[SETUP] Circus Dictatorship

[BBmolla]

Circus Dictatorship

13 Players

2 Mafia Goons

2 Clown Lovers

1 Town Loyal Doctor
8 Vanilla Townies

• Clowns do not have a nightkill, instead they have a factional loyal protect or a factional killblock.
  
• If the Clowns survive till Day 4, they win.
  
• If the Mafia are eliminated before Day 4, Town wins and Clowns lose.
  
• Traditional win conditions apply on the death of a Clown. (Town wins when Mafia are eliminated, Mafia wins when number is equal to town)

I SWEAR I posted this yesterday but apparently not

Please help me balance it, I had Day 3 originally but thought it might be too hard?

[TemporalLich]

I have a feeling Clowns are underpowered and that the EV isn't close enough to

50

/

50

/

50

(ideal balance with a neutral faction that doesn't interfere with Town/Mafia wincons, keeping the EV numbers close to each other is how you theoretically balance a setup but it is hard to calculate EV).

How do Clown wincons work when exactly 1 Clown is alive (assuming Clowns lose if they are wiped out)?

I do like the fact that Clowns need to scumhunt but also keep the scum alive, but Mafia would benefit from killing a clown so they can enable their wincon before the clowns survive and leave the game.

I'm not good at balancing so I wouldn't know how to balance it besides making the wincons clearer as it is possible for the setup to be a true multiball with Clowns being groupscum that block Town/Mafia wincons with a different wincon and factional abilities.

[BBmolla]

How do Clown wincons work when exactly 1 Clown is alive (assuming Clowns lose if they are wiped out)?

They're Lovers

What is unclear about wincons?

[TemporalLich]

How do Clown wincons work when exactly 1 Clown is alive (assuming Clowns lose if they are wiped out)?

They're Lovers

What is unclear about wincons?

oh I managed to miss that crucial info, and I thought clowns were already weak without them being lovers

It's unclear whether a Clown win ends the game with Town/Mafia losing or not, if not then clowns are a neutral third party faction but if they are I call this a multiball setup.

[BBmolla]

How do Clown wincons work when exactly 1 Clown is alive (assuming Clowns lose if they are wiped out)?

They're Lovers

What is unclear about wincons?

oh I managed to miss that crucial info, and I thought clowns were already weak without them being lovers

It's unclear whether a Clown win ends the game with Town/Mafia losing or not, if not then clowns are a neutral third party faction but if they are I call this a multiball setup.

Clown win ends the game

Yeah I'm undecided as to whether it should be Day 3/4 victory. I just thought giving 2 lynches and 2 kills to get the clowns was a bit rough, 3 and 3 seemed more fair (with the added that Clowns can possibly stop kills).

[Isis]

If I handwave that a doc protect should be good enough to figure out which clown is at risk of getting NKed and set the protect rate to 100% the clown EV is 7/13, if I go to the opposite extreme and have the clowns protect themselves randomly the clown EV is 231/520 (44%). The clowns are playing nightless, they don't get to eliminate threats to themselves, so they will be performing below EV.

I would at a minimum not make the doctor loyal, I don't understand punishing a clown for convincing the doctor that he's obvtown. Loyal doctor makes some amount of sense when you don't want a doctor in a normal setup to disrupt a teammate vig but here it doesn't make any sense to me at all.

I guess this setup might have a weird dynamic where if a mafiosi fails a kill N1 or N2 and by day 3 both mafia are alive but the clowns haven't been eliminated, a mafia goon might claim scum and claim the player who cheated death to help ensure the clowns don't win even if they have to try to win out the rest of the game with just the remaining scum. This probably sucks pretty bad for the clowns. Maybe they should have a roleblock instead of a protect for this reason. Indecisive if it needs to be indecisive.

[Kerset]

I think that mafia got low chance to win. There is no way for them to win without getting rid of clowns and they got 50% to fail a kill, even if target is selected correctly.

[Isis]

The mafia can push for a daily eliminate on the clowns just like the town can. Being able to shoot at the clowns is just extra