SS 1573 wrote:looking for validation is extremely common. 80% of people intuitively want to follow the lead of others, regardless of if they have opinions.
Of course. I'm not disputing that that's part of the human condition. We're not getting into a psychological debate here over the tendencies toward approval.
My contention is that notscience hasn't led his own fights. Hasn't stood up for his ideas. Hasn't shown me that townie, individualistic spirit ... as it relates to the confines of our specific game of Mafia.
like, even in this very game, NS stuck to me for a while because of a lack of direction. the thing that would worry me is a lack of conviction, not a lack of initiative.
Wicked's most recent game as mafia. I don't have time to read the game in depth right now. Looking at the iso, some things stand out to me as different from this game. I'm curious if you see them too. I'm going to wait until you reply before I expound.
so far ive noticed he asked questions more frequent, was marginally more defensive, and posted less often in that game. not sure if any of that means anything. about to dig into my "gameview keywords" method.
I think I'm also seeing there is less follow-up, more softballs/shallower pushes, slightly more content that isn't directly related to the game. All of that goes in my "tone" bin.
In post 1576, Soft-spoken wrote:psychological principles apply everywhere. unless you can prove that its not fitting of NS's personality it means nothing
I disagree. I mean, I agree, technically, but then there is no thing as scumhunting. I think you're looking at the game through way too broad a lens. Everything could be explained away by saying, "well, psychologically, people do X anyway, so it's null".
But if you're going to get meta, then yes, I have played with notscience on two previous occasions where he has tunnelled - I'm talking hard tunnelled over multiple days, in word and deed (read: vote), not seeking for or caring about validation like he is here - and he flipped town both times.
what do you make of #1528 and the conversation ns and I had leading up to that. i really get where you're coming from in terms of thought, rc, but self meta?
RC: have you made this kind of not-a-vanilla claim as a town power role getting lynched before? If not (and if you have been in that situation before, which I assume is true), what compelled you to do it in this game in particular?
yes. as with everything that is not tangible or provable, everything is context and meta. the perception most people have of scum tells only applies to inexperienced players. if notscience regularly tunnels people early in the game for any reason other than defensive impulse... she is likely to be scum here
This could just be me but I think my scum meta is more intricate than tunneling or not (which, us wrong seeing as I'm town)
I'd direct you to pie but she's scumreading me and I'm not sure she scumreads me along with a buddy after bins game so.
If you are one for selfmeta, a lot of my scumgame revolves around buddying my friends (which could arguably be said about fery here- me buddying nacho would have come off as off because I'm normally insanely paranoid of him. I wouldn't want pie to get too close and then Tammy hasn't really been a big factor (which also this bugs me btw)). I would join wagons based off of others stances and try to break u fights, taking every instance to make a post with genuine emotion. I would also aim to start some stupid off topic discussions to detract from the point at hand.
On the one hand, I kinda like it because as scum he could claim a role in an attempt to get counterclaimed and this leaves it ambiguous. But then that would be obvious too. He might also not be certain what Empire would use. When Mara claimed cop on day one of last swag town, we were able, well implosion I think, was able to prove through trends that the cop claim was extremely unlikely.
However, I don't get why he wouldn't just claim. I doubt very seriously that he has the type of role that becomes less useful if outed, so it's not that. He could just be leaving it to some mystery so that the scum team has a decision to make on whether or not to kill him for the role or someone a bit more dangerous and widely town read.
So yeah, IDK.
Notscience - Why would you expect me to be a big factor if you didn't have me as someone you would expect to take on a leadership role in this game? And how is this any different than We the Purple?
other than that i liked the self meta cuz i'm a sucker for self meta.
I think that SS, ffery and wicked are all pretty decently town.
Everyone else exists in this split pea soup where you guys keep doing things that look like they could be townish and while I like peas, I wouldn't bet that I would like mushy pea soup.
I don't want to lynch implosion because there is a chance he's the vig and even if he is the sk, he wants mafia gone just as badly as we do, and maybe there's a chance we'll figure out if he is town after all. Though him being sk would make so much sense for why I'm having such a difficult time this game. Like I have no scum reads. The closest I have is boonkies and that's in part due to cheetory, and I really don't think boon skies chaoticness looked as town as the last couple games I've seen him in. I also, on a somewhat self-centered note, hate his reasoning for the scum read on me because it feels false. Well I mean, I know I'm town, and I don't feel like I've done any of the things he's accused me of. But not one person call him out or tried to get him to elaborate or pointed out that it was wrong, so maybe I'm just crappier at this than I think I am.
tammy my takeaway from the whedon game is that his reads as town don't make a lot of sense, tend to be super-reactive, and digging for more from him is usually pointless. In that game, I hated the idea of him making it to lylo. I will probably feel similarly in this one.
Amid the pressure of great events, a general principle gives no help.
I would much rather see RC full claim than half-claim. Not specifying his claim today probably doesn't have that much utility as town but as scum, it can prevent his lynch today and allow him to out a power role tomorrow.
"Playing with Nacho is like playing with a religious conservative." ~UncertainKitten
-- Fate, Vanilla Townie, was brutally stabbed by a throwing sword in endgame.
In post 1588, fferyllt wrote:tammy my takeaway from the whedon game is that his reads as town don't make a lot of sense, tend to be super-reactive, and digging for more from him is usually pointless. In that game, I hated the idea of him making it to lylo. I will probably feel similarly in this one.
that said, his night actions as inventor had a positive impact on the game, eventually virtually cleared him, saved the IC by wifom about getting protection and enabled the last two town players to be in a neighborhood when the game went to the wire.
Amid the pressure of great events, a general principle gives no help.
well, i would probably claim the same as RC did as scum or town under duress... hard claiming before your lynch is confirmed seems kinda pointless in a closed setup. im not sure what relevance having a counterclaim or not would even have, as there could be multiple of the role... or none.
im fine with RC half-claiming until we decide to lynch him or dont. the only sway a claim would have on me, is having the relevant information available to us after intent is declared and before the day ends in the case he is a town member that had an impactful night action n1
In post 1587, Tammy wrote:Well I mean, I know I'm town, and I don't feel like I've done any of the things he's accused me of. But not one person call him out or tried to get him to elaborate or pointed out that it was wrong, so maybe I'm just crappier at this than I think I am.
I let boonskies be boonskies sometimes, I don't think his weird reasoning is really indicative of scum and I don't think that me refuting his logic would help him much because the real reason he's reading you as scum is because his gut says so.
"Playing with Nacho is like playing with a religious conservative." ~UncertainKitten
-- Fate, Vanilla Townie, was brutally stabbed by a throwing sword in endgame.
