Mini 2230: Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night: Game Over

[Annie Edison]

Is that invite-only?

[Annie Edison]

reading this game is killing me today ngl

@ffery

I may be off here, but I feel like you are engaging with me differently in this game then in our last one, which I think might be because I got hyper paranoid of you day 1 that game.

But I have reached a town read on your slot, and would not longer be paranoid of you

this reads so weird to me i keep coming back to it

i didn't catch this from luke at first, but i think i feel similarly weird about it

I want to go ahead and give Annie Edison (as notscience) and Snarky Fishes (as ffery) some space for now. I'm not scum reading them at present, but I'm sure not ready to town block them.

is this implying you want more interaction with me and bell?

Bell, please chill. I actually liked 611.

@LLD- what about Pooky?

[✓*]

*

I refuse to believe I rolled T/T with cabd 4 games in a row cuz that'd be imba af

does this mean you think pooky is unaligned with medea?

uhhhhhhhh shitty readslist in hopes of engaging w everyone more.

Spoiler:

Annie Edison - I echo sleez's sentiment here when it comes to them being one of the only people i think are approaching Medea in a (towny) manner (theres definitely a better word to get across what im trying 2 say here) so they can have a townread for now. i buy the whole "wanna be town saviour" shtick for now at least.

AA9 - i think most of the convo surrounding them has been their slip which was just nothing??? that discussionfeels misguided at best. i'll admit i dont wanna look for their iso and theyve been pretty forgettable so far

Dunnstral - i think their read on me was pretty shallow when they first dropped it, and i feel like their inability to elaborate on it miiiiiight be a scum scoping out the way the rest of the game is receiving me and if i'll be a viable push. i dont remember anything else.

Here There Be Dragons - lvl 1 townread for now. im not sure theyve posted since ive stated that opinion but it remains the same. ~vibe~ read more then anything else

LadyLambadelta - will probably have more to say when we can get more out of their posting style

Lukewarm - ive outlined most of my thought process regarding him but im struggling to find stuff i like regarding him. as sleez mentioned his medea vote felt opportunistic. not a huge fan

Medea - nullish. im not of the mindset near anything they've done is AI so theyre just sitting in no-mans-land right now. i dont view their "AtE" as indicative of anything but genuine frustration. i guess bc i think some votes on them are scummy i'd default town

Pooky - I have no real opinion besides maintaining my lvl 1 townread on him. i'd like 2 interact more.

Sleez - i dont think ive disagreed with most anything shes said and her perspective and approach to the game is a pretty easy town for me.

Snarky Fishes - not a fan of their characterization of Medea as manipulative,,, i tend to disagree w most takes framing Medea as scum so far and this isnt exempt. meh idk overall, should probably reread their iso

Spiffeh - uhhhh lvl 1 scumread for dropping a vote and disappearing forever ago

Titus - reads like Titus. im shit at meta but somebody probably will be able 2 grasp it better then i can

my only issues with this list are a lack of conviction in a post meant to spark engagement, and the lack of any substantial scumreads. notty has a good point about the inconsistency wrt finding medea's voters scummy but having them all sorted town, but I'm not 100% sold it's AI. at the same time tho I...don't really buy 680. still need to spend more time on this slot.

At this point,multiple people have called my vote some variation of opportunistic, which is wild to me.

My vote was a direct result of me calling out one of their posts and our following interactions, with a clear discussion about my concerns. If anything, I think that I included more reasonings behind my suspicions then any other vote I can think of. And I am the opportunistic vote?

is there a vote on that wagon you feel was particularly opportunistic?

Well Manatee, are you caught scum?

Why are you asking this you nitwit. It's not like she's going to say yes. If your immediate response is that you're testing her reaction when she's shown to already be a very reactionary person I will send you to your grave.

this is the first sleez post I'm not a fan of but eh playstyle

theres kind of a disconnect between what im saying and what im thinking often which is just frustrating bc its understandable why i get in shit for it but i don't know how to communicate how i miscommunicated. when i wrote "votes" on medea head manatee was really just thinking abt lukewarm

Exactly my vote (and subsequent unvote) was enough for you to dismiss the whole wagon as tainted, and then give your null read a town read?

Medea - nullish.
-
i guess bc i think some votes on them are scummy i'd default town

Like, if I make this change to match what you just said, this is what you think about Medea?

Medea - nullish.
-
i guess bc i think

some

Luke's

vote on them

are

is

scummy i'd default town

yes

VOTE: Manatee

like i said i don't like manatee's explanation, but luke looks worse than her in this exchange. he's still lacking the initiative I expect from his town game and is playing a lot of wait-and-see.

Hey how are we doing so far

not a good pop-in. like "how can I lamist in as few words as possible?", testing the waters

top of 30

[Annie Edison]

oh ya bell has posted enough I'm ready to call that slot locked in now

[Annie Edison]

And the "I currently have too few thoughts on them to even put them in null" - aa9, lld, spiffeh, titus

how have you been approaching lld's posts?

[Annie Edison]

ok yeah not much has changed for me in that last while.

i'm not impressed with medea. mostly these are things i've already mentioned. i disliked 186 quite a bit. i felt like that was an excuse for them to change the topic away from one that wasn't working for them. also looking at it again now, i feel like there are now multiple different reasons why they can't post reads. pick a lane (or just start solving). 214 bothered me as well.
i know that even if they're scum, they'll get a foothold, probably even with me, given enough time. i guess after witnessing the power of not giving scum the chance to bounce back in my game, i want to be morph even though i'm actually only okay at scumhunting which is sort of a key thing there.
i really expected them to be solving the whole ass game by now. maybe my expectations are wrong.
so, that's why i'm still voting there. it's annoying to me that the pressure has not produced much that interested me. i guess i'd like ffery, medea and/or LLD to interact with me about this and tell me if & why i'm wrong.

other concerns:
lukewarm has felt stuck out in the weeds to me all game. it doesn't remind me of his play in my game, but i could just be making this up. i'm also a little surprised he is scumreading manatee.

spiffeh's confident entrance followed by nothing, however, reminded me of my game a lot.

is this not just a straight up BoP read? is there anything else that strengthens it for you to the point of needing to be talked out of it?

why lld?

what is surprising to you about lukewarm scumreading manatee?

[Annie Edison]

Bell, please chill. I actually liked 611.

@LLD- what about Pooky?

[✓*]

*

I refuse to believe I rolled T/T with cabd 4 games in a row cuz that'd be imba af

does this mean you think pooky is unaligned with medea?

[✓]

does that go both ways? like if one flips red/green, your read of the other goes up/down respectively?

[Annie Edison]

While penguin works on her big post, let me casually just drop our bracketed reads completely naked ITT to generate a bunch of pages worth of P-edits for her.

{Dunnstral, Lady Rhea, Sleez, Fferyllt}
{Bell, Annie Edison, Pooky}
{Save the Ceph, AA9, Titus, Spiff}
{ManateeLass}
{Luke}

ugh i'm trying to READ here

[Annie Edison]

middle line null? @cabd

[Annie Edison]

lmaoooo

[Annie Edison]

I’m pretty sure I’ve been townier then bulge why aren’t we split

[Annie Edison]

[✓X]

ok gotcha

[Annie Edison]

I’m pretty sure I’ve been townier then bulge why aren’t we split

fr

[Annie Edison]

Do you think manatee was perspective slipping in her wall?

[Annie Edison]

I have been very patiently

I’m just sad bells higher than me

[Annie Edison]

I like playing with Rhea. She’s always my favorite poster.

Ninja-
Okay

HAHA BELL WERE ON THE SAME LEVEL

[Annie Edison]

…you know you don’t have to

post

that you’re biting your tongue, right

You can just wait

Mmm

[Annie Edison]

ME

[Annie Edison]

Players not doing as I am probably know who you are, sure.

As usual, I have no idea who the hidden alt is

We have a few guesses but no clue but we’ve been a bit more preoccupied on the people not in our top tier

[Annie Edison]

Fferys literally posted like three of them lmao

[Annie Edison]

Dunn is my TenetBrian this game.

[Annie Edison]

Do you need to spend some time in my dojo bell?

Ninja-
HI UNWND

[Annie Edison]

Unwnd why aren’t you townreading bell

[Annie Edison]

NO FAIR I GOT PEDITED A BUNCH I TYED THAT FIRST

[Annie Edison]

Unpack that for me?

[Annie Edison]

I was thinking about that too, ffery but it seemed way too tinfoil.

[Annie Edison]

I’m gonna vouch for ^ too unwnd

[Annie Edison]

Unwnd she’s going to keep posting that until you respond but I’m not sure what response she’s looking for

[Annie Edison]

I taught him everything he knows :’)

[Annie Edison]

Manatee, talk to me.

What’s confusing you?

[Annie Edison]

I’ve been working on it but old habits die hard

[Annie Edison]

My only unwnd scum experience was that game that never happened when he replaced in to a caught slot

[Annie Edison]

Bell I would like to circle back to the Titus discussion later.

Timing for circleback?

[redacted]

[Annie Edison]

A50 was a scum buddy they had to drag across the finish line in Tenet because they were hardcore lurking and just like… not town when they posted

[Annie Edison]

13

[Annie Edison]

Just because I asked about your read on Medea, they are coming hard on me. I dont like that very much. And their vote on post #482 is more concerning. They want to eliminate because my questions were weird. Since when weird questions means scummy?
Their POST #536 is bleeding scum. What does it mean by “clear from bottom”? and you mentioned that you want take out strong players before they take you out. So there, you are basing elimination based on your survival chance not by scum reads? And you’re trying to hard carry the game? , I cant begin explain how many times you contradicted yourself over there. You wanted to remove bottom players and picked me but you wanted to remove Medea hydra because they are strong players. And you want to hard carry the game but doesn’t seem to have a clear logic to eliminate players.
Post #553 – Why begging because you have a fake story?
Post #616 – Why the unnecessary obsession?
Post#705 – You put me in your scum list but voted Mantee. Why?
Post#948 – Trying to bring my name up just to get players attention. It’s a classic scum move.

AA9- I've talked about her in my ISO already. But the short version is her line of questioning of me feels weird given everything about her line of questioning was something I've discussed both before and after the line of questioning.

This is the short version of points I've already brought up that she blatantly dodges to paint her narrative. I explictly stated like 10 fucking times that I don't understand how she can-

A) Miss what my stance on Medea and her wagon was, given that was 80% of my iso
B) Miss where I share those stances AGAIN after she asked the question
C) Even attempt to read someone if she's not paying enough attention to see this

And this is a gigantic misrep as I basically just paraphrased my earlier thoughts in this post.

Bell help me kill AA9

This is not begging, this is working with townreads. It feels like she came up with the decision to have me as a scumread and is confbiasing it.

Do you think AA9 is town, LLD?

What about Sleez?

This is not an obsession, it is trying to get someone I think is scummy eliminated by working with my townreads and campaigning for their elimination. This is something I have a track record of doing that can be verified by like 75% of the game.

I think my reads now looks like

Town
Dunn, fferybell, sleez, LLD(^)
Pooky, CephTD
Spiffy, Titus, Lukewarm, Medea (^^)
Manatee (vv)
AA9
Scum

ninja-
Spiffy I day rolecopped you bc of your awful voting record and it told me you are a vanilla cop

What do you have to say in your defense

Manatee is still in my scumpool and was not lurking and leaving my vote in the nether. I can't put the game on pause to deal with lurkers, that's how apathy breeds and that shit loses games.

Not even hours into game its already 15 pages. would you guys slowdown for god sake!

hehehehe

This is totally bringing your name up to keep people's attention. Like, holy fucking shit at least PRETEND like you actually want to sort me.

AA9 dies today.

[Annie Edison]

Also I can't expect you to notice the difference but 948 was bulge, I'm more of a LMAOer.

[Annie Edison]

Urge to burn, rising.

[Annie Edison]

Manatee talk to me about the people voting Medea. What are your reads on al of them?

Where do you stand on Medea?

Bell let’s assume for a second you’re wrong and I’m town. Who’s scum?

You haven't answered my question about Meda, what do you think about their wagon?

You did not ask reasons. You asked for reads.

That were already given in thread both before and after your question. I don't think you are scum for

not understanding

I think you are caught BSing questions to look busy, and now coming to a reads conclusion before actually trying to read someone. Stop trying to misrep my argument.

Ninja-
How the fuck are you supposed to eliminate someone if you don't say their name?

My strength comes from townhunting and POE. This is easily verified by asking others. I'm pretty sure I've done a good job of it considering the usual suspects are near in sync with me. So, cut the misreps, cut the discredits.

Ninja-
Weeee more discredits

[Annie Edison]

Breaking news: Players in mafia games tend to say the names more of people they want to eliminate

Grass is green

More on this at 11.

[Annie Edison]

her*

[Annie Edison]

Medea what do I have to do to get your vote.

[Annie Edison]

Well unwnd, what about yours?

You know that entire readslist was hot garbage.

@Medea-
I asked and was told the only thing I can have is a loud towel cop, but we already knew that she's a towel

[Annie Edison]

oh cool

@Manatee- if you're town I'm offering you the limited time chance to get on a scum-elim and hide behind survivalism defense. This is a limited time offer and seats are going fast!

[Annie Edison]

I wouldn't be surprised. I don't think I'm outright scumreading titus there's some stuff I want to discuss but we need to wait on. But I do know that AA9's readslist looks REALLY bad its just easier to point out the issues with an ISO I'm most familiar with lol

ninja-
Yes I'm totally TvTing with someone who I've REPEATEDLY shown is not interested in solving, only in looking busy, misrepping, and discrediting.

[Annie Edison]

[Annie Edison]

Manatee join my righteous AA9 wagon. Strike First.

ninja-
I'm glad we're back on the russian title I vastly prefered that to wine club

What crimes did they commit in a past game?

[Annie Edison]

how does pooky tie in there? because of the early wagon?

[Annie Edison]

Manatee’s posts today have been giving me good vibes too.

Ninja-

[Annie Edison]

I honestly think I’m okay with competing AA9/Spiffy wagons

[Annie Edison]

I honestly think I’m okay with competing AA9/Spiffy wagons

[Annie Edison]

Vote me then, coward.

[Annie Edison]

It’s almost like someone pointed out that there’s probably scum using this to fence sit on her

[Annie Edison]

I mean each time you post something like you just continue to make my case

I’m honestly getting flashbacks to Tenet from this where I was completely neutralized by discredits despite having 5/6 right

Interesting.

[Annie Edison]

@unwnd I might be on board with the Russian theory.

[Annie Edison]

Pooky, help me kill AA9 please.

[Annie Edison]

Look at her approach to me- the short version is she tried to look busy, got called out on it, then misrepped and discredited. Her recent readslist section for me reads like she had a predetermined read and was cherry-picking to fit the read.

Ninja-
Exhibit J, your honor.

[Annie Edison]

I have not been miselimmed once since I’ve been back and I sure as fuck am not about to start getting miselimmed here.

[Annie Edison]

There's movement happening in my reads list because unlike bork, it knows the proper need for fiber.

Don’t be a tease

[Annie Edison]

How the fuck can you see her approach to me as town

[Annie Edison]

How the fuck can you see her approach to me as town

is this at me? i didn't say i was at town

No it's at Medea.

[Annie Edison]

I'm pretty sure it's not

I think this game might be the one

huh

[Annie Edison]

There's no speaking German here this is Russian only

[Annie Edison]

I meant the second half of it

[Annie Edison]

But does the egg rustle in the warm summer breeze?

Depends on the tree, of course.

[Annie Edison]

Manatee who should I vote and why

ninja
Oh, Bell.

[Annie Edison]

I mean yeah I'm pretty sure that was his intention by voting you

[Annie Edison]

Yes

[Annie Edison]

I think you scared him with the mousetrap

ninja-
spicy

[Annie Edison]

I mean she has been responding to the pressure, let me know when you read up what you think.

ninja-
isnt that the game I got into a really big fight with mollie and it was fucking multiball

i hate fucking multiball

[Annie Edison]

I could literally tell you and AA9 to stop posting and exclusively quote from your respective ISOs there to continue the current thread between you and except for the fact that I just mentioned this, nobody would have been the wiser.

I'm confused what that has to do with xmen

what am i supposed to be looking at

And she's not really providing anything new other than just proving my point after every fucking response

[Annie Edison]

viewtopic.php?f=56&t=58466&hilit=xmen

?

ninja-
wait which xmen I dont see her on that list either

[Annie Edison]

UNVOTE:

grumble grumble grumble

[Annie Edison]

If that games and indication I'll likely end up voting her again so

[Annie Edison]

God I was so fucking cringe

[Annie Edison]

I think my favorite part of reading that is she had the audacity to call me mean here and I see her ISO there

ninja-
yeah its really bad

I called myself obama

[Annie Edison]

Rhea where should I be voting?

[Annie Edison]

In my experience, a snarky AA is a town AA.

The snark was awakened, so there's that.

Well I have way too many townreads so something's up.

[Annie Edison]

It was the only way I could think to phrase it at the time, essentially fitting the read to the narrative

But anyways I have since moved on after going through a a time machine of cringe

[Annie Edison]

So you subscribe to unwnds theory of one scum in (Medea/Fish/Pooks)?

[Annie Edison]

I mean yeah I agree that fish is ridiculously obviously town but in the interest of repeating the theory fully I put all of them

[Annie Edison]

Do you think Dragons was the bus vote? Is that why?

[Annie Edison]

Want to re-iterate that this is the most town-in-our-eyes thing you've done all game.

I'm not sure if I should be happy or disappointed.

What are people seeing with CephTD? I haven't really minded anything they've done so far.

[Annie Edison]

Can you guys not?

[Annie Edison]

cleveland

YEAR OF THE BROWNS BABY

[Annie Edison]

Annie Edison - would be in the top tier but I got a little squicked by the appearance of placating medea in anticipation of the amazing technicolor reads list -FF

Huh

[Annie Edison]

Bell brings up a good point in that I totally understand most of Titus this game and that’s typically a bad sign

[Annie Edison]

I mean I’ve told her the exact same thing in multiple games

Like I feel like you first heard it from me lol but it like doesn’t change things? Some stuff is hard to replicate

[Annie Edison]

I genuinely liked manatees turnaround into today, did you other hydrae not?

Ninja-
rhea do you need the takes broken up, or itemized or something?

[Annie Edison]

Do you want to know which takes they want you to interact with?

[Annie Edison]

You have to do like me in calc 2 and guess and check

[Annie Edison]

@Rhea- is it because you think they were trying to come up with a reason for them to stick around later but then changed to more active control?

Or something about what bell mentioned about scum finding a way to break stuff open?

Or trying to justify their behavior from before? Or do you not think their behavior from before makes sense in line with their claim?

[Annie Edison]

Are there some specific posts you think don’t line up?

[Annie Edison]

Are you saying he should have come out of the gate with it instead of sit on it?

[Annie Edison]

Are you saying he should have come out of the gate with it instead of sit on it?

[!]

I mean in a world where I was a solo slot, I probably would have just blurted stuff out because I can't actually stop myself from shouting over shinies in the player list.

But how do shards help me here? I'm already two-sharded.

I think she’s saying sitting on scum starting with just one demon more so than campaigning for shards. And making sure town knows to be careful around shard giving?

[Annie Edison]

@ceph Luke is still floating in the bottom half of my list and I think bulge wasn’t a big fan during his catchup, I’ll direct him to that post whenever he’s available

[Annie Edison]

feeling this bad about the read is probs a sign I'm just wrong. hard reset time.with a side order of reread.

I might do one later too. I’m going to try and focus on how people are interacting with Rhea.

[Annie Edison]

I’m currently townreading like most of the game and have to figure out who I’m cutting unnecessary slack to.

[Annie Edison]

I was going to ask if it’s time for the obligatory Titus wagon.

[Annie Edison]

Live until XYLO:
Annie, Manatee

Live for toDay:
Lukewarm, LLD

Compromise/Sorting:
Medea, Dunnstral, Spiffeh, AA9

Tinfoil:
Pooky, Fishes

End D1 here:
Titus, Dragons

[X]

Which in particular

[Annie Edison]

Which in particular

@Rhea

[Annie Edison]

What did you like from Dragons that moved them up from your list of who to vote earlier?

I’m assuming Dunn should be higher and manatee/fishes flipped

What posts from Titus have you liked?

[Annie Edison]

Ceph trying to engage you?

Or sharing your misgivings about Medea

[Annie Edison]

Give me like 10 Spiffy

[Annie Edison]

Spiffy who are your top three elims for today snd why?

[Annie Edison]

Because I felt like it was this game's turnstile even though people said no to it at first (given the upcoming game advertisement)

It also didnt necessarily hurt anything and if a surge had gone through I could have easily un-sharded.

Also pretty shiny mechanic.

[Annie Edison]

I honestly forgot that game entirely, but did you look at the shared ISO cabd linked? It's literally like someone pressed paused and then continued between us here. (please dont read it its really cringe just trust mine and cabds word)

I know I have a habit of digging my feet in when people are being rude so trying to fix that+taking a second to be objective about it made Medea's point make sense.

[Annie Edison]

mine and medeas* cabd was the one who posted but it was pa who found it

[Annie Edison]

notty you've mentioned a few times that you think scum could be hiding behind null-reading LLD or something because of her posting style but I don't necessarily agree because I currently don't really have a read on her and I can understand if others are having the same challenge.

Who do you feel are the players that fit that category?

I'm rereading right now because I couldn't remember exactly who was doing it but I remembered a lot of excuses around it. I'm on page 32 (note im skimming bc its a lot) and the main culprit I've seen is manatee.

Titus didn't believe it was legitimate and tried to call it as a bluff but then retracted it after seeing Niamh's post, and that felt like a really awkward series of events. Like, I struggle to understand why that is a tactic from scum LLD who does just fine posting in a variety of ways.

I'm still taking notes and will draft up my conclusions in a bit, but that's kinda where my head is at now.

Like, this is going to sound weird but I found myself townreading LLD more when she was scum in games because of the things she was saying like tonally. But there's no real tone here, and I feel like there's decent solving coming from her.

Does that make sense?

[Annie Edison]

I've never been the expert reading pooky, but my two biggest things I was going off of was the parallels in my personal reaction to his early posting to Tarot, where he was town, and was sitting on that for a solid bit. I followed that up with 811 and that felt like a pretty solid take at the time.

I'm not super sure where his head's at right now though. I have been kinda chewing on the interactions with Medea, I feel like I would have felt worse if he automatically jumped because Medea said to jump? And he did mention he's waiting to sheep.

As is I feel like his only two expressed reads thus far are town on both LLD/Medea. Iirc unwnd mentioned something about his play here matching tenet? But I wasnt ever on the same side as pooky until like the final day? (Iirc we were both day 1 stiles) so I didn't really get to experience it first hand. @unwnd can you weigh in?

[Annie Edison]

I'm hedging a lot

I think unwnd might be right. I need some data to ground myself.

[Annie Edison]

fairylit where do you think we should be looking then considering you dont want either of the main wagons?

[Annie Edison]

He's BOPing cabd

[Annie Edison]

Medea*

[Annie Edison]

I am very cynical about the day and think we are not eliminating scum if this keeps up

This game feels like the unholy offspring of 2181 and tenet

ninja-
I'm kinda there too. I'm getting the same "everyone feels town" I had in 2181 but just the overall feel of the game is making me think tenet

[Annie Edison]

If we wanna kill Medea day one, we're going to need to solve for Medea day one.

That involves:
Figuring out why they claimed demonized day 1.
Figuring out how their play corresponds to faking that throughout the game. Or being honest about it and what they have to gain from it.
Figuring out their patterns and rituals day 1 in a game and how that corresponds more to their scum play than their town play.
Figuring out why PA isn't posting like a robot.
Figuring out why Cabd hasn't latched onto a scum yet and has chosen instead to go after pooky.

and a lot of other motivational cross points and personal choices.

-Bell

I think LLD had a good point about them not bringing it up at gamestart.

They also had the most noticeable change in demeanor after the pause.

[Annie Edison]

@Spiffy my original basis is I don't think Dunn-scum is the type to pursue a "didnt understand the setup" angle. I just feel genuine solving from him and theres some weird angles in his ISO that typically come more frm town-dunn imo (696 stands out)

Plus his reads are lining up fairly well with mine. But like, it seems like most people have come to similar townread conclusions.

ninja-
Which one of you asked who the russians are

[Annie Edison]

But like... look what games this game compares to

it makes sense

[Annie Edison]

unwnd's points about someone we dont want to be scum being scum

[Annie Edison]

Like, they know apathy is a strong weapon in scum's arsenal.

Theres also like various tinfoil paranoia whispers that I don't want to speak into existence.

I just know unwnd is making a lot of sense and I'm trying to figure out who my blinders are blocking.

ninja-
^^^^

Like maybe one of them but theres at least two heavy hitters out there imo

But maybe im just overthinking and things are just that easy?

[Annie Edison]

Excuse me sir

[Annie Edison]

What was?

[Annie Edison]

What was?

Joining this game? trying to play with cabd outside morph yet?

I feel like I'm playing against a construct of my own imagination.

I feel like regardless of the path we choose we need to just be decisive. unwnd is right.

Strike first.

Strike hard.

No mercy.

It

shouldn't

be this hard to get things going when we have such a wide range of people sharing reads. But it is. So we need to figure out if we're all off a cliff or if someone's pulling the strings. We need data.

[Annie Edison]

LLD is your vote on Pooky a joke vote?

[Annie Edison]

Do you think Medea/Pooky are scum together?

[Annie Edison]

Of the bunch I'd still bet the game on Fishes town.

I'm leaning heavily towards town LLD too. There's flecks of paranoia here and there in my post I mentioned to spiffy.

Medea

did

get a lot better after the pause, but that's concerning in its own right. As LLD and Ceph brought up it's weird they didn't say the demon thing right out of the gate. After tenet it gets harder to outright pull the strings on this group in particular. They would have to answer to being alive down the line. Why does scum-Medea try to break up my tunnel on AA9?

[Annie Edison]

Tone felt better as well as finally doing *something*

But am I attributing too much positive to it?

ninja-
what about wine club

[Annie Edison]

They didn't need much effort to control things but that change meant they needed to last longer, so they need to excercise more control?

[Annie Edison]

Ffery what do you think of the fact a decent chunk of PA's push is predicated on manatee positioning with the knowledge that Medea is town?

I hadnt thought much of it but on reflection it does kinda feel like they are trying to assert their towniness.

ninja-
I dont like clique

what about the funky bunch

[Annie Edison]

That they went from controlled play to effort play?

[Annie Edison]

They increased effort to increase their pull in thread?

[Annie Edison]

You think they swapped their wincon plans and adjusted their play accordingly? Haven’t they been a bit too transparent about it though?

[Annie Edison]

Bell what do you think of what Rheas saying?

[Annie Edison]

Did you not like the post or do you think bell is obviously town?

[Annie Edison]

today, I'm alive!

who's all here

[Annie Edison]

ignored by pooky, sad. we must be in the lead for pagetops

hi PA how does luke's current wagoncomp affect the bottom tier of your reads?

[Annie Edison]

rawr

[Annie Edison]

I'm not caught up but spiffeh beating down the budding cw is something

[Annie Edison]

ignored by pooky, sad. we must be in the lead for pagetops

hi PA how does luke's current wagoncomp affect the bottom tier of your reads?

Right now it's just ManateeGirl, but I'll count Titus as being on there too for this.

I'm not partner hunting at this point, so I'd say minimally. I'd also say after watching Warehouse 13 go with dueling scum wagons Day One I don't put nearly as much faith in the wagon/counterwagon dynamic these days. I also suspect there may be places in this set-up where bussing is helpful, so I'm not ruling anything out on the basis of impacting partner pairings.

Right now my ManateeGirl and Lukewarm reads are independent of each other. If one flips scum, it would of course impact my read of the other, but that's true for about half the players here to varying degrees.

Titus, I don't see scum-her as believing she's influencing the gamestate here, whatever else is going on, so also not really AI for me.

That does remind me that something else I disliked in Lukewarm's ISO was the sense that he was all 'woe is me, Medea scumreads me --> I get voted and elim'd' when we weren't voting him. Felt disingenuous again.

Actually (I assume this is Bulge) what's your take on Lukewarm right now? Independently of notscience and independently of game expectations for him (which I'm going to try to set aside myself for the rest of the day)

--PA

I guess the real difference I'm trying to get at luke is that in the situations you referenced, you were pushing scum for misplays. that's what I mean by focused on the right things. i'm not saying "scum luke hones in and town luke doesn't". I just think you're focusing on pointless bull and coming off somewhat defensive in the process, and it's jarring to me.

this still sums up my thoughts on luke well. I haven't thoroughly read anything past this point yet but up to my last exchange with him i feel strongly about it. my luke read is entirely independent of notty's, we've talked about him some but haven't put much focus there or on any slot in particular really until I'm fully caught up.

his response to this felt disingenuous as well. Luke tried to give examples of things/slips he picked up on in previous games that led to scum eliminations as if to imply anything he's done in this game is similar. I've never seen him so defensive, and usually when he catches something and sticks to it, I'm nodding my head along the whole time, but he hasn't sunk his claws into anything

important

this game.

[Annie Edison]

The game stalled

sad i missed this

[Annie Edison]

anyoneee wanna talk abt my new and improved readslist

I plan to spend some time with yours and PAs lists tonight.

Every time I return to the thread the 2181 parallels continue.

[Annie Edison]

Today it’s “someone who should be in the miselim pool claiming FN”

[Annie Edison]

Yeah. It makes my life a heck of a lot easier, that’s for sure. There’s still the concerning tidbits about Titus making more sense as scum but it’s pretty difficult to fake mod confirmation.

I doubt Titus saw this game but one thing in the back of my mind was in 2153 when Hoopla claimed even night friendly neighbor to stall the game out for two days. But given titus’s confusion about shards I’m not sure this is the case?

[Annie Edison]

On further reflection it makes my life harder because it makes it increasingly less likely scum is in the outliers.

[Annie Edison]

What do you think of his interactions with Titus today?

Ninja-
I mean if day three comes around and noones gotten a message we can figure it out then. It’s also just a weird fakeclaim for scum to make in general sans my one example.

[Annie Edison]

I mean that can be said for multiple people, but yeah. I don’t really agree with Titus’s “gotcha” reaction test and am a little confused what she thought she’d net in a playerlist like this. That seems like something you’d pull in a crowd of random people.

One thing I think is weird is that the varying buddies from Tenet all disagreeing on how his play here compares to say, unwnd, who iirc had a scumread on him in tenet?

I’ve been trying to think what his plan would be in a playerlist like this in a post-tenet world

[Annie Edison]

Like look at the elims we had in tenet. If you told me pregame we’d miselim peta, skitter (thinking back with what I know now ofc), FL, I’d have called you crazy. I just don’t know why Titus thinks this group would focus on the LHF unless it’s like a slight shift from unwnds mentality?

[Annie Edison]

Am i just proving unwnds point?

[Annie Edison]

What keeps scum Titus from claiming to have never received a second shard from scum

[Annie Edison]

Unless otherwise specified, a player is considered "Demonic" if they have two or more shards, otherwise, they are classified as "Human". Players may start with 0 or more shards per their role

[Annie Edison]

@Rhea- are you saying her characterization of you is wrong and intended to discredit you?

What does the quote about Manatee have to do with anything? Are you saying you’re right about Medea?

[Annie Edison]

You’ll probably have an easier time if you give her options to chose from.

[Annie Edison]

LLD is there a specific reason you reached out to Titus? Is it the claim?

Is it something you see that you think she would also catch?

[Annie Edison]

Something she missed?

[Annie Edison]

Idk I’m trying to translate for you because she’s not for whatever reason

[Annie Edison]

LLD and annie, do you think luke is town?

i feel like the people i would like to ask are either scum or living on another planet this game.

bulge here

luke is my strongest scumread. I doubt notty feels as strongly but we haven't really talked yet today, I've been trying to power thru reading today with as few preventable distractions (read: non-irl stuff) as possible.

when pressed about the fact he hasn't been solving or playing to his town meta, luke reacts with 1) confusion and/or 2) examples from other games. his play this game has been [uncharacteristically*] defensive. his claims of playing this game with a drive to solve amount to a whole lot of Lukewarm vs The World. and I'm pretty sure you are the only(?) slot up to bat for him.

* but meta is not as core to this read as I might be making it out to be

[Annie Edison]

while i'm on this page and this topic...

I am very surprised to see my placement on the fishes read list. Like in my head, given our experiences, ffery and cabd (if town) were both going to snap town read me and now both of them have me in their scum pile. Hers is extra surprising because I felt like ffery and I were slowly finding each other early on, and I thought she was town reading me all the way up to the moment that the read list dropped. Like she just started trying to have a side spoiler conversation with me

I am unsure what that means for their alignment. I really need to do isos, which I have not had a chance at any point to do, because in the moment she felt town to me all the way up to this morning.


Something that did stand out to me though, was that her and spiffeh's characterization of my morning posts were the same.

Spoiler: My full post 1309

I am still having a hard time seeing them as town.

Even thought most seem to not see it, I think that genguin's exchange with me and dunn early on was scummy.

I also am not a fan of the "actually, jokes on you, I was not trying to get town read anyways." Which I don't even think makes all that much sense just because of their demon status.

I actually find that really strange, but Ffery seems to get it. Maybe I am missing something.

If they were actively worried about the alternate win condition, I feel like they should have been trying to get thread control of the shard mechanic, instead of just shooting for null reads. Heck, they could have aimed to be widely town read, and just accepted the shards for themselves, which would guarantee that no new player was turned into a demon. Instead, they hung back and then just yelled at other people for trying to make plans.

From what I have seen of Town!Cabd, it seems like you can BoP them, and with me sitting at their scummiest scum slot, then I know that they are failing that.

I think that medea + mantee have a lot of scum equity together. With Manatee trying to vaguely discredit the medea wagon, and that being what got her caught.

And now medea putting me as their #1 scum and then Manatee as thier #2 scum, despite that pairing making little sense, to me at least. But you know, fos your buddy, vote a townie and all. If that leads to a miselim on me, then congrats, but if manatee still goes through they can give off the appearance of passing a BoP

Spoiler: The narrow portion of that quote that spiffeh grabbed to try and present my morning posts as "just discredits"

And now medea putting me as their #1 scum and then Manatee as thier #2 scum, despite that pairing making little sense, to me at least. But you know, fos your buddy, vote a townie and all. If that leads to a miselim on me, then congrats, but if manatee still goes through they can give off the appearance of passing a BoP

Why can't they be scum reading both you and Manatee independently of each other?

It feels like you're discrediting their read on you before they've really explained it (which I do wish they prioritized, btw)?

Spoiler: Spiffeh and ffishes now

Lukewarm has given me no town vibes and his point against Medea about having both himself and Manatee, an unlikely scum team, as scum reads is lazy and felt like he was preemptively trying to discredit their upcoming explanation for their scum read on him which is why I'm currently voting him.

Lukewarm - ffery didn't care much for Luke's Monday morning catch-up. It felt discredit-y. Other players' concerns about luke/medea and luke/manatee are noted

Ffery has an entire iso's worth of posts to sort me by, and I am in her scum pile because of like one quarter of one post, and nothing else in my entire iso is comment worthy

I want to do full iso dives tonight for a proper full read list, but spiffeh's posts stood out to me in my catch up as a misrep, and then I saw the fishes say basically the exact same thing...

Also, of note. I dropped all of that because spiffeh asked me directly for my thoughts on Medea, then it feels like he is turning around and spinning it like I sat down that morning with the goal of discrediting medea

"surprised" is not how you should feel this many pages into the game, mainly citing previous experiences instead of in-game content.

this post and the subsequent shift onto spiffeh ("I have talked myself into it" ) are a perfect illustration of Luke vs The World I mentioned above

[Annie Edison]

And the "I currently have too few thoughts on them to even put them in null" - aa9, lld, spiffeh, titus

how have you been approaching lld's posts?

still-relevant and unanswered question for lukey

[Annie Edison]

back to lurk-reading, almost caught up, currently top of 69

[Annie Edison]

and 84 too!

[Annie Edison]

You two literally bickered identically to this as town-town in said game.

Oh gosh. *hides away

Not science was so so mean to me that drove me crazy in that game. I promise that I am not the same person anymore.

Im sorry. I’m not excusing my actions there but I was like 16 at the time. We’re butting heads here some but I promise I’ve matured a lot.

[Annie Edison]

AA9 I’m not going to get into it but you need to reflect that you gave it as much as you got it.

[Annie Edison]

Titus claimed Friendly neighbor. People are wagoning pooky. Medea and manatee put out readslists.

Those are the spark notes

[Annie Edison]

Bell, I playstyle clash with her basically.

[Annie Edison]

(Please don’t judge me for my play 8 years ago I’ve spent the past 24 hours cringing)

[Annie Edison]

I mean like the only way that works is if the only person who actually remembered that game is aligned with them, frankly

[Annie Edison]

It keeps you away from each other and you're aggressively sorting. This kind of wedge makes more sense to me from a TVS perspective.

But whatever.

-Bell

I mean at this point it’s game health.

Go read what Medea linked later. It’s bad. At the very least I’m leaving it sit to not monopolize today, we can come back to it later if we don’t have a red flip yet.

[Annie Edison]

Pooky who’s townier me or bell

[Annie Edison]

Is it a pattern with someone specifically or the game as a whole? Not going to pry more in just curious.

[Annie Edison]

Was it that majority of them look like the same base with a few permutations?

[Annie Edison]

I’m assuming unwnd wants Medea. Which is part of why I’m trying to reevaluate because unwnd feels like 2181 skitter and I’m going to feel really shitty if I pull the same shit twice

[Annie Edison]

IM BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACK

[Annie Edison]

I mean yeah

my number 1 character strength/flaw is i want to be friends with everyone

[Annie Edison]

I really liked the followthrough on Manateegal interacting with LLD. I think a lot of times people make throwaway commitments and dont follow through but follow through typically indicates town.

Speaking of lack of follow through I got majority of the way through the thread tracking LLD interactions and was coming up with zilch. A lot of people just avoided interacting altogether and the people who normally interact with her have all been doing so.

[Annie Edison]

Cabd I'm most interested in why Rhea is so low on your list. What am I missing?

[Annie Edison]

I had this post typed up about how I dont think thats what shes doing then realized I had to ask her a lot of stuff to get a bearing on where she stands on everything.

But its weird to swap it from you to me though, right? I feel like I dont have as much pull this game as morph did in yggdra.

[Annie Edison]

(cabd that was too deep for me its going to be too deep for most of the people here)

[Annie Edison]

Spoiler: PT crasher

Do you think she'd be thinking on that level?

Like, scum titus figuring wed be too scared to empower her so a FN claim doesnt really matter?

Idk thats a weird train of thought imo

ninja-
I'm just trying to figure out why this game feels so fucking hard

but that post reminds me of nacho in mylo

[Annie Edison]

Does anyone have scum meta for AA9 so I can see the tonal discrepancy?

I feel like her tone is much more intense here (granted as weve seen we have that effect on each other) but I just want to peruse for a scum baseline real quick.

If someone posted this already and I missed it sorry.

ninja-
IM SORRY FFERY

Ive gotten ninjad more this game than even tenet

I was talking about Cabd's post. I was thinking about how Prism was talking in the dead pt about how awful it was we were making nacho tryhard wallpost on page 11 and thats like the vibe I got from that post of Cabd's (2253)

[Annie Edison]

@Ffery 2261 When Medea brought up Xmen I discovered mine and Mala's hydra was named Rogue!

Maybe I just didnt put in the effort, but I kept up with a good chunk in tenet and my eyes kinda glazed here. It could be pavlovian after where it got us in tenet, though.

[Annie Edison]

I hope it’s a bear.

[Annie Edison]

I honestly feel like im losing the thread of the game a bit and talking myself in circles. I’d really like some data to reevaluate. Unwnds probably right we should end the day soon.

Ninja-
It’s a pretty great game.

[Annie Edison]

I don’t drink beer but wine or liquor and I’m in

[Annie Edison]

Ffery I don’t know. I feel like as the days gone on I’ve gotten more lost in the excessive townreads I was concerned about early.

I think unwnds right we should try to go big and see what shakes out though, I think there’s a lot less room for scum to hide that way.

[Annie Edison]

Did you just count Ffery twice

[Annie Edison]

There’s 13 names

SF must be Mukuro Ikusaba.

[Annie Edison]

Is that as concerning as I think it is?

[Annie Edison]

@fferys response to my last post about not being *actually* ready to end the day- it’s less a “I’m confident in my reads” and more a “I need some data to ground me” thing but like… I get it

@Lukes case on Titus- I actually really liked that. Like not even just the case like thinking about Luke alignment wise? Idk it was definitely hitting a lot of the right notes in my head

@Rhea- I’m sorry. I’m not sure if I’m part of the problem but I’ll try to be better about including you and being helpful. Please stay :/

[Annie Edison]

If we are going to elim Titus instead of activate her I would like to

HURT: annie

[Annie Edison]

Sharding is how we go from human to demon.

[Annie Edison]

Did you do your homework like PA told you Bell?

@AA9- I feel like you should understand why this can’t be a prolonged discussion. I’m not getting into it more, but as is scum need like 75% of the setup to be demons to win?

So given we’re at like, 18 max, I think we’re okay. (Please note all math is in guesstimates)

[Annie Edison]

@AA9- it’s not that I’m trying to be rude it’s just very anti town (particularly in this group) to discuss this much. Some of us have roles that change based on shards. That’s the bottom line, iirc it was in the setup description.

Note: it is

Straightforward Central Mechanic - Players can accumulate "shards" to become demonic, and potentially alter what powers they have access to - at a cost

[Annie Edison]

Snarky
CephTD
Me/bulge
Unwnd
Manatee
Luke
Aa9
Dunn
Spiffy
Pooky

[Annie Edison]

I’ve been thinking about the fact that Rhea and Medea have each other both as scum and there hasn’t been a competing wagon between them. I was trying to decide how I feel about jt.

[Annie Edison]

I’ve definitely made several attempts to reach out to manatee and seen no response despite her asking to be interacted with

[Annie Edison]

@unwnd can I have a hint

[Annie Edison]

howdy

[Annie Edison]

i think for my next big game i need to focus on being able to play without having read the thread holyyy

lol usually it takes 1 full read for me to feel like wanting to post and 2 to be of any use

[Annie Edison]

(im caught up now tho)

[Annie Edison]

Luke I'm not sure you ever answered my question about how you've been approaching LLD throughout this game? and how that process has evolved for you

[Annie Edison]

(im caught up now tho)

Thoughts on the last 24 hours-ish?

I need to re-ISO titus. luke's case is admittedly pretty convincing, and I

really

didn't like that thing with Rhea appearing twice on her list. on its own like you said clerical errors/setup misunderstandings/"townslips" etc are so commonplace in site meta not to mention this very game that it cant really be read into. but when asked about it, Titus lied about having copy+pasted medea's list (her abbreviations for basically all the other slots were different, pooky/pooks, fferybell/snark etc), which is just......bizarre. but I don't like the mindset a white lie like that implies.

I don't think Medea has been approaching Rhea with any good faith and fmpov its been getting worse as the game progresses. I'm not familiar with PA but in my last game w scumCabd (a newbie with a tragic ending) he planned basically a full-game-length long con in his trajectory vs his partner, and this reminds me very much of that. im not saying they're s/s, i think Rhea is solidly town, but it's a method that's familiar to me of Cabd's scumplay, and I know they're both more than adept at faking emotion.

mmmm am i missing something? i feel i am