Mewbie 1461 ~ Game Ovah

[Drake Crusader]

it's honestly stupid.
I was certain Zek was scum because of his gameplay. How can you honestly read the last few pages and NOT get a scum vibe from him. He just seemed shady as can be. I honestly, thought he went full on rage mode.
CP's wagon was gaining traction and I felt that he was the nail in the coffin to bert's partnership. shwerf was silly as a team player and I considered his slot to be scummy since he joined in. He started off by implying that KK had access to names of players being his powers within the forum. Which was a slight turn off for any content that he pushed out. He also wanted Zek gone. When I actually read his other account. I then knew that I did make a mistake and then wanted his read gone. Zek. So then zek went on a rampage and I knew that it was his turn to go. He felt like scum. Which would of then been the best avengence I could obtain since I miss hammered CP. However, even though I hammered If I didn't Zek himself then tried to hammer with his vote on CP claiming my vote was invalid. That fact was the one I knew that Zek was a scummmer. Now with the doctor gone. We lost protection of him. I would of wanted to know his feelings on You KK. You been attracting a lot of side attention for the scum vibe you give off. However, Aisa was protected so that makes her safe. I feel as I been protected once in this game from Zek however, That now does not seem the case. That Leaves in my mind you or Quill.

[Aisa]

Remember, do not put a player at L-1 before you are sure that is the player you want to lynch.

Putting a player at L-1 should be considered equal to lynching him, as that gives scum the possibility to quickhammer and win.

I feel Quill is most likely town, but I'll be checking him when I have time. I think it would have made no sense for him to kill Dean on night 2; among the non conftown players, he was and is the least suspected. He was in pretty good shape and didn't need to risk so much.
That is wifom, I know.

Drake, your posting style is awful. Like, half of your last post has flawed reasoning.
You are confbiased (or you fake being so). This basically means that when you think someone is scum, you see his posts under a scummy light, ignoring the motivations that town may have to act in that way.
During this game, when I looked at your posts, I sometimes thought "That makes no sense! I'm gonna get him lynched right now."
And, then, seconds later, "But wait no. He may just be not realizing how bad his reasoning is in this moment."
If you are town, then all is well and I did the right thing.
But, if you are scum, this is giving you an advantage. You are in a very convenient situation, because as it is now, you can do whatever you want and make no sense at all with few or no consequences.

I can't ignore that second possibility. So I warn you:
Starting from now, I'm going to treat every single of your posts that contains confirmation bias (or posts with obviously flawed logic, or basically anything that gives scum an advantage) as a scumtell.
You are going to stop for a few minutes every time you type a post to think, "Am I considering every possibility here?"

Sorry for the hard time I'm giving you.

[Malakittens]

4.01

With Four alive it takes 3 votes to lynch

Voting:

*Quill -
*Drake Crusader -
*Aisa -
*Kublai Khan -

Not Voting:

Aisa, Quill, Drake Crusader, Kublai Khan [4]

Countdowns

Day 4 ends in (expired on 2014-02-16 22:25:00)

[Quill]

I really thought we had scum with Zek, guys. I really did.

If Aisa is scum, she deserves to win this game, so I'm focusing on Kublai and Drake. Drake looks the most conventionally bad, with lurking through most of the game and now all of a sudden stepping it up with that long post on Day 4. But we've also managed to go from lynching scum on Day 1 to LyLo on Day 4, which suggests the possibility that scum's been orchestrating things the whole way through, which points to the more-active Kublai. I just can't figure out why he would have targeted and killed Dean on N2, instead of TSO, who was clearly the bigger threat.

Consider my pseudo-vote on Drake also. Drake, tell me why I'm wrong.

[Quill]

Pretty sure im lynched.

Reads seem a little moot at this point, but ya'll got 3 confirmed town so things look good. If this thread is still open when I get home ill offer thoughts.

Picard, zekrom, drake, quill, (tso, aisa, dean)

Scummirst to townest. Good luck.

Oh hey, I'm not lynched. Forgot that nobody died last night. Okay, answering questions, stand by.

Actually, wait, let's talk about these, because I forgot about them until I ISOed KK. This guy spent two days thinking he was lynched and posting reads to help town (take my word for it; I thought the dates would show up and don't want to go back for them) before realizing he'd counted wrong. Can you see scum doing that, Aisa? Or pretending to miscount, but then waiting two days to come back and "realize" he's still alive?

There's other towntells in KK's ISO, but this is the key one for me. It's got to be Drake.

[Kublai Khan]

Aisa, any questions for me? We've got two pseudo-votes for Drake Crusader and 1 pseudo-vote for me.

[Drake Crusader]

Remember, do not put a player at L-1 before you are sure that is the player you want to lynch.

Putting a player at L-1 should be considered equal to lynching him, as that gives scum the possibility to quickhammer and win.

I feel Quill is most likely town, but I'll be checking him when I have time. I think it would have made no sense for him to kill Dean on night 2; among the non conftown players, he was and is the least suspected. He was in pretty good shape and didn't need to risk so much.
That is wifom, I know.

Drake, your posting style is awful. Like, half of your last post has flawed reasoning.
You are confbiased (or you fake being so). This basically means that when you think someone is scum, you see his posts under a scummy light, ignoring the motivations that town may have to act in that way.
During this game, when I looked at your posts, I sometimes thought "That makes no sense! I'm gonna get him lynched right now."
And, then, seconds later, "But wait no. He may just be not realizing how bad his reasoning is in this moment."
If you are town, then all is well and I did the right thing.
But, if you are scum, this is giving you an advantage. You are in a very convenient situation, because as it is now, you can do whatever you want and make no sense at all with few or no consequences.

I can't ignore that second possibility. So I warn you:
Starting from now, I'm going to treat every single of your posts that contains confirmation bias (or posts with obviously flawed logic, or basically anything that gives scum an advantage) as a scumtell.
You are going to stop for a few minutes every time you type a post to think, "Am I considering every possibility here?"

Sorry for the hard time I'm giving you.

Noted , and it is fine! I need all the tips I can get. Just trying to learn my flow really.

I really thought we had scum with Zek, guys. I really did.

If Aisa is scum, she deserves to win this game, so I'm focusing on Kublai and Drake. Drake looks the most conventionally bad, with lurking through most of the game and now all of a sudden stepping it up with that long post on Day 4. But we've also managed to go from lynching scum on Day 1 to LyLo on Day 4, which suggests the possibility that scum's been orchestrating things the whole way through, which points to the more-active Kublai. I just can't figure out why he would have targeted and killed Dean on N2, instead of TSO, who was clearly the bigger threat.

Consider my pseudo-vote on Drake also. Drake, tell me why I'm wrong.

Well I feel that Aisa is 100% town. So she is off the list. I know I am town so that takes me off the list. I am concerned about KK or Quill. KK more than Quill about a 70/30 spilt. With Aisa being 0%.
I was in a busy period of school for solid two weeks so that led to my very limited activity however, with all the big snow days and the initial rush of quiz happy professors and massive homework life has calmed down a bit.
I feel to answer why he would post those reads is because he is a good scum. He has experience. He has a very well developed game and therefore know's how to fool town. Look at post 685. He already knows what actions would look scummy and even offered how he could of played it do be town.
Which is why I feel that he is scum #2.

I don't know what a pseudo vote is so I will just regular vote.
I can change to a pseudo vote right ?
VOTE: KK

[Aisa]

I just can't figure out why he would have targeted and killed Dean on N2, instead of TSO, who was clearly the bigger threat.

Think of it this way:
If Dean lived to d3, it would have almost surely guaranteed a town win. Even if we mislynched on that day, in Mylo we'd have 2 conftowns instead of only one.

Pretty sure im lynched.

Reads seem a little moot at this point, but ya'll got 3 confirmed town so things look good. If this thread is still open when I get home ill offer thoughts.

Picard, zekrom, drake, quill, (tso, aisa, dean)

Scummirst to townest. Good luck.

Oh hey, I'm not lynched. Forgot that nobody died last night. Okay, answering questions, stand by.

Actually, wait, let's talk about these, because I forgot about them until I ISOed KK. This guy spent two days thinking he was lynched and posting reads to help town (take my word for it; I thought the dates would show up and don't want to go back for them) before realizing he'd counted wrong. Can you see scum doing that, Aisa? Or pretending to miscount, but then waiting two days to come back and "realize" he's still alive?

There's other towntells in KK's ISO, but this is the key one for me. It's got to be Drake.

So much wifom. I think you are right...
...but I also think that my mind is sick of my inner monologues and is trying to convince to end this game based on whatever reasoning sounds even remotely plausible.

Aisa, any questions for me? We've got two pseudo-votes for Drake Crusader and 1 pseudo-vote for me.

See what I just said to Quill.
I'm somewhat suspicious of your hammer yesterday, but you did the intelligent thing of showing a gradual change in your opinion of Zekrom and not just hammering him out of the blue. And I think you were right in lynching Zekrom yesterday.
So, no questions. I have my suspicions, but I think at this point any question will just add another layer of wifom and confuse me even more.

[Aisa]

Noted , and it is fine! I need all the tips I can get. Just trying to learn my flow really.

I really thought we had scum with Zek, guys. I really did.

If Aisa is scum, she deserves to win this game, so I'm focusing on Kublai and Drake. Drake looks the most conventionally bad, with lurking through most of the game and now all of a sudden stepping it up with that long post on Day 4. But we've also managed to go from lynching scum on Day 1 to LyLo on Day 4, which suggests the possibility that scum's been orchestrating things the whole way through, which points to the more-active Kublai. I just can't figure out why he would have targeted and killed Dean on N2, instead of TSO, who was clearly the bigger threat.

Consider my pseudo-vote on Drake also. Drake, tell me why I'm wrong.

Well I feel that Aisa is 100% town. So she is off the list. I know I am town so that takes me off the list. I am concerned about KK or Quill. KK more than Quill about a 70/30 spilt. With Aisa being 0%.
I was in a busy period of school for solid two weeks so that led to my very limited activity however, with all the big snow days and the initial rush of quiz happy professors and massive homework life has calmed down a bit.
I feel to answer why he would post those reads is because he is a good scum. He has experience. He has a very well developed game and therefore know's how to fool town. Look at post 685. He already knows what actions would look scummy and even offered how he could of played it do be town.
Which is why I feel that he is scum #2.

I don't know what a pseudo vote is so I will just regular vote.
I can change to a pseudo vote right ?
VOTE: KK

A pseudo vote is a bit like finger of suspicion, hand of suspicion or any other way you want to call it. It's different from a normal vote because it does not count towards the official votecount. We use these because otherwise it would be too easy for the scum to hammer and win.

KK probably knows how to fool town, that's true. But it does not make him automatically scum.
Minor reasoning mistake, but I see how you could have done it. You're speaking like you are almost sure he is scum, which makes sense from a Drake-town perspective.

[Quill]

(Phone post)

@Aisa: That...makes a little sense, "that" being your reasoning on why KK would kill Dean. I hadn't considered that particular motivation for what I considered a scum mistake. Do you recall what had been decided re: who Dean should track overnight? If it was KK, that's even better evidence.

[Malakittens]

]

4.02

With Four alive it takes 3 votes to lynch

Voting:

*Quill -
*Drake Crusader -
*Aisa -
*Kublai Khan - Drake Crusader [1]

Not Voting:

Aisa, Quill, Kublai Khan [3]

Countdowns

Day 4 ends in (expired on 2014-02-16 22:25:00)

[Aisa]

I'll track who I decide to track based on my assessment of who is most/least likely to be scum. My track could be on any one of my scum targets. If I decide KK is the best bet, I'll track him.

There was never an official decision, as seen in this ^ post.

[Drake Crusader]

I would first like to
UNVOTE:
and go pseudo vote on KK

I'll track who I decide to track based on my assessment of who is most/least likely to be scum. My track could be on any one of my scum targets. If I decide KK is the best bet, I'll track him.

There was never an official decision, as seen in this ^ post.

However, wouldn't it be something if he was on to something and was going to track KK ?

[Quill]

I'll track who I decide to track based on my assessment of who is most/least likely to be scum. My track could be on any one of my scum targets. If I decide KK is the best bet, I'll track him.

There was never an official decision, as seen in this ^ post.

Okay, I guess this makes this equally applicable to either KK or Drake. KK would almost certainly have thought he was on the chopping block, as TSO was super-advocating his scumminess, and Drake could have just gotten skittish that Dean was going to pull a fake-out.

I guess the decision for me is starting to come down to whether or not Drake is making less-than-great arguments because he's scum, or because of the confirmation bias you mention. I definitely believe KK

could

be making himself look super-towny as scum, I'm just not positive he is.

[Kublai Khan]

Unvote: TSO
Vote: Shewrf

Because at least Zekrom's posts have been entertaining, and he might get it together overNight.

@Quill - I know it's been a while, but do you have any idea why you capitalized the N in night?

[Quill]

@KK - Shorthand way of indicating (possibly unnecessarily) that I was talking about a game Night, not a real-world night. I think I've done it consistently elsewhere in the thread, not quite sure where to give examples though.

[Drake Crusader]

I believe KK is trying to divert attention from his scum play. By asking that question. It scores town points for him on Quill. This is a example why he would be scum.
I look at Aisa being town.
Quill is either the most passive scum I have played against. ( only being in two games that doesn't mean much.. I know)
Which leaves KK as scum. We could say that we have a hint that he is suspicious from the town tracker which, wanted him to be tracked (possibly). I believe from the quote he made, that the possibility of KK being tracked that night was pretty good. Then we know that the doctor saved aisa both days, as the player list got smaller KK killed TSO. I guess if I have this grid down that leaves us with col. C as our role pool which makes us out of power roles. This would equal that If KK doesn't get lynched then we misslynch with a town and with his NK knowing that the doctor can't save one of us then It is a scum victory?

[Aisa]

...Yes. In that case, it would be a scum victory.

Actually, let's ask a few questions.

Drake

, what makes you feel that Quill is passive?
Why did you feel the need to ask that question about the scum victory?
Why do you think that KK is trying to score town points as scum, as opposed to a townie acting as a townie?

Kublai

, so what do you think of Drake?

[Quill]

I don't have time to do it tonight, but my expectation is that tomorrow I'll be able to go through the game and make a town/scum list (think pro-con list, basically) for both KK and Drake's actions throughout the game. Aisa, is there one you're leaning toward at this point? Unfortunately, we're going to have to be on the same page to end the day, and hope that we make the right call.

I'd also like to reiterate Aisa's request to have KK give an opinion on Drake, as well as the reverse. One of you is scum and one of you is town, and I'd like to have something on record for both of you to pick through, in order to help figure out which is which.

[Kublai Khan]

sorry, been sick the past few days. Will write up something proper within 12 hours or so.

[Drake Crusader]

Drake

, what makes you feel that Quill is passive?
Why did you feel the need to ask that question about the scum victory?
Why do you think that KK is trying to score town points as scum, as opposed to a townie acting as a townie?

-I feel passive is the term to use to describe him because he hasn't done anything that would be viewed as a large scum sign. So he would be the scum that no one would notice or even think of. Sort of just sitting on the side lines watching it all play out.
-Well I am still ironing out the points of these forum based mafia games. Just wanted to confirm that this is either we win or we lose kinda situation. I know people use a term but, I don't remember it off my head at time of posting nor at this moment I am typing this.
-I feel he has been picking flak up all game. He would be the perfect scum. I know from my other scum game that people kinda picked me out quick. Which is why I like KK's play so much. His ability to slide into town mode and look town while knowing everyone's alignment at this point is neat. However, his ability to kill at night makes it very dangerous to keep him alive. Hence the perfect scum. That was why I voted him!

[Aisa]

Currently, in the moment I am writing this post, I'm leaning towards a KK lynch.

I found something interesting.

I'm somewhat suspicious of your hammer yesterday, but you did the intelligent thing of showing a gradual change in your opinion of Zekrom and not just hammering him out of the blue. And I think you were right in lynching Zekrom yesterday.

@Aisa - What do you think of Post 640?

...It looks like he almost wanted to make sure I was fine with the lynch before he hammered.
KK, comment this.

[Kublai Khan]

Kublai, so what do you think of Drake?

There's two major reasons why I think that Drake Crusader is the second/final scum.

There's PoE: You are town by virtue of the lack of kill on Night 1 (the possibility of scum no kill exists, but is negligable) and I just don't see Quill as being Bert's partner given that he shot down any possible counter-wagon to Bert in the waning moments of Day 1. I just don't read Quill as a ballsy enough player to do that. I know I'm town, so that leaves Drake Crusader.

Second is Drake Crusader's play over the last few game days. Check his ISO from #14 to 18. There is a vote in every post (usually after coasting 3 days). There's no attempt to play. He ignored every question thrown his way. He just popped in and hammered because.. just because. His later reasoning (in Post 700) makes no sense at all.

Currently, in the moment I am writing this post, I'm leaning towards a KK lynch.
I found something interesting.

I'm somewhat suspicious of your hammer yesterday, but you did the intelligent thing of showing a gradual change in your opinion of Zekrom and not just hammering him out of the blue. And I think you were right in lynching Zekrom yesterday.

@Aisa - What do you think of Post 640?

...It looks like he almost wanted to make sure I was fine with the lynch before he hammered.
KK, comment this.

Yes, that's exactly what I was trying to do. You are the town leader in this game and you threw a fit over the way Captain Picard was hammered. I found a telling clue that suggested that Dean Harper's killer didn't fully understand how the Matrix6 setup worked and/or still believed that T S O was a 1-shot bulletproof.

Look at this, Aisa:

Which leaves KK as scum. We could say that we have a hint that he is suspicious from the town tracker which, wanted him to be tracked (possibly). I believe from the quote he made, that the possibility of KK being tracked that night was pretty good.

Drake Crusader thinks scum is worried about the tracker. If I were scum, I would have killed the doctor. The tracker died before the doctor.

C'mon Aisa. It's crystal clear that Drake Crusader is scum.

[Kublai Khan]

*prods game*

[Drake Crusader]

Trying to work the kill list in your favor ?
You didn't have to worry about the doctor. Since you knew he was going to protect Aisa again like he said he did on the other morning. Therefore, you were able to focus on killing the tracker who would of pinned you to the being the one who sent the kill on the doctor.
How can you argue that ?
I don't like how your last line it almost pleading with her to rethink the game.