[SETUP] Reverse Mafia

[DiamondSentinel]

This is very much a WIP idea because I'm looking for ideas on how to solve some major issues inherent in this gimmick.

This game is for

3 players

.
There are

3 mafia

and

10 town

.

TOWN:
1x Macho Super Saint
1x Compulsive Doctor
8x Vanilla Townie

MAFIA:
3x Mafia Goon

The starting gimmick of this is literally just "your wincon is to get eliminated". All roles work like their vanilla versions with these changes in win conditions.

Town Win Condition

You are aligned with the

Town

. You win when the Mafia control 50% of the town.

and

Mafia Win Condition

You are aligned with the

Mafia

. You win when all Mafia members are dead.

Obvious concessions being that Mafia cannot kill one of their own. Micro 903 is apparently similar to this (thanks worst) but added a jester that the town and scum could eliminate to win, although I'm not sure that's necessary. Another thought that I originally had was that instead of the Supersaint, it's a sort of reverse of that, where it kills the

first

person who voted them (and is still on the wagon) when they are eliminated, but that might encourage vote parking.

Thoughts on how to adjust this?

[Isis]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... Town_Mafia

It seems like the doctor claims D1 here with some metagame on whether the mafia also claims day1? Doesn't seem good?

[DiamondSentinel]

Oh right. That was another thing I'd realized but forgot in the later iterations.

Yeah, so, I liked the idea that the mafia has to try to predict the doctor's targets, but you run into a couple of issues.

1. If a doctor successfully protects someone, they just claim it the next day and then the target get eliminated anyways.
2. Counter to most counterclaims, you absolutely want to vote inside the claim pool, so perhaps that's not great either.

Before I thought of a doctor and a supersaint, I'd originally thought of an informational role to replace it, so the town has to weigh if they want to leave them alive, but that one works

even less

because if the investigative role gets a

single

guilty, then the scum auto-loses.

[DiamondSentinel]

Hmm, perhaps maybe instead of a factional kill, everyone's vegenful with the same win conditions and no other power roles, and then the restrictions that vengeful mafia can't kill other mafia.

[DiamondSentinel]

But what separates this idea from Vote for Town is that there

is

a kill beyond elimination. Either I want the mafia to remove some folks they think would be removed anyways (or however they want), or this vengeful idea.

[Isis]

It's a unique setup I just think it's worth naming it in a way that connects it to the oldest version, like "Nightful vote for town" or something.

[DiamondSentinel]

Once I get it to an end-state that I'm satisfied with, I'll work on the name.

[Isis]

Would bodyguard be a fun role for this setup?

[DiamondSentinel]

Hmm, maybe a babysitter/hider instead? But yeah, it's a decent alternative to doctor.

[Isis]

Oh! I like babysitter!

[Something_Smart]

Why does this setup need PR's at all?

[Something_Smart]

Or, I guess more to the point, why wouldn't the PR's just claim and be executed on D1. If you do have a PR it has to at least answer that question.

[DiamondSentinel]

Because just VT and goons trying to get themselves executed exists. I knew that going in, and it was proved by the existence of Vote for Town!

The trick to adding PRs to this set-up is to make them have a potential payoff to

not

be eliminated. To use Babysitter and Supersaint for example:

If the Supersaint claims, nobody will want to vote for them because scum could just lurk to get the hammer. At the very least it causes a deadlock because people want to vote them, but they only want to be the last one to vote them.
If the Babysitter claims, then scum just never kills the babysitter, and if the babysitter gets eliminated, that removes the possibility for the town to lose 2 members in a night (a good thing).

So both of those roles answer that question thusly. Other than that, it's now "I want to see how these normal roles would interact in a gimmick that is already a thing".

[Something_Smart]

If the Supersaint claims, nobody will want to vote for them because scum could just lurk to get the hammer. At the very least it causes a deadlock because people want to vote them, but they only want to be the last one to vote them.

Meh, then it's just determined by speed if town tries to set up a quickhammer. That feels bad.

If the Babysitter claims, then scum just never kills the babysitter, and if the babysitter gets eliminated, that removes the possibility for the town to lose 2 members in a night (a good thing).

Is it a good thing? If the babysitter dies at night, taking X with them, wouldn't we rather have just executed the babysitter and then executed X, forcing scum to kill two additional townies?

[Something_Smart]

And as far as I know there isn't any existing vote-for-town setup that has nightkills. So you'd be still in new territory even if you did mountainous with nightkills.

[DiamondSentinel]

If the Supersaint claims, nobody will want to vote for them because scum could just lurk to get the hammer. At the very least it causes a deadlock because people want to vote them, but they only want to be the last one to vote them.

Meh, then it's just determined by speed if town tries to set up a quickhammer. That feels bad.

If the Babysitter claims, then scum just never kills the babysitter, and if the babysitter gets eliminated, that removes the possibility for the town to lose 2 members in a night (a good thing).

Is it a good thing? If the babysitter dies at night, taking X with them, wouldn't we rather have just executed the babysitter and then executed X, forcing scum to kill two additional townies?

I suppose that could be the case, but then you run into the issue of getting a scum elim.

This was still an issue with investigative roles, which was why I considered one in the first place, but there was the obvious issue

[DiamondSentinel]

And sure. If town wants to elim their “power roles” immediately, they can. It’s not any more or less optimal, imo.

If you’re that worried, I could make it more mountainous, although I’m not 100% sure if that’s even necessary.