Mini 1742: game over

[JohnnyFarrar]

Why tho

[Titus]

Why tho

We have been over wicked and abr town, thus ice is the only possible scum.

Scum want townies under a microscope so frequently they'll answer about their buddy but find some way to try to draw the focus on town.

[JohnnyFarrar]

You think that's what Ice is doing now?

[Titus]

Hey, I'm not scumreading Ice, I'm just not townreading him all that much.

Regardless, Wickan is scummy as all shit and he's pushing on me to boot so I'm happy getting rid of that.

ABR is lurking like shit which is as far as I understand it exactly what he does as scum.

It's definitely what RC looks to be doing here. Taly makes a sweeping statement. RC says nope null reading ICE and then offers up two townies.

Ice has plenty of content to take a stand on.

[Wickan]

But ICE has taken plenty of stands. He thinks I'm scum paired with one of you or Taly. And he's danced w/ RC about meta and us about "how do scum vs town think."

So is your belief that RC is scum reliant on ICE also being scum?

[Titus]

Wickan, you misunderstood. I was telling RC that Ice has said plenty to where RC should be able to sort him. The fact she's null is troubling.

[Wickan]

Okay, I understand. But my question is still there. You're saying that RC is avoiding sorting ICE and saying that that's scummy. But does that also rely on ICE being scum? If we knew for a fact that ICE was town, would that still be problematic??

[Titus]

Yup. Scum like to fenceshit and busywork. Null reads on high content qualifies.

[ICEninja]

Whoa a lot happened in a short time.

Why, are you quitting mafiascum?

I'll quit joining games you're in.

So what you're saying here is: In having a townish intention and follow-through to an RVS wagon - talah is scummy and might have been wanting a speedlynch for then townishly pushing on and interpreting reactions from, his random wagon target.

You just used extremely strong language, is all. I do the same thing, I just don't ever say I'm happy with lynching someone on page 2. You were obviously trying to draw attention to yourself, so it wasn't explicitly scummy, just over the top.

Also, talah, yes I do have an agenda. I want to find scum. I'm not going to do that if I don't press in on things I find eyebrow-raising, like your declaration of a wagon being lynchworthy on page 2. Should I instead adopt a strategy where I completely ignore a player that gives me town vibes early on? I've done that and lost games because scum tricked me in to holding a town read too long.

Plus, I rarely hear town say something like:

"Oh, get over yourself"

That is alignment-neutral irritation. You tried to come off as some martyr because town was pushing you for this reason and that and woe is me and it just annoyed me. I pressured you early to see where it would go.

Eckh.... Association tells aren't bad D1, but Ice has relied a bit on those on his reads which feels like he's creating a little world that revolves around who needs to be lynched rather than looking at his reads in an individual light. If that's understandable.

I feel like this is also either a misrepresentation of my views or a demonstration that you don't understand them. I've clearly stated more than once that Wickan is, by far, the scummiest player in this game.

Also

, his scum flip will give information. There's a reason I'm NOT voting Titus, because without any flips, my associative tell is useless. You can bet that'll change day 2 if we get the relevant information.

Titus, Taly has tons of content to read but I'm pretty neutral on him. Do you seriously think every player should either be town or scum reading EVERY PLAYER on day 1?

------------

Wickan, we aren't lynching Taly today. He isn't the townest player in the game or anything, but seriously, there are like 5 better lynches than him.

------------

Regarding my last game with ARB where he basically posted like he is now then ditched, I

think

he was town. Based on what others have said, he does this as either alignment though.

I'm leaning slightly scum on ABR, since while he could be disinterested in the game, town has no benefit to lying about that and lurking.

[Titus]

RC Taly Ice, are y'all scumbuddies again?

Since you can clearly use slightly scum and slightly town, a pure null read with high content is something I don't like.

[mykonian]

votecount

Wickan (3): JohnnyFarrar, Frozen Angel, ICEninja
Albert B. Rampage (3): RadiantCowbells, Taly, talah
JohnnyFarrar (2): A Simple Plan, Albert B. Rampage
RadiantCowbells (1): Titus
Taly (1): Wickan
Frozen Angel (1):

not voting (0):

[Titus]

RC, why you no fight me?

Vote me. :-p

[ICEninja]

So...you have strong feelings on every non ABR and SP player on day 1 with zero flips?

Yeah...no.

[Titus]

Vote me Ice. If you think I am so terrible. Come on.

Wicked is town. ABR is probably town. Johnny is lean townbeard.

[Frozen Angel]

Wickan why you ignored my post about you?

and titus just answer this once : why wickan is definitely town?

[Titus]

I literally just did.

Reason Wickan is town

1) Wickan wagon sucks
2) people push stale wagon
3) Wickan is saying what I think.
4) ice scumslip argument is shit

I don't feel like walling. Deal.

I answered this already FA.

Please don't make me repeat myself.

[Albert B. Rampage]

I'll quit joining games you're in.

You play what, one game a year?

I came off of a very emotionally invested game, warcraft 3 mafia. When you pour that much of your life force into putting yourself into people's skin to think how they think, controlling every aspect of the thread from the pacing, to the votes, to the emotional state of other players...it's extremely exhausting.

I don't put out that kind of energy in every game. In fact, I usually have a cooldown period.

This is what usually happens, I join three games, and one of them takes off and I'm fully engaged with it while the others I simply follow my process. I make observe, I sheep bandwagons, I annoy players. That's just how it is.

Even without emotionally investing myself, I trust my judgment when it comes to my voting. I am effective either way. Sometimes, I get lynched for not bringing enough energy into the game. You have to pay the cost to be the boss. I live for the moments where I am completely obsessed with the game, when I find that sweet spot. That's the best I have to offer to this game. Worth the other games where I'm low energy and skimming.

[Titus]

ABR, I still think RC is scum. Johnny has his moments of towniness. Would prefer Ice or RC wagons though.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Consider it done.

VOTE: Ice

[Taly]

Who is this in reference to? Wickan or ABR?

Bruh the answer to this question is literally

on this page

, you gotta learn to not skim

Honestly, I just got tired of doing back and forth walls with you that weren't getting anything done. I couldn't seem to convince anybody that you were scum and it wasn't changing people's minds about me. I just thought my time was better spent elsewhere.

On Albert: I actually don't think he's scum. I mean, he's being completely useless, but I'd rather we lynch somebody we think has a decent chance to flip as opposed to a policy lynch.

Alright, I see why you didn't respond then.

Tbh, seeing as about 3 to 4 people so far have said that ABR does this as scum - makes me wonder if that's true here.

If we had to PL in this game - this isn't a bad time. But I do agree, several people are pretty decent lynch options to see flips.

Plus, I don't think ABR's flip will be void of information. Especially since Titus wants to gut-townread him while ABR plays somewhat to his scum-meta, from what I understand.

Plus, I rarely hear town say something like:

"Oh, get over yourself"

That is alignment-neutral irritation. You tried to come off as some martyr because town was pushing you for this reason and that and woe is me and it just annoyed me. I pressured you early to see where it would go.

sigh... I'm not trying to come off as anything, I'm stating what I think - if I misinterpreted it; then I'm all ears to here your side....

Eckh.... Association tells aren't bad D1, but Ice has relied a bit on those on his reads which feels like he's creating a little world that revolves around who needs to be lynched rather than looking at his reads in an individual light. If that's understandable.

I feel like this is also either a misrepresentation of my views or a demonstration that you don't understand them. I've clearly stated more than once that Wickan is, by far, the scummiest player in this game.

Also

, his scum flip will give information. There's a reason I'm NOT voting Titus, because without any flips, my associative tell is useless. You can bet that'll change day 2 if we get the relevant information.

I'd go with misunderstanding because I know you think Wickan is the scummiest person in this game, and that his flip will give info.

The thing that makes me think is - you put out a theory concerning that Wickan and I are scumpair, then Wickan comes in saying that I'm scum buddying you for the back and forth over my vote/unvote on HIM - himself.

From what I'm seeing - I'm being thrown out as an associative with several players at this point - and this isn't even considering Titus saying that I'm scum with RC and you, who you apparently scumread as well.

I don't think people see the how sticky of a situation this is - it causes all kinds of division and miscommunication, and the fact that people discredit me as "woe is me" and "youre a martyr" seriously makes me question their perspective in this game - IE, whether they have an agenda to push something as scum despite what may be presented, or town who actually wants to decipher between the game and work on it.

This is why I considered - and still leaning toward, you being town - and Wickan - being possible scum, for the inconsistencies I've seen of him - and the idea that he hasn't pushed anyone else yet after saying that my wagon isn't going anywhere...

That's my thought process.

RC Taly Ice, are y'all scumbuddies again?

Since you can clearly use slightly scum and slightly town, a pure null read with high content is something I don't like.

1)

A pure null read? I see pure-null as something of "Oh, can't tell - not inclined to look to much into it"

Each of my posts so far as of when Wickan and Ice post, is me engaging with them to create conversation.

2) Did I misread? How would you know if we had 3 scum? This alone is worth my vote.

3)

Love how you threw RC, Ice, and I together in some shit-association. Especially since:

Wickans vote is on me, he express he wants to get people to vote for me - but you only throw me in with RC and Ice's name and then paint my reads on Wickan and Ice as pure-null without trying to engage with me on my previous post about them.

You got ABR to vote - he went for Ice - after he voted for RC and John, and you've tunneled RC for the last 280 posts. Something I've never seen you do remotely as town. Please link a time where you did so if I am wrong.

Unsure of how to read ABR's 341....

UNVOTE: Albert B. Rampage
VOTE: Titus

We haven't had a true push on you.

Hope you sharpened those claws since RVS.

[Titus]

Consider it done.

VOTE: Ice

VOTE: Ice

[Titus]

Who is this in reference to? Wickan or ABR?

Bruh the answer to this question is literally

on this page

, you gotta learn to not skim

Honestly, I just got tired of doing back and forth walls with you that weren't getting anything done. I couldn't seem to convince anybody that you were scum and it wasn't changing people's minds about me. I just thought my time was better spent elsewhere.

On Albert: I actually don't think he's scum. I mean, he's being completely useless, but I'd rather we lynch somebody we think has a decent chance to flip as opposed to a policy lynch.

Alright, I see why you didn't respond then.

Tbh, seeing as about 3 to 4 people so far have said that ABR does this as scum - makes me wonder if that's true here.

If we had to PL in this game - this isn't a bad time. But I do agree, several people are pretty decent lynch options to see flips.

Plus, I don't think ABR's flip will be void of information. Especially since Titus wants to gut-townread him while ABR plays somewhat to his scum-meta, from what I understand.

Plus, I rarely hear town say something like:

"Oh, get over yourself"

That is alignment-neutral irritation. You tried to come off as some martyr because town was pushing you for this reason and that and woe is me and it just annoyed me. I pressured you early to see where it would go.

sigh... I'm not trying to come off as anything, I'm stating what I think - if I misinterpreted it; then I'm all ears to here your side....

Eckh.... Association tells aren't bad D1, but Ice has relied a bit on those on his reads which feels like he's creating a little world that revolves around who needs to be lynched rather than looking at his reads in an individual light. If that's understandable.

I feel like this is also either a misrepresentation of my views or a demonstration that you don't understand them. I've clearly stated more than once that Wickan is, by far, the scummiest player in this game.

Also

, his scum flip will give information. There's a reason I'm NOT voting Titus, because without any flips, my associative tell is useless. You can bet that'll change day 2 if we get the relevant information.

I'd go with misunderstanding because I know you think Wickan is the scummiest person in this game, and that his flip will give info.

The thing that makes me think is - you put out a theory concerning that Wickan and I are scumpair, then Wickan comes in saying that I'm scum buddying you for the back and forth over my vote/unvote on HIM - himself.

From what I'm seeing - I'm being thrown out as an associative with several players at this point - and this isn't even considering Titus saying that I'm scum with RC and you, who you apparently scumread as well.

I don't think people see the how sticky of a situation this is - it causes all kinds of division and miscommunication, and the fact that people discredit me as "woe is me" and "youre a martyr" seriously makes me question their perspective in this game - IE, whether they have an agenda to push something as scum despite what may be presented, or town who actually wants to decipher between the game and work on it.

This is why I considered - and still leaning toward, you being town - and Wickan - being possible scum, for the inconsistencies I've seen of him - and the idea that he hasn't pushed anyone else yet after saying that my wagon isn't going anywhere...

That's my thought process.

RC Taly Ice, are y'all scumbuddies again?

Since you can clearly use slightly scum and slightly town, a pure null read with high content is something I don't like.

1)

A pure null read? I see pure-null as something of "Oh, can't tell - not inclined to look to much into it"

Each of my posts so far as of when Wickan and Ice post, is me engaging with them to create conversation.

2) Did I misread? How would you know if we had 3 scum? This alone is worth my vote.

3)

Love how you threw RC, Ice, and I together in some shit-association. Especially since:

Wickans vote is on me, he express he wants to get people to vote for me - but you only throw me in with RC and Ice's name and then paint my reads on Wickan and Ice as pure-null without trying to engage with me on my previous post about them.

You got ABR to vote - he went for Ice - after he voted for RC and John, and you've tunneled RC for the last 280 posts. Something I've never seen you do remotely as town. Please link a time where you did so if I am wrong.

Unsure of how to read ABR's 341....

UNVOTE: Albert B. Rampage
VOTE: Titus

We haven't had a true push on you.

Hope you sharpened those claws since RVS.

1) The latter is worse than the former.

2) LOL. Game size, mini 3 scum is true in 90% of games. The fact you try to argue scumslip from that is LOL.

3) Read my town games. :-p I tunnel as both alignments when I have scum especially when the top wagons are shit.

4) You gotta try harder. You can't mislynch ABR or Wickan with me being in the way. Haha. Sorry not sorry.

[Taly]

@Titus

1)

In terms of my reads? Well, I make mine coherent.

2)

Look at the many Mini Normals I have played - all my games (without ones I replaced in/out, which were Larges you were apart of) - I've never been in in Normals this size. Plus, any statistic isn't very reassuring on D1.

3)

Is the Johnny wagon also bad? If so, why?

4)

Haha. Haha. Haha. Haha. Haha. Haha.

>_> Instead of trying to figure out how scummy you can be without getting lynched; try actually forming more than 2 townreads while giving reasons why a wagon should be pursued versus shitting all over the ones that have occurred so far and minimizing those arguments that have been made against you.

I shouldn't have to read between the meanings of your posts to have a hint of what you're trying to do.

[Wickan]

about me pressuring you - I voted you to see your reaction and it was awful. you started accusing others when people started asking you questions. this was weird.

I started accusing others of being scum? Yes, yes I did. That is the game. Do you think that I did so in a particularly suspicious manner, and if so, why?

I read your only meta town game in site and this is not like it all.

I have one game from four months ago. I would argue you're reading way too much into one game.
(also, I would argue that there's plenty of continuity in my town playstyle: I sucked in that game and am doing poorly here )

I asked you a question about the ones your scum reading in your wagon and you refused to answer.

I think I've basically given my thoughts about all players (well, not Simple Plan, but there's nothing there).

Unsure of how to read ABR's 341....

I think the easiest way to read it is on its face: an admission from Albert that he's not going to put much effort into this game. I honestly don't see that as particularly alignment-neutral either way though.

[ICEninja]

Vote me Ice. If you think I am so terrible. Come on.

Wickan didn't do the thing you're giving him a town read for. You're actively defending him anyway, pushing someone because they left their RVS vote after developing a townread, and having "shit reasons" for voting someone. Forgive me if I don't do what you tell me to.

You play what, one game a year?

I did stop for 2 years, but I'm usually in 1-2 games at a time with minimal break between.

Aaaand you vote me. Glad to know you're voting for the person who calls you out instead of who you think is scum.

The thing that makes me think is - you put out a theory concerning that Wickan and I are scumpair,

Notice that I haven't brought that theory up in a while. In fact, my current theory is that if Wickan is scum, you confused him with your unvote; his post 113 could also read as "but Taly isn't my scumbuddy so it was confusing".

The 1v1 with Taly and Titus is interesting. Right now Taly is bringing up good points and Titus is responding mostly with "haha lol you're bad". Right after Titus switched his vote to me because it looks like he could push my wagon instead of RC whom he hasn't given very compelling reasons for voting.

Defending Wickan based on something that never happened, Attacks my case with weird reasoning, Chainsaw defends by voting me, someone is certainly VERY nervous of town finding Wickan's alignment, because he knows just how damning this is.

I still prefer a WickanWagon, but I could get behind lynching Titus today.