Open 596: Mega PopCorn Mafia - Over

[Heartless]

Who's tth?

tth = TellTaleHeart
that's my hydra partner. we're a hydra (see: our sig)

aa9, you may want to update the playerlist with hydras and their heads to prevent confusion. friendly suggestion.

[Heartless]

VOTE: nonsense

i endorse this

i would also endorse a west9 shot

[Wanderer-nl]

I vote that we use votes, despite the cosmetic nature.

When I read the set-up, I thought about something that happened in a Lights Out 1 (completed theme park game in 2006) where Pooky created a referendum-based voting system to create a papertrail to ensure that there was always something to look back at. And in a game with "cosmetic votes", I think we need to do something specific to ensure that everyone can be held to some standard. Thoughts?

I also remember Kingmaker (and the subsequent other versions...I think there was a consulmaker too?) where there were several other voting methods in a game where a small number had power to decide the "lynch".

Yeah I like this. If we all vote the scum will have to join to not stand out so lets not wait too long either. If the gunbearer doesn't know who to shoot, they can always go with the person who has the most votes.
Or we decide right now the gunbearer will shoot the person with the most votes? That might pressure scum a little more into making cases on town.
When a gunbearer attempts to shoot a towny, he dies and the targetted townie gets the gun. If a vengeful gets shot, they both die and mafia gets to pick the new gunbearer. I think we should find the vengefuls as quick as possible because I'd rather have scum control the gun early game. It will be harder to assign a gunbearer later in the game because of associations.

I'll reread and see if I find something worthy of a cosmetic vote.

[Wanderer-nl]

I only signed up for this game because I thought it would be quick and fun. If you're serious about your over a week-long plan, then that's just stupid.

also, is there a reason you haven't talked about why you think heartless is vengeful or no

I assumed you were just being obstinately oblivious. But I hate all the people immediately shouting "SHOOT ME" - you obviously can't shoot them all, and I'm pretty sure there's actual scum calling your bluff in Heartless, Jeanne, and whoever else was doing that.

'Whoever else' includes dcl (129) so this just feels awkward to me. Also, if she really thinks there's scum in the people calling to shoot them, then why not check back to see who exactly it were instead of writing 'whoever else'?
Not a solid case but this early good enough for me to put a vote on.

VOTE: dcl

[enomis]

▄︻̷̿┻̿═━一 - - - - - - (=ↀωↀ=)

[Nachomamma8]

It's possible that Heartless is scum and that this is the reasoning that scum want us to follow, but at the moment I'm choosing to think that's less likely, as it seems more high-risk than the alternative of, you know, not posting a cat picture.

If Heartless was scum, I don't find it overly likely that they would know I would attack them because of a cat picture.

I vote that we use votes, despite the cosmetic nature.

When I read the set-up, I thought about something that happened in a Lights Out 1 (completed theme park game in 2006) where Pooky created a referendum-based voting system to create a papertrail to ensure that there was always something to look back at. And in a game with "cosmetic votes", I think we need to do something specific to ensure that everyone can be held to some standard. Thoughts?

I also remember Kingmaker (and the subsequent other versions...I think there was a consulmaker too?) where there were several other voting methods in a game where a small number had power to decide the "lynch".

I personally will be listening far more to the content of people's votes and why they suspect who they suspect as opposed to who has a vote down where. Why didn't you talk about any suspicions/town reads that you've had at this point?

[Nachomamma8]

'Whoever else' includes dcl (129) so this just feels awkward to me.

It is hypocritical, yes. But I have trouble viewing it as scummy: I think that dcl, regardless of her alignment, would be aware that she made the "shoot me" play not even two pages ago, and that as scum, she would be less likely to use that as her reasoning for her primary suspicion. Am I approaching this wrong?

Also, if she really thinks there's scum in the people calling to shoot them, then why not check back to see who exactly it were instead of writing 'whoever else'?

This sort of laziness seems null to me.

[enomis]

Town:

(=ↀωↀ=)
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)

[VictorDeAngelo]

I fully endorse a Red Coyote shot.

VOTE: RedCoyote

[vonflare]

Reads:

Victor

: 2 posts, no real content other than a coyote RVS vote.

enomis

: despite having 9 posts, he has posted little more than 2 words. trolling, probobly, but if he keeps it up it could be seen as active lurking.

wanderer

: feels town. 4 posts, but all of them contain content and reads.

heartless

: hard to tell so far, posts have generally been contentless and/or ragey. null until i get more info. also, i cant ever read hydras very well.

pablito

: only a single post that wasnt "/confirm", so its a little hard to tell. But that one post seemed pretty pro-town, advocating using votes.

maxwell

:seems to contribute nicely, mostly asking the mod for rules clarifications, but was active during RVS.

west9

: meh. I don't like his posting style. his only post contains a bunch of questions with no opinions. (#171)

julienVonWolfe

: I like his single post of contribution, it has some strong opinions, but a lot of WIFOM.

CB

: very little content, need more to be able to read.

flubber

: really, really random. 9 posts but zero contribution. most of his posts are 3-5 words.

nonsense

: hard to read. i cant read hydras. also all of his posts are utter nonsense. start playing the game!

deep-city-lights

: dumb town, if i had to guess now. it looks to me like she wasnt expecting the amount of commitment this game requires and wants to die to get out of it.

millar

: lots of quoting people and commenting on their posts. generally contributing, but no real read yet.

jeanne

: keeps asking nacho to shoot her, for no discernable reason. scum using reverse psychology? thats the only explanation i can think of for now. contribute, please!

lucky2u

: his only posts are "I don't remember signing up for this game" and "I'm useless when I'm playing a game I'm familiar with". pretty much tries to excuse future uselessness. scum read.

redcoyote

: 1 post so far, nothing to go on.

[MaxwellPuckett]

Bolded because I want ArcAngel9 to confirm:

About the win condition. Since scum has no night kill, they have to eliminate every townie. The 'or nothing can prevent the same' would be when there's one townie alive and at least one vengeful alive, right? Also, is it a tie when there's just a townie and a vengeful mafia left, or would that be a maf win?

In any case, I agree with Wanderer. Vengefuls are the priority target, because they have to be eliminated sometime and our chances are best if we do that at the beginning. Ofc shooting mafia in general is preferred, and I wouldn't know what differences in play there would be between vengefuls are regular maf.

[MaxwellPuckett]

Victor, I have to ask: Coyote has made a single post, and it was his confirmation. That's enough to make you want him shot?

[Flubbernugget]

von you're scum reading people for the same reasons you're null reading others

"I can't read hydras" doesn't cut it

[West9]

west9: meh. I don't like his posting style. his only post contains a bunch of questions with no opinions. (#171)

This isn't an acceptable alternative to answering my question.

[vonflare]

von you're scum reading people for the same reasons you're null reading others

"I can't read hydras" doesn't cut it

where?

[vonflare]

west9: meh. I don't like his posting style. his only post contains a bunch of questions with no opinions. (#171)

This isn't an acceptable alternative to answering my question.

there were literally minutes between those posts. i was ninjad.

[Flubbernugget]

flubber

: really, really random. 9 posts but zero contribution. most of his posts are 3-5 words.

nonsense

: hard to read. i cant read hydras. also all of his posts are utter nonsense. start playing the game!

[Flubbernugget]

Also calling my posting random is bullshit

[VictorDeAngelo]

Victor, I have to ask: Coyote has made a single post, and it was his confirmation. That's enough to make you want him shot?

Yep.

[West9]

west9: meh. I don't like his posting style. his only post contains a bunch of questions with no opinions. (#171)

This isn't an acceptable alternative to answering my question.

there were literally minutes between those posts. i was ninjad.

You were ninjad for the twenty minutes between 89 and 127?

[Flubbernugget]

Victor, I have to ask: Coyote has made a single post, and it was his confirmation. That's enough to make you want him shot?

Yep.

Do you have town reads on everyone else or something

[vonflare]

west9: meh. I don't like his posting style. his only post contains a bunch of questions with no opinions. (#171)

This isn't an acceptable alternative to answering my question.

there were literally minutes between those posts. i was ninjad.

You were ninjad for the twenty minutes between 89 and 127?

it felt like we were discussing it at the time that i posted.

[vonflare]

Fucking hell we can't even vote yet and there's a shitfest to be seen

So apparently this girl is so high she can get the cops called on her but her tweets are still 100% coherent

That somehow came from a facebook conversation I was having with someone

Don't expect any posts of higher quality from me though

Fucking hell we can't even vote yet and there's a shitfest to be seen

not a shitfest

just a friendly reminder to nacho that i don't tolerate any bullshit and a friendly request to get out of his own ass and knock it off b/c regardless of his alignment it's annoying

Aka a shitfest

Can we get tth in here

Can we get tth in here

Why?

To end the drama

VOTE: nonsense

Also calling my posting random is bullshit

[pablito]

I think at this point, discussing strategies is for the best of the town. Because it is essentially a nightless mountainous with unique lynch mechanisms, we need to understand how we can scumhunt effectively rather than just blindly going into this. I get that it also gives scum a chance to prepare for everything as well, but the more efficient the town is, the better. Barring any suicidal gunbearers, the mafia only get to make three "nightkills" in which they get to choose a new gunbearer. This means that if there are four people we trust as town, we already outnumber the gunpower of the mafia. This is a game where great discussion, long "lynch cycles" and holding each other very accountable is a strong strategy to get a quicker win. That being said, my biggest scum tells are those that are opposing this by either trolling the thread, failing to comment on others and also voting daycitylights.

I propose that Nacho as the gunbearer (and subsequent ones that want to follow this tactic) make a short-list prior to shooting the gun and forcing everyone to comment on the shortlist to ensure that we have information before a shot is made. The voting as it is can only guarantee that votes (if even done at all) are on the spread, rather than commenting on the specific action by the gunbearer. That's what I remember from Kingmaker.

The referendum style voting I refer to in Lights Out 1 kinda went like this:

Target: Wanderer-nl
Accuser: pablito
Rationale: For agreeing with my post about needing to vote and then completely ignoring the rest of my post about voting styles only picking up on the first sentence. Then doing a re-read and voting for someone who mentioned about the game tactic and not fully understanding it. I would've suspected that wanderer-nl would have picked up on more in a re-read than a retread of what others are doing. Therefore, I believe that wanderer is trying to look town while also voting in a way that is not even applying pressure and is helping distract the town on a very futile lead.
Evidence: Post #177
YEA (0): people who voted yea here.
NAY (0): people who voted nay here.

This forces people to comment and put their votes down early on specific rationale. The gunbearer would not have to choose based on this either, but it gives us something to look into later. As far as I could read in the rules, this is not against anything because the gunbearer is not being held to any standard based on this.

I'm not sure what people think, but I am strongly advocating for not doing a simple "vote 1 person" system as it is too limiting when power is taken away from the vote mechanic. There's too much noise in posts right now to make me think the referendum system would work efficiently unless everyone agrees to it. Later in the game it would be crucial to use, but by then the paper trail would be lost. If there are other good ideas out there, please put them out there.

That being said, wanderer-nl is both my biggest town and scum read, that is until vonflare voluntarily posted reads. I also have another scum read but would like to wait until that person comments on voting techniques. VOTE: wanderer-nl

[pablito]

Also to everyone commenting about wanting to get vengeful mafia first - how do you expect vengeful mafia to act differently than mafia goons?