Mini Normal 1839 - Dead/Spectator PT

[Thor665]

Never ever bus in role madness. Too many 'lol wut' PR reveals can ruin any plan.
Mountainous? Yeah, okay. But Role Madness? Never in a million.

[Thor665]

Aaaaaand we're back to Iron throwing a temper tantrum.

[Foxbird]

UGHHHHHHHHHHHHH

[aronagrundy]

lol if they lynch Karnos

[Thor665]

lol if they lynch Karnos

I'll agree that it seems like a weak case theory.

[inspectorscout]

It's sad how 1 toxic person can destroy the fun of a game.
I'm not happy with this, especially not because foxbird did her best to make it as enjoyable as possible. This is not only disrespectful to the other players, but also to the mod. And I hope future Iron will read this.

(I'm less forgiving as a mod in these scenarios, just saying. You're lucky with this mod.)

[aronagrundy]

That said, if iron is scum he's doing a great job lol

So nero is scum I guess? There has to be at least one scum on that wagon.

[Thor665]

Lot of Penguin pressure right now.
I think he's choosing the wrong tack for his defense - he's buying in too much to the theory 'scum killed Aron because a scum was neighborized' concept.

Scum could have a Rolecop.
Scum could have killed Aron for some other reason entirely.

Bad defense tack - the case is weak.

[GreyICE]

Can they lynch Saru one of these years?

[GreyICE]

Honestly the level of play on MS is so low that by day 4 you should flat out lynch anyone who appears competent and hasn't been shot.

[aronagrundy]

Lot of Penguin pressure right now.
I think he's choosing the wrong tack for his defense - he's buying in too much to the theory 'scum killed Aron because a scum was neighborized' concept.

Scum could have a Rolecop.
Scum could have killed Aron for some other reason entirely.

Bad defense tack - the case is weak.

If scum was going to kill me because they were neighborized, then the only option could be pp

[aronagrundy]

Also, the neighborhood thread is basically karnos and pp telling each other that they're going to tunnel each other for the rest of the game, which is at least entertaining

[GreyICE]

Well yeah. They're fucking morons, so what do you expect?

Honestly mafia has become intolerable, and it's because the current crop of VIs is incapable of talking to each other like normal human beings. I don't know if it's the current generation or what, but people don't talk, they just aggressively declaim bullshit and assume anyone who disagrees with them is personally assaulting their universe. This has become a website for pampered children.

[GreyICE]

Like Nero Cain and Lowell are starting to look like decent players. These were people that would cause audible groans when they signed up for games. Fire Assassin is downright a genius by the standards of a 2016 join date. I mean he's not bad overall, but I'd guess he's an alt just because he doesn't suck like a black hole on steroids.

[aronagrundy]

That actually an interesting point. I had an account on this site ~5 years ago that I abandoned and despite not being good at all usually was read as town (as far as i can remember. it's been a while lol). But then I come back and i get scumread immediately in both of the games i play in. Which doesn't totally match what you said, but it's interesting to see how town meta has changed I guess

(also fun fact: one of the games I played was with lowell, which I remember because 1) I checked recently to check if the single large normal i played in forever ago was still there and there he was and 2) his avatar hasn't changed. I think we mislynched him)

[Fire Assassin]

Like Nero Cain and Lowell are starting to look like decent players. These were people that would cause audible groans when they signed up for games. Fire Assassin is downright a genius by the standards of a 2016 join date. I mean he's not bad overall, but I'd guess he's an alt just because he doesn't suck like a black hole on steroids.

Dude you need to stop this kind of stuff.

[GreyICE]

Dude they need to play better.

[Thor665]

Honestly the level of play on MS is so low that by day 4 you should flat out lynch anyone who appears competent and hasn't been shot.

Conversely, I'm actually becoming a strong advocate of hardcore lurker lynching - I'vehad multiple games with multiple scum taking advantage of general town lackadaisical malaise of late.

If scum was going to kill me because they were neighborized, then the only option could be pp

Agreed.
But is the only option for your death that scum was neighborized? (hint: it isn't - and that's the logical fallacy of both the attack and the defense).

Like Nero Cain and Lowell are starting to look like decent players. These were people that would cause audible groans when they signed up for games. Fire Assassin is downright a genius by the standards of a 2016 join date. I mean he's not bad overall, but I'd guess he's an alt just because he doesn't suck like a black hole on steroids.

I think both Nero and to a lesser extent Lowell (when he's not hard lurking) have become better due to time rather than a lowering of expectations.
To a certain extent, players who love the game, participate, and play multiple times, are going to get better regardless of their generalized playstyle unless they somehow care enough to keep playing yet refuse to learn.

I do think the aggression and lack of cooperation thing is a new site meta trend, that I agree I find strange.
I still kind of want to make an alt who will just be unfailingly cooperative and polite just to see how it would be treated.

[Thor665]

I hate building cases, it's tedious and I feel like I'm doing the work that other people should be doing,

...bwuh?

[Thor665]

I'll also say, he could have summed up his cases in like two sentences.
The Saru one is "called Thor scum, then voted a guy voting Thor - lack of logic in reads = scum" that's the case.

I actually kind of agree with him about wall cases being silly, but it's mostly because I think any case that can't be described in 1-3 sentences is probably just paranoia or made up scum gak.

[Foxbird]

Honestly, the fact that every game ends up with people being super toxic at some point is one of the main reasons I decided I don't really wanna play anymore. Playing gives me such bad anxiety that I sometimes can't sleep
So I'll just have to stick to hydraing and modding (and trying to cull toxicity in my modded games as much as I can).

[GreyICE]

You know honestly back when we could scream at each other and call each other shitheads and imbiciles without little children running for the moderator... it was surprisingly less toxic. People would blow up at each other and then sort it out because hey, we have got to lynch scum. This new kid-friendly mafiascum feels less friendly to me.

[Thor665]

I feel you on that Grey, but I disagree.
I find *more* offensive players nowadays then back them.
Not as in being offensive to a higher level (seriously, who can compete with some of the classics) but as in more people are doing it.
I think back in the day we had a few rage-derps, but overall people were less rude, and also (and this one is important) most of the rage-derps still played the game pretty well.

Nowadays it feels like you have players calling you a Smurf-sucking Smurf-face when you point out they're lurking and not playing the game. Or they blow up when you disagree with their Day 1 reads and they spend the rest of the game spewing filth rather than scumhunting.

I am highly unamused by it.
Maybe my skin got thinner...?
But I don't think so - I think it's rudeness paired with not seeming to care about the game.

[Fire Assassin]

You know honestly back when we could scream at each other and call each other shitheads and imbiciles without little children running for the moderator... it was surprisingly less toxic. People would blow up at each other and then sort it out because hey, we have got to lynch scum. This new kid-friendly mafiascum feels less friendly to me.

Calling someone a shithead and imbicile is kind of different than the toxicity that people get banned for.
Its kind of dumbing down the problem of "intent to personally insult a player".

And very few can see the difference when you do it because they don't know you well enough to get the difference.

[Thor665]

Oooooh, looks like Thor's history of reading what wagons are possible (incidentally one of the most useful skills to have as scum in my opinion) might be validated again with the Penguin lynch happening.

Math as IC was a bollocks of a whang for scum though, assuredly.

Still a lot of heat on Karnos and Nero though.
Really surprised by Karnos hate...well, not exactly, there's a reason I targeted him for a lynch Day 1, just surprised it's still there after I spent all of a day voting him.
Bit funny that Saru says I was on him 24/7 though - I did kind of spend an entire day phase hugging that Bji wagon last I checked.