Open 575: Friends & Enemies-Together At Last (OVER)

[acryon]

I'm also not saying I am ride or die with bork or anything, but I am finding myself trusting his reads more at this point than my own. Which is a little sad, but it's the fact of the matter.

[Mathdino]

Specifically:
-The wgeurts meta situation is a very weird slip, and I didn't buy your answer to it.
-Post like 1956 are awkwardly emotional compared to the way you've played a lot of this game.
-1928 in general is very on-point.

I don't feel the need to go through and put my thumbs up on everything he has said that I agree with and thumbs down on your responses, as I think the conversation speaks for itself. I have no reason to re-hash good arguments that he has already made. I won't say I'm 100% confident you are scum, but I am more confident in bork's case on you than in any case I have on anyone else. Maybe that's just a cop-out, but as the only confirmed-town, I have good reason to believe his play more than anyone else's, so putting extra weight on his input just makes sense IMO.

-I get defencive of my reasoning. I take pride in my reasoning. bork claims that I should never have voted wgeurts, I say 'like hell I shouldn't've'. It doesn't say why I'm town but it does say why that wasn't a bad move.
-I'm an awkwardly emotional guy. And I'd prefer my first loss to be a game I played poorly.

So what I'm getting is,
tl;dr: You're a sheep.

Edit: Give your lynch order, acryon.

[Newbie]

bmws, acryon

Why do you keep putting off your vote?

[Newbie]

bmws, acryon

Why do you keep putting off your vote?

[Mathdino]

Because I'm not ready to lynch anyone until I see people's lynch orders.

Do you see scum motivation in this?

[borkjerfkin]

Also, I think you're wrong about both me and mathdino.

That's nice; articulate it.

[Mathdino]

bork, lynch order. After all, it looks like acryon'll be a bit lost without confirmed town's help tomorrow.

[Newbie]

Because I'm not ready to lynch anyone until I see people's lynch orders.

Do you see scum motivation in this?

No. I strongly believe you're town.

Also, I think you're wrong about both me and mathdino.

That's nice; articulate it.

Well I'm town obviously, so there's the reason for me. You didn't say how I'm acting scummy, btw.

For mathdino, I just have a strong gut feeling that he's town. Everything from him seems genuine. Yeah, he did end up contradicting himself, but that's because he pulled a confirmation bias.

[Mathdino]

Can someone explain how I contradicted myself? All of the last 2 pages make sense to me.
Like, quote something and bold it, hit me over the head with it.

So Newbie, I'm guessing your order is then BMWS, acryon, me, you?

[Newbie]

So Newbie, I'm guessing your order is then BMWS, acryon, me, you?

Yes.

[borkjerfkin]

For mathdino, I just have a strong gut feeling that he's town. Everything from him seems genuine. Yeah, he did end up contradicting himself, but that's because he pulled a confirmation bias.

Seems we're at a standstill then.

[borkjerfkin]

I'm an awkwardly emotional guy. And I'd prefer my first loss to be a game I played poorly.

Perspective slip

You know how getting lynched today is a definite loss?

It's if you're scum

[Mathdino]

Getting lynched and acryon and Newbie lynching BMWS is a definite loss. I will lynch myself over a NL if the lynch orders prove satisfactory.

[Newbie]

mathdino, what I don't understand is why you're not trying to get a vote started on who you think is scummy.

[Mathdino]

A. I run the danger of actually lynching someone. Which I don't want to do right now.
B. I want to see how other people are voting first.

Can you point out that contradiction?

[borkjerfkin]

mathdino, what I don't understand is why you're not trying to get a vote started on who you think is scummy.

This is the stuff that is kinda irking me from Newbie. Her read on you seems a bit sticky in contrast to all the things she's pointing out as objectionable from you

[Newbie]

A. I run the danger of actually lynching someone. Which I don't want to do right now.
B. I want to see how other people are voting first.

Can you point out that contradiction?

But you're about to get lynched, and making a case on someone could sway votes.

mathdino, what I don't understand is why you're not trying to get a vote started on who you think is scummy.

This is the stuff that is kinda irking me from Newbie. Her read on you seems a bit sticky in contrast to all the things she's pointing out as objectionable from you

I think he's town, and I don't want him getting lynched. Scum is in one of bmws or acryon.

[Mathdino]

I already made my case. I need BMWS's input before moving forward.
Do you really think that voting you is going to encourage more people to?
I also kinda want acryon to stop being a sheep and provide his own thoughts on this.

[Newbie]

That's exactly what everything is hanging on: input from bmws

Until then everything remains stagnant.

[borkjerfkin]

I actually agree in that regard. I don't have anything else to say right now.

[acryon]

bork, lynch order. After all, it looks like acryon'll be a bit lost without confirmed town's help tomorrow.

Well I'm not helpless, and if I make it to tomorrow then of course I'm on my own, but it just makes sense to pay extra attention to what bork has to say given the gamestate.

Regarding lynch order, I don't think it's necessary to give that out. All that does is give whoever is scum more information to work off of. I'd rather not do that. If they want to work for it then fine, but I'm not going to spell it out for them. The only person it makes sense to get an order from is bork because A) He's the only person we can trust and B) He probably won't be alive tomorrow so scum can't feed on it.

[Newbie]

Well, I'm not changing my vote, so y'all can do whatever.

[borkjerfkin]

I'm not giving out an order.

[Mathdino]

I'm also not saying I am ride or die with bork or anything, but I am finding myself trusting his reads more at this point than my own. Which is a little sad, but it's the fact of the matter.

So what you're telling me.
Is because he's confirmed town.
You trust a different confirmed town more than yourself, who is (presumably) confirmed town?

If you lynch me, 'ride or die' is exactly what you're doing.

The entirety of 2023 is just showing an inability to think for yourself. So go through my ISO. Go through Newbie's ISO. You already went for BMWS's so screw that. Show me why I'm a better candidate than them just because bork says so.

Also, you guys have yet to point out the contradiction. The conversation very much does not 'speak for itself'.

[acryon]

I'm also not saying I am ride or die with bork or anything, but I am finding myself trusting his reads more at this point than my own. Which is a little sad, but it's the fact of the matter.

So what you're telling me.
Is because he's confirmed town.
You trust a different confirmed town more than yourself, who is (presumably) confirmed town?

Yes, because most of my reads have been wrong this game, and I'm mostly at a lost today. So if it's between two confirmed towns, I am going to trust the one who has been right more (which is him).

If you lynch me, 'ride or die' is exactly what you're doing.

That's not true. If you were lynched and flipped town, and then tomorrow I refused to think for myself and simply followed what bork had presented against the living players, that would be the case.

The entirety of 2023 is just showing an inability to think for yourself. So go through my ISO. Go through Newbie's ISO. You already went for BMWS's so screw that. Show me why I'm a better candidate than them just because bork says so.

Also, you guys have yet to point out the contradiction. The conversation very much does not 'speak for itself'.

The entire meta-reasoning on wgeurts was a contradiction. And I did write-ups on both BMWS and Newbie, and Bork's case on you and the subsequent discussion are better evidence than either of my cases IMO.