Star Wars Rogue One [GAME OVER]

[MagnaofIllusion]

So looking at Pine links and actions …

So Pine gets an sizeable page 1 wagon – 2/3rds of the votes needed for lynch. Do we think this is 100% Town BTW?

Vote Count 1.01

Pine [6] The Thinker, Aj the Epic, Infinity 324, Desperado, Heartless, PrettyPrincess

I have my doubts. Given the general lack of conversation about it (other than from Infinity, who was Town) there is an awful lack of attention to it in the moment. But Pine’s relative coolness under fire feels to me like they were not really worried about catching three more “for yuks” votes. So at worst we are probably looking at only 1 scum on the wagon at this stage.

I would like to call people’s attentions to the Pine versus Heartless balance discussion starting at 114 and using that as a mirror to the recent Nero versus Heartless “AJ is likely scum” discussion. The echoes there are pretty palpable.

Also Nero’s entrance looks forced as heck. Specifically 180 where he posits that Pine is the one most likely to be White-Knighting Titus early but manages to land right on the Sir Cakez counter-wagon – 181.

And by page 12ish the wagons have swung to the following –

Vote Count 1.05

Pine [2] The Thinker, Aj the Epic
SirCakez [6] Aeronaut, alban, Nero Cain, BBMolla, Lil Uzi Vert, Infinity 324

Again – knowing that Cakez was Town does anyone think this wagon was 100% Town? I don’t think that’s likely given this is what developed as an eventual counter-wagon to Pine.

Reminder – 364 may be relevant dependening on who gets Rogue Leader Day 1.

Mastin’s entrance at 512 may be very relevant depending on whether anything develops the rest of the day based on her “first instinct is Pine scum”. A vote for Pine shows up shortly afterwards (after a quick hop on the SirCakez wagon) but at this point Pine was in no danger.

And then we get Nero potentially chain-sawing for Pine at 543.

I don’t see 606 re: Mastin as partner posting personally. Same with 628 it doesn’t serve mastin and Pine partners for Pine to pre-emptively undermine Mastin’s ability to smoothly transition to a Town read on Pine.

I’ll note in my re-read that I am halfway through Day 1 and Aero (aka Ziefiend aka scum) still has not returned to the thread. He finally shows up to provide content on page 34. What I see is a bunch of comments regarding posts saying this is suspect and that is suspect with little drawn from it. Aka filler posting. Same with page 44 posting. It looks good but there is not drive in those posts to actually solve the game.

And look … Day 1 Nero was selling the same crap “Player X doesn’t want to bus” garbage (759) as he is now … only this time it is Mastin not wanting to bus Town SirCakez.

On page 36 Heartless seems to have twigged to Pine’s scumminess. Does a vote move follow?

Heartless’s vote for Pine at 1038 is solid Town given the state of the wagons on Page 42.

Aero’s 1118 twigged me for the comment “Pine’s post here is definitely sort of off” as it goes to the heart of what I have been saying about this slot. He’s willing to express some mild suspicion but not willing to vote what is a Top wagon (with AJ the other at this point). And the undermining of Klingon for the Pine vote at 1122 is bad.

And by Page 46 Pine is back to the dominant wagon. Note Nero’s 1142 and 1144. And also we get a discrediting run at mastin at 1147 for his vote on Pine. And more Nero attacking mastin for voting Pine at 1310.

I am a bit bothered that both AJ and BB has had so little impact in almost 50 pages that neither has shown up in my re-read notes …

And by 1474 a lurker lynch has derailed the potential lynch on Pine scum.

The Thinker [LYNCH] TheWayItEnds, Heartless, Infinity 324, AJ the Epic, Pine-A-Tonics, Desperado, SirCakez, Drunken Piper, Klingoncelt

No way a wagon on scum Pine got to 6 votes late in the day and Pine is the only scum vote on this wagon.

So coming out of Day 1 – I can’t see how anyone is selling me on “Pine interactions” being damning to anyone but Nero. He pretty much spent the day browbeating votes on Pine and his long term read on mastin developed today for mastin scum reading Pine and wanting him voted.

Does not compute.

Aero still looks like scum active lurking. Unimpressed by AJ and BB's posting but neither was actively looking to fight the Pine wagon like Nero.

Day 2 read through probably comes tomorrow. However I’m not expecting a guilty will be as informative as today.

[Nero Cain]

The answer is of course that the use was 100% Pro-Town. Heartless isn’t getting lynched and thus I haven’t made Town’s job harder by making someone I can’t know their aligment of certain harder to lynch in off chance I’m wrong on my reads. I doubt I’m wrong given Zefiend’s recent posting.

..........................................................

Myself, Zfiend and Molla had all expressed the desire to lynch Mastina. You were town reading Mastina. So instead of making her lynch harder you give it to a non lynch canidate. That makes no sense coming from town. I mean its not like I'm going to convince you that you are scum but I mean yeah....TWIE and Molla can see how much bull this is.

[Aj The Epic]

You're really high on Zefiend.

[Nero Cain]

What is your read on Heartless?

[Aj The Epic]

....This is obvious, isn't it?

Hard town. I'm valuing their life over mine at the moment.

[MagnaofIllusion]

So Day 2 …

So BBMolla claims Vanillaized … I don’t think scum wasted a shot of that limited ability created a clear for a partner. So unless I come across reason to doubt it happened I don’t see him as scum and think that reflects pretty poorly on Mastin still pushing his lynch even today.

Oh .. look Nero is once again pushing mastin as scum at 1492 … for his trying to lynch Pine. Why are people Town reading him again?

Ok. So heartless, desp, me, and nacho were in the rogue crew last night, and then pine joined the crew in the middle.

At what point did AJ start auto-protecting Heartless? Because this is pretty damn strong evidence that the N1 Rogue crew is all Town.

And again – mastin’s vote on Pine at 1520 is pretty Town since this is before the Guilty and a quick wagon had formed on KlingonTown.

And Pine’s Nightkill WIFOM discussion at 1644 does not reflect partner posting with mastin.

mastin’s push pre-Guilty on Pine reads very Town. Look at page 67.

And that’s that for Day 2.

@Heartless

– How in the hell are you floating Mastin interactions re: Pine at me with Nero’s completely scummy Day 1-2 interactions and Aero’s complete active lurking / lack of any read on Pine?

[Aj The Epic]

I didn't think to use my ability defensively until recently, mostly because I wasn't sure what other PRs were in play.

[MagnaofIllusion]

I didn't think to use my ability defensively until recently, mostly because I wasn't sure what other PRs were in play.

Ok, thanks ...

[Nero Cain]

@MOI-What was Mastina's d1 case on Pine?

[MagnaofIllusion]

@Nero - why did you do everything in your power to defend Pine and attack those wanting to lynch him Day 1 and Day 2?

[Nero Cain]

No way a wagon on scum Pine got to 6 votes late in the day and Pine is the only scum vote on this wagon.

I AGREE!

TheWayItEnds, Heartless, AJ the Epic are the only non flipped on the Thinker wagon so who is scum?

[Nero Cain]

@Nero - why did you do everything in your power to defend Pine and attack those wanting to lynch him Day 1 and Day 2?

answer my question first.

[MagnaofIllusion]

@Nero - why did you do everything in your power to defend Pine and attack those wanting to lynch him Day 1 and Day 2?

answer my question first.

Nope. Done jumping through your hoops Mr. Scumbag. I've laid out pretty clearly why you and Zefiend need rope.

@Everyone not Nero or Zefiend

- any comments about Day 1 and Day 2 review?

[MagnaofIllusion]

Think I will fire up the MoIputer in the morning after reading Day 1 and Day 2 as a sanity check for my Town reads ...

[Nero Cain]

Nope. Done jumping through your hoops Mr. Scumbag. I've laid out pretty clearly why you and Zefiend need rope.

translation. I realize that Mastina never laid out a case on Pine and its completely logical thought process for Nero to think Pine was a bus. But if I say that then it undermines my fake push on you and Zfiend and opens me up to questions about why I think there's no case on Pine but that its not a bus.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Nope. Done jumping through your hoops Mr. Scumbag. I've laid out pretty clearly why you and Zefiend need rope.

translation. I realize that Mastina never laid out a case on Pine and its completely logical thought process for Nero to think Pine was a bus. But if I say that then it undermines my fake push on you and Zfiend and opens me up to questions about why I think there's no case on Pine but that its not a bus.

Scum posting trying desperately to divert away from the fact that his Day 1 and Day 2 play regarding Pine was scum partner play.

[Nero Cain]

@Nero - why did you do everything in your power to defend Pine and attack those wanting to lynch him Day 1 and Day 2?

This is also sorta kinda false. Like I was defiantly

NOT

pushing Kling and my AJ push

NOW

can't be used as a "Nero was pushing against everyone that was pushing Pine"

[Aj The Epic]

Well you've been roughly adamant that it was a double town wagon between cakez and Zefiend, which i'm fairly certain isn't true.

[ɀefiend]

Well you've been roughly adamant that it was a double town wagon between cakez and Zefiend, which i'm fairly certain isn't true.

Says the guy who had equal nonchalance in wagoning both of us...

[Aj The Epic]

Yes because my belief is one of you is scum and a 1 for 1 is a fine trade.

[Nero Cain]

Yes because my belief is one of you is scum and a 1 for 1 is a fine trade.

Its not a 1 for 1 when you aren't playing with your own life.

[Aj The Epic]

hooo boy look at you trying to shade some shit in here and hope that Zefiend doesn't find the rope.

Explain to me how town misses so badly to have counterwagons going town and town day 3 after knocking out scum. Scum has less influence to know a wagon away, so you're acting like the town just picked two people both equally scummy and missed on both.

[Nero Cain]

but lets talk more about 1v1s. You claimed b/c you don't think that your and Mollas role can't exist together. Why did you never go after him?

[Nero Cain]

multiple town wagons happen all the time. Why does Cakes-Zfiend

have

to be TvS and who were the scum that got got Cakez pushed over Zfiend?

[Nero Cain]

And your "case" on Z?

He's flailing! His reads are not static!

(you actually used the word inconsistent, which I'd argue is even more likely to come from town than scum since town are uninformed and scumhunting requires constant change)

and the reason that you guys are pushing Z over me? Heartless scumreads Z and town reads me. Molla likely town reads me. You guys

might

be able to get Molla and TWIE on the Z train. Z is the scums mislynch du jour.

If MOI was town I'd have expected a much more reasonable approach to a Mylo instead of just going with the flow and wanting to lynch Z right off the bat.