Open 666 - Pick Your Poison - Day 5

[Titus]

Ugh, has every slot in this replaced out? Hell for the VCA.

[Titus]

Hi me!

Hi Transcend!

*falls asleep*

[Titus]

Hey Grey, why me in particular to be town, why should I vote TTT over Transcend?

[Titus]

Apologies for prod. My pc died and forgot to announce it.

[Titus]

And I'm the Queen of England

VOTE: Transcend

You will find a similar posts in all of my games. I do not take being accused of lying lightly.

[Titus]

Hi. I will be more active game tomorrow. Promise.

[Titus]

I am here. Tell me your thoughts. What should I review?

[Titus]

No, I have not. My pc died.

You can tell me where to look.

[Titus]

Great. Got your conclusion.

I can totally look for Transcend's partners. I expect him to be hardbussed btw.

He deliberately provoked my vote.

Was there a guilty on him?

[Titus]

No.

[Titus]

Transcend tanking his lynch and the fast hammer after I voted him.

[Titus]

Scum is in Not Mafia Grey or Narna most likely.

Mod VC please

[Titus]

Ok, the VC needs all vcs with replacements. I have been lethargic on doing that but i will eyeball it now.

[Titus]

Vote Count

Not Voting (1):

ArcAngel9

Zyf (1):

Gamma Emerald

D3f3nd3r (1):

A Simple Plan

desperado (1):

Lil Uzi Vert

Superhans (7):

Hawk, Alisae, Gendaberry, Desperado, rb, Zyf, Superhans

Gendaberry (2):

Dwlee99, D3f3nd3r

Superhans will be lynched.

Deadline in: (expired on 2017-01-14 00:00:00)

VOTE: Grey

Fight me young padawan.

[Titus]

Ok, the VC needs all vcs with replacements. I have been lethargic on doing that but i will eyeball it now.

I did put all the replacements in the vcs lol

A proper vca needs every vote count. Ugh.

[Titus]

Vote Count

Not Voting (1):

ArcAngel9

Zyf (1):

Gamma Emerald

D3f3nd3r (1):

A Simple Plan

desperado (1):

Lil Uzi Vert

Superhans (7):

Hawk, Alisae, Gendaberry, Desperado, rb, Zyf, Superhans

Gendaberry (2):

Dwlee99, D3f3nd3r

Superhans will be lynched.

Deadline in: (expired on 2017-01-14 00:00:00)

VOTE: Grey

Fight me young padawan.

Oh just curious. Why is that quote in your post?

I doubt the D1 wagon was all town.

[Titus]

Hi Titus what're your reads.

Dunno, just working stuff out

[Titus]

Not saying you did not. I was explaining why mine was an estimate.

Anyway, when i look at eod with Hans voting himself (and ignoring the not subtle of you coloring yourself green Dwlee), I see only two names that might be scum. Grey and Not Mafia (now RC). That's where we should be vot i ng.

[Titus]

This game as too many subs.

[Titus]

I am. I just acknowledge I had the wrong sub in my last post. You already voted me though, so if anyone needs to read, it is you. My tolerance for fake dumb is only so high RC.

[Titus]

I fucked up and mistook your slot as not Mafia when Alisae is not Mafia.

Grey, I see your whiteknight.

[Titus]

Scumread you since yesterday and it has nothing to do with the N_M slip. That was just kind of the final straw.

Nah, the nm error is why you could do that. Nice touch on the phrasing btw, trying to sell yourself the case stronger than is warranted.

What is your take on Grey ignoring and whiteknighting me while I vote him?

[Titus]

I have no strong read on the Grey slot because other slots, including your own, have drawn my attention.

I also think it's a stretch to call Grey ignoring you because he thinks that scum is off the wagon 'white knighting.'

Nah, he's saying he wants to pursue scum off the wagon to avoid commenting on me and keep himself from the pool. Unless I am horribly mistaken, there is one scum left. Arguing Hans wasn't bussed is ridiculous. Refusing to own it is worse. He's avoiding stating an opinion on me too.

[Titus]

And your theory is scum didn't bus SuperHans?

In our games together, have you seen me be wrong and town?

[Titus]

And your theory is scum didn't bus SuperHans?

In our games together, have you seen me be wrong and town?

Are you claiming omniscience as town, Titus?

Will you self vote if I say yes? :-p

I am asking you if I have ever been wrong. Implicitly, your answer is no. Yet, you jump to me moonlogicking. That is the type of thing that tends to resonate w others.

[Titus]

And your theory is scum didn't bus SuperHans?

In our games together, have you seen me be wrong and town?

Are you claiming omniscience as town, Titus?

Will you self vote if I say yes? :-p

I am asking you if I have ever been wrong. Implicitly, your answer is no. Yet, you jump to me moonlogicking. That is the type of thing that tends to resonate w others.

Assume whatever you want, but an evasion is by definition not an answer.

As a lawyer, you should know that.

You knowing that and attempting to manipulate my words to support your read doesn't seem legit.

And now that I force you to actually talk about me, you threaten me.

Throwing a question back at me as snark and trying to argue you expected a real answer is scum play.

You tried to avoid me, but I know you better. My vote isn't moving.

P.S. you still never jystified why you thought Hans was not bussed but deflected.

[Titus]

P.S. you still never jystified why you thought Hans was not bussed but deflected.

Because bussing on day one is downright stupid.

Forgive me if I feel it's unnecessary to state the obvious.

And just because you're claiming your predecessor was stupid doesn't mean he did. Hans doesn't hammer himself without scum on his wagon.

[Titus]

Again, you're discrediting rather than discussing that Hans doesn't bus unless scum are on his wagon.

Your response, rather than defending your assertion to hunt off the wagon is to dredge up games where I was wrong hyper early. I corrected that read later as you know.

[Titus]

Strawman. I was not claiming omniscence. I was asking if I had been wrong. A simple yes is sufficient, but you never once accused me of being moonlogicky as town. In fact, we sync quite well.

Still me being flawed is not a justification for your position that Hans was not bussed.

[Titus]

VOTE: Titus

Dude, you got replaced.

[Titus]

Alisae is you.

[Titus]

Mod, can you reorganize the first post with a section of living and dead? Trying to parse that has been difficult for me.

[Titus]

Still me being flawed is not a justification for your position that Hans was not bussed.

Bussing on day one being extremely suboptimal is plenty of justification.

There was scum on his wagon, alright. The hammer vote.

That's again, just saying what you'd do. A scum flipping D1 means scum are extremely ineffective or bussing.

Given the PR deaths, we can eliminate ineffective. So scum bussed.

Scum also do not hammer themselves if the wagon is all town.

[Titus]

Mod, can you reorganize the first post with a section of living and dead? Trying to parse that has been difficult for me.

Scroll to the bottom of it.

I did read the cross through and randomly organized flips. I wouldn't have asked the mod to redo it if it was clear.

[Titus]

Ok, really tempted to sub out since the mod won't make the first post coherent. Yet, this game has had like 10 replacements. Can someone do that for me so I can make a proper vca.

[Titus]

Oh and Grey VCA is kinda my thing. I would not self hammer unless inevitable, but most scum hammer if a buddy is already on the wagon. You and Not Mafia/Alisae are in the bussing zone. Is it possible you are right? Yes. Likely no. You need to justify your position with more than you say so. I think you just want to be out of the lynch pool. If I am believed, town wins.

[Titus]

If I am believed, town wins.

If you are wrong, you are giving scum a line of mislynches into victory.

Scaremongering.

[Titus]

Rather than address my VCA or telling me why the standard assumption is wrong, you still just use discredits and fear mongering.

[Titus]

Throw out all the buzzwords you want, it won't change the fact that we simply have different theories about where the last scum is.

No. You refuse to support your theory. That's not a buzzword at all.

[Titus]

Yup, it's Grey.

Grey's not voting when town are wagons. Countering scum wagons when they form. Insists on falsehoods on bussing. More focused on defending himself.

Gun to my head backup is Not Mafia, but Grey is the scum.

[Titus]

If you lynch me now, whatever. I told you the answer through this despite the unclear as shit modding and oppturinistic dumb town. Not my problem.

[Titus]

RC can you stop spamming Annie and your own ego to realize that it's Grey. We got two lynches before lylo and Grey is just going to peddle his scum ass to victory.

[Titus]

Like I would take being lynched today if it guaranteed his lynch. I am that confident it is him.

[Titus]

RC can you stop spamming Annie and your own ego to realize that it's Grey. We got two lynches before lylo and Grey is just going to peddle his scum ass to victory.

I'm not Scum.

You're not Scum.

Narna is probscum.

Come to the Narna side.

No. My VCA clears Narna.

[Titus]

RC can you stop spamming Annie and your own ego to realize that it's Grey. We got two lynches before lylo and Grey is just going to peddle his scum ass to victory.

I'm not Scum.

You're not Scum.

Narna is probscum.

Come to the Narna side.

No. My VCA clears Narna.

That's alright.

It's flawed.

Nobody is perfect.

It's not. My pool is absolute. You or NM.

[Titus]

The universe implodes. Time resets. We lynch you. You flip red.

[Titus]

When Narna has produced some content I will fully reread this game and see if anything has changed for me.

I'm slightly townreading Titus's recent content.

Why? I just said the same thing I said before?

[Titus]

I haven't seen her post, how the hell am I supposed to read her?

VCA and reads need to be taken into account.

Well yeah, but assuming you believe your VCA is useful, I'd expect you to have Narna low on your list of suspects, not expecting them to be a viable lynch candidate.

Why are you pushing someone if you believe your vote history doesn't indicate they are scum?

[Titus]

1) Scum end the day to deny information.
2) Scum self hammered, meaning he knew he was a goner.
3) Him knowing he was a goner explains the lack of a scum counterwagon.
4) Scum knowing they are going down means either
a) Scum bussing OR
b) scum are ineffective.

Given the list of players, b is very remote.

On the list of possibles, we have Not Mafia, Grey and myself. I know I am town. Grey has systemically been in the bussing zone and wants to lynch in a pool that ensures he's never lynched if his theory is bought. Grey just overall has the worst vote history of the two. His response as been to cry misrep and to fling mud than explain why he thinks scum weren't bussing.

[Titus]

Let's play a hypothetical game. You can lynch whoever you want today but if you lynch wrong you get lynched tomorrow. Are you ready to make that lynch and who do you do lynch?

Grey.

[Titus]

Are you _ready_ for that lynch though. Do you make the lynch now or do you take some time to think about it.

Neither. If I had to, I'd pick Grey but my absolute pool is Grey or Not Mafia. Given Grey's attitude and Not Mafia hiding, I cannot be absolutely sure bet my life levels. If I had to, I would though.

[Titus]

Vla until Monday

[Titus]

Still me being flawed is not a justification for your position that Hans was not bussed.

Bussing on day one being extremely suboptimal is plenty of justification.

There was scum on his wagon, alright. The hammer vote.

That's again, just saying what you'd do. A scum flipping D1 means scum are extremely ineffective or bussing.

Given the PR deaths, we can eliminate ineffective. So scum bussed.

Scum also do not hammer themselves if the wagon is all town.

So tell us, Titus, how effective scum are when there has only been one mislynch thus far.

Tell us why scum that are so bad as to be caught d1 would play optimally in regards to when they should or should not self-hammer.

Tell us why you accuse me of projecting, then proceed to project all over the place to justify your theory.

They aren't trying to save themselves. That's the point.

If it's ineffective scum, we'd be expecting counterwagons. This is resigned deep scum. There's no effort to counterwagon.

[Titus]

See, those are leading questions in a way that puts Titus down. That's not going to help you negotiate with her.

I'm not negotiating with Grey. Either, he can try to convince me I should vote Not Mafia, or I'll keep voting him.

[Titus]

See, those are leading questions in a way that puts Titus down. That's not going to help you negotiate with her.

I'm not negotiating with Grey. Either, he can try to convince me I should vote Not Mafia, or I'll keep voting him.

The grammar in this makes it hard to follow?

If you think Grey is obvious town, vote NM.
lol, both of you missing and obvious town slot its really funny

[Titus]

Just go ahead and lynch me now.

I'd rather be the mislynch now than be left alive and mislynched in MyLo.

I don't have reads I'm particularly invested in anyway, so there's no loss. We can afford the mislynch.

What the fork is this?

If you don't have reads you're invested in, why not try to convince me Not Mafia is scum?

[Titus]

Pretty sure she's town?

Just because she's wrong about my alignment doesn't make her scum.

PEdit: Sure it is. The sticker her reads, the more town she is. Scum!Titus evolves her reads to the narrative of the thread.

Actually, evolution is more consistent with early game Titus. If I am at the top of my game on D1, my townreads, not my scumreads are sticky.

[Titus]

Grey doesn't play lynch me card as scum.

Joey is not mafia.

VOTE: Joey

[Titus]

Vla until tomorrow

[Titus]

maybe she is referring to the player?

Yes. Joey is NM slot.

[Titus]

Sorry, I did not get a day start message.

Narna, myself, Grey, and RC are the four left correct?

[Titus]

RC can you pick another finished game Transcend was scum in?

[Titus]

That game doesn't have what I'm looking for. Trans's buddy appears to be dead when he subbed in.

[Titus]

Give me a bit of time RC. I know what I'm looking for. I'm checking all my data. I am not inclined to think you're scum, but I don't know. I'm iffy and hesitant. I want to just lock in on Grey, but Transcend's ISO doesn't suggest Grey as the partner. Yet, the vote patterns do. So I'm just taking things slowly one day at a time.

When I feel the game state is set, I'll likely vote NL to force scum to make the move. I'm not ready for that yet though.

[Titus]

I'm here too, Titus.

Say words at me.

Words at me.

[Titus]

Since we want to look at Transcend's play...

Let's pause for a second-

Hans self hammered. Do you think he's gonna self hammer with 6 town on his lynch?

I think it's possible, but he cut discussion really short so this leads me to think there was at least one busser and he self hammered quickly to give them town cred.

Titus, does this sound familiar?

Oh wait, just thought of something else too.

Wifom.

I want to meta compare for relational tells.

[Titus]

Well, I have homework to do for lylo.

[Titus]

None of this semantic talk is helpful.

[Titus]

I explicitly don't intend on allowing a NL.

That's a problem as NL is strategically besy for town. I have no intent on voting.

[Titus]

Yup, one of us can get lynched if we NL. Yet, no one is confirmed town. The action scum takes here tells us about the gamestate.

I trust you too.

If one of the townies thinks you're scum, they aren't going to join a wagon you're on anyway and just vote you in lylo.

I don't see an advantage here, which is why I'm playing close to the chest.

[Titus]

The advantage I see is that we're both alive to persuade people to make smart decisions. I'm not 100% confident that you will avoid getting mislynched tomorrow nor that I will.

I think if both of us move as a block we can force the game.

then pick one and see what happens. I am not voting today.

[Titus]

Titus, talk to me about things. I'm having difficulties here

You're having difficulties because either a) you're playing suboptimally as town or b) you're scum not wanting to give opinions and mislynch.

Scum must make a move. I have two slots I am willing to vote.

[Titus]

Perfectly viable to write someone of as town based on something that was done before they even joined the game and with no regard for their own original content.

Sure champ. Okay.

I think you're confbiased or tunneled.

That is actually ok.

[Titus]

I am kind of curious about her lack of presence.

It doesn't seem very Titusy, but r/l might account for that? Idk.

I don't do stupid. NL should have been hammerred already.

[Titus]

Lol NL should have been hammerred already. I WONDER WHO IS GETTING NIGHTKILLED

5 bucks says you are deciding between Grey and Vecna.

The answer is in how Transcend treats his buddies. Funny how you whine about me actually not engaging you where I told you precisely where to look.

[Titus]

Also, do you care to explain to the class how

you

180ed and I became obvious scum to you?

That's not what I said.

Read my post again, and if you insist on this, I will not trust you to get this lylo correct as you have let your zeal block basic English comprehension.

[Titus]

The skill needed here is comparing Transcend's meta to how he usually treats his partners. That's the failsafe on my VCA.

If you cannot do that, then I cannot trust you to handle this lylo.
If I cannot trust you with the understanding and parsing of basic English sentences, I cannot trust you to accurately define the meta in Transcend's that is important and apply it correctly.

[Titus]

Lol NL should have been hammerred already. I WONDER WHO IS GETTING NIGHTKILLED

5 bucks says you are deciding between Grey and Vecna.

The answer is in how Transcend treats his buddies. Funny how you whine about me actually not engaging you where I told you precisely where to look.

Aside from Vecna meaning Narna (as Vecna is not a player in this game), the meaning of this is pretty clear. If you're choosing between two players, I'm the corpse.

[Titus]

Your play changed the moment I said if you have a confirmed town read, the play is to no lynch.

You know that is the right play, so why did that make me cease to be obvious town in your eyes RC? My money is probably on pride. You and I both have that as our sin of choice.

[Titus]

Your play changed the moment I said if you have a confirmed town read, the play is to no lynch.

How does that make sense, though?

If he's town, and he's certain he has one other townread pegged, the likely result of a No Lynch is that either he or his townread dies, from his perspective.

His reasoning, I can understand. Yours, I can't.

Yes. That play tells you who is the better play to lynch. The urge to lynch here, when you know that you cannot get a lynch off without scum help makes no sense to me.

The desire to lynch when scum have to kill someone and give information is the one that makes no sense to me.

[Titus]

Scum are claiming right now, but I'm not exactly in a rush to push them yet, in the off chance that I'm wrong in their play and their interpretation. There's no point. Scum can always murder the strongest scumread if they don't know who town is going for today.

[Titus]

If RC stays pissed at me, then no matter what happens, we go to night with a no lynch that's a victory to me.

If scum kill RC, then a vote for town in lylo is eliminated.
If scum kill either you or Narna, a scumread is cleared and I know the answer.

There's no reason for me to push a lynch here at all.

[Titus]

Then there's the logical, I'm dead RC has to re-evaluate and I have told RC exactly what to do to find the scum.

[Titus]

If RC stays pissed at me, then no matter what happens, we go to night with a no lynch that's a victory to me.

How is it a victory to you if you die and he goes on to mislynch in LyLo if town?

Have you considered that possibility?

You obviously don't trust him to vote correctly, so what makes you think scum would be lynched tomorrow if you were killed tonight?

If RC's second choice, even supposing I'm town and he follows my roadmap still leads him to scum, we never would win lynching today anyway because he superhard townreads scum and no amount of energy I spend would persuade him of the correct answer. It tells townRC that my plan on where to find scum was more accurate and my strategy so far was the correct play to go down, and the last 3 days are just all wasted time.

Why are you not considering the possibility of scum RC not liking his odds in a 3p lylo with me alive in it?

[Titus]

Like you can't cry ego when I am trying to get everyone on the same page and you are (if town) relying on the fact that I am the obvious nightkill to get your way in lylo.

Except you are not the obvious night kill.

Getting everyone on the same page is detrimental. Telling me what I should do if you are the nightkill is helpful. Answering my exact read tells scum who to shoot.

[Titus]

I can also cry whatever I want.

[Titus]

UNVOTE:

Titus if you got something to say then say it now.

Look at Transcend's meta at how he treats his buddies if he dies.

[Titus]

We're not no lynching at this point, so please give out specifics Titus.

You got a reason and a case why I should act anti-town at this point. I don't even trust you, so it'd better be a doozy.

[Titus]

Narna just didn't quickhammer you. They are conftown fypov.

No. You both were not voting me I don't believe unless I missed something huge.

[Titus]

Welp, we can eliminate that theory. Looks like I borrowed the dunce cap for a bit.

Thank goodness y'all removed it. I was considerin votin Narna in lylo because of my stubborn pride.

[Titus]

Ok, RC, why are you still acting Anti-town?

[Titus]

Narna is confirmed town. Narna dies we are no nearer to the solution to the game. It is no longer anti-town even by that super strict argument that you are using to lynch today.

THere are 3 potential lynches. Myself, Titus, and Grey. If you think that I should be lynched today, you should explain that. If you think that Grey should be lynched, you should explain that.

And you know what? We learn something if scum kills Narna. We should be structuring this according to what Narna needs to solve the game. You've been here trying to force a play based off suboptimal information all the time long. This game isn't about you. So go ahead and be pissed at me, but Narna leads this group. Narna determines the direction, not you.

[Titus]

I'm talking to Narna because I can trust Narna. So if you two would please be fucking quiet. One of you two is rushing me into a dumb decision and you both know how I HATE that.

[Titus]

My VCA says it's Grey and I believe that's the case but RC is really pissing me off with the threat of being angry outside of the game.

[Titus]

I don't think that it's unreasonable for me to be unhappy here given that I've been attempting to reach out to you since we both replaced in and you've given me nothing for it.

And instead of actually doing what I said to do, you attacked me. You didn't reach out. You wanted me to do what you believed is smart.

Instead of forcing Grey to make a move if you're town, you basically just tipped your hand to scum and just pissed me off for it.

There was no conftown here at the start, so what the fuck are you doing other than being pissed at me for not doing what you wanted? Like really here RC?

[Titus]

I'm sorry I didn't realize that I'm such a horrible selfish person for trying to work with you.

Except that's what you thought you were doing at best. I never said you were a horrible person and if you don't get off this AtE kick, I'll just suppose Grey had a derp game and vote you right now. I need you to chill out and let me talk to Narna.

[Titus]

Hey, I accept that I fucked up, OK?

Apathy is a bitch. I was on autopilot for pretty much the entire game. RC slapped me upside the head and told me to step the fuck up, so I did. Because I did the same to him before too.

So today, I tried so town would at least have a fighting chance despite my slot being groomed for slaughter.

Interesting. So you understand why I scumread you? RC didn't. Why? If your slot was being "groomed for the slaughter" then why weren't you the one wagoned?

[Titus]

All I understand is that you just keep vomiting VCA over and over as your only reason I can be Scum.

VCA is the ideal. Unless it's fucked with, it tells the story. I live and die by the VCA as town in most situations. THe only reason I am not is because RC is in the game. My question is whether you are townbeard or scum.

[Titus]

There was no outside communication mod, wtf. RC and Narna should feel really salty about that modkill. Because the mid did not reset the votes, I would be an idiot not to

VOTE: RC

as Grey did not hammer when RC was voting me, Grey must be conftown from my perspective.

My apologies to RC if this is incorrect, but you got hosed by modding.

[Titus]

Were you scum Grey?

[Titus]

I had it right.

RC, sorry we got mod hosed. This is why you NL.

If you did, grey kills me. You lynch him.

[Titus]

Okay, I understand now.

Hidden messages and cryptography is designed for messages some players can see but others cannot.

For instance, if I developed a language with RC and used that to communicate.