Mini 699: Insane Asylum Mafia: Game Over

[Korlash]

a) I have no evidence against it and some, even if it isn't full proof, evidence to suggest it. It would be rash for me to think otherwise.

b) It makes as much sense as me being paranoid and Corv being Naive. But as neither of us has any reason to believe any of these to even suggest it is just reaching on your part to justify your thoughts.

c) I worked at the asylum and so have spent my days amoung crazy people. This calls my sanity into question. And I think it would have been easy to just give me a list of every investigation I would get on any player at the start, but the mod telling me stuff right off the bat just makes the game boring.

Coug's explanation was the exact thing I thought he would say. I have said before when you make cases you make them one-sided. They are unclear and hard to follow. Your 1188 is no different.

Yes, Coug did lie. Obviously your case was not "clearified" and he did not "understand the case." But this only proves laziness, inability to read well, in the most non-insulting way I can manage: stupidity on his part. What it does not prove is that he is scum.

You want proof? Here it is. when Coug posted 1189, I didn't catch it. Neither did SG. We both had to read it a couple of times to see what had happened. we made the mistake, it's just as possible Coug did as well. And as your post had quotes th no names and the sentence: "Coug, can you at least expect to post my case on Farside before posting you dont like my case?" it is perfectly understandable that someone would assume that case was about farside.

Now... can we get back to Crazy and his lynching?

[Korlash]

Did you read 1296?

... I just have to say this... pop... you are annoying as hell. All the "did you read?", "have you read?" and the like is just freaking annoying man. What do you expect us to say: "No... I'm posting in a game I refuse to read! dur...."

serously... it really grinds my gears...

[StrangerCoug]

Yes, I read #1296, but the only relevance I see that post having to what I'm currently attacking you for is the sanity issues. As I said, for Mirth and I to both be scum, Corvuus has to be either scum himself or naïve. Korlash doesn't have a guilty on Mirth and me, so that's obviously not why I'm questioning your scum grouping. A 50/50 cop is plausible, but I see no evidence supporting one.

Something I thought about after making it: For there to be two godfathers, there also has to be two scum groups. Mathematically possible at this point, but not supported by what's out there.

I admit that I was rather focused on what was your farside22 vote. Yes, that's in #1163 rather than #1188 where you talk about Mirth. I am fully aware that you mentioned Mirth in every paragraph in #1188. However, I misinterpreted the attacker as farside22 instead of you. If you are not happy with my explanation here, I'm sorry, but everything else has been said already.

[populartajo]

Did you read 1296?

... I just have to say this... pop... you are annoying as hell. All the "did you read?", "have you read?" and the like is just freaking annoying man. What do you expect us to say: "No... I'm posting in a game I refuse to read! dur...."

serously... it really grinds my gears...

Well, it also annoys me when I post something like this:

2 GFs is ridiculous and a mess in a cop investigations. That or Im reading one of them wrong.

And then some guy that you defended for being stupid for not reading well and lying, (why would town lie?) inmediately posts this:

I understand some of your case on me, but your denying that you are pushing a two-godfather theory when you have the scum trio pinned as Mirth, farside22, and me is logical fail.

Ill answer your big post tomorrow. I need to reread again this insanity. RL tomorrow, BTW.

[populartajo]

Coug, so you are admitting that you thought farside was the one I was quoting attacking Mirth?

[StrangerCoug]

Yes.

[Korlash]

Something I thought about after making it: For there to be two godfathers, there also has to be two scum groups. Mathematically possible at this point, but not supported by what's out there.

This also contradicts FP flavor... It mentiones one person gathering two friends to play the game. While it is true Mod flavor can never be absolute it does strongly suggest on scum group of three members.

Korlash doesn't have a guilty on Mirth and me, so that's obviously not why I'm questioning your scum grouping.

I have a guilty on Mirth...

And then some guy that you defended for being stupid for not reading well and lying, (why would town lie?) inmediately posts this:

Mystery mafia 2. I, a town masonizer, lied by saying I was vanilla. Town won.

That aside, in this case it is less a lie and more a mistake. Town makes mistakes all the time.

[StrangerCoug]

I have a guilty on Mirth...

Oops. So that

COMPLETELY

blows up the two-godfather theory. Who did Corvuus investigate other than me, then?

[Korlash]

Llama. I'm waiting for him to answer as to what result he actually recieved. I don't remember him ever saying he got one.

[StrangerCoug]

Thanks for making me feel like a complete idiot now >< I remember that now.

[populartajo]

Wait, why arent we no lynching?

[StrangerCoug]

Wait, why aren't we no lynching?

Shoot me if I know, but your suggesting that both Mirth and I are scum together is already credibly bankrupt and a no-lynch, if we're still playing the day after, will blow it to bits if Korlash and I haven't done it already.

[populartajo]

Wait, why aren't we no lynching?

Shoot me if I know, but your suggesting that both Mirth and I are scum together is already credibly bankrupt and a no-lynch, if we're still playing the day after, will blow it to bits if Korlash and I haven't done it already.

I dont understand this. Could you rephrase it?
Im not done with you, Coug, Btw. Im tired and going to bed right now.

[Korlash]

Shoot me if I know, but your suggesting that both Mirth and I are scum together is already credibly bankrupt and a no-lynch, if we're still playing the day after, will blow it to bits if Korlash and I haven't done it already.

What the hell did I do? O.o

Wait, why arent we no lynching?

No lynching is still an option and not a bad one. However, i don't usually jump on no lynches until every other option is gone.

[Mirth]

Unofficial Votecount, since I'm sick of waiting for one (the last one was Jan 5, 7 pages ago.) Someone please check it.

farside22 (0)
Crazy (2) sc, kor
StrangerCoug (2) farside, tajo
ShadowGirl (0)
Korlash (0)
Mirth (0)
Corvuus (0)
Populartajo (0)


Not Voting (4): Crazy, ShadowGirl, Mirth, Corvuus,

[Corvuus]

wow this is going fast.

First of all, I got innocent on llama and innocent on SC. I said that before (when I said I 'may' be naive as opposed to 50-50 or insane) because I got innocents in all my investigations.

Second of all, I will by NO MEANS agree to vote no lynch.

Scum has NO reason to kill a townie and make it easier for us, they will just target one of the '1 NK resistant' cops and we will be exactly where we are at tomorrow as we are today, and potentially worse if Crazy is scum-thief and a cop does get killed.

Third of all, SG, you specifically stated that in your PM it said what happens when cops investigate you. It made no mention of cops actually existing and such.

This matches with what Jul's said when he said his miller flavor was "not really flavor but just what a miller is", i.e. when a cop investigates you, they see you as guilty. To tell a miller that there *ARE* cops would be strange but to tell a townie what happens due to their role is fine.

Now, Tajo is claiming Death Miller and claiming that, his role and PM are not a simple "you are a death miller. if cop investigates you, you turn up scum, if you are lynched you turn up scum. and thats it". but instead Tajo said his 'PM' specifically mentions that cops exist which no other miller has said or claimed as being true.

I don't buy that. Why would tajo say this though with it being a lie? Because he, like crazy, is trying to confirm his role/PM by saying it fits with what is going on in game even when it doesn't make sense.

As for Tajo being the 'first' to claim miller, it just doesn't mean as much to me anymore. Tajo is claiming 'knowledge' of cops existing in his PM! Claiming 'pre-game' knowledge?

The entire basis of Mafia is a 'uninformed majority' versus a 'informed minority'.

Why would any town be specifically told that there are 'other town roles' that *definitely* do exist? I could imagine getting a death miller role and thinking that there has to be townie roles to balance it and thus pro-town roles like cop, doc, etc. *should* exist but for me to know *for sure* based on PM? No. This is also a 'insane' game, for all the millers knew there may be no cops at all and just millers and it is just to mess with their heads.

So it is much more likely that Tajo is informed minority and that he either "knew" that there were cops (and thus wanted to claim miller) or that he knew there were millers.

I find it much more likely (and consistent) if scum didn't know amount of millers or anything but Tajo *does say he knew cop existed* and perhaps scum were either informed or guessed that cops do exist and he decided to go do miller claim on his own. So he gambled and claimed FIRST so that his claim is more believable.

Seriously, it isn't *that* hard. It isn't like claiming doc or cop and being counterclaimed and even if he claims or is counterclaimed, miller isn't going to be killed instantly. It is virtually *the* safest thing to do. Claim miller first and then ride it out. He can make up and say anything as he goes along and if there are millers, use them to confirm himself, etc. etc. He (and us) didn't expect there to be 3 millers and so on.

This next bit is perhaps just my personally feeling but frankly, *if* Tajo was really a death miller, then I don't think he was playing his role correctly or the way I expected him to. (which is why I have disliked his play and such throughout the whole game).

To me, the best optimal move for a Death Miller is NOT to live. Death miller doesn't want to waste a town lynch so the best optimal move is to try to get himself night killed by being dangerous to scum. I.e. scum hunting, being very active, etc.

In fact, Tajo said he was 'basically semi-confirmed town' based on this and that scum can't let him (and other millers live) and my whole viewpoint and read on that is that he should be using his 'semi-confirmed'-ness to actually put pressure and vote after people and be very PRO-ACTIVE.

Instead... Tajo... was more like a turtle and reactive and his thing was getting sly lynched based on sly's case on lynching Tajo. It just doesn't make sense.

Even the subsequent actions and stuff, I just don't buy a town death miller doing those actions.

I could say more, but, in the end. I don't believe Tajo's claim or words.

------------------------

As for SC... SC seems to always be scummy to me in any game. and he does do things I find strange/controversial/scummy (which is why I investigated him) and his latest 'slip' is... actually ok to me.

SC is just being consistently who he is which is his normal 'misunderstanding' self while claiming that he is on top of the ball on everything. At some point SC might evolve into something scary but, as it is, I won't be voting for SC or Mirth.

--------------------------

I think Farside and Crazy are the two who need to start talking.

Crazy: Don't believe your claim. Can you give any breadcrumbing, reasoning or anything else that will help convince us you aren't lying? Also who is your scum picks?

Cor

[Mirth]

Corv, Crazy did breadcrumb. His breadcrumbs are what make his claim look bad. Like the whole "(or 4) *cough*" thing when refering to millers and the sucking up to Tajo.

[Korlash]

First of all, I got innocent on llama and innocent on SC. I said that before (when I said I 'may' be naive as opposed to 50-50 or insane) because I got innocents in all my investigations.

So you were given a result on someone who died that same night... interesting...

[ShadowGirl]

@Corv: What me and Tajo have been debating over flavour is whether the sentence structure shows the existence of that there are either multiple cops or none at all.

His flavour:

There could be cops but they will see me as mafia.

(On page two)

Which I agreed that it matches mine.

[populartajo]

@Corv: What me and Tajo have been debating over flavour is whether the sentence structure shows the existence of that there are either multiple cops or none at all.

His flavour:

There could be cops but they will see me as mafia.

(On page two)

Which I agreed that it matches mine.

So what does this mean, Corv? SG is scum also? Meh, SG destroyed your whole 1315 with only one paragraph.
I repeat, stop pretending I should play this game like you would do and use that reason to think Im scum. Think outside the box.
I think I played optimally. If you dont, then go read some mafia theory in MD.

[StrangerCoug]

Wait, why aren't we no lynching?

Shoot me if I know, but your suggesting that both Mirth and I are scum together is already credibly bankrupt and a no-lynch, if we're still playing the day after, will blow it to bits if Korlash and I haven't done it already.

I dont understand this. Could you rephrase it?

I don't know why we aren't going for a no-lynch. The last time I checked, you believed Corvuus to be sane and Korlash insane. You also said that Mirth or I,

BUT NOT LIKELY BOTH OF US,

could be the godfather. Corvuus has an innocent on me and Korlash a guilty on Mirth, meaning that unless Corvuus is naïve and Korlash paranoid (which I'm not denying), the scum team cannot be Mirth, farside22, and me as you believe. Korlash and I have gone through why two godfathers make no sense anyway. No-lynching will only serve to trash the possibility of two godfathers beyond all recognition.

You're stretching something that does not need to be stretched and making absolutely no sense.

[populartajo]

Well, if we no lynch then we would be in the same situation tomorrow, WITH THE EXCEPTION of cops claiming new results and one possible less player to maximize the odds of finding scum. Hell, if Mirth is a doc then maybe we could confirm someone.
I ALREADY said that 2 GFs is ridiculous so barring something crazy, Im prob reading one of you wrong.
Coug and Mirth, what do you both think of farside?

[StrangerCoug]

I'm leaning slightly towards scum on farside22 based on her reactions with Mirth earlier.

[populartajo]

I'm leaning slightly towards scum on farside22 based on her reactions with Mirth earlier.

So do you think scumpair?

[StrangerCoug]

Not necessarily. I don't have anything particularly damning against Mirth.