Micro 674 9:12 Dream Mafia. Game over

[gerryoat]

The vote on hap is town
When you see him flip,
you'll be sure to frown

[JaeReed]

Why vote Grey first and then me instead of hap if you feel like that's something I should have pushed on? Shouldn't you then be voting hap?

Cause I'm a replacement who replaced in attempting to reaction test. I liked the response I got.

Okay I'll vote hap now cuz I like you now cuz you has gud reasons for scumreading me not to mention your interactions with me seem to be coming from town.
VOTE: Hap

You're claiming Slayer's gambit here and I don't buy it.

What's your reason for suspecting Hap? Why did you feel you needed a reaction test to get reads rather than reading the thread and coming to conclusions on what you wanted to push based off that?

Why do you feel my reaction was town over scum? Was there anything in particular you thought I'd not do as scum there?

[Alisae]

3. Ok, what was Tepes an earlygame wagon for? How do you believe scum gained enough sway in the game to swing the wagon? Do you believe the Firebringer lynch was a policy lynch or something more? And yes, I expect something more when you start with a stance and try to work backwards than two VC quotes with no micro level analysis of the votes, because I taught you better than that.

Cuz they didn't exactly have good posts and then dissapeared.
Well considering you just replaced in and then started leading a Firebringer lynch sure. But let me read why that happened first.

[-Grey-]

The vote on hap is town
When you see him flip,
you'll be sure to frown

It's a bit early to be worrying about flips.

[Alisae]

Why vote Grey first and then me instead of hap if you feel like that's something I should have pushed on? Shouldn't you then be voting hap?

Cause I'm a replacement who replaced in attempting to reaction test. I liked the response I got.

Okay I'll vote hap now cuz I like you now cuz you has gud reasons for scumreading me not to mention your interactions with me seem to be coming from town.
VOTE: Hap

You're claiming Slayer's gambit here and I don't buy it.

What's your reason for suspecting Hap? Why did you feel you needed a reaction test to get reads rather than reading the thread and coming to conclusions on what you wanted to push based off that?

Why do you feel my reaction was town over scum? Was there anything in particular you thought I'd not do as scum there?

I did a gambit without knowing what it is.
Ok.

I'm suspecting Hap becuase they're pushing lurkers (BTD, my slot), and they even jumped on BTD for a NK. Seems to me like they really want that lynch to go through for some reason.

And I do that reaction test stuff while I go ISO people. Why can't I do both?

Cuz I'm seeing moreso town motivation rather then OMGUS and scummy posts. AKA the posts I saw in your ISO sorta seemed lackingish to me. I just felt like there could be more. But then I got more. So I liked it.

[-Grey-]

AKA the posts I saw in your ISO sorta seemed lackingish to me. I just felt like there could be more. But then I got more. So I liked it.

A scumspect responding to suspicion with behavior that is expected from them as town is actually grounds to strengthen a scumread if they are aware of their meta.

Not that I am scumreading Jae, it's just that your flip isn't quite adding up for me.

[Alisae]

Okay just read the Firebringer PL.
And what the fuck did I just read?
That makes me not like TPA even more.
Sure it was a PL, but surely there musta been scum somewhere on that wagon, don't cha think?

[Alisae]

Also I think the message Jae is trying to get across to me is that I need to actually read things.

[JaeReed]

One thing I did like about hap was he took hard stances on I think every major issue in the thread. The read on Grey, Tepes, TPA.
What I don't like is that along with his style this game he has only pushed lynchbait low content posters, which makes it incredibly hard to read him.

It's something that can come from town just as easily as from scum. It's plausible he believes he has PoE'd the game down to that. It's just not how it has been framed so far in that it all seems like actual scumreads from him.

[gerryoat]

TPA or Maker. Lets quick lynch one. IDC which. They are both scums

[Alisae]

I can see him pushing lynchbaity and low content posters as him not putting any effort into actually finding scum
pedit: I'd take TPA, but why you in such a rush?

[JaeReed]

He's not striking me as someone particularly low effort considering the effort he's putting into making his posts rhyme.

[Alisae]

Yep.
Someone is putting effort into making their post rhyme and making their posts look pretty.
But not any into actually playing the game besides pushing lurkers and low content posters.

[gerryoat]

You're talking about his rhyme
And that is a shame
You're committing a crime
If you put a VOTE: by his name

[JaeReed]

TPA or Maker. Lets quick lynch one. IDC which. They are both scums

Why are you so confident in BTD?

[gerryoat]

BTD and TPA are both scums i believe

[Alisae]

TPA or Maker. Lets quick lynch one. IDC which. They are both scums

Why are you so confident in BTD?

Echo

[JaeReed]

@Ali Except he's making cases on them too? So he's making an effort at playing.

There's also the fact that I have actually seen an all lurker scum team before and wasted my time scumhunting in the more actives and people who were pushing them because I thought it couldn't be that easy and lurker lynching was opportunistic. So there's a non zero possibility that he's town pushing on lurker maf as well.

[JaeReed]

Okay just read the Firebringer PL.
And what the fuck did I just read?
That makes me not like TPA even more.
Sure it was a PL, but surely there musta been scum somewhere on that wagon, don't cha think?

Not sure. I couldn't pinpoint any particular vote that stood out as obvtown to me. Grey's unapologetic stance for it after the fact strikes me as town, but he was honestly pretty town for his reaction to P_A's push on him anyway at the point in the game it was at, so that doesn't actually tell me much. I know my vote was just me not unvoting when I replaced in. gerry seemed to scumread Fire rather than want to policy him for his shit, and I'm not sure whether that was scum justifying the vote or merely that he ended up TRing me which put Fire's push on me in a bad light after that.

[gerryoat]

it was scum justifying the vote obviously

[Alisae]

For a second I thought BTD didn't actually pick at the case that Hap posted.
But then he posted his responses to each point within the quote in bold
Which confused me.
I don't like the last post in his ISO tho which is basicly him discrediting a dead townie.

[hapahauli]

I'm going to take a break from rhyming for a bit. While I had a lot of fun doing it...
a) It's incredibly hard to make detailed analysis in limericks, and;
b) This game is a bit inactive, and I cannot take for granted that players will really consider things the way I want them to.

This is how I'm reading this game:

Alisae

BTB6_maker

-Grey-

gerryoat

TPA

JaeReed

Let's start with the town-reads. I have

very

strong town reads on gerry, TPA, and JaeReed.

Gerryoat

is clearly pushing the game along, and has a vested interest in keeping the activity of the game alive. He is very clearly hunting mafia.
I've been very impressed by the quality of some of

JaeReeds

posts.

I mean that's kind of why I asked for reasons and mentioned the 180. Which he then ignored.

I don't know if being inconsistent coming in after a night phase is necessarily scummy though beyond surface level. Like you'd have to believe he'd be that sloppy as scum so as to both forget his townread on me prior to the lynch, and not have a case ready to push when asked about the read flip.

JaeReed very deeply considers the TPA situation. It's so easy for scum to just jump all over this, but you can see he's actively considering all explanations here.

One thing I did like about hap was he took hard stances on I think every major issue in the thread. The read on Grey, Tepes, TPA.
What I don't like is that along with his style this game he has only pushed lynchbait low content posters, which makes it incredibly hard to read him.

It's something that can come from town just as easily as from scum. It's plausible he believes he has PoE'd the game down to that. It's just not how it has been framed so far in that it all seems like actual scumreads from him.

Again, same thought process. Considering both sides of the argument, posting real analysis, and not painting things as a black or white issue. You can see he's actually trying to read my posts, and not turning my rhyming into a black-or-white issue.

TPA

is doing things that are just outright suicidal as mafia. His completely unexplained 180 on his Grey read is something that mafia would find very hard to post. TPA seems completely unconcerned with his reputation, and just is posting what he's thinking. That's a very clear town mentality. It's psychologically incredibly difficult for someone who knows their guilt to do what TPA is doing.

The rest of the players next, one by one.

[hapahauli]

-Grey

is a puzzle to me. He's my "margin of error" read right now.

On the one hand, I think his D1 hammer is very attention seeking. He doesn't bother to fake a scumread on Firebringer, he just hammers him. The no excuses, "fuck it, he's useless" mentality seems pretty genuine.

On the other hand, he currently owns the worst vote in the game. Grey's progression of his read on me:

hap raises a valid point.

Seemingly, thinks I'm town.

But everyone seems to be ignoring,
What mafia did while we were snoring,
Last night

Flubbernugget

died,
I opened his filter and looked inside,
And which lynch do you think he was exploring?

VOTE: btd

This assumes that because Flubbernugget was voting me and he died, that is evidence against me. Dead Townies can be wrong,

and are as likely to be wrong as any other Townie.

Err.. not necessarily?

I actually agree with this.

Town is often killed for being on the right track. Aside from PR kills, the next biggest threat is read accuracy.

Agrees with my post on BTB/Flubber.

Oh yeah, and hapahauli is fucking impossible to read because of that rhyming shtick.

He thinks I am impossible to read.

VOTE: hap

I can vote hyur.

Therefore, vote me?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So that's where I am on him. Hammer points to town. Voting someone you consider unreadable over people you scum-read is a no-no and points to mafia.

[hapahauli]

BTB6_maker

is a lurker. I made the case on him at the beginning of the day primarily because I thought he was a lurker and wanted to get more information from him. Also, I think making it to LYLO with a player like BTB is a disaster. He will be a liability regardless of alignment due to his activity.

That all being said, I do legitimately think he is mafia for his defense.

I will pick apart Hapahauli's case on me.

In my experience playing this game, stuff like this always comes from mafia. Mafia generally aren't confident, but try to put up a "front" of calmness or confidence. But that also betrays their mentality. When a townie is falsely accused, you generally see a very emotional response. Something along the lines of "FUCK YOU, I'M TOWN." Even if people don't explicitly say it, posts will generally betray that mentality. You'll typically see some emotion (sadness, anger, frustration). Most people do not enjoyed being called liars.

The mentality of "I will calmly pick this case apart now" is

very hard to come from town

. That's not a natural thought process from someone who is falsely accused.

Secondly, his actual defense. His defense boils down to "I can do this as either alignment." And to his credit, he is certainly a lurking player regardless of alignment. However, what's suspicious is what his defense is missing.

Nothing about his defense tells us that he's town.

. Again, the "FUCK YOU, I'M TOWN" psychology of being falsely accused. Nothing in that defense is about him being town. It's all about discrediting the analysis because he can do it as either alignment. Logically valid? Yes. But psychologically very suspicious.

[-Grey-]

My vote on you was out of annoyance over your green eggs and ham routine. Thank you for losing it.

UNVOTE: