Mafiascum.net

Posted: **Tue Jul 31, 2018 3:09 pm**

This is a sequel to Segaco's Murder Riddle. Thanks to him for providing the inspiration, the format, and the rules, which are apparently taken from Umineko no Naku Koro ni. (Though as Segaco mentioned, it's not necessary to know anything about this, as I myself do not.)

Just a note: I tried to make it of comparable quality but a bit tougher, and it ended up being significantly longer. I hope it doesn't drag on too long and you all enjoy it, though.

Rules

- All characters state things in

Purple Declaration

. All things said in Purple Declaration can be considered to be the truth with the exception of the fact that culprits may lie.
- Characters who are not culprits speak the truth and only the truth (**in purple**).
- There may be multiple culprits.
- A culprit is defined as someone who kills.
- A culprit may lie before murdering.
- A culprit cannot die, but they can fake death.
- All statements made in narration are true.
- Accomplices do not exist unless they murder, in which case they become culprits.
- Every room, aside from the bathrooms, is locked with an electric lock. These locks cannot be spoofed, hacked, or otherwise tampered with.
- Every person carries a key card, with the exception of Brian (who does not have an office) and Nettle (who is a visitor).
- The janitors and security guards' key cards can open every room. All other people's key cards can only open their own office.
- In addition, the president, VP, and top executives have access to the conference rooms.
- Rooms can be locked and unlocked from the outside with the key card.
- Rooms can be locked and unlocked from the inside without need of a key card.
- Every person initially starts with their own key card.
- Anyone may be a culprit.

People in this story:

1. Miles Hazard - President (Male)
2. Tony Burton - Vice President (Male)
3. Alder Hutch - Top Executive (Male)
4. Ruby Holland - Top Executive (Female)
5. Steve McCall - Executive (Male)
6. Ferris Beckett - Executive (Male)
7. Catherine Luda - Executive (Female)
8. Nik Werner - Executive (Male)
9. Menna Jones - Executive (Female)
10. Micah - Janitor (Female)
11. Tom - Janitor (Male)
12. Alpha - Head Security (Male)
13. Ren - Security (Female)
14. Brian Tooley - Secretary (Male)
15. Nettle Sands - Visitor (Male)

Map

Spoiler: I suck at art

Story

The SkyTech Corporation. An extremely secretive, high-security company, headed by Miles Hazard, that works on many sensitive government projects. The setting is the top floor of their headquarters, housing the president, vice president, and several top executives. Usually, nobody without security clearance is allowed onto this floor. But on this day, Nettle Sands was invited up for a meeting with Ferris.

At precisely 10:30 AM, the elevator opened and Nettle stepped out. He spoke to Brian, the secretary, informing him of his meeting with Ferris. Brian called Ferris, to tell him that his visitor had arrived, but nobody picked up the phone. Finding this odd, Brian motioned for Nettle to follow him, and the two of them went to Ferris's office door. Brian knocked on it. Again, no answer. Concerned now, Brian called for the security guard Ren, who opened the door. The three of them beheld the bloody body of Ferris.

Brian and Nettle immediately cried out in alarm. Ren ran to the security room to call a lockdown of the floor; the other people on the floor began to filter out of their offices and gather around the scene.

Tom

: "Oh God... is he dead? What happened?"

Brian

: "

Nettle had a meeting with him, and he didn't pick up the phone, and the door was locked, and so I called for Ren to open it...

"

Alder

: "

Ferris is dead. He was stabbed to death.

"

Alpha

: "Where did Ren go?"

Nettle

: "She went to lock down the floor, I think."

Nik

: "Does anyone know anything?"

Tony

: "

I met with Ferris from 9:30 to 10:00. He was quite all right at that point. I know he didn't have any meetings afterward until his meeting with Nettle.

"

Steve

: "I know Ferris. He was always paranoid.

He'd never open the door for someone unless he had a meeting with them.

"

Catherine

: "I've been in my office, right across the hall from Ferris's.

I saw Tony leave Ferris's room at 10:00, and nobody entered between then and 10:25. Unfortunately, I had to use the bathroom then; that's where I was when I heard the cries.

"

Alpha

: "Leaving a five minute window. We need alibis. Where was everyone between 10:25 and 10:30?"

Micah

: "

I was with Tom cleaning Conference Room 1.

"

Brian

: "

I was at the front desk until Nettle arrived. Ren can confirm, she was there as well.

"

Ruby

: "

Tony, Nik, and I were in a meeting in Conference Room 2.

"

Alder

: "Alpha, you remember.

I was in the security room talking with you.

"

Steve

: "

I was working in my office.

"

Menna

: "

As was I.

"

Catherine

: "

As I already said, I was in the bathroom.

I think several people can attest that I did go there."

Brian

: "

I didn't see her go

, but I wasn't paying much attention."

Alpha

: "Those aren't very reassuring. Can any of you prove that?"

Steve

: "No, I'm sorry. But you can search me,

I swear I don't have a knife anywhere.

"

Menna

: "

Me neither!

"

Alpha

: "All right. Ren and I will search you two and your offices."

Nettle

: "Wait a minute. Miles, where were you?"

Miles

: "Are you doubting me?"

Nettle

: "I just want to make sure we've covered all our bases."

Miles

: "Well,

I was in my office, as well.

"

Tom

: "You don't have to worry, Nettle. I can vouch for Miles's character.

He would never kill anyone.

"

The security guards began to search the persons and offices of Steve and Menna. Some of the other people left. They were shaken, but it seemed as though the security guards had everything under control. That is, until a scream was heard. The source of the scream was quickly determined to be Tom, and as everyone rushed to him, they found him at the open janitor's closet, staring in horror.

Tom

: "Micah... how could this happen?

We went back to cleaning, and we were doing Conference Room 2. She ran back to get something, but she was gone so long I started to get worried. I came to check on her, and the door was locked, and when I unlocked it I found this... She's definitely dead; she was stabbed. Here key card was here on the floor beside her. I'll destroy it now so nobody can use it.

"

Brian

: "

Nik is in here too. Looks like he was also stabbed to death.

"

Menna

: "That's terrible..."

Ren

: "

Alpha and I searched Steve and Menna. Menna didn't have a knife.

"

Alpha

: "

Neither did Steve.

"

Miles

: "

Tony and I were with them the whole time, supervising.

"

Tony

: "

Indeed we were. Nik was with us too, but he went off toward the conference rooms. That was the last I saw of him.

"

Brian

: "

I was at the front desk for most of the time, but I had to use the bathroom as well.

Alder, Ruby, and Nettle were talking in the lobby pretty much the while time, as far as I know."

Alder

: "

We were discussing intently almost the entire time. We were trying to figure out a reason that somebody would do something like this. The discussion got very heated toward the end.

"

Nettle

: "Yes, it did. I'm surprised that those two didn't see it the way I did... maybe I know some things about Ferris that you people don't."

Ruby

: "

Actually, Alder stormed off near the end.

He was upset about something Nettle said."

Alder

: "He was accusing Miles of killing his own employee!"

Miles

: "What?"

Nettle

: "Listen, I don't know you, but I know more than a few things about what goes on in your department."

Alpha

: "Which way did Alder go?"

Alder

: "

I went up the east hallway, but I didn't have time to kill anyone. I saw Tom come around and open the door to the janitor's closet.

"

Tom

: "

I didn't see you at all.

I must have been too focused on making sure Micah was okay."

Tony

: "Brian, you went to the bathroom?

I didn't see you come through the west hallway.

"

Brian

: "

I went the long way.

I didn't want to interrupt the security guards' search."

Alpha

: "Catherine, where were you?"

Catherine

: "

...I was in the bathroom again.

"

Alpha

: "O- okay. Is it possible someone was hiding in here?" *gestures to the janitor's closet*

Tom

: "No,

there are no spaces here big enough for someone to hide.

"

Miles

: "That's it. We need to get to somewhere safe so we can figure this out. Let's go to a conference room."

Tom

: "Neither conference room is big enough to fit all twelve of us."

Miles

: "We'll split up, then. Tony, Ruby, Alder, Ren, Catherine, come with me to Conference Room 1."

Miles, Tony, Ruby, Alder, Ren, and Catherine went to Conference Room 1. Menna, Steve, Nettle, Brian, Alpha, and Tom went to Conference Room 2.

Ruby

: "Is there anything we can use to figure out who did this?"

Ren

: "There are security tapes. I should go check them."

Miles

: "I should see the tapes too. I'll come with you."

Miles and Ren left and headed toward the security room. Meanwhile, in the other conference room...

Menna

: "Where did Miles and Ren go?"

Alpha

: "Oh, they might have gone to look at the security tapes. That's a good idea."

Tom

: "There are security tapes?"

Alpha

: "

Only outside of Miles and Tony's offices.

But they might have seen someone go into the janitor's closet."

Nettle

: "We can't just sit here. We need to do something. I wonder if I can find any evidence in Ferris's office. I do know a fair amount about what he was doing."

Steve

: "Care to share it with the rest of us?"

Nettle

: "No."

Nettle moved toward the door, evidently unwilling to wait for anyone's approval.

Brian

: "Don't go alone. I'll come with you."

Nettle and Brian left together and headed toward Ferris's office. Some time passed. Neither of the parties returned, nor were any sounds heard.

Alpha

: "I'm getting nervous... I better go check on Nettle and Brian to make sure they're all right."

Before anyone can stop him, Alpha exited and walked toward the offices. Not ten seconds later, a loud sound was heard, and soon thereafter, another. Everyone rushed out of the conference rooms and begins to search. It didn't take long to find the bodies of Nettle and Brian in the hall.

Menna

: "No..."

Steve

: "What happened, Alpha?"

Alpha

: "

I didn't see. I was distracted... there were two sounds, and then I saw them both on the ground Nettle outside of Ferris's office, and Brian outside of Nik's office.

"

Tony

: "

Brian and Nettle are both dead, both from gunshots.

"

Alpha

: "

Gunshots? How? The only guns allowed up here were mine and Ren's, which are identical. And mine is right here...

"

Alder and Ruby entered from the north. Nobody had noticed they were missing.

Alder

: "We have some bad news...

I found Miles and Ren too in the security room, with the door open.

They look like they're dead, but I'm not sure.

The security tapes were all erased.

"

Ruby

: "We had a feeling that something was wrong there.

Alder found them, and he called me over. Ren's gun is gone, but her card was still there. I destroyed it.

"

Alder

: "

Miles still had his key card too. I didn't do anything with it yet.

"

Alpha

: "Ren's gun...

that must be how the gunshots happened.

"

Everyone followed Alder and Ruby to the security room, where they found the bodies of Miles and Ren.

Tom

: "

Miles is definitely dead, stabbed by the looks of it.

"

Catherine

: "

Ren was also stabbed to death.

"

Tony

: "

Miles's key card was still there as well. I destroyed it...

we can't have anyone getting into Miles's office."

Alpha

: "

Somebody must have that gun.

I need to search you all."

Alpha searched everyone else.

Alpha

: "

Nobody here has it... There's somebody else who's still alive, who only pretended to be dead.

I'm sure of it."

Steve

: "That's crazy. Pretended to be dead. That can't be true."

Alder

: "I believe him.

Alpha would never lie, and he would never say he was sure of something if it weren't true.

"

Catherine

: "So what do we do?"

Alpha

: "For now? We stay together. I don't want anyone out of my sight."

Menna

: "If someone is pretending to be dead, doesn't that mean they must have an accomplice? Someone alive who 'confirmed' that they were dead."

Ruby

: "That's a good point. So we have two potential killers on the loose."

Tom

: "And I have a feeling that they won't stop until everyone else is dead."

Alpha

: "Now at least we have some facts nailed down. Does anyone know anything about motive?"

Steve

: "Well, I know there's been some weird stuff going on here, but nothing worth killing over..."

Ruby

: "Are you sure? If anyone knows anything, we need to know now."

Tony

: "All right, I should probably say something.

Miles had some... extremely sensitive documents

, and it would be very bad if they fell into the wrong hands."

Alpha

: "How bad?"

Tony

: "It could cost thousands of lives."

Menna

: "Shit."

Tom

: "What do you people DO on this floor? This is darker than I imagined."

Ruby

: "Maybe Nettle was wiser than we thought... He told us this was something bigger. Not by Miles maybe, but somebody important must be behind this."

Alder

: "

Those documents are probably what the killers are after.

"

Tony

: "Tom, can you please let me into Miles's office to see if they're still there?"

Tom

: "I don't want anything to do with this, if I can help it."

Alpha

: "

Tom, do it. This is important.

"

Tom and Tony went to Miles's office, where the documents were kept. Tom unlocked the door and waited outside while Tony searched inside.

Tony

: "

The documents... they're gone.

"

Tom

: "Tony, how do we know you didn't just take them?"

Tony

: "You're welcome to search me."

Alpha quickly searched Tony.

Alpha

: "He's clean.

He doesn't have the documents.

"

Catherine

: "Who could possibly have taken them? Only Miles himself, the janitors, and the security guards could have gotten in there."

Tony

: "We need to go check their bodies. And be careful... don't go anywhere alone."

Tom

: "

I will go search Micah.

"

Catherine

: "

I'll come with you, then.

"

Tom and Catherine left to find Micah's body.

Tony

: "I don't trust anyone but Alpha here.

Alpha, come with me to search the bodies of Miles and Ren.

"

Tony and Alpha left to find Miles's and Ren's bodies. Alder, Steve, and Menna remained; nobody paid attention to where Ruby had gone. Suddenly, an extremely loud police siren echoed outside.

Steve

: "Why is that so loud?"

Menna

: "Hopefully they're coming to help us."

Alder

: *looks around* "Did you hear that?"

Menna

: "The siren?"

Alder

: "

No... I thought I heard a gunshot.

"

Steve

: "I couldn't hear anything over the noise."

Alder ran down the hallway. About fifteen seconds later, the siren stopped and Alder was heard yelling furiously. Everyone ran to where he is, finding him outside Ruby's office.

Alder

: "

I heard a shot, and the door is locked.

What happened in there?"

Alpha stepped forward and opened the door.

Alder

: "Ruby! No!

She's dead... shot to death. I was waiting with Steve and Menna, until I heard the shot.

"

Alpha

: "You heard a shot over that noise? Did anyone else hear it?"

Tony

: "Well, there definitely was a shot.

I can confirm that Ruby died of a gunshot wound.

"

Steve

: "

I couldn't hear anything over that siren.

"

Menna

: "

Neither could I.

Did anyone find the documents?"

Tom

: "

They weren't on Micah's body.

"

Tony

: "

Nor on Miles or Ren's. And then I searched Alpha, just to make sure; he didn't have them either.

"

Alder

: "

There's nobody hiding here, either.

I can't believe this... I need to be alone. I don't trust any of you."

Catherine

: "Are you sure that's safe?"

Alder

: "

I'm going to lock myself in Conference Room 2.

This mystery killer won't be able to get me there; only a few people have access to it."
Alder left and headed toward the conference rooms.

Alpha

: "This is enough. We need more help.

The stairs are still locked due to the lockdown, but with my security clearance I think I can override the elevator.

"

The rest of them went to the elevator room. Alpha tried to call the elevator, but it didn't come.

Alpha

: "What?"

Catherine

: "

The elevator is disabled! Somebody used the company software to disable it.

"

Menna

: "

Well, there are only computers at the desks.

But it seems like anyone with a computer could have done that."

Tony

: "

Only an executive would know how to do it.

"

Steve

: "We're trapped here?"

Tony

: "Only until the lockdown ends."

Menna

: "I feel bad for Alder, and I'm very sorry about Ruby-- I know they'd known each other for a long time. But we need to stay together. He's in danger."

Steve

: "Yeah. Let's go find him."

Steve and Menna started up the west hallway. As they reached the northwest corner, they began to scream, and several loud sounds were heard. By the time the others reached the southwest corner, Steve and Menna's bodies were on the ground. Steve was in the northwest corner, Menna right in front of Ferris's office.

Alpha

: "What just happened?"

Tom

: "Somebody shot them.

I definitely heard three shots.

Maybe the shooter missed?"

Alpha

: "I don't think so...

Menna was definitely shot to death.

"

Tony

: "

So was Steve.

"

Alpha

: Let's move their bodies out of the way. I don't want to have them here.

Together, they moved Steve and Menna's bodies down the hall to the front desk.

Tom

: "Where's Alder? Is he in one of the conference rooms?"

Catherine

: "What-?

I don't see Alder in either one.

"

Alpha unlocked both conference rooms.

Alpha

: "

He's not there.

Where did he go?"

Tony

: "Alpha is right.

I don't see him anywhere.

"

They frantically began to search for him. After a few minutes, Alpha called out.

Alpha

: "

I found him in Ferris's office, under the desk, with the door locked.

"

Tom and Tony came immediately.

Tony

: "Is he dead?"

Alder

: "

I'm not dead.

I'm sorry I hid, I just didn't feel safe there."

Alpha

: "How did you get in here?"

Alder

: "

When we first found Ferris... I swiped his key.

I thought I might be able to hide in his office if things ever got awful. What happened?"

Alpha

: "Menna and Steve are dead, because they went looking for you."

Alder

: "

I saw the whole thing. Menna's body fell right in front of the door.

"

Tony

: "Where's Catherine?"

Alder

: "Oh,

I saw her go into her office, a few minutes after the shooting.

"

Alpha

: "Did you see anyone else?"

Alder

: "

No.

"

Tom

: "How could you even see her office from under your desk?"

Alder

: "

I looked through the window at the base of the door.

"

Alpha

: "So you could only see her feet?"

Alder

: "I recognized her shoes.

It was definitely her.

"

Tony

: "She should still be in there then... Is the door locked?"

Alpha

: "

Yes, it is.

"

Alpha opened the door to Catherine's office. She was in there... but not how they expected.

Alder

: "No... how is this possible?

Catherine was stabbed to death.

"

Tom

: "

Her key card is still here.

How was the door locked?"

Tony

: "

There's no one hiding here, either.

"

Alpha

: "I think I know the answer to this. You three stay right here.

If I see anyone else, I will kill them, trust me. I'm faster on the trigger than anyone else here.

"

Tony

: "Still, be careful."

Alpha

: "I will.

I won't leave any doors unlocked behind me. And nobody's quick enough to get to me with a knife without me noticing

, so I should be safe."

Alpha left promptly, heading north towards the conference rooms.

Alder

: "I hope he's all right."

Tony

: "I'm sure he will be.

If he sees anyone, there's no way they'll harm him.

"

Tom

: "We shouldn't stand here; we should go somewhere more protected. What if the killer comes back?"

Tony

: "You're right, we should move. Where?"

Alder

: "Maybe the elevator room. There's only one way in, and we could try the elevator again."

The three of them went to the elevator room. Tom tried the elevator.

Tom

: "Nope,

it still doesn't work.

"

A loud sound was heard. The remaining three anxiously ran to the other side, and when they reached the door of Tony's office, they stared in horror at Alpha, slumped on the floor.

Tony

: "

The door's locked.

"

Tony pulled a card out of his pocket and fumbled, nearly dropping it.

Tom

: "Hurry up!"

Tony finally managed to open the door.

Alder

: "It's as we feared.

Alpha is dead. He was definitely shot. His key card is right here.

"

Tony

: "Check his gun, see if he shot back. He said this wouldn't happen..."

Tom

: "

It has all six bullets. He never even shot it.

"

Tony

: "Six bullets? Let me see."

Reluctantly, Tom handed the gun to Tony.

Tony

: "

Tom is right. Fully loaded.

"

Tom

: "Put the gun down. I don't think anyone should have it right now."

Tony

: "All right." *sets the gun down*

Alder

: "We need to solve this now. Can anyone think of anything that might help us?"

Tony

: "Hold that thought."

Tony went over to the door and locked it.

Tony

: "Let's talk about what happened..."

And with this, the story is paused.

-------------------
A few things to keep in mind:

Security reports from this day prove that the people listed are the only people who were present on this floor. In other words, there is no sixteenth person.
Also, it is impossible to remove or add ammo to a gun.

Now that you have finished the story, you can now start trying to solve it. There are three more things you need to know about theorizing before starting:
- To win the game you must pinpoint the culprit/s and how he/she/they did it. Basically, you have to post a full theory explaining how everything happened*.
- When stating a theory, it is mandatory for you to use

blue text (#00FFFF)

.
- After you make your theory, I will respond to it either with

red text

to disprove it (anything said in red can be considered to be the truth) or normal text just explaining why it's not correct.

*That said, there is definitely some room for interpretation allowed. As long as your explanation is reasonable and reasonably close to what I intended, you should be fine.

That's all you need to know.
Anyone can participate, so I hope you hop in and try to solve this!

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 4:16 am**

All right, so I was trying to figure out who confirmed whose deaths.

Alpha (3) -> Ferris, Ruby, Menna
Tom (2) -> Miles, Micah
Brian (1) -> Nik
Tony (5) -> Brian (-> Nik), Nettle, Ruby, Steve
Catherine (1) -> Ren
Alder (6) -> Catherine (-> Ren), Alpha (-> Ferris, Ruby, Menna)

I am not sure if Brian actually confirmed the death of Nik. He said in purple that it "looked" like Nik died, but that does not seem like the same thing as confirming Nik's death. (EDIT: Brian did confirm Nik's death.)

Three people are left at the end. So either all three are innocent and there are at most 3 culprits

EDIT: No, because all deaths are ultimately confirmed by one of them.

(unless Nik is the only culprit)

, or

two are innocent and the third is a culprit with at most one accomplice.

(Or else, the culprits would outnumber the innocents.)
The interesting thing is that I believe that we have no outright confirmed-innocents (from the narration), and of the last three, no one claimed another as innocent. Unless I missed something.

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 7:04 am**

It was intended to be Brian confirming Nik's death.

Also, this follows Segaco's rule that

if the culprits ever outnumbered the innocents, they would immediately kill off the remaining innocents.

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 8:34 am**

woofdog
i want to get on this before it gets 4000000000000 posts

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 8:49 am**

when i get to a non-car place i'll try to draw a pathway of where people claimed to be/walked later

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 8:53 am**

So let's see what happens if Alder is clear. Then Alpha, Catherine, Ren, Ferris, Ruby, and Menna are also clear.
It also means that the "dead" culprit faked his/her death

before

Alpha said "Someone pretended to be dead", so Steve would also be clear.

No matter what, Ruby is

definitely town

, because Tony and Alpha (who is clear according to Alder) confirmed Ruby dead.
(Man, those names are confusing... Tom and Tony... and Alpha and Alder... have to be the last four...)

@Invisibility

what?

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 8:55 am**

what do you mean what

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:38 am**

ego/there's a small chance i'll actually try to help figure things out. I thought the first of these was pretty interesting.

Posted: **Wed Aug 01, 2018 11:11 am**

In post 5, 2 718281828459 wrote:(Man, those names are confusing... Tom and Tony... and Alpha and Alder... have to be the last four...)

My apologies, lol. I hadn't yet planned out who would live until the end when I named them

Posted: **Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:33 am**

I just realized something.
Since there cannot be more than 2 culprits, then Nik, Ferris, Ruby, Menna, and Ren are town, because if they were scum then it would imply

two

others lied.

5 confirmed innocents. Now that's something to go off of.

Posted: **Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:18 am**

I think I got everything... those five were not that talkative (or lucky)...

Spoiler: Nik, Ferris, Ruby, Menna, and Ren are innocent

Posted: **Fri Aug 03, 2018 4:30 am**

I will also EGO and follow along, deduction is not my forte

Posted: **Fri Aug 03, 2018 10:43 am**

What do you mean you will "EGO"?

Going back on this:

Tom

(2) -> Miles, Micah

Tony

(5) -> Brian (->

Nik

), Nettle,

Ruby

, Steve

Alder

(6) -> Catherine (->

Ren

), Alpha (->

Ferris, Ruby, Menna

)

That leaves us with

7

5 possible pairs of culprits:
Tom + Miles
Tom + Micah
Tony + Brian
Tony + Nettle (probably wrong)

Tony + Steve
Alder + Catherine

Alder + Alpha

I think that Tony + Nettle is incorrect, because in Micah's death scene, Tony and Nettle were both confirmed to be away by someone else. However, I do not know if it is possible to, e.g. set up knife traps.

I would like someone else to please check my logic here

, before I assume Nettle must be innocent.

If the scum team is not Alpha+Alder, then the "dead" culprit faked their death

before

Alpha made the claim that

There's somebody else who's still alive, who only pretended to be dead.

. This means that

Steve

and

Catherine

are innocent.
Therefore, the elevator is actually disabled.

Confirmed Innocent:

Nik, Ferris, Ruby, Menna, Ren, Steve, Catherine

Posted: **Sat Aug 04, 2018 12:15 pm**

I have more evidence against the Tony+Nettle pair -- Tony did not kill Ferris, and Nettle probably could not have done it based on the initial story.

Tony+Brian

may

be an innocent pair, but I noticed that Ren never confirmed that she and Brian were away at the time.

All right, Alpha+Alder just looks like a suspicious combination, so let's see where this goes. (It's like RVS.)

Theory 0xA0

Alpha and Alder are the culprits.

1: Alpha lied that he and Alder were talking in the security room. They snuck out and Alpha used his security clearance to open the door, kill Ferris, and close it without being seen.

2-3: Alder stormed off as told, and killed Micah+Nik. He lied that he did not have time to kill anyone. Alpha then locked the door with his security card.

4-7: Alpha killed Miles and Ren, grabbed the gun, and used it to kill Brian and Nettle. He hid Ren's gun and made his own visible. Then Alpha lied that nobody has the gun -- Alpha himself was never searched!

8: Alpha had the gun and the documents. He killed Ruby but then he secretly met up with Alder and gave Alder the gun and the documents, so that a search of Alpha would reveal nothing.
Alder, the executive, knew how to disable the elevator.

9-10: Alder killed Steve and Menna. Do I need to explain this further? Alder lied that he was in CR2.

11: Catherine was stabbed by Alpha. The door was not locked; Alpha only pretended it was.

"12": Alpha faked his death, of course.

Posted: **Sat Aug 04, 2018 12:32 pm**

There is a problem in 4-7: According to the narration, there was less than 10 seconds between Alpha leaving the conference room and Brian and Nettle's bodies being found. In order for him to do what you described, he would have had to walk the long way around to the security room, kill Miles and Ren, walk the long way back, and kill Nettle and Brian... in less than 10 seconds.

Also, there are some events that you suggested occurred but did not say WHEN they occurred (Alpha locking the door to the janitor's closet before Micah and Nik were discovered, Alpha taking the documents from Miles's office, and Alpha meeting up with Alder to give the gun and documents).

Posted: **Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:01 am**

All right, here is my modification.

Theory 0xA1

Alpha and Alder are the culprits.

1: Alpha lied that he and Alder were talking in the security room. They snuck out and Alpha used his security clearance to open the door, kill Ferris, and close it without being seen.

2-3: Alder stormed off as told, and killed Micah+Nik. He lied that he did not have time to kill anyone. Alpha then locked the door with his security card.

4-7: Alder killed Miles and Ren, grabbed Ren's gun and Miles' documents, and gave the gun to Alpha when Alpha left to "check on" Brian and Nettle. Alpha used Ren's gun to kill Brian and Nettle, and then hid Ren's gun and made his own visible. Then Alpha pretended to search Alder and instead

gave

Alder the gun secretly during the "search".

8: Alder had the gun and the documents. He killed Ruby and then knew how to disable the elevator.

9-10: Alder killed Steve and Menna. Do I need to explain this further? Alder lied that he was in CR2.

11: Catherine was stabbed by Alpha. The door was not locked; Alpha only pretended it was.

"12": Alpha faked his death, of course.

Posted: **Mon Aug 06, 2018 5:35 am**

When would Alder have had a chance to kill Miles and Ren? He was in the conference room until the bodies of Brian and Nettle were found.

Posted: **Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:46 am**

I thought there was a time where Alder was not with the others... "no one noticed they were missing"... let me make that more precise.

Theory 0xA2

Alpha and Alder are the culprits.

1: Alpha lied that he and Alder were talking in the security room. They snuck out and Alpha used his security clearance to open the door, kill Ferris, and close it without being seen.

2-3: Alder stormed off as told, and killed Micah+Nik. He lied that he did not have time to kill anyone. Alpha then locked the door with his security card.

4-7: Alder killed Miles and Ren a minute or two before he and Ruby "entered from the north" and "no one noticed they were missing". He opened the door, killed Miles and Ren, grabbed Ren's gun and Miles' documents, and gave the gun to Alpha when Alpha left to "check on" Brian and Nettle. Only after that did he call Ruby over to the security room.

Alpha used Ren's gun to kill Brian and Nettle, and then hid Ren's gun and made his own visible. Then Alpha pretended to search Alder and instead

gave

Alder the gun secretly during the "search".

8: Alder had the gun and the documents. He killed Ruby and then knew how to disable the elevator.

9-10: Alder killed Steve and Menna. Do I need to explain this further? Alder lied that he was in CR2.

11: Catherine was stabbed by Alpha. The door was not locked; Alpha only pretended it was.

"12": Alpha faked his death, of course.

Posted: **Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:37 pm**

Alder and Ruby only entered from the north after the bodies of Nettle and Brian were discovered; everyone not mentioned as having left one of the conference rooms remained in there until the sounds were heard.

Posted: **Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:38 pm**

oh...

that may mean I need a complete revision of the theory... but I am not going to declare Alpha confirmed-town either way.

Posted: **Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:39 pm**

what would alpha's motive be though

Posted: **Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:49 pm**

Uh, the documents? Unless Tony is lying, that would be a very likely motive for the murders.

...wait...

Tony declares that

the documents

exist. Alder says in purple that

the documents

are "probably" what the killers are after. Tom confirmed Miles' death. So it

seems

like this means that Miles is not a killer (why would he want to steal his own documents?) but that word "probably" messes up that line of thinking.

Posted: **Thu Aug 09, 2018 12:59 pm**

I've been thinking and I'm pretty sure the two people who held the gun at the end, Tony and Tom, are clear, at least.
The gun had 6 bullets, more than enough to kill the other two in the room, and neither of them shot the others. And if the two are lying about the gun being loaded then it doesn't make sense as they could just kill Adler right there.
Though, there may be another possibility I'm missing there, but I'll be assuming those two are clear for the time being.

I'll re read in a bit since I'm

finally

free from exams. Let's see what we can come up with

Posted: **Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:13 pm**

I'm having a problem regarding narration and character claims. If we sum up everything said in narration and by characters, then we end up with a total of 7 gunshots happening: The

2

gunshots that killed Nettle and Brian, the

1

gunshot that happened during the police siren that killed Ruby, the

3

gunshots Tom heard, two of which killed Steve and Menna while the other one is unknown, and finally the final

1

shot that killed Alpha.
Both Tony and Tom checked Alpha's gun at the end, and it was fully loaded. Alpha said his and Ren's guns were identical, which means each have space for 6 bullets, so where did that seventh shot come from?
Since two out of the three characters alive at the end confirmed this, I'm certain at least one of them is telling the truth, else they would have killed Alder right there because of the more culprits than innocents red.
So... how did seven gunshots happen if each gun only has six bullets and one was fully loaded?

...At this point, I'm certain Alder is the culprit. There's one viable theory I can think of to get around the gunshot problem, and that is that one of the old bodies was re-used in place of Ruby, while Ruby was killed and put elsewhere. Meaning Alder lied about hearing a gunshot during the siren.
Alternatively, Alpha lied about his and Ren's gun being identical when the truth is either his or Ren's gun has more bullets. Or if we assume Alpha lied again, there's more than two guns.

That said, let me help my dear number friend with his theory.

Alder and Alpha are the culprits.

Before anything, the two got into Miles' room and stole the documents. I don't know why they would want them, possibly hired by someone?

For the first murder, they claim to have been together. However, that is not the case, as Alder just lied to give Alpha an alibi. Alpha went over to Ferris' office while Catherine was in the bathroom and stabbed him to death. After this, he locked the door with his master card key and left. When he reached Alder, Alpha gave him his master card key for the next locked room.

For the second murders, when Alder stormed off he found Micah and Nik. He led them to the closet and stabbed them both, locking the door with the Alpha's master card key afterwards when he was out.

For the third murders, Alder left the conference room with Ruby at one point. Ruby's purple of "Alder called me over" implies Ruby was not with him when he called her, so Alder just got into the security room and stabbed Ren and Miles to death. After this, he took Ren's gun, deleted the security footage and called Ruby over to the crime scene.

As this happened, for the fourth murders, Alpha got out of the conference room and quite simply shot both Brian and Nettle with his own gun.
Alpha lied about no one having Ren's gun, because his partner in crime had it.

At this point, secretly while everyone else was distracted/doing something else, Alder gave the master key card back to Alpha, and Alpha swapped his gun with Alder's (because Alpha's gun has space for more bullets, while Ren's only has 6).

For the fifth murder, Alder had possibly set the sirens to play at one point, and he used this chance to say he had heard a gunshot to go over to check on Ruby. He entered the room she was in and shot her with the gun he had been given, then left.
The door was not locked, so Alpha just opened it.

For the sixth murders, Alder separated from the group, lying when he said he was going to the conference room. When he saw his soon to be victims, he shot them both. Catherine, who was in her office, rushed out, but she was shot too. Alder quickly pushed her body into her office and went to hid in the room closest to him: Ferris'.
He lied when he said Catherine was stabbed to death. Honestly, he had me fooled there.

Finally, at the end while Tom and Tony were distracted, Alder gave Alpha's gun back to him. And so, Alpha went over to Tony's room. There, he locked the room from the inside, shot his own gun at the ceiling and hid it in the room.
After this, he laid down on the floor and faked death. When Alder arrived, he lied about him having been shot and about him being dead. The gun Tom and Tony checked was Ren's, which had not been used at any point, so no contradictions were made.

Posted: **Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:12 am**

@SS you said that any statement in purple can be considered true. Does that mean it's objectively true or only that it is true as the character sees it?

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Murder Riddle II (Solved!)

Murder Riddle II (Solved!)