[SETUP] Guns & Roses

[implosion]

Not sure tbh. It also gives scum the amusing option of picking like, d6 rose in a wild attempt to be unlynchable in lylo.

[FakeGod]

Reimagined:

Everyone chooses a day and either a

gun

or a

rose

. This decision is sent to the mod and kept secret.
Mod tellies up the choices, and the day that the largest number of players picked is blocked. (the players who picked that day receives neither a gun or a rose)

During their chosen day, players are revealed to have a gun or a rose.
If it's the blocked day, it is instead revealed that this day is blocked.

People with

guns

have 1-shot vig during their night.
People with

roses

have lynch immunity during their day, and night-kill immunity during their night.

I'm thinking a 3 Mafia vs 14 Town setup.

[Lycanfire]

So, essentially, if everyone chooses d1 gun and tries to prove they took a gun, nobody gets a gun, meaning to avoid mountainous, some townies do need to choose d2/n2, which could also justify mafia choosing d2/n2 or d3/n3 and so on in order to get a rose. Am I understanding this correctly?

I still think drawing a rose is always a scumclaim. Why not continue this line of reasoning and have all

reveals

blocked on a certain day, but powers are only null if it was the most sought after power? (if it's a tie, no powers) This would incentivize scums to overload a day to sneak in roses, but they could get found out immediately, so they might sneak one or two and draw a gun on another mafiaso for insurance. I feel like this is more representative of what you want (guns and roses, opposed to just guns)

[Lycanfire]

I don't know if anyone mentioned it: while drawing a gun on scum is clearly the best play, performing a double kill along side another townie makes the power a complete waste. With the number of kills flying around, I think rose is a good scum power (and an awful town power), though I haven't and won't try to calculate what the dominant strategy could be. I think scums in general would be more concerned about not dying in either game phase, and scum do not have perfect information. The potential reward from gun is possibly pointless, therefore rose is viable.
(but only if you can choose rose without getting lynched.)

[Lycanfire]

I think this is the thing that kills most open setups: we're assholes and can't have anything nice.

This might come down to how well you can crumb your kill while not looking like a scumfuck.

I think this would be a good f2f setup, especially if you make a lot of finger guns at people. That'll get the soyboys and soygirls to pick roses.

[FakeGod]

Reimagined again:

Everyone chooses a night and either a gun or a rose. This decision is sent to the mod and kept secret.

During their chosen day, players are revealed to have a gun or a rose.

People with guns have 1-shot vig during their night.

If there are no town-aligned player with a rose, mafia wins, even if there are no mafia aligned player remaining.

[Lycanfire]

If this were a review I would give that a pass.

[implosion]

ooooh.

[Awoo]

Top [mafia + 1] people on the playerlist pick a rose.

If anyone else has a rose, they're scum.

[Awoo]

Don't underestimate how much I hate roses, Fakegod. Guns will prevail.

[Lycanfire]

Isn't broken because you need a rose for each day. If there's a mafiaso in the top 4 players, you will run out of lynches unless you have godlike aim in the bottom 13 players.

[Awoo]

Since when?

If there are no town-aligned player with a rose, mafia wins, even if there are no mafia aligned player remaining.

Did this mean per day and not per game?

[Lycanfire]

Roses prevail

[Awoo]

If it's per game then it's easily broken by that strategy though. All four pick rose day 1, and if it's not a day 1 rose then gun em down.

[Lycanfire]

The game won't go long. It's by day. Sorry.

[Awoo]

If it's per day though, that's interesting, because if only one person is reveal to have a rose and the game continues, congrats u just got urself an inno child.

[Lycanfire]

guess scum have to pick roses now. you make a compelling argument.

[Awoo]

ehhh actually you can't even discuss what you're going to pick pregame tho?

ehhh this setup is just all pregame wifom now thats gross

like you get stupid situations where its like every townie thinks "oh im gonna pick a rose day 2 because thats a pro town move" and the game instantly ends. Sorry I just don't see this being fun at all

[Lycanfire]

It's your own fault for joining a shit for brains playerlist

[Awoo]

lol should have taken the wine in front of you instead amirite

except instead of that it's wifom against someone you're supposed to be allied with...

[implosion]

my interpretation was that the mafia win condition is to kill all town players with roses

[FakeGod]

I assumed the whole game as well. "Mafia needs to kill all the town rose players".

Top [mafia + 1] people on the playerlist pick a rose.

If anyone else has a rose, they're scum.

I think you crafted this strategy assuming roses still have vig-immunity.

[Awoo]

No, I crafted this strategy assuming the setup was "at least one townie has to pick rose or we don't play the game at all."

[FakeGod]

If top 4 players pick rose and rest of the players pick day 1 guns, then mafia has enough shots to kill all rose players on night 1 and win, assuming mafia wasn't lynched on day 1.

[FakeGod]

I'm toying with the blackout mechanic (day that is most picked = no reveal + guns do nothing) to reduce swing, but I'm not sure what the town's optimal strategy is in the first place here.

If top 5 slots pick rose and rest of the players pick day 1 gun and kill each other, then mafia wins 77%ish which is the chance of top 5 containing at least one mafia member.

Perhaps there is no optimal strategy and it's up to town to pick some mix of roses/guns and varying days?