe, as the huge numbers of not voters stood out to me and I immediately reacted.

I usually prefer joining wagons - all else be equal - but my priority with two weeks to go is my biggest scum read.

- Right here, you tried. No one asked you why you were voting for him, you were asked why you FoS'd everyone who wasn't voting.

- Now you're voting Ali for mason hunting? Bullshit, he wasn't accused of that earlier.

This is another lie. I have never said that my vote was put on Ali for mason-hunting. You've just quoted my explanation for her obver LUV. owever, with your constant lying, then you're still getting beaten by Ali for Mason-hunting.

- That's not even the original question you asked. You asked what was wrong with your jump on Ali and I said it was suspicious. I didn't state anything wrong with your jump beforehand so I never even repeated myself. Regardless, it's me explaining why I voted you for your jump on Ali. Your dislike of it doesn't mean it isn't valid.

This is arguing semantics. "You didn't say scummy, you said wrong-with"!

[Empking]

This implies that you're now voting Ali because you think he's mason hunting and that if you thought I were, you would've moved your vote to me.

My vote is still on ali partly because of Mason-hunting.

However, your post was clearly implying that I was claiming that my vote was put on her for mason-hunting. Which iwould've have been true. But was not what I was claiming.

"What's wrong with my post" "It was suspicious" is not an explanation. Its a theasaurus. I assume your denials of this basic facts are trying to bait me. But I'm not sure why you'd go with something so banal.

[Empking]

Scum would never want to show no interest.

Town would even less likely to want to show no interest.

If someody is showing no interest, its probably not alignment indicitive.

[Empking]

Hawk, are you pretty sure BBT is scum? Are you planning to vote him?

Honestly let me finish reading all the ISO's but from skimming his yeah I scum lean him. Don't like his questioning feels really busy. Naked votes with little content or reasoning around them. I'm still at work sorry if these posts are a bit lacking.

I came really close to laughing out loud t this post. It is just so clearly unrelated to the truth.

I've got a townread on BBT, and I might be willing to sheep him closer to the deadline thanks to my natural modesty and humbleness.

[Empking]

I didn't get the BBT wagon, but

Lol.

Whoever is town on my wagon you should be embarrassed.

This was awful.

[Empking]

Don't mine BBT. I feel he's one of Kings scumbuddies after a reread.

VOTE: BBT

L-1

How did you figure they were related? How does BBT's flip affect your King read?

His 186, 291, and 488.

It doesn't affect it at all.

If BBT flipping scum would have strengthened your read on me then an intelectually honest person trying to determine people's alignments would be forced to decrease his read on me, btw.

Vote: Ali

- Nothing's changed on that front.

[Empking]

Don't mine BBT. I feel he's one of Kings scumbuddies after a reread.

VOTE: BBT

L-1

How did you figure they were related? How does BBT's flip affect your King read?

His 186, 291, and 488.

It doesn't affect it at all.

If BBT flipping scum would have strengthened your read on me then an intelectually honest person trying to determine people's alignments would be forced to decrease his read on me, btw.

Vote: Ali

- Nothing's changed on that front.

I have no idea what you're trying to say.

Imagine that you think I am 6 on the scum metre and you think BBT is 50% to flip scum and if he does then I'll be an 8. If he flips town then I'll be a X.

6 = 8 * 0.5 + x * 0.5
6 = 4 + x * 0.5
2 = x * 0.5
2/0.5 = x
4 = x
x = 4

If the world consists of two possible states, and if the first state being true would cause me to be more scummy than you estimate my being at current in the uncertain world, then if in actuality we live in the second world then you ought to revise my scumminess down.

[Empking]

This is literally basic mathematics.

[Empking]

Yeah I still don't understand.

The reasons I'm scum reading you have barely anything to do with BBT. I don't see why his flip would make me reconsider why I was scum reading you.

Would BBT flipping scum have increased your read on me?

[Empking]

To clarify, Grendel has replaced FancyPants and Empking has been prodded.

THe apathy I feel in this game is stifling

I as prodded within pretty much 24 hours of the flip when my internet was down. I'm not apathetic.

[Empking]

Vote: Ali - Nothing's changed on that front.

Reasons plz

Mason spec and a general lack of pro-town play.

[Empking]

Good reasons.
You wanna know who also has been lacking pro-town play?
Snowman and Mick.

Also Ali.

And I like Mick; think he's town.

[Empking]

Actually Grendal, why are you explaining why you're townreading people?

Also Moz I second the motion.
VOTE: Fitz

I really don't like the avatar changing. I was ready to bark at this post before realising it was from Ali (for whom there are more interesting things tio remark).

[Empking]

Is scum really Hawk, Snowman, and Grendal?

At least one of these is wrong

Aye, since she missed herself off.

Ali: re my reads, I have lots of town reads. I'll wait for your flip before investigating further into scumreads since that's a big chuck of info.

[Empking]

Yeah I still don't understand.

The reasons I'm scum reading you have barely anything to do with BBT. I don't see why his flip would make me reconsider why I was scum reading you.

Would BBT flipping scum have increased your read on me?

Probably not.

Yeah, if the 'if' is wrong then nothing that follows will follow.

[Empking]

I'll wait for your flip before investigating further into scumreads since that's a big chuck of info.

what? you dont suspect anyone else?

Obviously LUV.

Grendel: Its mainly conincidince - as my posting over the last days testifies - and wrt BBT he self-imploded in a really ugly way as soon as he was wagoned, and I was only willing to sheep based on the logic-using rather than a big town-read.

[Empking]

LUV: Have we played a completed game together?

[Empking]

LUV: Have we played a completed game together?

Yes.

Oh yeah, duh.

[Empking]

then we set a precedent for town reading giving up underpressure. It's not good for town to be so loose with someone who won't defend themselves or actively hunt scum after being pressured.

Who are you responding to?

(Ignore that is just a partial quote; accident)

[Empking]

Grey: Y u no voat?

[Empking]

Alli has already claimed. I'd be happy to just lynch her without this becoming a replacement mass. Also, becuse I think Allu is most likely to be scum. Mostly, that to be fair.

[Empking]

: Vote: Hawk

- Just because BBT blew uo doesn't mean he was wrong.

[Empking]

Grendel seems like a very odd kill. He was far too try-hard to be a Masonm. So I'm guessing scum are in who he was lookng at.

[Empking]

Only Moz, but that's half the game so that still doesn'r explain the kill as compared to other more Mason-like players who were also on the Moz wagon.

[Empking]

Only Moz, but that's half the game so that still doesn'r explain the kill as compared to other more Mason-like players who were also on the Moz wagon.

Just stawp. Mentioning "mason-like" players is bad. Scum should not be given clues as to who the masons are. If they get clues they can start offing the masons which is bad. IMHO we have gotten lucky so far in that no masons have died.

I do not hink that scum are wondering if Grendel is a Mason or not.

[Empking]

Yeah, i don't think it is remotely reasonable to expect the mode to intervene in a BBT sistuation.

[Empking]

Neither Anti nor Snarky have posted today, which is really not good.

[Empking]

So glad math is joining us but also math you post way too much xP

Why did your post come immediately after the prod? You forget about us?

[Empking]

I would hope that everything involving someone replacing out would be NAI.

[Empking]

Snarky: Why no answer to my questions?

[Empking]

Ignore the erroneous 's'.

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: Snow

Ignoring my question

Unrelated: What's IEM?

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: Snow

Ignoring my question

Unrelated: What's IEM?

You reads too

Why doesn't anyone post what they are thinking? I has sads.

I am posting what am thinking. Snow not responding to my question has not town motive behind it. Is from scum.

[Empking]

yeah uh i'm replacing in for antihuman i didnt actually know until now lol

{CMN, Uzi, Mathblade, Snarky, Hawk} are all town i'm pretty sure based on the last page which i skimmed last night

i think that poes the game down to fitz/mozamis/empking fmpov but from reading emp is the only one i actually scumread - will double check i'm not missing any slot tho

more after class i forgot entirely about this

Not missing anyone.

Unvote
Vote: Hawk

No point being lonely if I don't have to be.

[Empking]

lol???????????????????

uzi do you think that makes sense

that the d1 lynch was all town and the cw was all scum?

like

i really REALLY do not see anything else in terms of reads

but what does this imply

It implies your reads are garbage, and a result of confirmation bias.

Snarky and Hawk have both never met a wagon, they disliked. They're both obviously scum. Obviously, not with Moz. And I feel pretty confident - what with so many people in this game being so a resolute in not changing their reads after two town lynches - that Moz flipping town is not going to start some of Hawks/Ss' useful idiots to start reevaluating themselves.

[Empking]

We definitely ought to be waiting for Having's claim That's only sensible.

I haven't been in the background If the other eight players take pleasure in ignoring me then I cannot physically stop that Even when the scum team is obviously Hawk/SS/LUV and at this point LUV can taste his chain of mislynches that he's not even bothering to hide it.

Giga: your whole thinking behind us being scum was your Mason-reading Everything after that is confirmation bias - you're human you suffer it - should you not try to read the game with an open mind. I think you're town. If any of us of your 'scum team' get lynched and when we flip town can you promise me that when we flip town that you'll start looking at Hawk, at SS, and at LUV?

King is confirmed scum and I have actual meta on him. I've caught him as scum twice.

Have we played two completed games together? Have we played any completed game where you didn't want to lynch me from my first post?

[Empking]

Or Moz' claim if Having is right about him being on L-1 Although, I doubt he is

[Empking]

I've been working off the assumption that Moz and Having are Masons - I haven't looked for the third since Mason-hunting is anti-town - which would explain Moz' immortality since Mason's won't bus etc. They're bussing right now, which doesn't really make sense.

I think I may have been reading the game all wrong. Which would make human if I stuck by it Still if the people who had a better grasp of the game are calling for a hasmmer then I guess

Unvote
Vote: Having

I'm going to get to rereading the game.

p-edit: Oh, that confirms it sorry guys

[Empking]

p-edit: Oh, that confirms it sorry guys

What are you talking about? What are you apologizing for?

It confirms that you're not a Mason. You claimed it. I had thought your "I'm Town" and not being more specific was a veiled Maon game. I'm sorry for misreading the game so badly up to this point.

[Empking]

I didn't hammer for Hawk and sheeping LUV and SS cause I still consider them the scum team.

I haven't looked for the third since Mason-hunting is anti-town

also tf is this

doing in-thread stuff like outing reads and asking questions to push for masontells =/= masonhunting

just reading the thread and noting associations isnt anti-town

If it leaks into your posting, and it undoubtely will, then it is anti-town for two reasons.
1) It helps the scum narrow down the mason's If you're going "these three players are town for *reasons* " then scum will notice that.
2) You are not - despite being a VT - not being completely open to your fellow townies. This means your chain of thinking is not so open and you are more likely to be read as scum as you make chains of logics that have leaps in them etc.

p-edit: I was thinking Moz was also Mason, but there aren't enough possible partners if one of them isn't Having.

"regardless of flip" is not the language of someone who thinks he's lynched scum. Its from someone who either knows he's hit town and is chaining mislynches, or someone who doesn't want to give away that he

knows

we've lynched scum.

[Empking]

Vite: Moz

- L-1

[Empking]

Yeah, just waiting for Hawk.

[Empking]

@king, which two of me, math, and hawk are scum?

I'm not sure. I'm happy throwing p my hands and voting wherever the Masons tell me to.

[Empking]

I'm willng to bet on Hawk being scum.

Vote: Hawk

[Empking]

Does no one think it odd that everuone is just willing o accept tat he is town. Would not scum try to sway people off that?

[Empking]

Well actually BBT (flipped town) tried to get awau from that.

@ BBT - I agree that Hawk doesnt look "super-town". But where are you getting this "Hawk def. scum" stuff from?

And look at this dampening concern from flipped scum.

[Empking]

I'm convinced BBT v Hawk is TvS. Can't figure out who the scum is in this situation.
So I'ma just sheep this
VOTE: Hawk

This is scummy as fuck.
"Lets give the hawk wagon real momentum and pretend its just derp!".
No. Opportunistic.

VOTE ALISAE

I'm just going to leave this here.

[Empking]

Flipped scum Mozamis literallu vote flpped town Al for voting scum-buddy Hawk.

[Empking]

If you look at Hawk his reads have not changed ever. His scum reads being BBT, me and Moz. That's from the first couple of pages.

However, it is not until very much later that he votes the actualy scumuy in his scumreads.

[Empking]

Please welcome BlueBloodedToffee replacing rb and Antihuman replacing kentofan!

VC 1.2

-Grey- (L-4) - ConManMick, boring, Hawk
Alisae (L-5) - -Grey-, havingfitz
mozamis (L-5) - FancyPants, Empking
FancyPants (L-6) - mozamis

NV (5) - BlueBloodedToffee, Alisae, Antihuman, SnarkySnowman, Lil Uzi Vert

(expired on 2017-01-25 11:09:00)

VC 1.6

Empking (L-3) - Lil Uzi Vert, Hawk, boring, Alisae
mozamis (L-4) - FancyPants, Antihuman, -Grey-
Alisae (L-5) - havingfitz, Empking
ConManMick (L-6) - mozamis
-Grey- (L-6) - ConManMick
havingfitz (L-6) - BlueBloodedToffee

NV (1) - SnarkySnowman

(expired on 2017-01-25 11:09:00)

Parked on town to keep his budy safe.

VC 1.10

BlueBloodedToffee (L-4) - Alisae, Antihuman, -Grey-
Empking (L-4) - Lil Uzi Vert, boring, Hawk
Hawk (L-5) - BlueBloodedToffee, havingfitz
mozamis (L-6) - FancyPants
Alisae (L-6) - Empking
ConManMick (L-6) - mozamis

NV (2) - SnarkySnowman, ConManMick

(expired on 2017-01-25 11:09:00)

To clarify, no BBT was NOT lynched.

VC 1.11

BlueBloodedToffee (L-2) - Alisae, Antihuman, boring, Hawk, Lil Uzi Vert
mozamis (L-5) - ex-FancyPants, BlueBloodedToffee
Hawk (L-6) - havingfitz
Alisae (L-6) - Empking
ConManMick (L-6) - mozamis

NV (3) - SnarkySnowman, ConManMick, -Grey-

(expired on 2017-01-25 11:09:00)

Park on another town: stull keepin his buddy safe.

VC 1.L

BlueBloodedToffee (L) - Alisae, Antihuman, boring, Hawk, Lil Uzi Vert, SnarkySnowman, ConManMick

Alisae (L-4) - Empking, mozamis, havingfitz
mozamis (L-5) - ex-FancyPants, BlueBloodedToffee

NV (1) - -Grey-

BlueBloodedToffee was lynched, he was a

Vanilla Townie

.

Thread locked out, Night 2 has started.
(expired on 2017-01-24 09:44:00)

Scum keepin their options open with controk of two wagons keepng Moz safe.

[Empking]

In a work: How did t take four days for Moz to get lynched.

Hawk.

[Empking]

VOTE: King Where was all this yesterday King -_-;;

Sorry, too busy hammering your scumbuddy.

Also I'm confirmed town Ive known the masonry since Uzi came in and said Snowman is town and so is CMM. Why would I leave masonry alive for so long? Wouldn't it make more sense to have blind town searching for scum?

The treason why the Masons wre so hard to find was because they were acting like such scum.

Scum would have realised that LUV's play was Mason rather than Scum. The fact that you never considered that possibility only has one explanation: You knew he wasn't in your PT.

Why you didn't you kill them? Because tjheir reads were pretty wrong. LUV, for instance,hasn't had an accurate read all game.The fact that he was willing to lynch Moz rather than forcing a mislynch on me probably came as a shock to you.

[Empking]

VOTE: King Where was all this yesterday King -_-;;

Sorry, too busy hammering your scumbuddy.

Also I'm confirmed town Ive known the masonry since Uzi came in and said Snowman is town and so is CMM. Why would I leave masonry alive for so long? Wouldn't it make more sense to have blind town searching for scum?

The treason why the Masons wre so hard to find was because they were acting like such scum.

Scum would have realised that LUV's play was Mason rather than Scum. The fact that you never considered that possibility only has one explanation: You knew he wasn't in your PT.

Why you didn't you kill them? Because tjheir reads were pretty wrong. LUV, for instance,hasn't had an accurate read all game.The fact that he was willing to lynch Moz rather than forcing a mislynch on me probably came as a shock to you.

Wut you realize that makes no sense right? Like leaving Masons alive is just stupid as scum EMP look at the vote counts me and Moz are never if I was scum wouldn't I just run up the mislynch on you earlier like Uzi was a mason. I knew he was a Mason. Your logic is that he has a bad read on you and as scum we as scum team never ran up that mislynch? That's stupid you're literally talking out your ass with this logic.

]

You are literally trying to run up that mislynch right now.

VC 2.4

mozamis (L-1) - ConManMick, SnarkySnowman, Hawk, Grendel

Alisae (L-2) - havingfitz, Empking, Lil Uzi Vert
SnarkySnowman (L-4) - mozamis

NV (3) - -Grey- (TBR) , antihuman (V/LA), Alisae (TBR)

With 8 active players, it takes 5 to lynch.

(expired on 2017-02-07 15:56:00)

VC 2.L

Alisae (L) - havingfitz, Empking, Lil Uzi Vert, ConManMick, mozamis

mozamis (L-3) - SnarkySnowman, Grendel

NV (3) - -Grey- (TBR) , antihuman (Returned!), Alisae, Hawk

With 8 active players, it takes 5 to lynch.

Alisae was a

Vanilla Townie.

Night 2 has begun, vote is off, -Grey- will be replaced under standard procedure.

(expired on 2017-02-03 16:24:00)

Never together** Why would I not stay on and mislynch Alisae d2 if me and moz are scum together? I will admit me not coming back and hammering Moz was bad and lax by me I left my vote on the wrong person here considering The whole masonry was on him that day.

EMP is scum. So is MB. Snowman if you have questions just ask buy we should be on King today

Never being together is what scum would do. If you didn't know his alignment then I'd expect you to be with him occasionally due to sheer chance.

If one looks at the vote counts then the avoidance of Moz is crazy. Both with avoiding being caught all on one wagon together and in lynching Moz.

[Empking]

Proving not scum-teams through votes seems like a good idea.

[Empking]

What we could try but one wrong guess and it's game over so shut up scum.

Back at ya, actual scum.

[Empking]

Yeah, we messed pour kills something awful. Still, 7p Lysol to town-win (and the best part is that it wasn't even town feeling on the back foot) isn't something you see everyday, good game.

Mod: You might want to change the topic title.