Mini 1469: Rage (Game Over)

[GuyInFreezer]

vote count 2.8

morph the cat (L-6):

Shamrock (L-6):

Cheery Dog (L-4):

Team Rocket | Yates

Naomi-Tan (L-6):

serrapaladin (L-6):

Surviva316 (L-6):

Yates (L-5):

surviva316

Kalimar (L-6):

>

Team Rocket (L-2):

implosion | Shamrock | Kalimar | serrapaladin

implosion (L-6):

Not Voting:

Cheery dog, Naomi-Tan, morph the cat

With 10 alive, it takes 6 votes to lynch.

Until deadline: (expired on 2013-08-07 11:00:00)

Mod Notes

• I wanna stop using emoticons

[Yates]

I'm going to need you to explain this like I'm a five-year-old with a learning disability.

Everyone seems to think scum kill people suspicious of them. The reality is that scum just kill either because they are too Town or to create WIFOM. Neither of those two were "holy shit Town" reads for everyone. So whichever one was killed by scum was killed for wifom.

TR *could be* 3rd party [since an SK might ACTUALLY be inclined to kill someone with a strong scum read on them], I suppose, but isn't scum.

[implosion]

I'm going to need you to explain this like I'm a five-year-old with a learning disability.

Everyone seems to think scum kill people suspicious of them. The reality is that scum just kill either because they are too Town or to create WIFOM. Neither of those two were "holy shit Town" reads for everyone. So whichever one was killed by scum was killed for wifom.

TR *could be* 3rd party [since an SK might ACTUALLY be inclined to kill someone with a strong scum read on them], I suppose, but isn't scum.

Uh... yes, effulgence was kind of townread by pretty much everyone. I can't think of anyone who scumread them (at least off the top of my head) and I can think of a lot of people that townread them. Are you really saying he wasn't near-universally thought of as town? Who else would scum have killed if they wanted to go for a "holy shit town" read?

Also, there is no one "way it is" with how scum kill. Some scum will kill those who suspect them. Some will kill those who are too town. Some will kill based on who they think are power roles. You can't generalize like that.

The entire reasoning of "eff suspected TR, therefore TR is town" in and of itself is also really, really horrid. It completely ignores that there could be myriad other reasons that we don't know for the kill on effulgence. It seems like it's making more assumptions than feels natural.

Hrm.

[implosion]

Additionally, there's an element of congitive dissonance there. You simultaneously expected Shamrock to figure out on his own why those comments from the dead made TR town, while admitting that "Everyone seems to think scum kill people suspicious of them." You can't simultaneously think that common knowledge would dictate one thing and expect Shamrock to disagree with that.

[morph the cat]

We have time now, nya. Pulling ISO(s)

[Team Rocket]

Heyy people, just got back really late yesterday, and about to go into work. Content later tonight.

[Kalimar]

We have time now, nya. Pulling ISO(s)

How did that go?

[Shamrock]

I'm going to need you to explain this like I'm a five-year-old with a learning disability.

Everyone seems to think scum kill people suspicious of them. The reality is that scum just kill either because they are too Town or to create WIFOM. Neither of those two were "holy shit Town" reads for everyone. So whichever one was killed by scum was killed for wifom.

TR *could be* 3rd party [since an SK might ACTUALLY be inclined to kill someone with a strong scum read on them], I suppose, but isn't scum.

Implosion has already pointed out that this is not very good reasoning. Even if you think it is good reasoning, though, why did you wait so long to bring this up if it is so obvious to you and so relevant to the alignment of today's main wagon?

[Yates]

Even if you think it is good reasoning, though, why did you wait so long to bring this up if it is so obvious to you and so relevant to the alignment of today's main wagon?

Specifically because it is

good

reasoning but it isn't

strong

reasoning. Also, I don't like to show my cards. Why would I tell scum what I'm looking for in relational tells? That's counterproductive.

My point [in a question not for you, mind you] is that you didn't appear to take any of yesterday's information into account with your vote on an easy wagon. And that's scummy. Also, trying to focus on a portion of a question out of context is SUPER scummy.

[Shamrock]

So you do think that this reasoning was obvious, and it was enough to make you uninterested in voting for Team Rocket today. But you didn't feel it was worth bringing up evidence that the target of today's primary wagon is town? If you aren't going to use your relational tells in determining who we lynch, when

are

you planning on using them, exactly? This hardly seems like the behavior of a townie who cares about who is lynched.

I don't consider the information you brought up valuable, so no, I didn't take it into account. What do you think of implosion's critique of your reasoning?

[morph the cat]

We have time now, nya. Pulling ISO(s)

How did that go?

Haven't had a chance to sync up 100% yet, but our initial findings is that as town, Elyse is very much a leader type player, regardless of the strength or weakness of the rest of the player base. We're not really seeing that here from a re-read of the game. It is possible the VLA is slanting this, but I'm still feeling like this isn't townplay, nya.

We had a look at a newbie scum game where she replaced in. She was pretty low key in that one, but sailed right through to the win. Maybe there is a better scum game to look at than a newbie. Ffery will do her usual deeper conclusions soon enough.

[Team Rocket]

Not sure what more to say at this point...
My townread on Naomi is wavering, based on her recent posts just generally not being constructive.
-ac

yeah cool, you do know im one of the only people who doesn't think your scum, maybe you should look else where for criticism, on the other point. Yeah, she is attacking people defending her. isn't that a pro-town thing on the basis that scum are trying not to die.

what is this???
The thing is that, you haven't posted any case or analysis of anyone since your case on Reecer6 yesterday...Around that time, you became a solid town read for most of the players in this game...Since that point, you've done basically nothing but defend yourself or make a few short comments here and there...Makes you look like you're coasting by.
Also why would it matter that you think I am town? I'm actually more likely to townread players who legitimately think I am scum and fight for my lynch.

I'm going to need you to explain this like I'm a five-year-old with a learning disability.

Everyone seems to think scum kill people suspicious of them. The reality is that scum just kill either because they are too Town or to create WIFOM. Neither of those two were "holy shit Town" reads for everyone. So whichever one was killed by scum was killed for wifom.

Well the only way to know why scum killed someone is to be the scum themselves, and while I am ok with nightkill speculation statements like "the reality is" are kind of ridonkulous....

Anyway, I think Serra's wagon hop onto CD and then back onto me looks out of place...He basically townreads cheery all day yesterday and only started scumreading him earlier today with no reasoning given...I think he was expecting more people to follow Yates', and when he didn't he switched back. So file serrapaladin in the scumread pile.

In fact I'll switch to him if there is more interest in lynching him than Cheery.
-ac

[serrapaladin]

Oh shush, you. I never had anything close to a scumread on Cheery, and you should really view my temporary vote on him in context. Nice try to start another counterwagon to yourself though.

[Yates]

If you aren't going to use your relational tells in determining who we lynch, when are you planning on using them, exactly?

When I vote? When I make my Town and Scum reads? When I chose not to jump on the TR wagon to rush a lynch through?

What do you think of implosion's critique of your reasoning?

I don't particularly care how implosion scum hunts since he's a Town read. As long as I'm following his logic and he's making cases? I'm cool.

[implosion]

Unvote

VOTE: Yates

[Yates]

Unvote

VOTE: Yates

You moved to the wrong wagon. It should be Cheery Dog.

[implosion]

*twiddles thumbs*

[Team Rocket]

Oh shush, you. I never had anything close to a scumread on Cheery, and you should really view my temporary vote on him in context. Nice try to start another counterwagon to yourself though.

Don't really want to lynch Naomi any more. Team Rocket/cheery are the closest to scumreads I have right now.

don't fucking condescend to me as if I haven't done my research or as if I'm some sort of monkey that has been trained to play mafia
-ac

[Shamrock]

If you aren't going to use your relational tells in determining who we lynch, when are you planning on using them, exactly?

When I vote? When I make my Town and Scum reads? When I chose not to jump on the TR wagon to rush a lynch through?

What do you think of implosion's critique of your reasoning?

I don't particularly care how implosion scum hunts since he's a Town read. As long as I'm following his logic and he's making cases? I'm cool.

both of these answers are really terrible tbh

[Cheery Dog]

Oh shush, you. I never had anything close to a scumread on Cheery, and you should really view my temporary vote on him in context. Nice try to start another counterwagon to yourself though.

The context that you voted without reasons? Without even a scum read?

Let's have a look at other posts around there, there's where I voted Yates and then unvoted yates because I had misread in excitement of possibly finding a meta scum tell on him.

I don't think anything happened while you had the vote on me, seeing you you never mentioned anything except that you were happy to then put TR onto L-1.

Opportunism detected.

VOTE: serrapaladin

Unvote

VOTE: Yates

You moved to the wrong wagon. It should be Cheery Dog.

Do you have more reasons than I stuffed myself up with what I thought you were doing and rushed stuff?
Because I'm faily sure if you're going to push wagons like they're the only senisical thing you should do. If not then I'll settle for you just having OMGUSed me with no actual case.

[Kalimar]

We have time now, nya. Pulling ISO(s)

How did that go?

Haven't had a chance to sync up 100% yet, but our initial findings is that as town, Elyse is very much a leader type player, regardless of the strength or weakness of the rest of the player base. We're not really seeing that here from a re-read of the game. It is possible the VLA is slanting this, but I'm still feeling like this isn't townplay, nya.

We had a look at a newbie scum game where she replaced in. She was pretty low key in that one, but sailed right through to the win. Maybe there is a better scum game to look at than a newbie. Ffery will do her usual deeper conclusions soon enough.

How about the ac head?

Also, do either of your heads have any completed low-priority/low-effort games on this site? I see you guys posting a storm elsewhere and it doesn't fill me with confidence. The whole 'we're swamped' thing doesn't really work when I see you guys doing that either - clearly you have the time or you wouldn't have joined another game together.

[Yates]

Opportunism detected.

Actually, I hadn't noticed this. And that's not serra's style as Town.

VOTE: Serrapaladin

[Kalimar]

@AC:

I did ctrl+f on Cheery in serra's ISO and I don't see that he ever gave him a town-read, he tended to be in the middle of the pile and then later a slight null-scum lean today. I'll let serra talk for himself before adding more on that.

Given you think serra is scum do you think his vote on Cheery was distancing or a vote on another townie?

Good point on Naomi. I don't know if it makes her scummy or not but she hasn't voted all day and I would like her to soon even if it's on less robust reasoning. If she's town, we need the input. If we're wrong somehow and she's scum, it's a good way to avoid building connections to other players.

[Kalimar]

unvote

Team Rocket is reminding me of ToastyToast in HxH... I think I need to recalibrate.

[Kalimar]

I probably can't say that I'm doing all I can, but I can say that I'm doing all I can think to do to prod action. Even if my attempts have failed, at least getting off TR's wagon has bought Morph some time to check in and promise content. What's truly futile is constantly trying to convince the town that all efforts are futile. I have no idea what good you're trying to serve the town by trying your damnedest to shoot down efforts to kickstart the day.

Now we've had a bit of action, how has it helped develop your reads?