[SETUP] Red and Blue

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[SETUP] Red and Blue

Post Post #0 (ISO) » Fri Oct 15, 2021 4:17 am

Post by Something_Smart »

This is a very old setup idea of mine, but I don't believe I ever posted it anywhere. Painters and Lies reminded me of it, even though the setups are nothing alike.

1 Mafia Red Godfather
1 Mafia Blue Framer
1 Town Red Cop
1 Town Blue Cop
5 Vanilla Townies

Both cops are full cops, except that the Red Godfather shows up as innocent to the Red Cop, and the Blue Framer can target a player and make them show up as guilty to the Blue Cop.

This is unchanged from my original idea, but in retrospect it feels pretty townsided. I wonder if it could get away with being 5:2 Carbon-14 style?

Could also be interesting, though more frustrating, if the cops didn't know which color they were. (I would still have them flip color on death, probably.)
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #1 (ISO) » Mon Oct 18, 2021 9:38 pm

Post by Ythan »

Two cops in a nine player game seems strong. I don't think a normal godfather and framer beat two normal cops and the color element seems to make the scum powers weaker. So I think it is town sided as is.
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Post Post #2 (ISO) » Tue Oct 19, 2021 2:33 am

Post by Something_Smart »

What about the 5:2 version?

It's probably swingy, but it seems like it might be a fun experience anyway. I guess hitting the godfather/framed person is pretty feelsbad.
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #3 (ISO) » Tue Oct 19, 2021 3:29 am

Post by Ythan »

I'm bad at balance idk but I'll think about it.
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Post Post #4 (ISO) » Thu Oct 21, 2021 10:00 pm

Post by RH9 »

Wait, what is meant by Carbon-14 style? Does the Godfather and Framer know each other?
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Post Post #5 (ISO) » Fri Oct 22, 2021 4:21 am

Post by Something_Smart »

Yes, they are on the same team. The colors are merely for interaction with the cops.
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #6 (ISO) » Fri Oct 22, 2021 10:31 am

Post by TemporalLich »

I think the red and blue cops should just be variants of a Normal cop (with red having reliable guilties and unreliable clears and blue having reliable clears and unreliable guilties), that is, they should be binary investigatives.

otherwise a Red Cop in the setup has these as potential results: Vanilla Townie, Mafia Blue Framer, Town Blue Cop
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Post Post #7 (ISO) » Fri Oct 22, 2021 10:33 am

Post by TemporalLich »

imo, having the cops not know what color they are ruins the spirit of the setup - the color determines whether you should 100% trust red or green checks
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Post Post #8 (ISO) » Fri Oct 22, 2021 10:36 am

Post by RH9 »

In post 5, Something_Smart wrote:Yes, they are on the same team. The colors are merely for interaction with the cops.
Oh, thank you. I thought that it was Multiball. I am bad at balance too, though, I guess that I too could try to think about it.
If Godfather dies, then the Red Cop would be able to know that all their results will be accurate. Though, if the Red Cop dies too, then Mafia still has a chance for a miselimination, because of the Framer. If the Blue Cop dies, then the Framer is pretty much useless, and the Godfather can be caught by the Blue Cop. I do agree with Ythan, that two cops seem strong in a nine player game. However, in a seven player game, the Blue Cop has a 3/7 chance of receiving a guilty result, and the Red Cop has a 1/7 chance. Both Cops have a higher chance of finding the Mafia in the seven-player version, though the Blue Cop has a 4/7 chance of investigating a Framed person instead. of a 2/3 chance in the nine-player version. I guess that Mafia can also win faster in the seven-player version, only needing to have both Mafia alive in the endgame, two kills, and a miselimination. Alternatively, they could have both Mafia alive in the endgame, two miseliminations, and a kill. Though, if at least one of the Mafia is eliminated, it would be harder for Mafia to win, though it depends which one was eliminated and which Cop is or Cops are still alive. If there is only one Cop and Mafia alive, and both of them are the same colour, then Mafia still has a easy chance to win. If they are different colours, Mafia needs to avoid suspicion or to NK the last Cop. If there are two Cops, then Mafia needs to work harder to avoid suspicion, or to NK both Cops, if time allows. Over all, it feels balanced.
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