Newbie 113 - Game Over

[Kain]

Hi- I'm the replacement dude- just for kicks and giggles a random vote.

VOTE STAM

Nobody voted for you stam and I didn't want you to feel left out!

[Kain]

Well yes Mr. Flay it was quite by accident- last night I posted that note around 2;30 am- perhaps not the best time to be posting- but anyway I didn't notice that someone else was voing for Stam until too late. I know that double posting is like major rude so I decided to wait till tommorow knowing that someone would point it out to me that someone else had in fact voted for Stam.After that I then could admit I made a mistake in seeing who got votes without double posting. Now that having been said I find it somewhat scummy that you called me " evil" and perhaps I should vote for you. However for pointing out that the two scum could very well jump on and get me lynched at this point it seems to reason that perhaps you yourself are not mafia- in other words why would a mafia member point out something that helps me? A mafia member would in fact not do that- therefore even though you made scummy comment towards me I refrain presently from casting my vote on you. For now now my random vote is on Stam until i believe someone is scum.

[Kain]

You make some good points there Mr. Flay. I agree with you I also would like to hear from Tamuz....being too quiet in my book is a serious sign of mafia or just a sign of him experiencing a stupor of thought as to what to say....we will see eh?

I'm awfully curious why LoudmouthLee decided to FOS (Finger of Suspicion) Kain for his second vote, but not me for mine. He's also been very chummy with me, when I was scum with him in the Greek mafia game on the GL.

Now as for what you have said here- It is my opinion that perhaps you are pointing out LML's FOS on me as to shift any SUSPICION on yourself....or perhaps you are right and LML is acting sucpisicious? it could be taken either way. And what did you intend to mean or point our when you said that he was quite chummy with you?

[Kain]

Tamuz I feel you are innocent as snow- either that or scummy/lurkish. I'm not sure which. Mr. Flay I'm very amused by the fact you quoted me quoting you but I think it possibly suspicious of you to volunteer the information that he is acting chummy with you and that perhaps he is using it to try and lower your suspicion of him. The reason I find this possibly scummy is because it seems that you yourself may be trying to shift any focus on him and make yourself appear innocent. A FOS on you but no vote as of yet for what you have said is either the epitome of innocence as it seems you are claiming or a sign of scumminess.

[Kain]

In pondering the points( especially the ones that Mr. Flay has brought up) I am now going to

FOS

you LML. I'm not voting for you right now because I want to hear your defense to everything Mr. Flay has brought against you so far.

[Kain]

Mr.

Mod

person dude.
Could we please get a vote count.
thanks

[Kain]

Pardon me but would you like to explain what you meant by saying

Couple this with Kain, and we are pretty much easy to lead by Flay... but I'm not sure enough of this to even FOS yet

I agree with you Tamuz about Stam, but I'd like to hear your reasonings/viewpoint as to why you feel bad vibes about him.

[Kain]

Hmm some very interesting posts have been made today. EYNH I find your post to be extremely scummy. First I did expain as to why I was FOS and not changing my vote. Go read page 1 and 2( especially two). Your reasoning for voting for me is weak. I

FOS

You for what appears to me to be you trying to start a bandwagon based on poor logic and faulty reasoning. Everything you said against me could very easily be argued the totally opposite way that you have thus far argued them.

[Kain]

Wow Tamuz that was an interesting statement you said in post 70. Let me explain why. Oh and btw I find it so very interesting how you suddenly are jumping on me when earlier you said you were getting bad vibes on Stam.
But let's not get on that tangent- let's get back to the original tangent the one where I show you why EYNH's logic is poor and why mine is acceptable for me to FOS for him. First let's quote you.

Wow Kain... a retaliatory suspicion when one votes you. That FOS on EYNH makes me very suspicious of you, you have no reason to fling accusations back into his face, just because he voted for you. His reason may be weak, but your is even weaker because it is based on his weak reason. …..

Vote Kain

Why should a justifiable FOS arise suspicion on your part? I think I might understand that you cannot fathom reason or logic if you FOS me for it, but by placing a third vote that was really super scummy. I have every reason to FOS someone EYNH who voted for me based on such lousy reasons. Logic dictates that only a newbie or scum votes for someone ( and I'm not speaking about a random vote) with as lousy reasons as he had on me.

POST 66:

Then again, I may be missing why LML's chummyness makes him so guilty, because I don't see it.

*EYNH SAID THE FOLLOWING:*

My thoughts exactly. I'm not saying "LML is not scum," I'm saying "if LML is scum, it's for reasons other than this." And he very well could be, but at the moment, I don't suspect him.

I don't have time to leave a more detailed reply at the moment (I will later tonight), but I am very suspicious of Kain's asking for a vote count. That, plus his previous post in which he FOSes and almost votes LML, makes me think he's a scum trying to see if he can jump on the LML bandwagon without getting "found out." That, plus his earlier tautologies (dammit Flay! That was the word I was looking for ), makes me want to

Vote: Kain

.

ENYH promised to explain more as to why he feels the way he does later that night. He made that post last night around 10pm-11 MST last night May21. Why does he not bring forth the evidence and moreover why does he not do it last night(May 21) like he said he would? Why is there is no evidence….is it because there really isn’t any? As for me asking for a vote count I am very guilty sometimes of not reading everything new that’s been posted so I missed the vote count on page two. I thought I was doing everyone a favor for asking for a vote count on page two. And the lesson learned is don’t ask for vote counts because people will jump on you for that…..weird huh? Well at least Mr. Flay speculated correctly that I had not seen it( the vote count posted by the mod) Anyway I get off the topic. Let me explain why I FOS LML and did not vote him.

In pondering the points( especially the ones that Mr. Flay has brought up) I am now going to

FOS

you LML. I'm not voting for you right now because I want to hear your defense to everything Mr. Flay has brought against you so far.

As you all can see by reading Mr. Flay’s numerous points that he has made against LML that I had every good reason to believe that LML could be scum as Mr. Flay has suggested. However it’s not kosher/proper to vote someone without allowing him/her a chance to defend him/herself. I did the right thing and I felt he did a very good job in defending himself hence I did not vote LML. If I had felt that his reasons that he provided to support himself against Mr. Flay’s accusations were provably weak I would have said so and voted for him. Okay moving on to my next part of this huge explanation.

Now that having all been explained about why I did what I did with LML I find myself justified in saying

Hmm some very interesting posts have been made today. EYNH I find your post to be extremely scummy. First I did expain as to why I was FOS and not changing my vote. Go read page 1 and 2( especially two). Your reasoning for voting for me is weak. I

FOS

You for what appears to me to be you trying to start a bandwagon based on poor logic and faulty reasoning. Everything you said against me could very easily be argued the totally opposite way that you have thus far argued them.

As you all can see it was reasonable to FOS him because he voted for me based on what I did with LML even though my reasoning for FOSing LML was logical. It’s rather stupid to vote for someone who votes for you as a revenge statement(unless you have sufficient logical evidence to support yourself) so I didn’t do that. I didn’t feel that ENYH was definitely scum but I FOSed him with justifiably reasoning. So this brings me back now to your post Tamuz.

Wow Kain... a retaliatory suspicion when one votes you. That FOS on EYNH makes me very suspicious of you, you have no reason to fling accusations back into his face, just because he voted for you. His reason may be weak, but your is even weaker because it is based on his weak reason. Your constructing buildings on someone else's glass mountain.

Oh, and Kain

Unofficial Vote Count, just for you:

Vote Count

2 - Kain (EYNH, Tamuz)
1 - Mr. Flay (LML)
1 - Stam (Kain)
3 - LML (Mr. Flay, Stam, Big_k)

Takes 4 to lynch.

Vote:Kain

So Tamuz do you care to explain now how my FOS on EYNH wasn’t logical and justifiable? Really please do. If you don’t understand my reasoning in this post then I highly suggest rereading what everyone has said….maybe you’ll see where I’m coming from then.

Also how is my reasoning built on his reasoning as you have claimed in your post that I have now quoted or partially quoted twice? I’m just not seeing how my reasoning is built on his. I just said that his points were weak because they could very well be argued the opposite way as they have thus far been argued. I did not vote for him because what he said did not construct in my opinion enough information for me to justifiable vote for him; it did give me grounds to question him and FOS him for it.

So I think I’ve said enough on the topic- So feel free to explain yourself now Tamuz. After all everyone has the right( or should be given it) to explain themselves after they’ve said something. So please do speak up. I really hope that all made sense to everyone.

[Kain]

I making a role claim now because according to the polls I'm not very popular and very close to dieing. I am a townie. I strongly urge all that are voting for me to reexamine the reasons why you are voting for me. I realize that ENYH is voting for me becuase I FOS LML and he thinks I was trying to get him lynched. If I was trying to get his lynched I would have voted for him. But I need to make it very clear to everyone that I did ask LML to explain himself before I did anything other than FOS him. Mr. Flay made a case against LML that seemed to point out some contradictions that LML had made- therefore I FOSed him. I realize that Tamuz is voting for me becuase I FOS ENYH here but I did it becuase he was basing his vote on poor logic. Mafia generally benefits more from poor logic than the town doesa dn therefore it was reasonable to be suspicious of a person that submits to poor logic against another player.now it wasn't enough for me to have a cause to vote for EYNH but it was reasonable enough for me to FOS him. Now concerning Stam's vote on me- everything he has said on me is based purely on speculation and there's no basis or fact for any of it. I maintain my suspicion against him and my vote stays on him. If die and everyone then knows that I am a townie I urge you to investigate Stam. In closing again I didn't see the vote count posted earlier on the page and I thought I was doing everyone a favor by asking for it.I also want to note that the mod didn't even give me the vote count I asked for. Think about what I have said and reread what everyone has said and hoepfully yall will see my points are valid.

[Kain]

Shesh the noose tightens again! 3 votes on me again!lol....I have several key things to point out to

LML AND EYNH

especially.

A:

LML has apperantly no good reason as to why he is currently voting for me.Odd eh? I will now quote him and point out what I believe are some problems with what he has said.

...

Vote: Kain

now.

I have no problem lynching him. I just didn't find HIM to be particularly scummy. I have already told you who I believe is scum..

I'll tell you right now. I'm not mafia. I don't think Kain is mafia. I think that Stam's acting VERY scummy. But, the bandwagon is squarely on me. That's fine.

I was set to defend Kain because I though (with the way he was posting) that he had a power role. I didn't see that he calimed townie until after I made my first post....

Regardless, I'll vote for Kain if you think he's the right lynch.

I'm going on record to say... I don't think he is.

Point A1:

LML claims he is not scum. This seems wierd to me because isn't it obvious that we all are claiming to not be scum without verbalizing it?

PointA2:

It doesn't make sense to vote for someone who you don't think is mafia even if alot of the town thinks that he/she is. If you stoop down to that level then you are settling for mediocrity and helping the mafia win. I am sure that the mafia is rejoicing that one suppossed townie(LML) has adopted the attitude of " well I don't think he is mafia but I am going to vote to lynch him because it seems everyone else is." The town needs to kill mafia to win, not townies-so to you LML I say your action is not very good in the intrests of the town at all.

LML I am very suspicious of you now. Will you explain your actions/statements to us all and why they are logical and in the interest of the town?

Point B: ENYH'S TURN

I just wanted to point out to you a few things that have occured since you posted last.let's quote you first.

I think that Kain/LML is a legitimate mafia pair. The two have been relatively uninvolved in the bandwagons on the other: Kain FOSed Lee but did not vote for him, and Lee did not even recognize the attacks on Kain until he claimed townie. And this post somewhat confuses me:
quote]

EYNH for crying out loud how many times do I need to explain why I FOSed LML and didn't vote for him? Your repitative accusations over that one action of mine are simply antagonistic and should be flashing red lights for everyone. Again I say I FOSed LML because Mr. Flay made some points that seemed to point out some contradictions that LML made. I Fosed him because I believed that Mr. Flay might have been correct in his accusations, but I wanted to hear LML's explanations on it.LML defended himself sufficent for me not to vote on him. This whole issue makes me even wonder if you are reading all of the posts that have been made by me. You know the posts where I am defending myself again and again over the same issues that you keep on bringing up EYNH. Seriously everyone especially you EYNH go back and actually read the information over this issue and decide if what I am saying makes logical sense or if what EYNH here is saying. I want logic to rule- logic benefits the town more than it does the mafia! I point a serious

FOS

on you ENYH for continuing to attempt to bandwagon me on that arguement against me concerning my FOS on LML. Your arguement is getting old and weaker and weaker.

Oh by the way If I'm lynched( and by the way fellow town members I feel like you've been giving me like zero support. I mean it'd be nice for someone to actually go back and read oh I don't know maybe from the begining and do some research and acctually see why I'm innocent over all the commotion that has been happening to me) for this at least everyone will know then that I was innocent. By the way COP( if we have one) I serious suggest an investigation on Stam and EYNH now. I believe that they are the most likely mafia members out of everyone here.Oh yes EYNH -LML/Me doesn't make for a good mafia combo as you have suggested- LML has put his vote on me and last time I checked mafia never vote for mafia. They lose that way.

[Kain]

Well it looks like I will be lynched tommorow due to Mr. Flay's willingness to vote for me-Seriously everyone that is protown look(as in go back and READ!!!!!!!!) at what has caused this all and you will see my innocence. This whole fiasco started with a justifiable FOS I made on LML. After you lynch me and your stuck with two mafia it serves you all right! I say this because I am just really annoyed with all of you right now because none of you are doing your homework on this all! In other words I really wish you'd all go back and read how this whole thing started. It seems like NONE of you have read. If any of you had gone back and seriously read what caused all this comotion around me you'd be supporting me not lynching me. Cop seriously investigate Stam and EYNH. Oh by the way if reason and logic is used and I survive the lynch and then I get shot in the night still investigate Stam and EYNH.
Oh yah and LML am I "pressing you" because I am pointing out some possible scummish behavior on your part? And Mr. Flay that's simply illogical to desire to switch your vote to me if any of the reason behind it is a desire to not see the game stall up because you are leaving town. I'd rather the game stall anyday than see the mafia avoid the lynching that they deserve.

And Yah Mr. Flay I'm a frustrated townie because all I see around me is a bunch of people who aren't going back AND READING what has been said! Mafia generally benefits from poor logic not the town! I'm asking for you all to go back and use logic when reading what has occured- you will see that I have been bandwagoned for lousy reasons.

LML and ENYH how about you answer my questions I have brought up about your actions in my previous post? I'm tired of people ignoring the valid points I bring up-
all I want is an explanation that's all. Logic will prevail in the end for the town.

[Kain]

Mr. Flay- sigh here we go again- this all started with of course as I have mentioned my FOS on LML. I was jumped on for that by I think TAMUZ ( i think it was him) anyway I preceeded in my posts to defend why my FOS on LML was justifiable and not deserving of a vote. Then I was very critical of Tamuz I think because he said something that seemed very weak in logic to me - to which EYNH here got on the bandwagon to lynch me. His main point was that it was suspicious that I had FOSed LML instead of voting for him. Again I say in my defense that I wasn't going to vote for somone until he had a chance to explain himself. Apperantly the lesson to learn here is that the newbie game is full of people who don't believe in questioning somoenes motives, FOSing them and then allowing them a chance to eplain themselves. So i think i pretty much gave a short summary of the whole fiasco- the alst couple posts have just been posts in my defense mostly it seems about the whole EYNH's repeating arguement against me. I'm still not sure why Stam is voting for me. I'm still waiting for a reply from him. I'm still confused at to why EYNH is still voting for me because it seems his original beef with me was witht he whole FOS on LML and apparently he doesn't accept my answer of " I wanted to allow him the option to defend himself against my FOS which was based on some points that MR. Flay brought up on like page 1 or 2. And Mr. Flay concering who is mafia I highly suggest you study out what EYNH and Stam have done- especially Stam. I think that Tamuz isn't scum I can tell you that much - it seems to me that he wouldn't have taken his vote off me if he was.
And finally Ahhhhhh!!!! I'm getting so tired of having to explain myself I think it might almost be a relieve to get lynched so I don't have to do any more of these super long posts trying to help everyone understand my innocence! I'm even almost tempted to vote for myself.Shesh! lol oh well!

[Kain]

Thanks Stam I appreciate that- very kind of you.Yah I realize I"ve been throwing my FOS around alot Stam, but it has of late gone on those that have voted for me. Now a vote in itself isn't a bad thing, but a vote for lousy reasons is. I felt very strongly that the votes on me were for lousy reasons, based mainly on an attempt to Bandwagon me by EYNH I think. I think that I've presented a very logical case as to why Tamuz(possibly why he took his vote off me), EYNH, And Yourself( possibly also why you took your vote off me) should not vote for me. Wow!! I think this is the shortest post I've done in a long time.....I almost feel wrong to not have quote somebody. LOL!

[Kain]

Stam, I'm just waiting for the rest of the town to go back reread the posts and figure out who the two scums are.I totally support Mr. Flay in his choice to go back and reread the thread- I think it is a very wise idea as it will help a person determine who is mafia and who is not. I'm fairly positive that you and EYNH are the scums...possibly LML(not as positive as I am about you two).So that is in repsonse to your inquiry to my silence and oh just one more thing to say-. I was kinda unable to use the computer starting thursday and ending today(saturday).I still live at home( cheap insurance rates) and I was banned from the comp until I did something.

[Kain]

Um yes Stam- concidences do occur just like miracles do and other odd occurences.And please do lynch me Stam really I do insist- becuase then ( hopefully) the town will see you for the scum for that you are. Really I insist deal me the death blow and my death will most likely equal yours as well as it will be revealed that I am townie.
And Tamuz I have already stated or strongly hinted as to who I think is mafia several times- I dont' think theres much purpose to continue to point out why to yall if yall haven't figure out already hence another reason for my silence....and seriously I was banned from the computer for many hours.

[Kain]

LOL oh this is really a quite funny. This is only my second game of mafia so I don't have much experience but in retrospect of this one I am quite amused at all the " hey let's vote for Kain!" And then soon follows the "Hey let's unvote kain and vote this guy or that guy." LOL! So yes Tamuz I find your yo-yoing very amusing.And Big K thank you for rereading the post and seeing that my posts made logical sense. You have some very good points concering EYNH and LML in your posts -some that I need to consider as I go back and reread the post.
And Happy memorial day everyone.

[Kain]

I'm not dead yet!- haha monty python quote-
On page one it says - Once your death scene has been posted, you’re dead. Stop typing. - Well I'm not lynched yet so here I go!
First seriously go back and reread the thread like Big K has done- of course you will know me to be a townie after the lynching occurs but you will be able to see who the scum are. The scum are Stam, EYNH and possibly LML. More likely it is a Stam/ EYNH Combo but a LML/ EYNH combo is quite possible. Regardless of the combos I seriously suggest that you lynch EYNH after I'm dead. Oh yes thanks Mr. Flay for making my lynching possible with your third vote.

[Kain]

Oh yes just for everyone to consider- the mafia will probably end up knocking somebody off in the middle of the night so that'll leave you with three townies and two mafia- it would be very unwise to vote for someone unless you were conviced that they were mafia. 3 votes lynches somebody- so be careful or the mafia will jump on that innocent guy you vote for and then the game is over with two mafia killing the last two townies. And in closing hhaha I'm not dead yet! LOL

[Kain]

Well I'm not lynched yet- WOOOHOOO! okay now that my innocence has been established ( or soon will be after the mod posts my death) I just want everyone to really go back and reread the thread and look for what I said already- that there was a rather lousy bandwagon put on me by I do believe EYNH so I think you should reread his posts especially. I suspect LML to be a possbile mafia member but I really think Stam and EYNH are the scum. Cop investigate EYNH, not LML! I'd like to point out that EYNH has been very quite for the past long while also it seems. Most likely( another thing to point out) that both mafia are voting for me right now- they are as following: Tamuz, Mr. Flay, EYNH, Stam. In some mafia games the mafia would probably just have one of thiers vote on a person and the other one lay low or vote for someone else but in this game I think that they got very tired of how long day one was taking and they voted for me. Basically i am using this as additional evidence that EYNH and Stam are the scums. Okay I don't think I have anymore to say on the topic now- And yes MR. Flay I'd be one insane mafia to be saying/ doing all this stuff during the twilight before I am lynched. And if we have a doctor please protect Mr. Flay. Well adios yall until tommorow- hopefully the mod will not have lynched me by then! lol wow this is one long twilight!

[Kain]

Of course you want the attention off of EYNH, Stam! I think that LML unfortunaely has possbily been bandwagoned innocently also- if anyone is a better selection it would be you or EYNH. Sorry nothing personal but you're mafia. Yes LML has said some very odd things that should arise suspicion on our part but by virture of the fact that EYNH held his vote on me for the same BOGUS reasons throughtout all the commotion surrounding me is a clear sign that he is scum. A good townie would have seen the errors in his logic as I so clearly pointed thme out- yes I was frantic but I was logically! As I was saying a good townie upon seeing the errors of his logic would have unvoted but does EYNH ever take his vote off me? No. Tamuz does based on good logic but then comes back on board- his reasons were legitimiate thought. Mr. Flay voted to put pressure on me which was fine considering the possibly scummy behavior it appeared I was doing. Now concerning Stam- it would make sense for one mafia memeber( supposing that both were voting me at one point) to have one of them unvote me like I recall Stam did and then vote for me later based on a pretty BOGUS reason. Also because it was based on a bogus reason The fact that you dealt me the death blow is possibly a sign of scumminess in this long game where I wouldn't be suprised if a mafia memeber would now jump on the chance to hurry the game on to day two. And Mr. Flay come on I was logical-i was just really frantic also! I think that you should be protected because you've held a lot of sway this game and perhaps they fear you'll get them next. Aie aie aie....this seriously is a way insansley long twilight.And Aie aie aie I hope that I'm not being incohenrent or anything and that this is making SOME sense to yall....and in closing " I'm nt dead yet!" Go Monty Python and the search for the Holy Grail!

[Kain]

Ahhhh! This is a crazy twilight session indeed- I agree with Mr. Flay that we have accomplished more in this twilight than some games accomplish in a day. Well I didn't come on to just say that. I came on to point out some BOGUS points made by some people- Okay it's establish that I am a townie now- right-?right.

I would like to point that until now EYNH and Stam seem to have not touched each other with even a 10 FOOT pole. I find this very scummy because perhaps they are now pointing the finger at each other now that I , the innocent townie, have been preaching thier scummy behavior for oh I don't know the past 5 pages. LOL!

Now concerning EYNH's tactic (see post 144 right above this)I say that the town benefits most from GOOD LOGIC and that the mafia benefits most from poor logic. Therefore I say EYNH is scum because he seems to think that the town benefits from attacking people( me!) based on poor logic. I find his tactic to be very scummy after I pointed out earlier several times that the TOWN benefits from good logic( as in good logical points against a player not BOGUS ones) and mafia from the bad ones and he CONTINUED to attack me.

He knew his points were bogus- I logically pointed them out to be bogus several times so I ask why did he then stick on me like glue when I defended myself based on logic? My scum radar is going crazy due to his behavior! In other words your defense is bogus EYNH.

Now concerning his invite for the cop to investigate him- that is possibly a mafia ploy. Mr. Flay in this game or another game I read him say something along the lines of " i invited the cop to investigate me and I was scum that game." Just something to consider for our Cop...if we have one!!!!

Well I hope that made all sense- Don't let the mafia confuse you fellow townies in this twilight session! In closing LET LOGIC GUIDE YOU!

Are you enjoying these paragraphs Mr. Flay? I did them just for you!
Yes I would enjoy playing another game with you also- you did an awesome job in newbie 102 with Mr. Stoofer. Well I'll talk with yall later tonight- suppossing Im not lynched by then.

[Kain]

Thanks Big K- I appreciate that I'd like to play with you again 2. Shesh Norinel where are you? i've been waiting with this noose around my neck for a while now.

Hey Doc/Cop big k has a point but keep in mind that after my death all my statements will be validated as legitimate ones and the people I'm pointing towards you protecting or investigating are very valid targets( in my opinion of course) but hey it's an opinion that is scum free eh?

[Kain]

hey yall here's a voice speaking from the dust ( aka the first to die!lol)

Good game- i 've beeen observing it - grrr @ stam i was right you were scum but wrong about eynh! lol oh well gg! well im out of stuff to say anyway typing with one hand is hard-my right hand is broken now. sigh.gg and adios yall