Newbie 1963 - Game Over

[Uncrowned]

Hi everyone, first timer. Let's see how this plays out.

I think a no lynch is a bad idea, I'd rather get as much info as we can out of the early stage of the game.

I'm putting my vote on someone who hasn't posted yet.

VOTE: Gyro Zeppeli

Also you're a JoJo character so you're already intimidating me, you stud you.

[Uncrowned]

Man Australia timezone sucks. I'm gonna cry if i wake up tomorrow and there's like 10 pages lmao

[Uncrowned]

Lynch Teacher? Perhaps. I must ask him a question first though.

What subject does teacher teach? Not murder, I hope.

[Uncrowned]

@Newnewbs Is this your first game of mafia ever or have you played before on different sites?

I've played Town of Salem Online and Ultimate Werewolf (Normal and One Night) in real life.

This is my first try at Forum Mafia but I've read some of the guides and stuff.

[Uncrowned]

Lynch Teacher? Perhaps. I must ask him a question first though.

What subject does teacher teach? Not murder, I hope.

I teach history. And I offer an elective in scum strategy. Prerequisite is outting your buddy though. Want into the course?

I'm assuming we're all already in the course, since this is your scum game.

[Uncrowned]

Ok, let's break the ice a bit:

1) What is your experience with Mafia specifically? But long-play forum Mafia?
2) Do you prefer being a Townie or a scum? Elaborate your answer;
3) Are you organized in your head, but complete mess physically? Are you the other way around?
4) What type of food do you enjoy and why?
5) Time-zones. When are you the most active here?

1: Like I mentioned earlier, mainly on Town of Salem. Played a bit of Werewolf/Mafia in real life as well. Haven't touched forum mafia besides this.

2: I prefer Town when playing Town of Salem, but Mafia when playing in real life. I think a lot of it has to do with me being ultra competitive and loving to try and deceive the homies right in front of them. Telling the "perfect" lie and getting away with it in a real life game is so much more satisfying imo.

3: Depends. I like to think I'm organised, but if I'm being honest I think I'm pretty average. Not organised or disorganised.

4: I"d say I like sweet and salty things the most, a good piece of feta or some green grapes are always more preferable to me than savoury foods or bitter things. Couldn't really tell you why though, that's just my tastebuds man.

5: I'm Australian Daylight Savings Time right now, and at the time of this post it is roughly 12:17am. Since I'm on break from uni at the moment though, I'll generally be active from most hours of my day except for anything that's like... let's say 2am to 8am my time.

[Uncrowned]

What game are you guys referencing, just so I can view this stuff for myself?

[Uncrowned]

Just some thoughts over the last couple of things I've seen:

1: Fish's playstyle is interesting to me, aggressive town is something seen often, but by drawing attention to himself he could be letting his teammate fly under the radar (assuming he has one).

2: Read back a few pages. Teacher, you said you got a townlean from Gardenia. Why?

3: Would like to see some votes from the 3 who haven't voted yet, want to see some of their thoughts.

[Uncrowned]

@Chib sorry you're not having much fun, man. I'm trying to help progress the game but not really sure how to do that yet.

@Salad I want to have more input, but there isn't really much for me to assess right now except for the interactions between FF/Teach/Chib, which I felt I already did by talking about his playstyle in my previous post. I'll elaborate a bit: I don't necessarily THINK he's scum since this might just be the type of player he is. Applying pressure could be an attempt to get a scumslip from someone else? However, I don't think the current interactions give a whole heap of information, hence why I wanted to see where some more votes get. People are playing very passively right now.

As for your SL on Gyro... I'm keeping my vote on him for a reason. He hasn't really said much in his few posts, I'd like to see him get a bit more involved. Not to be rude, but I don't think he's been helpful yet. At least with some of the others we're getting some information from them and when we see the lynch/NK we may be able to pull something from there. Right now Gyro isn't helping with that imo.

Your TLs are interesting. Gardenia does just seem new and eager to learn, I'd also like to see her list (speaking of, I think I'll do one of those too in a bit.), could be useful at this stage in the game.

I like your TL on Chib, I feel like he's trying to help the game progress, at the very least, so that's a plus for me.

[Uncrowned]

@Salad and yeah the timezone stuff is frustrating but I'll work through it. Didn't even realized you had replaced in btw, sorry about that

[Uncrowned]

Well, 1 just replaced in, another just got prodded and the last one is just making Jojo references. @mario, What do you think of the game so far?

I see what happened. I misread the "1 just replaced in" as "I just replaced in" lol

[Uncrowned]

Just putting the first two people to vote on the same person is flimsy reasoning. With your vote on Teacher we could argue the same thing about you and Fish. It's not really enough evidence to go off of.

[Uncrowned]

2: Read back a few pages. Teacher, you said you got a townlean from Gardenia. Why?

Combination of entry/no-lynch vote and poking the active bear in the room with the FF vote. Is being herself without a filter, it feels.

Uncrowned, what did you get out of this? (I.e., both why did you ask and what do you think of the answer?)

I wanted to see your reasoning since I've got Gardenia still in my "null" category for now, at the time I hadn't really noticed anything from her that pointed me in either direction, personally.

As for your answer, it's okay. The reasoning makes sense, but I feel like the vote on Fish is the easiest one to make at the moment, since he's been the most aggressive player thus far.

[Uncrowned]

posts 20 and 24 strike me as off tonally/overly-explain-y. 119 is overly fence-sitty on FF (and 134 doesn't help that much imo.) And your thoughts on gardenia are a bit unclear to me (134 vs 187)

#20 and #24 were my first two posts ever in Forum Mafia. I like to explain my thought processes and wanted to move Gardenia away from voting for a no lynch, and the 2nd one was just a play on Teacher's name.

#119: Yes, I'll admit I'm fence-sitting on FF. I'm cautious around these types of playstyles. More on this in a bit.

#134: As I said before, I like to explain how I'm thinking. I may tend to ramble, but I'll try make things more concise. The passive plays and general inactivity made me want to attempt to put something on the board so the ball would at least start rolling a little.

#134/#187 (Gardenia Thoughts): I thought they were rather clear. I think she's new and trying to be helpful, but I didn't think Teacher's read of her FF Vote necessarily makes her Town. Like I mentioned in #187, Fish at that point was the easiest vote to make for anyone, as he had the most polarizing playstyle and had drew the attention to himself.

As for Jackson, my vote on Gyro was at the start of RVS and I wanted it on someone who hadn't posted in the game yet, if only to see if he'd react. He didn't. I'm keeping it on him since his posts haven't had much substance behind them imo. I don't think inactivity indicates scum, at least not right now. If that was the sole basis of my vote, I would've switched it once he posted a few times.

[Uncrowned]

Okay I thought I did those post link things correct, but they're leading to other pages. Would someone be able to show me how to properly do them? Ty <3

[Uncrowned]

Oh, so it's because I was putting the # in front of them.

134

[Uncrowned]

...am I missing something here LOL

[Uncrowned]

134

[Uncrowned]

There we go. Thanks. I'm out here showing my -25IQ right now -.-

[Uncrowned]

That's fair. I'm just hesitant to put someone as a town in my mind with little info besides a few posts. That's why I'm in favour of her giving her list on everyone, I think that could prove useful.

[Uncrowned]

Sure. Usually I hesitate to jump on the person who is being the "loudest in the room" as I feel like it's the obvious choice, especially for people who COULD be evil as the louder people are more likely to toss out accusations and make themselves appear more guilty in the process. However, most of my experiences with these aggressive types in other social deduction games is they've usually been either town trying to catch people slipping, or they're a jester (obviously this role list doesn't include that, so that's not a worry here)

However, I want to keep my mind open to the possibility of FF being a distraction for someone else assuming he has one. I see my mistake though, since the only way we'd even be able to figure that out would be via a lynch. Sitting on the fence in that scenario doesn't really make sense. I was hesitant to push since I'm not sure how that sort of thing plays out here. I'll commit to reading FF as an aggressive townie, rather than a scum at this stage.

And you're right, it is a bit odd. My only logic behind it is that Gardenia had been given a TL by two people I believe at that point (Teacher and Salad, who was in your slot before) whereas I had been read as null at that point and hadn't really been asked for my opinions. I'm starting to understand now that it'll be more helpful if I take an actual stance on things instead of waiting for others to do so.

[Uncrowned]

My reads thus far

Town Leans

Datisi

- Liked his slot when Salad was playing it. Unvoted me when fast wagon occured, seemed like a town play. Questions and digs for info in his posts.

FormerFish

- Aggressive townplay imo, made a good connection in post 118 between bugspray's former slot (Chib) and a past game they had played.

Teacher

- I like the logic behind post 102 with the whole idea of "how does this benefit town?". I'm leaning toward Teacher/Fish being a TvT situation.

Gardenia

- After reading back, I like post 150 - except for including Fish in the trio, since he voted Teacher way before back on Page 1. I believe the vote on me was when we started "redoing" the RVS.

Null

Jackson Virgo

- Would like to see more activity. Don't really like his assessment of my vote on Gyro in Post 222 but I don't think that means anything.

Bugspray

- I don't mind this slot, since Chib was at least attempting to get things to progress earlier in the game. Fish's point about this slot in post 118 is a good one, but I'm not certain it's scum indicative.

Scum Leans

Marionette

- Little input, random vote on Teacher seemed out of place. Admittedly, we were redoing the RVS, but Teacher had been one of the more active players up until that point, so voting him without saying anything is odd to me.

Gyro

- Don't like his votes (Teacher, Gardenia) nor his reasoning in Post 140. Seems like a reach. Would like more reads and depth from his posts. A majority of them aren't helpful to town imo.

[Uncrowned]

@teacher I like the reaction test, seems like a town move.

@gyro This is a game of reads, we need them for early game info.

[Uncrowned]

I'm leaning towards changing my vote to Marionette soon if we don't get any input from her.

[Uncrowned]

That's fair too. I just think it's odd that she: Replaced in, answered questions from RQS, cast a mostly random vote with no reference to earlier interactions during the game, and then remained silent from that point on. Just seems a bit off to me.

[Uncrowned]

I think it would be more prudent to await a prod and potential replace than to just kill someone for being inactive.

We're not killing, we're pressuring people to come out and talk (correct me if I'm wrong). Imo, it makes sense because no one wants to get lynched. If you're not going to do it, I might soon.

Definitely not trying to kill, just want Mario to give some insight.

[Uncrowned]

@bugspray Not sure what you saw in my responses after people voted on me, I just explained my perspective to Datisi when he voted on me (for reference, post 226 and 238. Would also prefer if you did defend yourself and give explanations for your reads since even little things can be helpful.

[Uncrowned]

Sorry, when she voted on me not he. Also I'll set my pronoun I thought I had one

[Uncrowned]

^ I'm sorry but that rubbed me the wrong way. My vote was a random vote -

I don't want to be put into a wagon.

VOTE: Marionette because you're still the person

I want to talk to the most.

Bolded- why dont you wanna be on a wagon? How are you going to get a read off him without that pressure.

Italics- This is a tactic that new scum often uses because it makes it look like you are being active and are making a pressure push, but you are basically naked voting that slot and saying that you want them to post, which is why you voted them which defeats the purpose of the vote in the first place because now the guy knows why you are voitng him and how to change.

But until then your vote is being used, but in a way that is not likely to do any damage at all.

I agree here in regards to the wagon and vote usage, even if the pressure was being applied on me it's still beneficial to town as we're seeing how people react.

I think Mari is another one of those "easy votes" that I'm not willing to make just yet. That's the second time I've noticed Garden making one of these (the first was on Fish at the start of the game). Would like more of an explanation on that if you could, Garden.

Even though Mari's behaviour has been odd to me, it was only in a couple of posts. Not enough to go off of yet. I'd prefer our votes pressure someone who we know is around and will give their thoughts.

[Uncrowned]

@bugspray I'm going to defend myself hard, that's how I am in social deduction games. Not everyone likes that style, but that's how I do things.

[Uncrowned]

@Uncrowned; Explanation: But your vote is on Gyro? But seriously, I don't see things like that. For example, if you look at my FF vote, I voted him to try and be funny cause he swung at me like 3 times. For Mari, it was just me saying "hey, will you come back and maybe answer my question?" I don't think it makes sense to analyse my votes without looking at the context behind them.

@Datisi and everyone; gard/garden/whatever abbreviation of my name is fine! Or you can call me...GD

Okay, I can see that. I just found your votes on them to be interesting.

As for my vote on Gyro, I've stayed consistent with that. At first, it was RVS. I've kept it on him since then due to his lack of helping town from my point of view. Mari was next in line, but I'll wait for a replacement, and bug is at least formulating a defense and giving his viewpoints now. I don't like how much pressuring it took for him to reach that point, but that might just amount to being new.

[Uncrowned]

I will say I like bugs point about Jackson slowing down his posts once the topics of conversation changed. I'd also like an actual reads list from Jackson that includes everyone and gives more detail.

[Uncrowned]

I will say I like bugs point about Jackson slowing down his posts once the topics of conversation changed. I'd also like an actual reads list from Jackson that includes everyone and gives more detail.

Yeah apologies, just have been busy and I am currently a basket of sickness. Give me a bit to gather a full readlist of everybody

It's all good. Question for you though, since I just read through your ISO.

You voted for me when you replaced in, and in post 222 you said it's because I voted on someone for inactivity. Okay, I'm following you there.

Then in post 263 you do your reads list, with me in null and Marionette, the least active player in the game up until that point, in your scum pile.

That seems inconsistent to your earlier thoughts, mind explaining? You can do so in the updated reads list you just said you're gonna do, if you'd like.

[Uncrowned]

VOTE: FormerFish
Reasoning in my last post

Sort of siding me me and trying to get on my good side when I'm a scummier looking town is a smart move as scum because it would mean that you just NK someone who is super town and then use that rapport in future days for more ML's

Thoughts?

p.s. if JV is maf then I think the tierlist would be a good nit to pick for clues about partner

I don't think people voting on the same person means they're trying to get on their good side. I wouldn't say myself/Teacher and Datisi/Fish are trying to "get close" or whatever, yet our votes are on the same people. Not sure if that's good logic to work off of.

[Uncrowned]

VOTE: FormerFish
Reasoning in my last post

Sort of siding me me and trying to get on my good side when I'm a scummier looking town is a smart move as scum because it would mean that you just NK someone who is super town and then use that rapport in future days for more ML's

Thoughts?

p.s. if JV is maf then I think the tierlist would be a good nit to pick for clues about partner

I don't think people voting on the same person means they're trying to get on their good side. I wouldn't say myself/Teacher and Datisi/Fish are trying to "get close" or whatever, yet our votes are on the same people. Not sure if that's good logic to work off of.

I mean from my pov, it isn't good logic and it seems to be biased against me completely. If they want to base their future reads of that it's fine, just they need to think the same about you/teacher, datisi/fish like you stated or the logic falls through the cracks.

That's what I'm saying, I don't agree with the logic. I think it's too surface level.

[Uncrowned]

Also, Fish is at L-2. Not a fan of that naked vote.

[Uncrowned]

We've had people voting together earlier too. When did this thought occur?

This is what I'm thinking, it seems like an odd thing to point out. What I want more of an explanation of is this part though:

trying to get on my good side when I'm a scummier looking town is a smart move as scum

Maybe I'm crazy, but isn't this the opposite of what you'd want to do? Not that I think JV voting with you is valid reasoning anyway, Bug, but this seems off.

I could be misunderstanding your point. Explain?

[Uncrowned]

To put it simply, I voted because I feel they are a TvS with Teacher. The fact Gyro jumped onto that with a naked vote makes me want to get off that shiz as fast as I can.

Didn't you also say you thought Gyro/Fish was SvS?

Do you still see Fish as Scum then, or no?

[Uncrowned]

To put it simply, I voted because I feel they are a TvS with Teacher. The fact Gyro jumped onto that with a naked vote makes me want to get off that shiz as fast as I can.

Didn't you also say you thought Gyro/Fish was SvS?

Do you still see Fish as Scum then, or no?

I don't remember writing that anywhere but yes I feel Gyro/Fish are a SvS and this might be a way of Gyro getting towncred but I also think Teacher/Fish is a TvS.

So currently my reads are FF and Gyro being scum. I left that wagon because I don't want it to be lynched yet.

I went back and found it, Post 373 is when you said it.

So you think Fish is scum but don't want to apply pressure onto him yet? I don't like the Gyro vote on him either, but if you think he's scum wouldn't you want pressure on FF?

[Uncrowned]

Well, you put him at L-2 not L-1, Jackson. And even if someone hammered him without waiting for his defense, it'd be clear they're scum and they'd be next on the chopping block. We established earlier on in the game that we want to be applying pressure on people.

[Uncrowned]

Since I am set on TvS {Teacher, FF}. It's either SvS {FF, Gyro}

(meaning it could be Gyro/Teacher)

or SvS {FF, bug}

What do you mean Gyro/Teacher?

Yeah could have formatted that better and now that I am writing this, I disagree with my own read on that.

I mean originally that if FF flips scum. All my SvS reads with FF were now with Teacher but I don't think that anymore

You're chopping and changing a lot, I'm not sure what to make of you.

[Uncrowned]

You're chopping and changing a lot, I'm not sure what to make of you.

How so? I believe I've been dead set on TvS FF and SvS Gyro/FF for a while. Have I not made that clear enough?

The Fish vote, unvote, and then revote.

Saying Teacher could take FF"s role in the SvS teams you have listed, and then taking it back a few posts later.

Could just be mistakes or reevaluating, which is fine. I'm pointing it out because it's happened two times in quick succession.

Your TvS and SvS have been consistent, I wasn't referencing those.

[Uncrowned]

I mean originally that if FF flips scum.

All my SvS reads with FF were now with Teacher but I don't think that anymore

Okay, genuinely no idea what this means.

And yes. By default, each page has 25 posts. So posts number 25, 50, 75, 100, 125 etc. are pagetoppers.

Words aren't helpful for me when I am half asleep, apologies

The only way I can make sense of 413 is if you'd meant to write "meant originally that if FF flips Town". Is that right?

OH! Yeah that's what I meant. Since I TvS Teacher and FF.

If FF flips town, Teacher is the scum from my pov.

I'm confused now. Do you think it or do you not?

[Uncrowned]

I think FF is the scum. I don't believe teacher is, I thought that was what I was saying?

Let me try make full sense.

FF is Scum to you. But if he flips town, you think Teacher is scum instead. Is that correct?

[Uncrowned]

SvS is when you think two scum are arguing and going against one another to "distance" from each other, so that people don't think they're a team.

TvT is when you think two town members are going against one another.

TVS is when you think an interaction is actually a Town going against a Scum.

[Uncrowned]

my list:

town:
* bugspray: duh
* Datisi: pretty solid town to me tbh, doing a lot of good scumhunting that makes up the foundation of effective townplay
*

Gyro: seems to have made same earlier mistakes as me but even sooner and now has effectively joined the scumunt (cant wait till figure out how I do this).

**null:**
* teacher: null leaning town but still town imo, been helpful and making a lot of good points, possibly
* Gardenia: still not fully sure, scumlean on her for sure because a lot of the same newb mistakes I'm making
* Fuzanglong: slight scumlean because not helping but this is a less serious accusation and more of "applying pressure" or something
*JV: scumlean because might be bad town like earlier gyro and then me seems to be sort of digging a hole like i was earlier but way more spectacularly

**scum:**

*fish: start helping and acting like town

I don't get these two parts. Gyro has been one of the least active players in the game and has provided no insight and made only naked votes. Fish, even if you don't agree with his playstyle, has pressured other players into giving explanations and has made some connections that seem feasible. I think at best Gyro can only be put into the null category due to lack of useful activity. I'm still susp of him though.

Also, where am I on this list?

[Uncrowned]

FormerFish: at least recently, being vague, also is trying to convince ppl he doesn't care if he gets lynched or not (but then maybe he doesnt?) at least twice, once in pg 19, once in pg 18

Incorrect. I care. It just isn't going to happen.

Anyone who looks at me better come up with one hell of a case, cause I have the means to dismantle any case brought against me as scum

Assuming I am town and focusing on other slots is beneficial to town. Focusing on me is a red herring and will be proven to be a bad read eventually.

I mean theoretically it can happen lol also then a counterclaim would be that why do you care? If you're a townie then dying would just be like a "ha in your face" moment would it not?

...why would a townie want to be lynched?

[Uncrowned]

Thanks for answering lol
UNVOTE: bugspray

Why so quick to unvote after he answered one question? Isn't he on your scum list? Or am I wrong?

[Uncrowned]

Oh, okay. You got another vote up. This puts Gyro at L-2 I believe.

[Uncrowned]

It feels like the attention has been focused on bug and that’s the momentum slot. And it feels like nobody has been pushing against that, which means everybody (including bugs presumptive partner) is ok with that. So I’m not.

The second line was on bugs response to the avi and other pressure - not trying to appease others to survive. I’m just not getting much survivalism. Again, not a great sign.

I understand the premise here, although I'm not sure I agree with the second point. Bug has been trying to survive, more notably after he said he was taking the game more serious after his earlier interactions with Datisi.

It feels like the attention has been focused on bug and that’s the momentum slot. And it feels like nobody has been pushing against that, which means everybody (including bugs presumptive partner) is ok with that. So I’m not.

The second line was on bugs response to the avi and other pressure - not trying to appease others to survive. I’m just not getting much survivalism. Again, not a great sign.

You're pushing against it.

Teacher/Bug lol

Well, yeah. But he explains why.

It feels like the attention has been focused on bug and that’s the momentum slot. And it feels like nobody has been pushing against that, which means everybody (including bugs presumptive partner) is ok with that. So I’m not.

The second line was on bugs response to the avi and other pressure - not trying to appease others to survive. I’m just not getting much survivalism. Again, not a great sign.

dis makes you sound sus bc what if you're bug's ally and you want the pressure off him and therefore yourself

Isn't the opposite happening here? If anything, Teacher got a slight pressure from you and JV for making that post.

[Uncrowned]

Thanks for answering lol
UNVOTE: bugspray

Why so quick to unvote after he answered one question? Isn't he on your scum list? Or am I wrong?

I only voted bug because they wouldn't answer my question, then they did so I unvoted. Gyro is more sus to me. Its either Gyro or bug from my current pov

Can easily be both, to be clear, and I have slight inclinations to believe that from cokes one post. Just think gyro is the more progitable lynch for the day.

Who are you referring to, Teacher? JV and Gyro? Bug and Gyro?

[Uncrowned]

Uncrowned and JacksVir:why vote Gyro? (Jacks, if you have reasoning past "not explaining his naked vote on ff" I would appreciate it)

As I said in post 244 I didn't like his votes on Teacher or Gardenia and his reason behind the Teacher vote (post 140). My original vote on him was from RVS, I've kept it on him since my current mindset right now is "Does this post or person's overall play style benefit town, or seem town motivated?" since I liked that thought process when Teacher brought it up during the Fish/Chibi/Teacher interactions near the start of the game.

I don't think Gyro has helped town much, I liked when he asked for Datisi's explanation of why he thought Bug was scum, since that was encouraging discussion and progressing the game, but that's about it.

He's not clear scum to me by any means, but I've got more suspicion to him than I do to others. Bugs made the "mason hunting" blunder earlier and has had some takes that I don't agree with and Jackson has seemed a bit jumpy in terms of votes and his reactions to things, but I could see this potentially being nervousness and/or inexperience. I'd also like to see a bit more out of Fuzanglong overall.

I will say out of the 4 I mentioned in this post (Gyro, Fuz, JV and Bug) I think Bug is the least likely to be scum out of them, he has this "stream of consciousness" style with his posts, like he's reacting to things naturally as they come and he's just giving us his thoughts as they pop into his head. It feels right to me, even if I think he's been wrong on a few occasions and could probably do with evaluating his stances a bit better at times.

[Uncrowned]

FF, why did you quick hammer on Gyro though? I thought the normal play was to state intent to hammer in case that person had a claim or at least to get more defense.

I'll be the first to say I didn't like Gyro's play, but I think we could've gotten more out of D1 than what we did.

[Uncrowned]

Scum can easily sit back and stay off a wagon they know is on town and throw shade on townies who get on it.

I hammered the way i did because i needed to stay alive to be useful to town, acting like scum means that scum isnt going to shoot me becase they are going to try to mislynch me and use my behavior as the reasoning.

Its low hanging fruit and it is the easiest push for scum to make.

Oh, I missed this. Thanks.

This makes sense with what I was saying earlier. Also, we were making points earlier in the game about how there was a lack of defense being made on Bugspray's behalf, with the logic being that scum were content with him being lynched. I'm seeing a similar pattern here with a few people taking jabs at FF.

[Uncrowned]

Sadly hunting for mislynches / town by gamestate isolation ("they have no allies itt therefore they're likely town") doesn't really work after that tell has been discussed in a game. Gyro was that townie this game. We're gonna need to get more creative.

I kinda follow you, but I still think it could be a factor? There's something about the pressure on FF that I'm not liking, especially from Fuz, since it's the first time she's coming out to say anything with substance against another player. Prior to this, she's only:

-Said you seem reliable.
-Voted on Gyro (second to last vote)

To me that seems like a reaction based playstyle that's giving me opportunistic vibes, since she only seems to jump in when something has already become somewhat of a consensus among the group (your slot receiving lots of towncred, Gyro picking up votes, and now the pressure on FF).

[Uncrowned]

From my current point of view, FF seems like the scummiest person here; if you have a problem deal with it
VOTE: Formerfish

just to compare: JV diving in with the vote here is a markerly more aggressive stance. JV also feels generally unapologetic for his read.

Normally I'd pin this is fairly town indicative but the "ig you have a problem deal with it" gives me like the tiniest bit of pause

basically I think JV is townier than Fuz which doesn't really come as much of a surprise to me.

I don't think Uncrowned/Fuz is a likely scumteam after #719 tbf. I think I had Uncrowned down to look at based off partner equity with Fish which I think I still want to be pretty wary of; I think I can say in a world where Fish is town I don't think Uncrowned has a particularly scummy scumbuddy

While I'm at it: sorry to drag you into the fray teacher, do you think I should be townreading Fishy? Not going down trust tell territory but if you think my d1 misread was stupid I'll shelf it.

The reason I didn't bring up JV in 719 is because he's held the same stance on FF for a while now, it's more consistent than Fuz who seems happy to join in on things once other people have brought them up. That's how I'm seeing things atm.

[Uncrowned]

problem w this is JV is being completely earnest and that still doesn't tell me anything further abt his alignment

I think JV is being honest, but I also think he's wrong. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and just say it's an incorrect read.

I'm interested in Fuz's response to what I said about her, and also want to see what Eth0s has to say about the game. That slot has also been pretty passive iirc.

[Uncrowned]

Give them* the benefit

I am also bad at looking at these pronouns smh

[Uncrowned]

Explain your reads JV, since they've changed from FF for now?

[Uncrowned]

@eth0s Not sure how you want me to defend myself, I feel like being blunt can only convey so much.

Interested as to why you think I fit the bill for the Bugspray kill, would like to see your logic behind that.

[Uncrowned]

Also why are you set on Fuz being town?

[Uncrowned]

Bussing Fuz? I had that slot as a SL since D1, and was planning on pressuring the slot prior to Gyro getting lynched quicker than I thought he would've.

Ethos having them as clear town is weird to me, I want to know why he thinks that because I don't see it at all yet.

[Uncrowned]

Uncrowned doesn't have many posts at all and their readlist is mediocre at best, but I can't say shiz on that behalf lol

You said yourself that inactivity doesn't mean a slot should be pressured. Interesting you bring that up now.

And my readlist was at the beginning of the game and besides the incorrect read on Gyro I think has been somewhat accurate. Not sure what you're going for there.

[Uncrowned]

VOTE: Fuz

Maybe you're passive town, but your playstyle seems opportunistic to me.

Also still want Ethos to explain why Fuz is "clearly town" from his POV.

[Uncrowned]

Uncrowned doesn't have many posts at all and their readlist is mediocre at best, but I can't say shiz on that behalf lol

You said yourself that inactivity doesn't mean a slot should be pressured. Interesting you bring that up now.

And my readlist was at the beginning of the game and besides the incorrect read on Gyro I think has been somewhat accurate. Not sure what you're going for there.

I am just going to say that scum would know who the town are so you can't really lean on that as your saving grace.

Obviously. I just don't get why you'd call it "mediocre" but then not explain why you thought so? Unless you just can't be bothered going back through all the info right now, then I gotcha.

@uncrowned, who'd you put as your scum-team?

In my readlist? I had Gyro as my most scum and Fuz's predecessor behind him.

[Uncrowned]

Yeah I am haha, I get you, I'm about to head off myself. We still got plenty of time

[Uncrowned]

I get JV's point about the list being mediocre, that's cool. I don't think it was amazing or anything, but I too want him to expand on why he said it's meh.

I've seen 2 other readlists with similar quality behind them. Fuz's Post 479 and Gardenia's (Ethos' slot) Post 258.

I don't want to cause offense either and say they're not good, because this game has been tough. I like JV bringing up the readlists, but if he's aiming at me based on the quality, we need to be looking at multiple instances of it.

I made that mistake earlier too imo, singling out only Gyro's early game inactivity was poor reasoning, I agree. I should've analysed more and waited for Fuz to give us something, which is what I want to give her the chance to do now before we rush into votes again like we did D1.

[Uncrowned]

I haven't liked JV's opinions much the last few pages, but he did appear townie after the "hammer test" by the worst. I put that in quotations since I have a suspicion that it could have been coached by the worst since he seems to be a pretty good player, and it'd be a good way to "confirm" JV as a townie through AtE.

But I can't say I'm sold on them as a team. I've liked the worst's slot since the beginning of the game. Highly unlikely to me that there's been 3 separate players of that slot that I've liked for the most part and it turns out they're scum.

Eth0s came in hot with the reads after catching up, but hasn't followed up much since imo. I've asked him about a couple of things, namely why he thought I fit the bill for the Bugspray kill, and why he though Fuz was definitely town, and he hasn't responded. Maybe caught up in the rest of the game? Possibly, but seems unlikely for someone who was combing through so many posts and analysing a majority of them quite well.

I don't think Fuz looked townie at all, yet Eth0s seemed convinced, which doesn't make sense to me. I still want an explanation on that.

[Uncrowned]

Also on the hammer test, I feel like my first instinct as a player would be to double check the votes and see if I actually got lynched. This isn't something I can prove on JV as perfect evidence that he's scum, but it's my gut feeling. Just the way he's appeased other players, jumped back and forth between votes and opinions on the game and been kinda inconsistent overall has me questioning if he's town or not.

I'd like to hear from Eth0s first and get his thoughts before I proceed with making accusations.

[Uncrowned]

Uncrowned doesn't have many posts at all and their readlist is mediocre at best, but I can't say shiz on that behalf lol

Also why are you set on Fuz being town?

This could be somewhat of a bus? I guess?


UNVOTE: FormerFish

So my read on the bluff was correct, and what do you mean by info I shouldn't have had?

This fits his playstyle this game, tbh. He's on the verge of making assertions, but he doesn't go all the way with it. There's a hint of passiveness and lack of conviction behind a lot of his thoughts, which gives me pause. An example of this is Post 817 where he lays out possibilities, but doesn't lean toward any of them.

To me, it's like he's throwing out bait and seeing if anyone will agree with it. This also fits with his voting, which has been sporadic. Votes, unvotes, and then ultimately, following the votes led by other players. With Gyro, it was me and Teacher who thought he would be the most profitable lynch. He followed.

With Fuz, he was the hammer vote. Granted, I haven't done a full VCA of everyone remaining, but he's had a tendency of putting votes onto the more vulnerable slots in the game and seeing if it has an impact. Gyro, Fuz, Bugspray, and Fish (prior to him being confirmed mason) were all players who were either under the spotlight in terms of attention, or were otherwise easy lynches (in his eyes, assuming I'm right and he's scum).

List ripped from the alive list and removed all 'confirmed' people mainly the masons and myself.

Fuzanglong - Scum
Uncrowned - Scum
eth0s - Town
the worst - Town

If the scum insists of newb!scum it's Fuz and Uncrowned. And even I wouldn't have attacked bugspray as scum so I doubt the worst or eth0s would have but the other two may as well have.

He did suggest I was bussing Fuz, so this is one of the more consistent things he's posted. What I'd like more explanation of is his post 920 where he found something interesting in my read on Marionette (Fuz's slot). I'm not entirely sure what he was getting at by attacking my reads list, since at that point my reads were mostly made up of points that no one else had touched upon.

What I'm trying to say is, bringing up the reads list just feels like a weak attempt to put me under some pressure, similar to how he did when he entered the game and put a vote on me for "voting someone up due to inactivity" (Gyro), which makes no sense considering he ended up voting on him as well, and then brought up my "inactivity" later in the game as a reason for me to be scum.

Is it just mistakes of a new player, or is it scum trying to put attention on another slot that is equally vulnerable? My gut tells me it's the latter.

@uncrowned I think JV had strong posts and posts which gave me pause around the hammer test but there's probably juicier stuff AFTER the hammertest

what do you think of these? can you see anything else in their ISO around here which makes you think they're scum?

agree a lot of YMMV around hammertesting but often posting during excited gamestate (e.g. after the hammertest here) forces townies to think fast and scum to improvise; which one do you think they were doing?

[Uncrowned]

@theworst I'm going to re-read the hammer test reactions again before I address that last part of your post.

[Uncrowned]

Another thing before I do that, JV has mentioned Eth0s a handful of times in his ISO, but never given any real reasoning no matter whether he's listed him as town or scum in his book. If he thinks Eth0s is scum, there should be some actual reasoning behind it. Could easily just be another weak bus attempt to say "Hey, I had him on my scum team" if he does get lynched today and flips red.

I don't get why you'd list multiple times as being either alignment, and then giving zero reason as to why you believe so. Again, the passive playstyle just doesn't seem right for a player who has been so involved in the game.

For reference, the posts I'm looking at: 764 882 921

[Uncrowned]

@theworst Honestly, looking back on the hammer test I don't know if it's worth much. It seems like the perfect WIFOM (correct me if I'm using that term wrong) to clear his name with the use of some salt and AtE. It could come from the viewpoint of an exasperated townie pissed that they've been lynched, or a scum who recognized that they weren't lynched and saw it as an opportunity.

The coaching possibility from you via PT is a possibility, but highly unlikely from my current POV as I'm more centered on Eth0s atm than I am on you.

I'd much prefer to go off the other stuff I've mentioned, since to me it seems far more AI than the hammertest which imo is a 50/50.

[Uncrowned]

You talking about my inactivity was in post 879, that's what I was referencing.

And sure, PoE makes sense now, but prior to that is where it gets iffy.

You started with him as potential scum in Post 764 with no other thoughts on him.

Then in 882 you switched him over to town. Again, with no no explanation.

So your 931 is accounted for by PoE, but the others still aren't.

[Uncrowned]

Actually, wait, no. I was referring to your 921, not your 931. Your 921 again switches Eth0s back over to scum, which wasn't when PoE had kicked in yet since Fuz hadn't been lynched.

[Uncrowned]

@theworst Honestly, looking back on the hammer test I don't know if it's worth much. It seems like the perfect WIFOM (correct me if I'm using that term wrong) to clear his name with the use of some salt and AtE. It could come from the viewpoint of an exasperated townie pissed that they've been lynched, or a scum who recognized that they weren't lynched and saw it as an opportunity.

The coaching possibility from you via PT is a possibility, but highly unlikely from my current POV as I'm more centered on Eth0s atm than I am on you.

I'd much prefer to go off the other stuff I've mentioned, since to me it seems far more AI than the hammertest which imo is a 50/50.

I have no idea what WIFOM means.
Also Uncrowned are you saying it's {JV, Eth0s}?

I'm not making any assumptions until I get more thoughts from worst and Eth0s, but especially eth0s since worst's slot has been safe to me almost this entire game.

Right now though, I'd say from safest to least safe is: Worst, Eth0s, JV. Subject to change once eth0s gets here.

[Uncrowned]

There's no framing going on, it's me looking at your inconsistencies and seeing what I can gather from them. Right now, they put you at the top of my list. The only real instance I've seen you actually give a decent reason for someone being scum is PoE, but that only works assuming that you're town, which I don't think you are atm.

Will reread your ISO now but I'm not sure what you want me to get out of your read baits. If just calling people town or scum with no backup behind your thoughts is a read bait in your mind then you're not helping out town. Maybe I'll find something more indicative this time around.

[Uncrowned]

I'm not criticizing your reads, man. I've been dead wrong on both of mine, them being Gyro and Fuz.

I'm pointing out the fact that you've swung from Point A to Point B numerous times with no rhyme or reason. It seems out of character for someone who at one stage of the game was set on FF being scum. The fact that you became so passive and swingy gives me reason to believe you're scum.

[Uncrowned]

Every read I've had, I've stuck to it and had reasons as to why I've felt that way. Wrong or not, they seemed agreed upon and in some cases followed up on by other players (including yourself). We need to be aggressive if we're going to find scum, and prior to this you've only showed aggression when defending yourself, and when targeting Fish.

The more I look back on it, the more it starts to make sense. You push on Fish because you thought he'd be easy to push on and other people will agree with you. You push hard, it doesn't work, no-one except for worst really seems to have even a slight bit of suspicion towards Fish, so you back off since you know it's not going to go through.

That's why you played more passive from that point on, talking in "maybes" and "I guesses" trying to keep yourself as a safe player, the only time you really started speaking out being when you've had people wagoning against you.

Now you're kicking into gear again because I've got the read on you and you're trying to find something to suggest otherwise. I'm starting to think I've got this figured out, though.

[Uncrowned]

You've voted: Me, Fish, Bugspray, Gyro, Fuz.

You weren't in the game during RVS, I believe. So these are all people you've at one point or another have had at least a SLIGHT feeling of them being scum, right?

Just going through and looking at different stages of the game, your base reads were:

1: Gyro/Bug with a chance of FF being part of a team. Post 373

Then you dipped into this thought were Teacher could be part of a scum team with Gyro, even though Teacher had voted Gyro D1 and saw him as a "profitable lynch" (his words). That's already an odd read to me since Teacher is an SE, doubt he'd bus D1. Not that it matters now since they're both dead and Teacher was Mason, but again, it leans into your whole playstyle of poking and prodding to see where you can sway people to make a lynch happen.

2: After they both died (Bug, Gyro), you had the back and forth with FF, no real base reads here to be seen yet.

3: Now your team changes to Fuz/Uncrowned in Post 882

4: Then you switch to Fuz/Eth0s in Post 921

5: And now you've got Me/Eth0s.

So no, I think I'm right in saying your reads have chopped and changed significantly over the course of the game. Being open-minded is cool, but from what I've seen from your play, yours seems more opportunistic and set on achieving mislynches.

Another point of interest here is that on every vote you've made except on Fish IIRC, there's already been other people voting on that player. Me, Bugspray, Gyro and Fuz all at one point or another had a lot of attention coming our way and had at least one or two votes set on us before you decided to jump in. Call it a frame if you want, I'm calling it as suspicious until I get more from worst and eth0s.

[Uncrowned]

Who have I townread that is scum, are you saying? My strongest townreads were the worst's slot and Teacher, if I recall correctly.

[Uncrowned]

I null-read you.

Also, in Posts 820 822 886 899 and 909 I tried to bring attention to Ethos and get him to answer my questions, but the phase ended and I got nothing out of it, and no-one else seemed to have any opinions on what I was saying at the time. I had suspicions on him, but I was more suspect of Fuz at the time. Like those posts have said, I'm STILL wondering why Ethos had these clear thoughts of Fuz being town, since that's an opinion that I think no-one else really shared at the time.

[Uncrowned]

Of note too is that my Post 909 was a direct response to JV mentioning that Ethos' predecessor had a similar type of read list to mine, but you didn't reply to that at all.

Odd how I tried to bring another slot into the game and you didn't react at all, but now you're set on him being a scum.

This is linking back to my thought that he could be attempting to bus Ethos as I mentioned in 941

[Uncrowned]

If you find anything of interest on the worst, link the posts. I've been pretty confident in him being town but he could have just played a 200IQ game. I'll look through myself as well when I can.

[Uncrowned]

Who have I townread that is scum, are you saying? My strongest townreads were the worst's slot and Teacher, if I recall correctly.

You haven't scum-read or null-read anybody who is possibly scum right now (except me now I believe) meaning you're town-read every scum. Is that wrong? It was mainly a funny quip

I thought you were talking about my original readlist here, not currently. Right now I don't have any null-reads.

[Uncrowned]

And right now I do think The Worst is town, but I'm not set on anything yet until we get more discussion. He's clearly a smart player. You and Ethos are definitely more on my radar than he is, though I'm yet to read his ISO.

[Uncrowned]

I do have my reads, that doesn't mean they're not open to being changed. I just think I've seen what's going on here. I'd be an idiot to assume I'm 100% correct though and not be open to changing in case something does pop up in worst's ISO that is a red flag.

[Uncrowned]

For 971, No it's just I don't have time to fully read through everything right now, since year 12 final exams and that but now I can.
For that last one, if you think he's town then you instantly should view me as scum not a null. So what's up with that?

And yeah, I meant to quote this one. Like I said, I thought you were talking about my original reads post where I had you as a null-read.

[Uncrowned]

Don't really get what you mean, you were talking about my reads, I automatically assumed you meant the reads list since that's what we've spoken about a few times.

[Uncrowned]

I think you're talking about something completely different right now, because I'm lost on where this conversation is. You said I haven't scum-read or null-read anyone that's left in this game, so I thought you were talking about my read list. I said that in my original read list, you were in my null pile, which you were.

And then I said that I was starting to suspect Ethos could be scum, and I even laid out the posts where I did that, which you still haven't responded to besides saying that you're set on Ethos being scum.

I've never null-read you in this stage of the game. The first posts of this day that I've made were 934 and 936, where it's pretty clear I've got you and Ethos as my more likely team than one featuring The Worst. My reply of saying "I null-read you" was me referencing my original reads list, not what I'm thinking right now.

If you're talking about something else, I apologise. I think you've missed something though because we're talking about entirely different things.

[Uncrowned]

I get what you're saying, but you're misunderstanding what i was talking about. It makes sense if I was saying I'm null-reading you now, but I'm not.

Also don't really like how you're sidetracking into this kinda pointless debate tbh, especially when I made a bunch of points on the last page that you still haven't really addressed.

[Uncrowned]

Ethos is less suspicious to me because he's done less suspicious things, I've already laid out various reasons as to why I think you're scum. I've also already said in recent posts what I thought made Ethos seem scum, but they're less prevalent than what you've done.

If you want a recap on what I think of Ethos, I basically want to know why he was so set on Fuz being a townie when pretty much no-one else in the game thought that of Fuz at the time. A scum would know she was town, is my logic behind that. And I don't think he had good reason to call her town since she hadn't really demonstrated townie behaviour imo.

He also hasn't replied to any of my other queries on him, which I don't like considering he had a pretty hot start and came out with a lot of reads, thoughts and theories.

[Uncrowned]

You didn't reply at all to anything I said in post 964, for one.

[Uncrowned]

And you said almost nothing of relevance in response to my post 969, besides saying you were set on Ethos being scum.

[Uncrowned]

Well, exactly. That's why I'm asking him why he said that.

And again, exactly. He hasn't done much of anything. I don't want to keep repeating myself, but I've already made a bunch of posts in the last few hours explaining my thoughts on you, so just read those. I've said it again and again, my list in order of most likely to be town to least likely is: Worst, Ethos, You.

[Uncrowned]

That above response was to JV's Post 996 btw, not to you Worst. just so it's clear

[Uncrowned]

actually given Uncr had an incorrect scumread yday and is forced to reevaluate you today I think the mindset of
"oh by POE I guess JV is scum..."
"oh that's a scumpost"
"oh that could be scum too"
"OH THIS IS SCUM"
checks as a town indicative mindset

obv. i'm not a mind reader (YET) and i'm still building a baseline mindset for uncr - but i don't think the trajectory there is actually scum indicative. him interacting with you like you're town while trying to lynch you defs wld be. but i think the active reconsideration/affirmation could p easily come from town

This is what I'm saying. Right now, JV has given me so much more to work with, so obviously I'm going to analyse him. I've tried in heaps of posts now to try and get Ethos to interact and explain some stuff, and even tried to lead other people in that direction, but no-one was saying anything of the sort until today where he's one of the few remaining suspects.

[Uncrowned]

no dramas
what was your read on JV yday? i'm working thru your iso first so will know l8r but it's more useful to me now but i'm also making dinner

I still had JV in my null category yesterday, but I was actively questioning him on his Fish reads and his voting/unvoting and his overall inconsistency/jumpy behavior.

At the time, I was admittedly far more suspicious of Fuz, and also didn't like Ethos seemingly giving her a random vote of confidence when no-one else had similar thoughts.

[Uncrowned]

No, as I laid out in my post, your reads have been jumping back and forth with various combinations, and my theory behind that is that you were looking to see what would stick. It's all in that post you just quoted, I think it was opportunism and going for mislynches that would be easy for you to pull off.

And no, scum can start a wagon, I'm just saying your voting throughout the game has been in line with my theory of you being opportunistic, that's all.

[Uncrowned]

To elaborate @theworst, my D2 had me thinking JV could possibly be a nervous/new townie who kept taking back and putting on votes to different people because they weren't sure of anything. After further looking into his ISO and playstyle though, and from what's happened during this game, my opinion has swung, but that was only at the start of D3, not D2.

[Uncrowned]

No, as I laid out in my post, your reads have been jumping back and forth with various combinations, and my theory behind that is that you were looking to see what would stick. It's all in that post you just quoted, I think it was opportunism and going for mislynches that would be easy for you to pull off.

And no, scum can start a wagon, I'm just saying your voting throughout the game has been in line with my theory of you being opportunistic, that's all.

Did you not read what I said before? Jesus

I'm pointing out that no, you weren't set on me and Ethos, you've changed frequently. I thought that was clear. You're trying to say you have these "base reads" when my post made it clear that you didn't until today.

[Uncrowned]

And you said almost nothing of relevance in response to my post 969, besides saying you were set on Ethos being scum.

Literally that means nothing since if you're scum you're obviously bussing

...I want you to listen to yourself.

As I've said multiple times, Ethos had almost NO attention on him during D2. I was one of the ONLY people who saw something in his posts that struck me as odd, so I brought it up.

And everyone, including yourself, virtually ignored it. And then? The phase ended.

Keep in mind that I also had no attention on myself, so why in the world would I decide to start a conflict and get put under the microscope?

Because clearly I had a suspicion on Ethos, and I was willing to get into conflict if it meant finding a scum. You calling this a SvS is a reach, and I just laid out why.

[Uncrowned]

If you don't agree with me on Ethos's D2 being a little odd, then explain to me why, because him calling Fuz clear town when nobody else did? You said it yourself, maybe he wanted to get some towncred. Cool, that's YOUR answer. I want HIS answer as to why he thought that way, which he still hasn't, and I'm not going to be satisfied with making a vote until I get something from him.

[Uncrowned]

And you said almost nothing of relevance in response to my post 969, besides saying you were set on Ethos being scum.

Literally that means nothing since if you're scum you're obviously bussing

...I want you to listen to yourself.

As I've said multiple times, Ethos had almost NO attention on him during D2. I was one of the ONLY people who saw something in his posts that struck me as odd, so I brought it up.

And everyone, including yourself, virtually ignored it. And then? The phase ended.

Keep in mind that I also had no attention on myself, so why in the world would I decide to start a conflict and get put under the microscope?

Because clearly I had a suspicion on Ethos, and I was willing to get into conflict if it meant finding a scum. You calling this a SvS is a reach, and I just laid out why.

If that's the case and merging with my pov, you're saying Eth0s and worst is scum.

Explain how this makes Ethos and Worst scum? I didn't mention Worst at all in this post, and I'm not merging with your POV at all. Like I said, my first post of this phase was literally me explaining some of my suspicions towards Ethos, that's my own POV not yours.

[Uncrowned]

I'm still yet to see any real reasoning behind your "Ethos is scum" POV except for when you said PoE. Otherwise, your thoughts on him in D2 and D3 had no other backing behind them. That's why to me, it comes off as a weak attempt at a bus and towncred for you assuming it's you and Ethos, which I think it is.

If you have actual reads on him and his posts, show that. Since you haven't done that at all? It's hard for me to get behind you as a townie, you're only making reads on me and completely ignoring Ethos even though he's the one you want lynched today. That just doesn't add up at all.

[Uncrowned]

You've said minimal about Ethos this entire game. You've either said (at various stages of the game) that he's town or scum, and that's about it. You also said he doesn't done much this game, which is true. But that's it. No other reads, no posts he's made that have set off alarm bells in your head, nothing except that "oh, he must be scum because I'm pretty sure Worst is good."

The lack of reads is unsettling and I think you've seen the opportunity to bus him and haven't given it the proper setup. You've slipped up, and now you're making all these reads on me while entirely ignoring the guy you are almost certain is scum. How does that make sense? It doesn't.

[Uncrowned]

Sorry, was writing that post up and didn't see that reply. That was just a continuation of my thought process.

This shit is stressful so i get you. take a break if need be.

[Uncrowned]

@TheWorst I don't think you misrepresented me, a lot of the stuff was just playstyle/mentality that I wouldn't expect you to be able to read from me, as we've never played together before. I can see your views. There's just a couple of things I'll touch on:

The post Gardenia voted me randomly I disregarded because I liked the rest of her Post 150, Marionette didn't receive the same treatment from me due to her vote coming from nowhere and not being followed up at all. I think circumstance needs to be taken into account there.

You're correct, I didn't spot the Teacher/FF Mason connection, I just legitimately felt they were a TvT since by that point, they had each made at least a post or two that I liked the logic behind.

I couldn't identify why other people were giving Gardenia TLs, which is why I asked teacher.

Everything else is either stuff I've already spoken about, or just personal playstyle.

[Uncrowned]

Also, Gardenia's readlist there was the same one I was referring to when JV was calling my list mediocre. I'm not sure why he referenced mine and tried to use it against me when I feel like Gardenia's was of similar quality, seemed weird to me that they would ignore that and go straight for mine.

[Uncrowned]

Who was the null read that I kept pushing on? I'm not following you there. That list was made D1, I wasn't pushing on you or Bugspray at that point in the game, I believe. I was just asking you questions then.

And as I said, 2 people had already townleaned Gard at that point. I could've put them in my TL immediately and no one would have batted an eye, but I thought better of it and decided to actually ask for the reasoning behind it, rather than just following along. If that's scummy to you, then I can't really say anything else tbh.

And when did I push on The Worst? At the moment I've been pushing mostly on you, which would... make you my buddy? Not really sure what you're trying to say there.

[Uncrowned]

Yeah, but you've read the other ISOs too, correct? And the two other people with similar readlists to me are... Fuz and Gardenia, two of the lowest posting people in the game, meaning it wouldn't take much reading to find those lists.

And as I said, you said nothing about them.

[Uncrowned]

Also, me jumping on the "quiet person" was the same person you also voted on, if you remember correctly.

But yes, I don't see the reason behind people being quiet in this game, unless they're super busy or got stuff going on. If me voting them makes them react and at least make a post, that's one step closing to helping town in my book. I'm not going to backtrack on that, I stand by those votes but wish we could've gotten more out of both D1 and D2 before we hammered.

[Uncrowned]

In fact the more I think about it, the more I realize you've also pushed on almost every quiet person, except for Fish. That was the one push where you didn't do that.

When you pushed on me originally, you said I could fit the bill for scum since I haven't posted much.

Fuz was quiet, Gyro was quiet.

If we're going by your logic, you've targeted the quieter posters more than I have. I don't really think that proves anything towards you being scum, since as I said in the above post, I WANT to motivate those quiet posters into giving some input, but you mentioning me as if I'm the only one doing that is interesting, considering you're doing the same thing to an even greater extent.

[Uncrowned]

I was one of the few people questioning Gyro and trying to get him in the game, IIRC. So I don't think that holds up, honestly.

As for Fuz, I was the 2nd vote.

[Uncrowned]

If I recall correctly

[Uncrowned]

Gyro being quiet wasn't my sole reason, I clearly stated that his posts weren't benefiting the town from my POV. With hindsight, we can see it was just a different playstyle, but back when we didn't know, it just didn't seem like he was willing to help progress the game in any meaningful way - and that's exactly what i said when I kept my vote on him. Don't try and twist the story, we have the ability to go back and see what happened.

[Uncrowned]

VOTE: Fuz

Maybe you're passive town, but your playstyle seems opportunistic to me.

Also still want Ethos to explain why Fuz is "clearly town" from his POV.

third vote incl. Fishy; fishy off then back on; JV with the hammer. trajectory on Fuz up until this is kind of null/undecided but always kinda asking questions/concerned. This was a well setup vote if Uncrowned is scum.

My Post 719 makes it pretty clear I was beginning to suspect her, imo. When she wouldn't respond to my questions, that only furthered my suspicions and led to my vote.

[Uncrowned]

Dude, JV, That was on page 1 of the game, we were in RVS.

I'm talking later on when I kept my vote on him, and when other people started voted on him. I gave my reasons then, as he hadn't done anything up until that point to make me feel comfortable in unvoting him.

[Uncrowned]

...is it just me or does my ISO already explain half this stuff? I've given reasons for my votes, guys. Pls look. ):

[Uncrowned]

Sorry if I'm seeming like a dick in the above post, I'm just getting kinda frustrated since I feel like I've touched on this stuff, and people have already gotten on me for being "over-explainy" so repeating myself is leaning back into that. Oh well.

[Uncrowned]

Gyro Zeppeli - doesn't give a fuck how he's perceived which gives me a bit of pause. mentality is probably town tho. fwiw I've found his posts heavily relatable and think they probably come from a solving mindset who isn't super invested/doesn't feel the need to be townread, rather than a scum mindset who wants to force an agenda but post little enough that he's not mislynched. his takes haven't been popular. they've gone against the grain. but ngl they've aligned more with how I've been seeing things. looks like a dude who's been spending more time looking for scum than sitting on the thread tryna be townread; this is prolly town most of the time.

Actually rq either of you have any feelings about this? I'm being vain ik but I thought it was a p hot take and no one really reevaluated Gyro's alignment at all late d1


pedit: I'm aware your ISO already explains it. I just said your ISO explains it. :< I'm trying my best ok !!!! the scum in {you, jv} has played well and hasn't been put into a position where they've kinda been 'exposed' so I'm trying my best to work with what we got!

When I saw that post, I saw your point to an extent but I wasn't convinced. The only posts I liked from him were 468and 581 but I wanted more, which is why I wanted the phase to keep going. Other than that, what I saw from him was either unrelated or just random, such as 140 242 and 252 which were some examples of what I thought wasn't helpful.

[Uncrowned]

Sorry if I'm seeming like a dick in the above post, I'm just getting kinda frustrated since I feel like I've touched on this stuff, and people have already gotten on me for being "over-explainy" so repeating myself is leaning back into that. Oh well.

I'm the same yet you kept ignoring the post in which I feel I explained it quite well

Which one, exactly? On a lot of them I was just following up on missed posts or things I don't think really got touched upon enough to make me satisfied with the answer.

[Uncrowned]

Oh, that? I made a post on why that's not true, I don't want to keep talking about that lol

[Uncrowned]

@TheWorst

The way I've been operating this game is trying to weigh a slots Townie moves against their Scum moves. I kind of explained that thought process with Gyro, where I liked some of his stuff, but I disliked more of it.

With Gardenia, it was the same thing but in reverse. I didn't like her votes and as I said, I saw it as opportunistic play. However, her explanations were DECENT (not great, because they seemed like potential cop out sort of answers imo) but she had done other things prior to that, such as her post 150 that I thought were okay. Between her and Mari, I still wanted more out of Mari, and between Gard and Gyro, I still wanted more out of Gyro.

I did let her off a little easy since at that point I was still playing sorta passive, i'll admit.

[Uncrowned]

Later in D1 I can't recall perfectly, if I'm being honest. I remember Bugspray and Gard interacting, but it was short-lived and I don't remember it really being followed up on by anybody. If anything, the only takeaway I have from it besides Gardenia's defense against Bugspray being relatively chill was that Bugspray was the NK that night. However, Bugspray had targeted a few people at that point including myself at one stage I believe, so I'm not sure that gives us anything to work with.

[Uncrowned]

@TheWorst

I'd prefer you get to the end of my ISO and see the connections I've been making from JV's earlier play to now, things will make a lot more sense then once you start seeing what I'm seeing.

[Uncrowned]

Hi, sorry. Received prod. Been out.

[Uncrowned]

I'm yet to catch up on anything Eth0s has said so once I've done that I'll be casting my vote on either him or JV depending on what I think, will probably ask questions.

Don't really like how Duck has kinda glossed over what I've said on JV but can't really say it's susp considering how I've seen that slot throughout the game

[Uncrowned]

How am I using AtE with Worst I'm literally saying that I think it's a bad move that he's glossimg over the end of my ISO.

[Uncrowned]

The fact you're reaching like that makes me want to put my vote on you but either way we're lynching scum so unless Eth0s has put up something convincing I'll be voting him

[Uncrowned]

Worst's entire reasoning behind why he thinks you're town seems to be AtE which can be faked. If he wants to ignore the connections I've been making then I can't really hate on him for it. Odd for someone who has taken the rest of the game with such an analytical approach but what can you do. It's just a game.

[Uncrowned]

I'm not saying it's bad play I just think it needs to be addressed and isn't being right now.

And yeah will look through what's been said and I'll make an assessment on him. Pretty sure 9 times out of 10 he's scum based solely on my reads on your slot and the fact we have confirmed town but you never know

[Uncrowned]

If I were scum, I would've shot Worst. Worst said he'd be fine with lynching me D3 and FF had already had some questionable interactions with JV that would've made it easier for me to sway Fish than Worst, from my POV.

It would've been a smart play by JV to kill Worst and then bring that up, especially since he thought I fit the bill for the Bugspray kill earlier in the game. I don't think he saw that far ahead though.

Tentatively: @Uncr, I don't think Eth0s pushed JV in good faith f3 and I think their reaction to this was very honest. Could you talk to me about what you're seeing there?

I'm not surprised by the Eth0s/JV SvS D3. It was the safest play to make by Eth0s, but I'm about to break it open.

He puts JV as his clear Scum Lean. First, this makes it already looks susp towards me as I was the one going in on JV earlier in the D3 stage. Then, he puts me a "N/S" to make us seem aligned in the event that Eth0s gets lynched.

Now Eth0s gets the best of both worlds. If he gets lynched on D3, JV looks more townie because JV voted on him AND they were heavily conflicting, whereas Eth0s was being more neutral towards me. If JV was the one to get lynched, then Eth0s would still get townie cred once JV flipped red and try to push the "JV/Uncr S/S" angle that he said was the easy solve.

JV has done well with his reactions towards other players, but I think that's part of his playstyle. I already exposed his weak attempt at bussing on D2 when he randomly threw Eth0s in as part of his scumteam on D2 with Fuz with practically no reasoning behind it, since that would allow JV/Eth0s to conflict on D3 and in the event that one of them got lynched and not me, give them an easier time in D4 to win during lylo since one of them would look more town.

That's what I'm seeing.

[Uncrowned]

I did no more legwork overnight as I was lowkey paranoid I'd just die.
Uncr ISO incoming.
I'm fine if you guys are interested in crossvoting.
Explaining why you're playing a town wincon is currently more valuable to me than you casing each other. It's hard to believe; one of you is a townie with a guilty and the other is scum who knows who they need to push.

I've been playing with the mindset of gathering info and reads the entire game, and figuring out town motivations behind other players posts. I've pushed for phases to run longer and to wait before making rash decisions. D3 I think everything came together for me and I started making connections between the relationships between other places (JV/Eth0s) and spotting the minor scumtells that are going to win town this game, provided you see where I'm coming from.

I think something big that has gone unnoticed until now is this: Think about every time I've been questioned or put on the spot by somebody. I haven't deflected or disagreed with them, I've seen their point of view and explained my thought processes. Some people take this as over explainy and that's cool, but I see it as giving info and making my stance on matters clear.

Now look at the interactions between myself and JV. On a lot of those topics, he was deflecting and turning things back onto me, causing chaos and not progressing the interaction, always going back to the same safeguard of "I'm voting Eth0s, we're lynching Eth0s". Why? If he was so suspicious of me and turned everything into me being the suspicious one, why would he still end up going for Eth0s, who he gave little to no reasoning for being as part of a scum team besides PoE at the start of D3? If you recall, you'll remember he gave almost no reasoning at all for having Eth0s as scum in D2.

JV's scumplay has been fine but I've spotted the holes in it, and if i'm being honest he hasn't had the greatest defenses to cover it up. It's up to you to see that for yourself.

[Uncrowned]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

[Uncrowned]

What's most telling for me here is the difference between Eth0s' post 1101 and 1106

With JV, he's direct and to the point, he has clear reasons for why JV is scum and wants to conflict with him, since one of them will end up looking better for it.

Then look at how he approaches my ISO. Vague, his points are "adequate" but they don't really suggest anything. It's almost like he's TRYING to not push too hard on me, hoping that in the event that he gets lynched, the remaining players would see that he didn't push too hard on me. It's subtle, but it's an attempt at aligning the two of us in the event he gets lynched.

I called JV's beginning bus attempt on D2 out immediately during D3, assuming that Worst was town. Now that it's confirmed, it turns out I was right.

[Uncrowned]

No, JV. Here's why you and Eth0s was SvS.

You said it yourself, I was aggro on you, and I was supposedly a "suspcicious" person according to you. But for whatever reason, even though you had far less to work with on Eth0s, you inexplicably wanted him to be the one that was lynched. How does that make sense? in what world does lynching eth0s make sense from your perspective as a player when in reality, you should've wanted me lynched?

Easy. Because it's the safer play for you to make. If you and Eth0s start gunning me down together, Worst and Fish would spot that and assume that you're aligned. Hence why Eth0s saw that I was going after you and then decided to put you as his main target of conflict. Again, to make it seem like an Eth0s/Uncr team rather than an Eth0s/JV team.

[Uncrowned]

On D2 you hard Gard in your town group, yes. But then by the end of D2, you swung that POV around to saying that Fuz/Eth0s could be a team.

[Uncrowned]

You weren't bussing them outright, either. You put him there to setup your conflict on D3, so that you could say you had suspicions of him during D2, probably hoping that no-one would look back and realize that you hadn't actually given any reasoning up until that point that you thought he was scum.

In fact, you just said it yourself. You had Gardenia as a Townread, but then swung Eth0s around to being a scum team with Fuz? If that doesn't make it even more obvious than man i don't know what to think

[Uncrowned]

Are you scumslipping right now? If me and Eth0s both went hard on you and you got lynched, than scum would have won the game if you were town.

But now you're saying we'd be in Lylo with me, worst/fish (depending on who you guys decided to kill) and eth0s if you were lynched? what?

[Uncrowned]

On D2 you hard Gard in your town group, yes. But then by the end of D2, you swung that POV around to saying that Fuz/Eth0s could be a team.

Woah, could? That's a very high modality word, must mean that I 100% believed that at the time.

That's exactly what I'm saying. From D1-D2 you were leaving possibilities open. Like when you gave all those possibilities for Fish in post 817

You don't want to come out and be too aggressive in the event that you're wrong and get called out on it, so you leave the door open. That's why you say "could" so that if Eth0s did get lynched, you could get credit.

I've stuck with my reads and pushed on them, and I haven't feared the results, because i know that I'm town and i'm trying to push for openings and find someone slipping. You've clearly been holding back hoping that you don't get called out

[Uncrowned]

No I am not scumslipping, you're just sayin' that hoping that duckyboi sees this shit and is biased into thinking 'Woah did they scumslip?!'

You literally said that Eth0s could have teamed up with me in an attempt to get you lynched, and then use that in LyLo.

There wouldn't be a LyLo if you were town, because scum would automatically win due to evening out the players at 2-2.

You saying that there would be a lylo after you getting lynched would mean that you're scum and Eth0s is your buddy.

Tell me where I'm misreading here, because I think that's a slip my guy

[Uncrowned]

You're not seeing the point. You're not leaving possibilities open in the "townie open mindset" type deal. You're leaving it open and not pushing too hard because you don't want to get caught out for being wrong, which is why you were passive in your reasoning on all your scumreads except for Fish, since you saw he was an aggressive player and thought it would be easy to get a lynch off on him.

I gave you the benefit of the doubt earlier for being a jumpy/nervous player because you're new, but now that we're at this stage and looking back on it it's clear you were just scum not wanting to be the center of attention for making a clear misread.

[Uncrowned]

Because you were worried that that would be too obvious and decided to play the safer option and conflict with Eth0s instead. I already said this.

[Uncrowned]

And yes, Worst saw you as more town than me, but Worst thought Eth0s was the safer lynch. You've obviously been concerned with Worst reading me as more town than you, so you didn't want to give me the opportunity to sway him and make you and Eth0s obvious once both of you would have placed a vote on me if things played out with both of you pushing on me.

[Uncrowned]

Because Eth0s was targeting you and not me. How many times do I gotta say it?

[Uncrowned]

...clearly not since he voted on Eth0s and not one of us? maybe earlier in the phase he did, but he clearly came to his own conclusions.

You've been trying to play up to him and that's cool, but honestly I don't care if he doesn't want to see what I'm seeing. I was convinced I solved this D3 and I'm right, if he doesn't see it than that's not my problem. That's the game.

Like I said, having FF here would've been the smartest play for me to make since he already at one stage or another had a finger pointed toward you. Worst is someone who hasn't really acknowledged my points so keeping him here wouldn't be a smart play if I were scum

[Uncrowned]

If you read the interactions between myself and Fish, and then yourself and Fish, anyone with eyes could see that Fish was the most dangerous player left alive for you to deal with.

Your strategy this game has been appeasement, if it works, good for you. I'm not gonna try and get people on my side who don't feel like listening to any input i've given, which imo has been far more substantial than anything you've really offered besides a weak bus attempt and process of elimination

[Uncrowned]

Worst said I didn't feel earnest last phase, which I find interesting. Why? Because I haven't spammed AtE and raged at the thought of losing? It's an analytical game and that's my playstyle. Sure i understand frustration but just filling up this thread with emotional manipulation is not my style. If i'm gonna win as town I want it to be because I figured it out, not because i guilt-tripped a guy into siding with me

[Uncrowned]

Yeah, you were pushing on me, and then Eth0s hit you up in your PT and told you to conflict with him instead, which explains why you swung from going hard at me to all of a sudden deciding to throw your vote onto Eth0s. It was a good attempt at gaining towncred, seems to have done its job up until this point.

And I already said what I would've done as scum, and that would've been not keeping you alive. Like JV said, you've got him as a higher probability of town. Keeping you would be dangerous for me, JV identified that and kept you alive. A lylo with Fish would've been far more winnable for me as scum than a lylo with you.

[Uncrowned]

As for what doesn't come from me as scum... probably my aggressiveness on votes, I'd say. As a townie, I know I'm safe and can follow with my gut. I haven't been afraid to be wrong, which is why I've started wagons and led the charge on two lynches (Gyro and Fuz). Admittedly i've been playing on instinct and a lot of my posts have been stream of consciousness, which is why people think they're rambly and filler i assume.

Scum me wouldn't want to be caught leading those wagons out of fear of being put on the spot for being a major part of them

[Uncrowned]

weather was actually nice today was gonna hit the beach but decided to be a nerd instead and play some of the new pokemon today.

I'm lucky I think, I haven't so much as even seen a bit of smoke where I'm at. Sucks you guys are nearer towards it. Feels like it's becoming more of a risk each year as our summers get hotter than the last

[Uncrowned]

I actually really like it! The graphics are gorgeous and the environments look great, as do the pokemon designs. The gameplay is what you'd expect, and since I don't play every release it doesn't feel like it's getting stale or anything.

I don't understand all the hate it's getting in terms of the reduced number of pokemon. From what I understand, there's a "National Pokedex" where people can trade pokemon from previous games into this one, but that feature has been removed from this game and instead we get a decent portion of the old pokemon generations, and the new ones that have been introduced through the new region that this generation takes place in. Maybe it's because I'm not a diehard fan, but I personally don't really see the need for there to be 1000s of pokemon. I've caught around 70 right now and I already feel like my range is interesting, versatile, and fun. But that's just me. Maybe some people are super into the collecting part of the game and that's why they have so much criticism for the new system.

I love some of the new battle aspects they've added in, and they've also added new "wild areas" and pokemon dens that can be taken on with 3 other trainers online, or with AI teammates, which are a nice change of pace and can net you some solid rewards. All in all, a fun experience.

I will say the game does feel a bit TOO easy. Like I've gotten 3 gym badges and man have I been butchering everything in sight. Not once have I come close to losing, and the only time I've had pokemon faint on me has been when I'm testing out new ones and their moves. I would've loved to see a difficulty feature where you can make it harder for yourself, but unfortunately that's not the case.

Other than that though, I'm loving it. I think it's done me some good to take a break from the series (I haven't played the last few games) and return on this release, had an awesome time thus far.

[Uncrowned]

Are the fires close or has the smoke drifted your way from fires that are far off?

[Uncrowned]

What game are you guys referencing, just so I can view this stuff for myself?

Uncr, if you remember: what inspired you to ask this/what was your takeaway from the old game?

That was at the beginning of the game, I asked it during the Fish/Chib/Teacher interactions that were going on, as Fish pointed out that Chib was asking RQS questions that were similar to what Teacher/Chib had used in a previous game where they were scum together.

I asked it so I could check the game for myself and see what FF was referencing. After checking the Teacher/Chib scum PT it turned out it was a good connection made by FF and it's the reason I had him as one of my early TLs, since I don't think a scum would've bothered to go out of their way to check something like that.

I didn't actually read the entirety of the old game, I only read the relevant parts of the scum PT to see what Fish and the other two were discussing.

[Uncrowned]

JACKSON VIRGO WHAT IS YOUR FAVOURITE COLOUR.

i'm working thru this i'm sorry; i think i'm voting uncrowned ultimately aorn but i'm not quite there yet

I think you're falling for AtE over actual play but I can see why it's difficult to see that from your pov

[Uncrowned]

Woah, uncr you're alive woo

Yeaaaaahhh boiiii had a big sleep. Woke up and everyone in my house is gone and it's a fucking oven inside of here. My bro didn't even leave the air conditioner on for me ):

[Uncrowned]

You're making her vote a big deal, but that vote was immediately when we restarted RVS. You weren't in the game for that, but after the first 5-10 pages or so it was a general consensus that the game wasn't going anywhere and we decided as a group to go back to the beginning. That's why I didn't make anything of the vote.

Datisi unvoting me felt like a townie move to me since he was one of the people who felt like he was leading the game, and yet he wasn't willing to put a fast vote on me along with others. He wanted to slow down the game and gather more info, which is exactly what I wanted to do during that phase as well.

These are all very early game reads, so I have to take what I was given. Out of everything that was said, I liked the connection that Fish made and thought it was a decent link, even if you don't think it solved much. From what I understand on this site, a big part of the game for some people is looking at player meta and what other players do in their prior games, so that to me felt like a smart move made by a town player.

Same thing with Teacher. We were at a super early stage of the game and I liked his interactions up until that point. In my reads I wanted to have at least some reason rather than use what other people had in their reads list like "I just had a feeling" or "They feel good to me". I was taking what little we had to work with and tried to analyse it.

I lifted Gardenia into my town tier since I was swayed by Teacher's reasoning for why he thought she was town. Yes, I still had my concerns about her, but that can go both ways. Some of Gyro's ending posts gave me slight doubts about keeping my vote on him, but I ultimately kept him as my SL. There were few players I was 100% sure of. I even said I wasn't entirely sure of Fish at a few points, but I thought his aggressive play was more likely to come from town. My style was to balance actions taken by players and determine which side I thought they were more likely to be on.

[Uncrowned]

Woah, uncr you're alive woo

Yeaaaaahhh boiiii had a big sleep. Woke up and everyone in my house is gone and it's a fucking oven inside of here. My bro didn't even leave the air conditioner on for me ):

Our air-con overheats and I can't use it anymore and it's boiling all the time, I know the pain lol

This is the saddest thing I've heard all day ):

Mine works but it only hits like one area of the house, so if I'm down the other end I'm pretty much gonna die.

Man, I miss winter.

[Uncrowned]

I get why you think it's important, and looking at her ISO it is pretty glaring when compared to everything else in it. I just think there's a bit too much weight being placed on it, especially when I feel like there's similar things that I've pointed out alignment wise that have either gone ignored by you, or you've seen them and just haven't chosen to mention them yet.

In the above I'm specifically mentioning the JV bus attempt on Eth0s in D2. You point out Gardenia voting me when she had multiple other SLs, but JV swinging Eth0s' slot all the way from a decent TL to being on his scum team all of a sudden seems more obvious. Maybe I'm the only one seeing it.

I also think you're slightly taking the vote out of context. I understand why you think it's a big deal, but look at all the posts made by other people that were placed during that period. Gyro, Marionette, Chib and Salad also made votes that fall under this category, but they get no mention. Gyro in particular was disliking myself and your predecessor at the time, but he put his vote on Gardenia anyways. If you look at the context of the game and what state we were in at the time, the vote is meh and not really worth mentioning, which is why I disregarded it.

[Uncrowned]

oh shit

[Uncrowned]

OH SHIT

[Uncrowned]

This game was insane, I straight up thought after I made the mistake of killing Bug N! that we'd probably lose. Well played to everyone, Worst you were in a super tough position there man, me and JV were going at it and it would've been hard to comb through all of that stuff. You're clearly a skilled player, even though the result didn't go your way.

I was having doubts about this game due to the slow start but man did it pick up toward the end, glad to have had this as my first experience on the site. Will definitely be playing again even though I'm not sure what style of game to queue up for next!

Also Worst, was just looking through your own PT and you really pointed something out that's true about me: I do enjoy the high level scum manipulation that mafia/social deduction brings to this table. Guess if I'm scum again and you're in the game I'll have to be careful about letting that part of my game slip. ;P

[Uncrowned]

I was kinda sweating on D1 actually when Datisi was looking into me a bit, I was like "fuckkk how did she figure me out so quick I haven't even done anything?!?!?!"

[Uncrowned]

That's the thing, I think I did a decent job of putting on a townie mindset/tone, which reading through Worst's PT, sort of seems to be what sold him on me being town?a

But my acts definitely had scum elements to them, which I think is what gave both you and him a bad feeling about me.

Honestly heading into this lylo I thought I was done. Really had to work for this one, which I credit to JV and Duck. Also props to Eth0s for joining the game in a pretty tough spot and still not making it obvious that we were the team.

[Uncrowned]

Uncrowned deserves all the credit for that win. Well played sir.

Nah man, like I said, you were in a really shit position to start out with. Plus I think you taking some of the heat off of the Me/JV conflict in D3 gave me room to breathe and think of a strategy for the next day.

uncrowned, you carried yourself *very* well under pressure - endgame narative was pretty silky, too. my townread went like jv jv jv jv jv aaaaa maybe uncr....no jv jv jv but what if it's...hmmm uncr!!!, like, the more i read the more i townread you.

I knew I had to go reaaaal deep into the act of "townie trying to solve this game with every little bit of evidence he has" to try and swing you, because I was almost certain that after JVs reaction to the hammertest that he was most likely in the clear. You have a really in-depth, inquisitive style that I like, you just had the toughest job in the room imo.

[Uncrowned]

Thanks for the compliments guys, really appreciate it.

Teacher if you're checking this out, I vaguely remember you saying you have recommendations for queues to sign up for on this site? I'm not opposed to joining another newbie game but could be fun checking out what else is offered around here.

[Uncrowned]

Gardenia was doing a great job and had practically no heat on her, a shame she had to replace out. Eth0s did well given his position tho, especially since I messed up that N1 kill bad. Whoever originally pointed out that a newb made that kill was entirely correct lmao

[Uncrowned]

worst man reading through your PT has me feeling anxiety for you even though I know how it ends LOL goddamn this game is stressful

[Uncrowned]

I felt so bad for everyone I pushed on, especially Gyro lol he was so chill

I felt even more guilty for JV like man knowing I was the scum and he was just the super frustrated town was eating away at me

Another interesting thing I forgot to bring up is I was tossing up between killing you or Fish on N3 for so long, which inspired my posts about "If I was scum, I would've killed The Worst" since that was legitimately my thought process and what I was set on doing for a few hours until I finally decided to go with NKing FF.

Sidenote: I love FF's playstyle even though I can see why others may not. I don't think I could pull off something that aggressive.

[Uncrowned]

Gardenia was doing a great job and had practically no heat on her, a shame she had to replace out. Eth0s did well given his position tho, especially since I messed up that N1 kill bad. Whoever originally pointed out that a newb made that kill was entirely correct lmao

I pointed it out but that's only because you didnt seem like a newbie and I thought it would help you. Ducky was thinking it too though.

I really like the micro game queue

Micro is sorta similar to this setup, yeah?

I was thinking of trying my hand at one of those bigger setups with a bunch more players but maaannn after seeing the stress this setup caused I'd probably cry being a townie and having to sort more players.

[Uncrowned]

I believe originally I wanted to kill either Datisi or Teacher because I both thought they were dangerous players to keep around. I didn't know Teacher was a mason at the time, either.

Gardenia when she was in the game thought that you were the cop, and was pretty convinced about it. I wasn't sure but I didn't want to take the risk of NOT killing the cop in case you were, so I went with it. Turns out we were wrong, but oh well. Killing you nearly cost us the game honestly imo.

That's not a shot at Gard btw she did very well to go under the radar. Everyone makes mistakes, this is a super difficult game. Although I will admit looking back in the dead thread and seeing Datisi list out all the mason crumbs by Fish now has me slamming my head against the table.

[Uncrowned]

Gardenia was doing a great job and had practically no heat on her, a shame she had to replace out. Eth0s did well given his position tho, especially since I messed up that N1 kill bad. Whoever originally pointed out that a newb made that kill was entirely correct lmao

I pointed it out but that's only because you didnt seem like a newbie and I thought it would help you. Ducky was thinking it too though.

I really like the micro game queue

Micro is sorta similar to this setup, yeah?

I was thinking of trying my hand at one of those bigger setups with a bunch more players but maaannn after seeing the stress this setup caused I'd probably cry being a townie and having to sort more players.

Micro queue, like most queues, doesnt have defined setup possibilities (I think newbie is the only one that just uses one setup type). I prefer micro because of the player size which is generally close to newbie size. But there's tons of available setups to play depending on what is open for signups.

There's games in micro quite like this one, games with jesters, arsonists, trees, you name it. I think looking at all the queues and seeing what is currently in signups is your best bet for finding something new.

Micc, our mod from this game, is actually the listmod for micro games. So if you look at his recent posts in the micro queue you can see what is in signups for micro games

Oh that's cool, I think I like the lower player counts as well. Thinking now that I can sign up for multiple games at once, I'll do another newbie and then maybe one more from another queue, micro looks like it would work well for me.

[Uncrowned]

Gyro, Eth0s, me and worst all signing up for a new game in the newb queue? This is gonna be like Season 2 of my favourite tv show or some shit

[Uncrowned]

Wow okay, ducky why?!

I'm sorryyyy I still love you! My pt explains everything :<

Don't be lol, everyone played well end-game (except me :c) and you played exceptionally for the situation you were placed in. Honestly, I kept thinking to myself that I would even lynch myself if I was in your position, Uncrowned played so well!

It was down to the wire, I don't think you did a bad job at all. Plus, it's your first game on here and it's wildly different to any other kind of mafia I've played, so I can only imagine how tough it must have been for you as a townie in that situation. You had a lot of flashes of good play, I'm sure with more experience we'll both cut out some of the mistakes we made this game and make improvements along the way. It was a heap of fun going up against you, you made it really tough for me there at the end during D3 and D4.