This forum is for discussion of individual Open Setups, including theoretical balance.
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #22 (isolation #0 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:52 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:52 am
Maybe a cop for scum would be good
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #26 (isolation #1 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:51 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:51 am
Ok I wrote a program for this and am currently in the process of running it 500 times.
If anyone else also wants to run it so we have as much info as we can, that'd be great.
Also if anyone sees any problem with my code point it out. But it's not super readable so sorry
Spoiler: python code
Code: Select all
import random
class Player():
def __init__(self, team, blocker):
self.block = blocker
self.team = team
self.killing = False
self.BP = False
if self.team == "town":
self.BP = True
def __str__(self):
return self.team
def main():
wins = [0,0,0]
n = int(input("How many times would you like it to run?\n"))
scumA = True
scumB = True
players = initPlayers()
done = ""
for i in range(n):
while(done == ""):
if done == "":
players = day(players)
for player in players:
print(str(player))
print()
teams = checkWinCon(players)
done = teams[0]
scumA = teams[1]
scumB = teams[2]
if done == "":
players = night(players, scumA, scumB)
for player in players:
print(str(player))
print()
teams = checkWinCon(players)
done = teams[0]
scumA = teams[1]
scumB = teams[2]
end(done)
if done == "Town":
wins[0] += 1
if done == "Scum A":
wins[1] += 1
if done == "Scum B":
wins[2] += 1
players = initPlayers()
done = ""
print("Town wins: " + str(wins[0]))
print("Scum A wins: " + str(wins[1]))
print("Scum B wins: " + str(wins[2]))
def initPlayers():
players = []
for i in range(4):
players.append(Player("town", False))
players.append(Player("scumA", True))
players.append(Player("scumA", False))
players.append(Player("scumB", True))
players.append(Player("scumB", False))
return players
def day(players):
print("Day")
random.seed()
del players[random.randint(0,len(players)-1)]
return players
def night(players, scumA, scumB):
print("Night")
random.seed()
if scumA:
killerA = findEnemy("scumA", players)
players[killerA].killing = True
if scumB:
killerB = findEnemy("scumB", players)
players[killerB].killing = True
for player in players:
if player.block and not player.killing:
blocked = findEnemy(player.team, players)
players[blocked].killing = False
for player in players:
if player.killing:
target = findEnemy(player.team, players)
players = kill(target, players)
player.killing = False
return players
def checkWinCon(players):
scumA = 0
scumB = 0
Aexists = True
Bexists = True
for player in players:
if player.team == "scumA":
scumA += 1
if player.team == "scumB":
scumB += 1
if scumA == 0:
Aexists = False
if scumB == 0:
Bexists = False
if scumA >= len(players)/2.0:
return ["Scum A", 0, 0]
if scumB >= len(players)/2.0:
return ["Scum B", 0,0]
if scumA == 0 and scumB == 0:
print("sup")
return ["Town", 0,0]
return ["", Aexists, Bexists]
def end(team):
print(team + " wins!\n")
def kill(index, players):
if players[index].BP == True:
players[index].BP = False
print("checkBP")
else:
del players[index]
print("checkNonBP")
return players
def findEnemy(team, players):
random.seed()
enemy = Player("", False)
while(enemy.team == team or enemy.team == ""):
enemy = players[random.randint(0,len(players)-1)]
return players.index(enemy)
main()
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #27 (isolation #2 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:55 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:55 am
Town wins: 343
Scum A wins: 76
Scum B wins: 81
That's pretty fucking townsided
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #28 (isolation #3 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:15 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:15 am
Town wins: 1018
Scum A wins: 254
Scum B wins: 228
Which adds up to:
Town wins: 1361
Scum A wins: 330
Scum B wins: 309
Still very townsided
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #30 (isolation #4 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:20 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:20 am
I'll test that, but first I'm gonna test what happens at 3:2:2 and no lynch d1
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #32 (isolation #5 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:23 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:23 am
In post 31 , Pine wrote: Ehhh. This takes the human component out of consideration, which I'm never a big fan of. For example, I doubt it considers that shooting someone who doesn't die is effectively a cop inno on that person. I dunno, I'd hesitate to beef up scum anti-Town power much. Maybe make the goon a 1-shot Doctor?
Yeah, that's the issue with EV.
Also going to test what happens when town doesn't lynch until a scum faction is eliminated
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #33 (isolation #6 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:48 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:48 am
No lynching until 1 scum faction is gone:
Town wins: 1586
Scum A wins: 220
Scum B wins: 194
Which is, interestingly enough, an even higher win percentage than the others. Now, if scum knows town is doing that they'll try to aim at town, making the strategy pretty ineffective, but it's certainly interesting.
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #35 (isolation #7 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:57 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 9:57 am
Actually, if town gets lynched in that case then scum have to shoot each other
Very weird but yeah
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #37 (isolation #8 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:09 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:09 am
There are 2 possibilities for each scum. Either it gets shot or it doesn't. If it gets shot it loses no matter what. If it doesn't get shot, it's better off shooting the opposing scum because that gets it a win instead of a draw.
But that assumes the townie is confirmed, which isn't necessarily true. Look at this thread for in-depth explanation for that scenario and others
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 7&start=25
And also that reminds me, that thread would be pretty useful for determining the EV in terms of if everyone followed optimal play.
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #39 (isolation #9 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:18 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:18 am
It would be great if I incorporated mith's conclusions from that thread into my program, but it seems very complicated taking into account BPs
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #40 (isolation #10 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:35 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:35 am
Ooh, interesting.
3:2:2 with random lynch every day:
Town wins: 776
Scum A wins: 649
Scum B wins: 575
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #42 (isolation #11 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:41 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:41 am
In post 41 , ThinkBig wrote: That is interesting! Though how can we prevent the scum teams from hammering no-lynch?
Hmm, good point. If all scum vote no lynch every day, or just refuse to lynch, then they can force no lynch every day.
The question is, is that worth outing themselves to the other team? Might be worth plurality lynch in the setup anyway though.
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #45 (isolation #12 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:51 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:51 am
In post 43 , ThinkBig wrote: In post 42 , Infinity 324 wrote: In post 41 , ThinkBig wrote: That is interesting! Though how can we prevent the scum teams from hammering no-lynch?
Hmm, good point. If all scum vote no lynch every day, or just refuse to lynch, then they can force no lynch every day.
The question is, is that worth outing themselves to the other team? Might be worth plurality lynch in the setup anyway though.
That is true...if the same people continue to vote no lynch, it could out themselves as scum
Especially if they don't give a reason.
It's not a real EV calculation, I'm just generating a lot of sample runs. So there's the randomness factor.
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #46 (isolation #13 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 11:02 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 11:02 am
3:2:2 with no lynch d1:
Town wins: 1500
Scum A wins: 280
Scum B wins: 220
Pretty crazy
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #48 (isolation #14 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 11:22 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 11:22 am
Well for lynch every day town had a well below 50% winrate.
EV just heavily favors no lynch d1 with 3:2:2 for some reason.
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #49 (isolation #15 ) » Mon Nov 21, 2016 11:23 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Mon Nov 21, 2016 11:23 am
The question is do you want 50% town winrate or 33% for everyone
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #51 (isolation #16 ) » Tue Nov 22, 2016 9:28 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Tue Nov 22, 2016 9:28 am
Fair enough.
With only 2 BP townies:
Town wins: 6160
Scum A wins: 2042
Scum B wins: 1798
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #52 (isolation #17 ) » Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:03 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:03 am
Ok my code was off and the results are way more scumsided.
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #53 (isolation #18 ) » Wed Nov 23, 2016 2:22 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 2:22 am
Town wins: 1132
Scum A wins: 948
Scum B wins: 920
But is it supposed to be more or less townsided than this?
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #54 (isolation #19 ) » Wed Nov 23, 2016 3:23 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 3:23 am
Ok again the d1 no lynch is better but I still don't know how reliable that can be
Town wins: 1013
Scum A wins: 504
Scum B wins: 483
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #56 (isolation #20 ) » Wed Nov 23, 2016 4:49 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 4:49 am
That might be a good idea.
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #58 (isolation #21 ) » Wed Nov 23, 2016 9:02 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 9:02 am
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Infinity 324
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor
Infinity 324 they (pl.)
Survivor Survivor
Posts: 18337 Joined: April 7, 2013
Pronoun: they (pl.)
Post
Post #60 (isolation #22 ) » Wed Nov 23, 2016 11:38 am
Post
by Infinity 324 » Wed Nov 23, 2016 11:38 am
Ok cool.
Will there be blitz deadlines?
Show new GTKAS
<3 you are valid
plural system, we may or may not sign
Copyright © MafiaScum. All rights reserved.