Mod Error Mafia [TM2015] - Game Over

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It's 10 fucking AM.

I want to go to sleep but this has been a good several hours.

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Wisdom does shos's explanation actually make sense to you, or do you just believe in his frustration?

If it's the latter, help me decipher the last post.

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If it's the former*.

My head hurts.

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So what did he actually mean on D3?

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However, there's also this:

also I know that someone targetted me tonight.

shos, explain.

Tgat has relevance to my role

Are you sure that wasn't you being targeted by Rhinox?

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Magua has just responded to my question from earlier.

I may not track myself and I may not give results to myself.

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I DID NOT THINK IT WAS A NIGHT ACTION AFTER WISDOM FULLY CLAIMED.

ME SAYING IT WAS ROLE RELATED WAS TLAKING ABOUT THE POOOOOOOOOOOOOOST NOT ABOUT THE CONTENT
AT THE TIM EOF THE POST I DID NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT KNOW THAT

OMFG GUYS READ STUFF IN CONTEXT

This is Shos's explanation for the ones I just quoted I think.

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So the logic is that his having said that PER SE (and being mistaken!) was relevant to his role. Like, "I would not have thought that I was targeted at night except for confusion about my role."

Regarding Grey, I found their iso very town when I read it 30 pages ago, but I hadn't realized that Bins had flipped Cop at the time. I hate to admit it but x3 investi is goofy. But scum roleblocker also makes a lot of sense to me and T-Bone is uwa.

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Oh so it could be like "I can't explain because the explanation has relevance to my role and I would have to claim."

Rather than "something about my role, e.g. being a self-watcher, made me know that."

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But I mean. Ugh. Jesus.

This game.

Which awful claim is bad enough to be flubbed but not so bad that a committee of 12 could come up with it?

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I'm hoping Ooba will solve the game for me whenever he finishes.

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Ya I imagined making a meme about senpai noticing me a little bit ago but I am too tired.

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Shos, how do you know that you're self-targeting?

Like, I've been a self-watcher (scum self-watcher actually but hey!) in a game before, but my role counted as passive, so I would track as no-action.

You should also explicitly confirm whether you count as having a night action.

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if Grey is scum he's functionally a rolecop.

pedit yw for providing giggles

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I almost had an extra one for Reck that was like "I decided to commit suicide in the middle of D3!" but it didn't have the same punch.

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GreyICE's flavor makes the least sense.

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Also, Katsuki's Miller is tacked on similar to Ceph's. Like, no flavor connection there either.

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GreyICE's flavor makes the least sense.

Relevant because I could see Grey tweaking the claim relative to his role.

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Someone lurks through the night and can't use their night action, so he knows whether they had one?

Pedit @Shos -- Your explanation was not very articulate to be frank, but Wisdom's gloss made more sense.

Grey was like my ONLY TOWNREAD (and ns by association) as of 24 hours ago. I am kind of getting wishy washier. I thought Grey was town because when I read LLD and then him in iso earlier today I thought they were town. Like, there's clear continuity, in Grey's case there was appropriate frustration and feeling pressured to claim, he had impressions about the game that generally made sense to me, etc.

Compare T-Bone, for whom none of those things are true.

Roleblocker as scum can counter information just as viably as 1 fewer crappy investigative roles counters it.

When I voted T-Bone I hadn't even remembered Bins's flip yet, though.

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I am the opposite of Wisdom. I have read inertia, AND the degree of "read sharpness" is always kinda low/hazy. He has read sharpness, but very low read inertia.

Pedit I still don't really understand. I mean vaguely maybe the mod has night go longer until he player is replaced, but the connection isn't as obvious as the others.

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But that's not really a mod error.

I mean, I doubt the game is breakable on something so dumb, so not sure why I keep posting about it, but it bugs me slightly.

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PLAYER ERROR MAFIA.

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(That was a joke.)

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I guess Cabd's flavorname is similarly more of a player error thing.

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The N2 target was reck.

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It's pretty bizarre that we had ACTIVITY from midnight until 10 AM on a Friday night, and then basically nothing?

Are you people trying to imply that you have normal social lives?

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Is notsciene V/LA or what's the deal?

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My implication is more like "Americans who aren't me, plz."

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I can't send the result to myself.

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3. Iece: I'm like, 95% sure this slot is scum because of the role and the above analysis. The flavor matches very lightly, because he claimed to CHOOSE the "wrong player", and someone said that he knows of a game from whence this fakeclaim may have been taken in which Iece played. In actual gameplay, this slot didn't do shit in serious stuff, the only things I realy remember from it is against *me*, which was bullshit. This is where my vote is, and where I think everyone's vote should be.

1. My flavor fits so well that T-Bone literally guessed it D2.

2. I never claimed to choose the "wrong player."

3. The fact that you are unaware of things I have done honestly says more about you than it does about me.

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He said it was because of his claim and his impression after an iso.

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GreyICE did not weigh in on TS.

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Yes, I read the fucking thread. By doing that, I noticed that your story is full of holes. You have an ability that EXPLICITLY informs you if you have been targeted at night.
If you then post that you HAVE BEEN TARGETED AT NIGHT, that means you are crumbing that you have received a pm saying you were targeted.
ANYTHING
ELSE
IS
NOT
FUCKING
POSSIBLE

No, it does not mean that. It means he received Eddie's message and thought it was a night action. Since he received no PM from the mod regarding his action, his action could have malfunctioned. It's entirely plausible.

My inference was more that scumShos's thinking was that there was no reason for the Mod to clarify that his ability had gone off, because he'd just gotten a "night" mod message. So the mod hadn't gone a step farther and said "lol, you were targeted fyi in case that wasn't clear."

Only weird part for me is how he could have any kind of subsequent communication with the mod and not make that clear.

But it does make his posts interpretable if you take it that way.

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I don't see the weird part but whatever

Because I feel like if he asked the Mod about his ability, the Mod could have said that his night action did not trigger, and he did say that he spoke to the Mod.

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3. I was given mollie's (? or eddie's?) message immediately on the start of D2. I had a little conversation with the mod in PMs, trying to figure out if this was a night or day action, and after failing miserably (the mod is very good lol) I decided that this was a night action. only after the full claim I understood that this was a day action. I'm guessing Eddie sent this immediately at the start of the day, because it was literally minutes iirc since daystart when I got the message.

Like, the explanation is "He didn't figure it out!" but I don't understand why the Mod would have to obfuscate this in a way that it would become unclear.

But, there are plenty of claim-related mysteries to go around!

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My inference was more that scumShos's thinking was that there was no reason for the Mod to clarify that his ability had gone off, because he'd just gotten a "night" mod message. So the mod hadn't gone a step farther and said "lol, you were targeted fyi in case that wasn't clear."

Correction here -- this was from townShos's perspective.

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The mod's been pretty clear and direct with me, too. D1 I asked him about the rules for talking about team chat content in-game, and he explained it and then gave me 4 examples of dos and don't. Today I asked him about targeting myself and he responded the next time he was on the site.

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The recipient of my action is alive. ^_^

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inb4 T-Bone claimed to have blocked me

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claims*

/drunkposts fyi

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Shos claimed no one targeted him night 2 and I demonstrably targeted him night 2

lol

lol

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@Shos, he's referring to your and ns's votes being switched yesterday.

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I see no reason not to claim who has my track.

Wisdom has my result.

I am not going to claim who the result is on, though. Suffice it to say that it wasn't on ns.

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Shos is scum unless Cephrir is an all-actions ninja from what I can surmise.

Or Shos erred. Which ^^;.

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btw because i suck at setups; what does the framer flip tell us about the roleblocker? Is the framer enough against cop+tracker?

I think the framer has no effect on tracks. That's what the wiki suggests, at least.

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btw because i suck at setups; what does the framer flip tell us about the roleblocker? Is the framer enough against cop+tracker?

FWIW ActionDan's perspective N3 was that the framer increased the chance that GreyICE was town.

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Let's continue to wait for GreyICE.

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Guys chill for a minute.

This was the subtext.

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shos would never in a million years fuck up his fakeclaim, especially in Team Mafia. And ESPECIALLY after Tier fucked up his. I don't know what the explanation is, I don't know if Tbone blocked him or something else that we don't know about happened, but shos is not scum.

1. I don't think T-Bone blocked him, because that would mean that scumT-Bone lied and claimed to have blocked the dead player (i.e., unnecessarily risking being caught by the tracker, which he knew existed, and targeting a claim that itself would invite suspicion even if he didn't do that). If scumT-Bone, I think T-Bone blocked Rhinox, and Rhinox was killed+blocked on suspicion of having my ability. But T-Bone targeting Reck N3 looks fairly town to me.

2. Usually, self-watchers are passive, meaning that they cannot be blocked or redirected.

Shos claimed that he would track as "self-targeting," suggesting that this game may be unique in this case, but the main thing supporting this aspect of the claim was TierShift's claim that his 1-shot invent was self-targeting. Shos made this connection himself D3.

@Reck, Quil will have to wait for the time being for what I would imagine are obvious reasons.

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"When the mod gives results to the wrong player"
"When the mod confirms the action to the wrong player"

those are really similar and also im not even sure what hte second one means

The latter is presumably when you send a night action to the mod and he sends a PM back that says "Confirmed" or something similar, indicating that he received the action.

After Tier's flip, I assume that scum have fakeclaims, so I am not that concerned about the similarity.

Pedit: Idk @Ceph, I feel like T-Bone has a sketchy enough ability use track record that he could probably use an argument like "One of them had to be scum so I blocked them" and do whatever he wanted.

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Are you saying that Tbone got two different PMs, one for the tracker result and one for "Rhinox targeted you" and thought Rhinox is the tracker?

That is not part of the logic that I was considering and hadn't occurred to me, but it would make sense, yeah. Good thought.

The logic I was using is the following.

1. T-Bone's N2 claim target is scummy and he was aware of the tracker. So it is probably his real target. He could easily simply claim blocking shos if he targeted shos, for example, and have less risk of being found by the tracker.
2. If it is his real target and he is scum, then either he is not a roleblocker at all and simply killed Rhinox, or scum both roleblocked and killed Rhinox.
3. No one got the Loud Doctor effect from Rhinox, so T-Bone DID block Rhinox unless Rhinox protected scum N2.
4. So if T-Bone is scum, probably scum blocked AND killed Rhinox.
5. So if scum did that, they probably thought he was the amnesiac tracker, since there's no reason to block the kill target ordinarily.

Another way out of this is that T-Bone could be town who blocked Rhinox, which doesn't require that scum have a reason for killing+blocking the same target.

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"When the mod gives results to the wrong player"
"When the mod confirms the action to the wrong player"

those are really similar and also im not even sure what hte second one means

The latter is presumably when you send a night action to the mod and he sends a PM back that says "Confirmed" or something similar, indicating that he received the action.

After Tier's flip, I assume that scum have fakeclaims, so I am not that concerned about the similarity.

Pedit: Idk @Ceph, I feel like T-Bone has a sketchy enough ability use track record that he could probably use an argument like "One of them had to be scum so I blocked them" and do whatever he wanted.

confirming an action to the wrong player is literally something I've never heard of before

TO me, it sounds like shos getting lost in translation while coming up w/ a fakeclaim

To be clear, I agree that shos being scum is super super parsimonious right now.

I just don't think the claim is a necessary condition for it really.

pedit yep

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I think shos being town requires that T-Bone took unnecessary risks D3 or that unknown scum powers made shos's action fail N2 *AND* that shos's action is non-standardly capable of failing *AND* that no scum picked up on the discrepancy they created D3 to lynch shosTown.

Shos being scum also fits with him supporting TierShift's claim by validating the "self-target" aspect of it.

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say shos flips scum. Who is the third?

I do not think I should openly speculate too much about my personal opinions until after GreyICE claims.

The shos speculation is OK because it's mostly related to Cephrir's D4 content and is irrelevant to inferring my N3 target one way or the other.

I can say that scumShos's actual ability flip would probably be relevant to narrowing down the possibilities.

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Cephrir took no action N1. He's already explained that he thought his ability was a day action, and he didn't notice otherwise until D2.

N3 he switched my vote with Reck's.

pedit ya.

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He perceived his ability to be anti-town, so he did not use it at first. He used it N2 because he thought he should use it to demonstrate that he has it.

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I was just checking my role PM to see if my role worked in a certain way or not, and I noticed that I actually do have a night action. I thought my ability was a day action.

Whenever I full claim I will be able to explain why I might have thought this.

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Let Wisdom claim the result first.

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(Shos had claimed that his self-watch was an active ability, so you'd get a guilty either way.)

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Yes, it's likely that it was intended as a way to get around your action if you're town.

Shos could still have made the kill with Grey/Shos.

I targeted Grey because something TierShift said at one point in his iso made me think Grey could be scum with him, and I thought there was a reasonable chance he would claim off-target if scum.

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It's pretty goofy that Notscience would die instead of GreyICE in the case where GreyICE is town.

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VOTE: Shos

I am betting against all the requirements for shosTown being true.

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That is L-1.

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Or uh actually it's a hammer.

^^;

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I had thought that Wisdom was one of the previous shos voters when he unvoted.

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Grey should have targeted Reck or Wisdom.

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It was legit an accident.

I am intrigued by the circumstances that made shos's N2 result happen, though.

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ActionDan has suggested I state my plan for the event where Shos flips scum.

If shos flips scum, I will track Wisdom and give the result to Cephrir.

I haven't thought this through very carefully really, but that's my beat-the-mod plan.

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The reasoning is so that block/cop/track don't overlap.

pedit yes, that makes a lot of sense.

If shos flips scum, I will track T-Bone and give it to Cephrir.

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I think if nothing overlaps it's likely to end in a 1/1 for the last one.

Grey should target Reck or Wisdom, since they are the only people who haven't already claimed a night action.

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Grey's claimed target the previous day also didn't make sense, which normally wouldn't mean much, but he had used his ability in a way that showed his awareness of how he should use it the previous night.

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It was really great that you Rhinox died N2, given that you guys blocked me the same night.

It would've been really awkward if Rhinox didn't get my track result.