Vengeful in the Night

[Bicephalous Bob]

This probably already exists:

2 Mafia Goons
7 Vanilla Townies

Nightkills and lynches are compulsive. When a townie gets killed by the Mafia, the townie may vengekill someone.

This is an alternative to Nightless in that it makes sure players with good reads don't get nightkilled at the start of the game.

Depending on the numbers, different win conditions can be used:

The Mafia win if half of the living players are goons. A townie making a vengekill is not considered dead. The Town wins if all goons are dead.

Or:

The Town wins if all goons are dead, even if no one is alive at the end of the game. The Mafia win if all townies are dead and at least one goon survives.

[mith]

There's a version of this where Mafia only get Vengeful kills here: viewtopic.php?p=6201446#p6201446

I don't know that I ever ran the numbers on a version with normal nightkills, though.

Clarification: Do the nightkill and vengekill happen simultaneously, or does the vengekill happen first? (The way the win condition is worded implies the former.)

[Bicephalous Bob]

I reworded the bit in the area tag because it sounded like the Mafia could vengekill someone when they killed a townie.

Assuming this didn't trip you up, I can't think of any scenario where the two lead to different results. But let's say simultaneously.

[mith]

Oh, I guess I totally misread this, then. The vengekill happens because of a nightkill, not lynch. (This is an interesting variant, and could have its own associated role.) I am not good at reading lately.

My initial instinct was that EV is somewhere around Double Day - town only get one lynch to start with, but otherwise.

However, there may be some interesting no lynch strategies. For example, at 2:3, a mislynch loses immediately, but a no lynch means the Mafia have to kill someone, and that player now has a 50-50 shot at extending the game. (I'm not sure if this is a desirable feature. It could be eliminated with a rule like "Only gets a vengekill if there was a lynch the previous day".)

[callforjudgement]

"You kill someone when you die" is half of Babysitter, but the other half would rather screw the setup up. I'm not sure if we have a name for just the "take someone of your choice with you" part on its own.