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Post #69 (isolation #1) » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:22 am
Postby ajolin »
Twistedspoon wrote:
toxictaipan wrote:RayFrost was doing it, nobody cared. I do it and I have to explain myself? That doesn't make sense.
Nice logical fallacy there; Tu Quoque I believe
and yes it does make sense
you showed knowledge of only something scum would have.
I also like how you call me scum yet don't vote; that's because you know I'm not
VOTE: Toxic
one down
Actually, I'm fairly sure Tu Quoque Is more of a "You are a hypocrite, so anything you say is automatically wrong." He was saying that because RayFrost was doing it without consequence that he could do it as well. Similar logical fallacies, but not exactly the same. I would also like to point out that this is getting a bit into "srz bzns" as Dekes had said, and it's the first day in a newbie game. All that said...
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Post #103 (isolation #3) » Sat Apr 09, 2011 7:44 am
Postby ajolin »
UNVOTE,VOTE:RayFrost
, RayFrost has been making a large amount of accusations t'ward other people based on the fact that they suspect him or toxic. I still believe that toxic is scummy, but the way Ray's been posting lately...
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Post #104 (isolation #4) » Sat Apr 09, 2011 7:47 am
Postby ajolin »
TwistedSpoon: ETA, Estimated Time of Arrival. He's waiting for a mod post.
David: If you're interested in votecount, there's one on page four. Just count 'em up from there.
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Post #130 (isolation #7) » Sun Apr 10, 2011 8:57 am
Postby ajolin »
I have to agree with Twistedspoon. Ray defends himself and Toxic despite ray being under minor pressure, especially because the death of one townie wouldn't make a big dent in their ability to win, but the death of a scum... I could see defending Toxic some what, L-1 on the first day is pretty harsh, and it was my bad for not counting up the votes. I'm reminded of an old poof I used to use in TTT and Werewolf, if I turn out to be town, kill so and so, because that's the guy on my wagon. Honestly I'm thinking we kill Ray to see if he's town, then we kill Twistedspoon for wagoning him, and, if neither are mafia, you can kill me as compensation. It's a risky play, but I used to use it all the time when I started, and it was a 50/50.
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Post #132 (isolation #8) » Sun Apr 10, 2011 9:09 am
Postby ajolin »
If Ray is scum then we know why he was defending Toxic so much. If it's Twistedspoon then half of the mob is gone, so we only have to worry about finding one guy.
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Post #133 (isolation #9) » Sun Apr 10, 2011 9:12 am
Postby ajolin »
I agree about the "I'm town." thing Voidedmafia. It was at an early stage, and he was most likely reaction fishing. That Twistedspoon take is seriously is surprising, but it doesn't make Ray feel more or less scummy to me.
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Post #148 (isolation #13) » Sun Apr 10, 2011 4:58 pm
Postby ajolin »
The point is that it's almost always a guaranteed scum kill if the scum doesn't expect it. You usually don't pull things like that unless you are afraid you'll get killed in the night, or as a last resort before getting lynched so people will get the scum. It's hard to do this first day and have it work, but discrediting the strategy entirely doesn't make sense. And Ray you say not to set roles and associations in stone, but as long as you don't announce them, nobody knows what they are to use them against you. In this case the mobs know who we think is affiliated with who, and what flips point to which players, but it's not like we will actually use this information at this very second. I'd like to point out that we have a good sized deadline and we don't actually have to lynch(it's a risk to lynch, but at the same time, you could loose a valuable player to night kills) Damn, this game is a lot easier with PMing.
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Post #153 (isolation #14) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:14 am
Postby ajolin »
Ray, I'm not entirely confident it WILL work outright. I said " It's hard to do this first day and have it work, but discrediting the strategy entirely doesn't make sense." Which you must have read if you were talking about discrediting th strategy. I'm saying it works out sometimes to do that, especially right before a lynch or night kill. You don't have to lynch to flip somebody, you wait for a scum kill, or for enough real evidence to lynch them. And when you can't, when it's a tight game, sometimes you have to lynch to flip. This is not one of those cases, obviously. I can tell this is going to be a fun one.
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Post #156 (isolation #16) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:00 am
Postby ajolin »
Why is it worse to no-lynch on day one than any other day. No-lynching on day one would increase the chance of lynching a town because, most likely, you don't have a large amount of evidence first day. Besides, if you read on after that comma, I said to actually try to gather real evidence, not that you should avoid lynching altogether. I'm saying it's a bad idea to rush directly into voting to see if somebody is mafia and going on association. It's not bad to think people are a little to chummy, but to rush into it without being sure is risky.
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Post #158 (isolation #17) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:34 am
Postby ajolin »
I'm not saying don't lynch, I'm saying don't rush. I like how you said in the second comment that you might not see what I'm thinking, I'm glad. I'm saying we shouldn't rush, right? So we have to slow down and gather evidence. We shouldn't lynch for the very reason of flipping exactly, we should get evidence. But that's not to discredit lynch flipping as a sometimes necessary tool. I'm not saying we should rush to a no lynch, I'm saying lets wait for a bit more evidence. I still like my plan of the lynch to flip, but I'm thinking we need to gather a bit of evidence. I would also like to say that as the day's continue you will always have greater that or equal to the amount of evidence from previous days. Evidence gathered on D1 doesn't just disappear on D2, no matter how slow the day is. NK's bring into scope new evidence that was overlooked.
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Post #175 (isolation #21) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:22 pm
Postby ajolin »
I have to agree with Dekes that Voided is acting a little off, but I'm not going to call him scum just yet. In fact, I think I'll hold my vote for a while until I get some better reads.
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Post #178 (isolation #22) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:30 pm
Postby ajolin »
There's a reason I said I need new ones Ray. I'm going to go back and re-read the game tonight and see if I can show you guy with quotes what I've been seeing. Maybe I will even see it from one of your guy's sides.
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Post #179 (isolation #23) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:34 pm
Postby ajolin »
Okay Dekes. I did apologize for that one though, I really should have been keeping better track of the votes. Also realize that was second post. Now that I've been here for a few days and have a better feel on the mafiascum style of play, it will be easier to read mafiascum players and make votes that are better thought out. I'm glad there's a newbie section, or it'd be a disaster trying to play.
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Post #189 (isolation #25) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:23 pm
Postby ajolin »
Okay, thanks. No I'm completely new to mafia. I've played mafia style games, but in the two I've played the roles were fixed and based on the number of players in the game.
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Post #196 (isolation #28) » Mon Apr 11, 2011 3:10 pm
Postby ajolin »
With recent events as they are David I'm inclined to agree somewhat with your reads. Voided, just because he's the only one voting doesn't mean we don't believe it could be you. I said I'll abstain for a while until I get better reads, but you're still a suspect. While this doesn't necessarily mean you have a wagon, I see what Dekes meant in that post. Also Dekes, I like your avatar as well.
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Post #216 (isolation #29) » Wed Apr 13, 2011 1:16 am
Postby ajolin »
KittyMo, I just thought it would be more fun. It didn't have an effect on the course of events so much, but it was interesting. I thought that this, being a newbie game, would have more freedoms for the newbies to play around and learn how the game works. I wanted to test the mechanic. Also, I thought I unvoted Ray... Oh well.
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Post #243 (isolation #31) » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:23 pm
Postby ajolin »
Well, if he flips town I get lynch, which I really hope won't happen, especially considering how much trouble a few of you were going through getting evidence for his case. I also know, however, that what happens next should be fun to watch.
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Post #247 (isolation #32) » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:32 pm
Postby ajolin »
Because I reviewed the thread. I reread it and read all of your cases. Voidedmafia may seem fishy to me a bit, but from an objective point of view he had a strong case. Looking back it seemed as though Twisted just wanted to find somebody to vote on. He was trying to start a wagon really early based on some silliness at the start of a newbie game. In any case, I can't turn back now, can I?
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Post #248 (isolation #33) » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:36 pm
Postby ajolin »
What I really hope is that I get NK'd, no matter if it was town or not. I know the mafia isn't stupid enough to NK me though, because if they NK me, town would start scum hunting again and try to find a new lead. If they don't though, it's an easy pick for lynch, me or jindori, and then they get another free NK.
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Post #262 (isolation #35) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:20 am
Postby ajolin »
Voidedmafia wrote:Ray, you do have a point that it could be just newbtown and all, but look at what he's said after the hammer. It's pretty obvious that his main reason for doing it was pretty much for his own lulz. No one in their right mind should be THAT
hopeful for their lynch
, unless they're just desperate to get out of it, and Ajolin was in no such position when he hammered.
[quote="Ajolin]Well, if he flips town I get lynch,
which I really hope won't happen,
especially considering how much trouble a few of you were going through getting evidence for his case. I also know, however, that what happens next should be fun to watch.[/quote]
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Post #275 (isolation #37) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 3:48 pm
Postby ajolin »
Actually Jin, you only have one vote, and I know I won't be voting for you with the info I have now. Sure the l-1 was kind of a large slip-up, but I find Toxic and Voided more suspicious right now.
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Post #279 (isolation #38) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 4:39 pm
Postby ajolin »
Ray: just read what you said in #268. Pretty much sums up the whole thing. Plus the fact that Voided was trying to build his case off of a misquote, as I pointed out in #262. As for Toxic... I don't really have a case for him right now. it's more just a feeling, and honestly I don't expect you to start voting based on a hunch.
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Post #287 (isolation #41) » Sun Apr 17, 2011 6:05 pm
Postby ajolin »
Voided, you voted for me in 258, and you provided your reasoning for voting me in 258. That reasoning was
"Ray, you do have a point that it could be just newbtown and all, but look at what he's said after the hammer. It's pretty obvious that his main reason for doing it was pretty much for his own lulz. No one in their right mind should be THAT hopeful for their lynch, unless they're just desperate to get out of it, and Ajolin was in no such position when he hammered."
And that was the misquote, what I didn't do. I never said I didn't hammer Twisted, don't twist my words. You said "[ajolin] could just be newbtown, but", so that means that the hammer was was possibly just a mistake or such on my part. The basis for your case comes in after the "but", because you're explaining that even if the hammer wasn't scummy, what I said was. You proceeded to misquote me and say I was hopeful for my own lynch.
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Post #292 (isolation #43) » Mon Apr 18, 2011 8:53 am
Postby ajolin »
You didn't correct yourself, I corrected you. And I never said that I didn't do "anything yesterday", I said I didn't do what you accused me of. Again, I'm going to tell you to quit twisting my words Voided.
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Post #295 (isolation #45) » Mon Apr 18, 2011 12:08 pm
Postby ajolin »
I like how you don't address my other point. I'm voting you because you are trying to bring me down even though you have no case, and because when I pointed out that you had no case, you made a "correction." Also because you keep trying to make arguments off of things I never said, which I addressed both times in the "twisting my words" posts I made, but you never mentioned after the fact. It may just seem like an OMGUS, but I'm doing it because they way you are accusing me is scummy, not because you are accusing me.
P.S. I'd like to mention that, while the "correction" about the NK could be true, it seems a bit fishy to me. You made it a point that I was excited for my lynch, but you say that either you misread it, or made an error when typing the post. The second seems more unlikely to me, and the first makes the fact that you stayed on my case a bit (a while after the correction you voted for jin) even though I wasn't doing what you said your reasoning for my case was anyway.
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Post #300 (isolation #48) » Mon Apr 18, 2011 1:14 pm
Postby ajolin »
Yeah that was my bad with the correction. I was reading my post again to see if I made any mistakes and misread "unlikely" as "likely" and didn't make mention of it because I thought it would be stupid to make four posts in a row.
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Post #301 (isolation #49) » Mon Apr 18, 2011 1:16 pm
Postby ajolin »
KittoMo, to my understanding, that's only in regards to the actual game. I thought it was completely fine to PM people about things that aren't ongoing game topics.
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Post #349 (isolation #50) » Tue Apr 19, 2011 3:50 pm
Postby ajolin »
Wow, this entire thing is just tragic. It makes me want to cut out my eyes so I don't have to read it. I have an idea. Scum usually don't vote for scum buddies unless they think the scum buddy will be lynched, when they'll try to bandwagon to "confirm" themselves. We have two potential scum teams. I'm not picking a side yet, because obviously shit's going down hardcore and I want to be sure before I vote either way. Any way, the obvious choices are:
Ray/Toxic
and
Jin/David
. There are other possible combos involving the people not in those pairs, as you could've guessed. The point is, which pair seemed to be more chummy and defensive of each other? Which looked more like a team of scum, and which looked more like two random towns?
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Post #373 (isolation #52) » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:35 pm
Postby ajolin »
It appears to me that Jin and Voided missed the part of the post where I said... "There are other possible combos involving the people not in those pairs, as you could've guessed."
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Post #375 (isolation #54) » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:47 pm
Postby ajolin »
To further explain #373, I meant that if you think one pair is scum more than the other, go read the thread and look at the way they react to each other. It wasn't "LOL LETS PICK A TEAM BASED ON WHICH ONES ARE NICER AND KILL 'EM", but more "Well, if you really think they're scum, check. Look if they seem to work together and do scummy thing's with each other before deciding they're a team and not just unlucky towns."
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Post #385 (isolation #56) » Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:19 am
Postby ajolin »
Jin, you can interpret my post however you want. If you feel that the post was scummy I'm fine with that. I can even agree that I could have phrased it better.
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Post #391 (isolation #57) » Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:49 pm
Postby ajolin »
Toxic: Why should I. You're just one vote, and I already said why I did it. It was a gut reaction, as I said. I felt like there was enough evidence on him that I assumed people wouldn't mind if we had finally picked a lynch.
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Post #399 (isolation #58) » Fri Apr 22, 2011 1:31 pm
Postby ajolin »
Ray, not to good. This recent fight distracted me a little bit, go over Toxic's and Jin's points. Honestly, Jin still seems a bit funny to me. The hammer setup seems a bit off, with his reasoning being flimsy considering he didn't say all of why he did it. If there's anybody that seems scummy but I'm not sure about right now it would be Voided. His vote is somewhat stable, but his accusations are everywhere.