[SETUP] Zombies

[Irrelephant11]

Zombie game! (Aka can a cult game be fun and feel fair??)

Zombie prime
Zombie
Human
Human
Human
Human
Human
Human researcher
Human researcher

“Tests” (lynches) only reveal (and immediately eliminate) zombies.
However, Zombies recruit a human whenever a human gets tested - though they can’t target the one being tested.
Researchers must stay human until Zombie prime is killed or until three regular zombies are killed for humans to win.
Zombies win by achieving parity or zombifying both researchers.
Zombies have daychat.

[Awoo]

noo

[Irrelephant11]

But is it because cult
Or a different reason

[the worst]

isn't this 3v5 after a single mislynch?

[Irrelephant11]

Hmmm yes it is. Though town has a temporary IC at that point
Yeah it should maybe have 2 more humans
Or one less zombie?

[the worst]

I think the short answer is cult games will never feel fair:
1) playing to a wincon which then becomes irrelevant would be super devastating
2) it's a faction which gains numbers as the playerlist is dwindling--the gamestate manipulation is really confusing

even adding more people, going into like 3v7 => 4v5 after two mislynches still feels super unfair to me

i kinda assumed zombies don't have a factional nk but idk why i assumed that. maybe this is better as 2v11 with a one shot factional recruit which cannot be used along with their nk?
this means the town is ~aware of when the recruit happens (which is less icky from a gamestate pov) and caps the game at 3v10 faux mountainous with 1-2 ICs
also adds for interesting plays via no kill gambits and so forth

i'm not on top of my game rn so just throwing ideas out

[Irrelephant11]

No Nightkills in my mind, no

The fact that zombie prime dying is an immediate win for humans doesn’t help balance this? However hard it probably is to track those whose alignments are changing, hitting the two original scum at any point before endgame is always a town win

[callforjudgement]

Giving cults a Flagbearer is the usual way to attempt to balance them.

Just because it's usual doesn't mean it actually works, though. Either you find the cult leader quickly, or else the cult takes over.

[Irrelephant11]

I mean cult also doesn’t recruit on a correct lynch
But yeah maybe this isn’t different enough from regular cult games

[Awoo]

the best cult is the cult with a fixed maximum size including dead cultists (even then its still a cult lol)

[Irrelephant11]

Right I mean I’m not pretending this takes away all the weird aspects of cults

Oh also @tw I just realized: no, this isn’t 3v5 after a mislynch. It’s 3v6. Humans can’t be lynched

[Irrelephant11]

Yes that is actually the big difference here, I’m now remembering! Townies can’t be lynched here; a mislynch just lets cult recruit

[BBmolla]

The only acceptable version of cult is with alts. Cult Leader cults target player upon each incorrect lynch. Culted players lose access to accounts, cult leader gains it.

In this way a player will never have to change win conditions which is the main issue with cult games. Culted players still win with the town, cult wins if leader + living culted equal or outnumber town.

[Awoo]

Has anyone hosted a alt-cult game like that before?

I know NSG ran lone wolf but that wasn't cults.

[BBmolla]

Has anyone hosted a alt-cult game like that before?

I know NSG ran lone wolf but that wasn't cults.

Someone had it as a SK role in a game but other than that no.

Would be a fun game though I think.

[northsidegal]

The only acceptable version of cult is with alts. Cult Leader cults target player upon each incorrect lynch. Culted players lose access to accounts, cult leader gains it.

In this way a player will never have to change win conditions which is the main issue with cult games. Culted players still win with the town, cult wins if leader + living culted equal or outnumber town.

i like this idea a lot (and i remember something kind of like it but for the life of me can't remember where)

the primary problem with games like that is finding some way to deal with replacements that doesn't mod-confirm people as not controlling multiple accounts.

as for the zombies setup, i think the cult not recruiting unless town is lynched is a good mechanic, but it would still mean that for the town to ever win, they would have to lynch a bunch of times correctly in a row (at the very least two times in a row, in most cases i'd imagine more), with a single mislynch "resetting" their progress. if i'm understanding the setup correctly, that is – if town wins when zombie prime is lynched, it's a different story.

[Irrelephant11]

Town wins when zombie prime is lynched
Town also wins if three zombies are ever lynched in total
Town loses if both researchers become zombies (maybe this is a bad/unnecessary piece)

[callforjudgement]

the primary problem with games like that is finding some way to deal with replacements that doesn't mod-confirm people as not controlling multiple accounts.

Just don't mention that the replacement happened – swap out the person controlling the account without any visible change for the other players.

[BBmolla]

the primary problem with games like that is finding some way to deal with replacements that doesn't mod-confirm people as not controlling multiple accounts.

Just don't mention that the replacement happened – swap out the person controlling the account without any visible change for the other players.

If you do that, there's an added bonus where scum could fake replace outs

fuk i hoep this is scum, gl boys

Hey guys, I'm the new Roger the Red replacement.

Basically replacing out would be a scumtell. But maybe that's okay?

[BBmolla]

Starting own thread so we stop clogging Irel's