Dumb hydra mechanic

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Dumb hydra mechanic

Post Post #0 (ISO) » Sat Aug 28, 2021 1:24 am

Post by Awoo »

Dumb Idea when I got out of the shower: Mafia but instead of a nightkill, mafia merge 2 slots into 1 slot, and that slot gets the outcome that is worse for town. PR's get vanilla'ized if merged with a VT, town + mafia = the slot is mafia.
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Post Post #1 (ISO) » Sat Aug 28, 2021 6:59 am

Post by Ythan »

You hooked me with the title but that's kind of an interesting idea too.
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Post Post #2 (ISO) » Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:15 am

Post by Isis »

Has this really never been suggested before? I don't see any immediate issues.
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Post Post #3 (ISO) » Sun Aug 29, 2021 6:46 pm

Post by MathBlade »

Town + Mafia making the slot Mafia has an inherent bastardness and balance problems as a player can start as town but end as mafia without knowing their alignment changed.

Also has balance issues as if you start with 10 town 3 scum then miselim 9 town 3 scum. Night kill becomes 8 and 4. Miselim 7 and 4. Nightkill 6 and 5. You’re at elo if you’re town in two days. It doesn’t make sense to do anything other than gain a new member.

Yes the slots are merged so there is still 3 scum slots but you have 6 town aligned people talking versus 5 mafia aligned. Huge balance shift
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Post Post #4 (ISO) » Sun Aug 29, 2021 6:47 pm

Post by MathBlade »

Probably would need a limit to town + mafia merges as it acts very similar to a cult.
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Post Post #5 (ISO) » Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:09 pm

Post by Infinity 324 »

i assume you'd get a scum role pm if you got merged with scum

i'm skeptical of the idea that the number of players of each alignment talking would have a huge impact on balance. i think it would have some impact.
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Post Post #6 (ISO) » Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:29 pm

Post by MathBlade »

It has a huge impact because town works on cohesion.

Scum don’t have to convince anyone to do a elim, they have to just sow enough chaos.

When it’s 6 v 5 (but three slots) town have to correctly identify every other player who is town to get an elim. It’s essentially elo.
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Post Post #7 (ISO) » Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:30 pm

Post by MathBlade »

Yeah bastard per MS rules to change alignment btw might be balanced if done right but literal bastard. Two different kinds of bastard I guess.
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Post Post #8 (ISO) » Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:36 pm

Post by Infinity 324 »

sure, i played in a open game where when you died you hydra'd with someone else (possibly scum) and it didn't feel bastard. but yeah.

i think the advantage of having more posters is heavily dependent on the plist. town would have to change their approach and be more independent with developing reads. good scum would be able to control the narrative much better but i'm not so sure how well average scum could use it. also a lot of times people use the excuse of being in a hydra to lurk

anyway this seems like a cool idea.
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Post Post #9 (ISO) » Mon Aug 30, 2021 4:42 am

Post by Dwlee99 »

If scum always merged town with scum then town would learn to always lim the merged slot, so that situation won't be as cut and dry. Who merges is actually a lot of info.
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Post Post #10 (ISO) » Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:37 am

Post by Bingle »

In post 4, MathBlade wrote:Probably would need a limit to town + mafia merges as it acts very similar to a cult.
In practice in the game infinity referenced it actually ended up being pretty townsided because people would change when they became scum. Not sure that’s always the case, but definitely worth noting.
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Post Post #11 (ISO) » Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:38 am

Post by Bingle »

I’ll link when not mobile
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Post Post #12 (ISO) » Mon Aug 30, 2021 8:04 am

Post by Jingle »

In post 11, Bingle wrote:I’ll link when not mobile
viewtopic.php?f=83&t=87385


Of course, major difference was that game scum didn’t have unilateral control of the merges.

It’s also worth noting that cops/other investigative effects become disproportionately powerful because if they’re merged with town they can still put their old results.

In fact, holding onto results becomes an even better idea because if you become scum you don’t want innos/guiltiest floating around.
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