Survivor: Nexus {Over! Congrats Karass!)

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Drench
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Post Post #50  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 5:56 pm

haha owned
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Shadoweh
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Post Post #51  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:08 pm

In post 46, hiplop wrote:Okay but like...most people don't base decisions off of ID's . We do play together a lot! And we often work together a lot, or at least have some sort of complex relationship. I think that is varied enough game to game, and is based on us being people who are somewhat compatible. Never once have I ever been like "wow, this is Bellaphant. I better work with her because of that". We generally have complex relationships that vary game to game because we have no idea who eachother are. I think I ID'd you successfully 1 time...and it didnt change anything. I don't think you can say that is the same with you and shadow. I love you both as people, but I do think there is a problem if someone is using something to their advantage that is blatantly put as a rule (Keep your ID private, and if you do find one, dont let it impact your decision making)

FTR, I think people do respect you a ton. I know I do. I think you ARE a ridiculously strong social player. I don't think any of the issues brought up are anything to do with you (besides you being the only active british player :P) or are your fault. They are circumstances outside of your control but I think it is fair to say there is certainly a problem?

First of all, the spec forum is literally full of posts that if Bellaphant wins her win is illegitimate. I wish I were making that up but yeah. So there's no level of respect there.

Secondly a bunch of that is based on Bella IDing me and being willing to throw for me when she wasn't and didn't know who I was. The mods told this narrative to the pre-jury so a bunch of people with no information about it suddenly knew our IDs and joined in on the harrassment because that's what Reck told them.

Thirdly, since we're talking about blaming this on me. I don't make decisions based on IDs. I talk about finding them in confessionals because that's how the games I've spectated have gone. I would go as far as to say talking about who you think the other players are IS NORMAL. Thinking about who you're talking to is part of the game to me. How history repeats itself and how history changes. There is no reason in this game that we should not have worked together and I have no idea why there's a focus on that when I was allied with.. literally everyone. Or when there WAS someone else willing to help me win that wasn't her. If we had allied every single game in our history you might have a point, but we've both voted each other out the round after meeting each other now. So I refuse to take the blame for something that somehow only I am getting wrecked over.

Besides, in a weird twist of fate we literally got to repeat PSV's situation, and I'm sad to say my suggestion that rocks were TOTALLY a good idea fell on deaf ears. :(
I HATE YOU SO MUCH PLEASE GO JUMP INTO A FREEZING LAKE - Mr. Freeze
Plan B: it serves you right if i (hug) you in the face though, right?
I love it when people talk about my brutal murder in front of me, it's actually my secret fetish - Sangmin

xRECKONERx
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Post Post #52  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:34 pm

Nobody said if Bella wins her win is illegitimate to my knowledge, so I think you are making that up.

Bella was fine playing except that she seemingly wanted to take you to the end. Without her using her confessional much she seemed to lack some game awareness w/r/t you specifically. And even Lor said "I will take Ysera to the end even though she'd win"... so it was a little grating seeing people so seemingly unaware or willing to throw their game to you.

Nothing about Karass's play was under fire, other than the notion she'd take the biggest threat in the game to FTC. Granted, we couldn't see everything Karass was doing. Based on what we thought was going on, yup, we thought it looked pretty dumb.

Shadow, on more than one occasion this game you talked about potentially basing your gameplay around who you thought other people were. Also, those ID guesses were hilariously wrong, but let's not act like this issue got dragged up out of thin air.

Did the harassment get taken too far? Uh, yeah. Bella was a deserving winner and this was still one of the closest FTCs I've ever seen. I'm proud of the way the game played out and mostly proud of how all the players played. The toxicity and harassment was taking it too far. It's probably a lot of built up frustration about other shit I know nothing about because I don't live in the Treehouse and thrive on that complex drama bullshit, and it's unfair it was taken out on Bella here and tarnished her win.

I even said on Skype in our discussion afterwards that I thought Bella owned her game well and was another entry in a series of meta-breaking winners. You know how much I love fucking over the meta, right? I voted for Shaco.
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Vijarada
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Post Post #53  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:43 pm

I said some probably mean stuff about Karass, but she totally deserved it. I didn't know anything anyway about what was going on so i wasn't really qualified to make such statements. Sorry if that offended you, you played a great game and won an incredibly close final tribal council.


EDIT: BY "she deserved it" i meant the victory, not the hate. you didn't deserve the hate, you deserved the victory. the original post really makes me look like a bad person :facepalm:
Last edited by Vijarada on Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:50 pm, edited 3 times in total.

McMenno
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Post Post #54  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:44 pm

In post 51, Shadoweh wrote:The mods told this narrative to the pre-jury so a bunch of people with no information about it suddenly knew our IDs and joined in on the harrassment because that's what Reck told them.

I just wanted to say I had no part in this and just wanted to shitpost

xoxo

LORD C'THUN

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Post Post #55  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:00 pm

In post 52, xRECKONERx wrote:Bella was fine playing except that she seemingly wanted to take you to the end. Without her using her confessional much she seemed to lack some game awareness w/r/t you specifically. And even Lor said "I will take Ysera to the end even though she'd win"... so it was a little grating seeing people so seemingly unaware or willing to throw their game to you.

Nothing about Karass's play was under fire, other than the notion she'd take the biggest threat in the game to FTC. Granted, we couldn't see everything Karass was doing. Based on what we thought was going on, yup, we thought it looked pretty dumb.

Direct quote from me: "my biggest problem with karass potentially winning is that she seemed fully willing to go with ysera to the end because "im a [expletive] threat too" even though all signs show she would have lost in a blowout." From all that we could see, I thought Karass planned on taking Ysera to the end, and knowing that she didn't plan on that makes me view her win in a much more positive light.

I accept responsibility for a lot of the toxicity, and a lot of that stems back to issues I've said ever since PSV, where Shadow and xof aligned and made it to F3 together, and Bella voted herself out. It's impossible to prove how someone makes decisions, and it's unfair to ever jump to quick judgments. But I can't help but be concerned when I see quotes like:
"Is Karass seriously Bellaphant?! That can't be right, she doesn't play two games in a row usually.
Maybe she has a twin hot british sister that's PMing me in her voice."
then a few hours later:
"WHY COULDN'T YOU PAIR ME WITH KARASS"
or:
"Oh good we booted Klick so this game can ACTUALLY BE A CHALLENGE THANKS

yesssssssssssssssssss finally a game I enjoy!"
"I was checking other games to see their pony scores and sure enough in RSX Klick got over 100k points.
Get outta here buddy let someone else play!"

It's not even that I'm specifically zeroing in on things you say, Shadow. I also posted in the spectator forum that I had a huge problem with this post from Aronis:
"Also Abathur's identity is Skelda. So as long as I just avoid giving him/her any information I want to remain confidential, things should go great between us."

In the end, I don't think you mean any harm by saying any of that, and in general I'm against casting people together who would be able to ID each other easily (for example, I would never cast Ceph/STD together after Eon and that's because I know it's impossible for them not to figure out who the other one is). It isn't just something I'm focusing on you for doing, Shadow, and I think you're still a great player. It's unfortunate that all of this has built up in such a way, but it has to be addressed at some point.
"CC is very [whatever the equivalent of photogenic as it applies to videos]" - racefan12
"CC is an objectively attractive person." - Crazy
"You look like a happy version of Trent Reznor." - LicketyQuickety
"Do you practice sounding like you're high all the time?" - xofelf

D3f3nd3r
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Post Post #56  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:12 pm

As time goes on people will be able to ID others better, and I'm sure trends will eventually form that people try to work around (stuff like how I have a tendency to blindside Radja). But what can you do? You can't avoid casting each and every one of those combinations. Mods can only do so much. I mean, mods can try to keep players from meeting early in the game through how tribes are formed, but that only does so much in a world where half of tribes are picked by the players.
Back to school, back to indefinite semi-V/LA. I should still be reachable through normal means though.

CuddlyCaucasian
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Post Post #57  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:16 pm

For me, the only thing that needs to be countered for sure is relationships where someone ALWAYS IDs the other without fail. Every game Shadow and Bella have been in after PSV, Shadow has correctly identified Bella pretty quickly, and that's something that can't really be disputed.
"CC is very [whatever the equivalent of photogenic as it applies to videos]" - racefan12
"CC is an objectively attractive person." - Crazy
"You look like a happy version of Trent Reznor." - LicketyQuickety
"Do you practice sounding like you're high all the time?" - xofelf

xRECKONERx
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Post Post #58  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:17 pm

what about everybody in the world IDing drench immediately
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D3f3nd3r
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Post Post #59  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:19 pm

I've literally only ID'd Drench once in...uh...three games where we interacted a decent amount?

But holy shit he was SO obvious in Nexus.
Back to school, back to indefinite semi-V/LA. I should still be reachable through normal means though.

xRECKONERx
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Post Post #60  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:22 pm

idk every game ive seen drench in he's like "so politics elections voting systems staple this to my ass???"
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D3f3nd3r
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Post Post #61  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:25 pm

Wait no I did ID him in Eon.

I ID'd him in GoT off his use of the word "noo" and in Eon because the RL issues he shared with me there timed really similarly to the RL issues that he had been sharing with me as a player in BOTB.
Back to school, back to indefinite semi-V/LA. I should still be reachable through normal means though.

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Post Post #62  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:27 pm

I have no idea what should be done about that, you just gotta throw ideas out there. It's not like this is some new concept though, Flameaxe and peg weren't cast together dating all the way back to Season Finale for this very reason.
"CC is very [whatever the equivalent of photogenic as it applies to videos]" - racefan12
"CC is an objectively attractive person." - Crazy
"You look like a happy version of Trent Reznor." - LicketyQuickety
"Do you practice sounding like you're high all the time?" - xofelf

Flameaxe
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Post Post #63  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:27 pm

(for example, I would never cast Ceph/STD together after Eon and that's because I know it's impossible for them not to figure out who the other one is)


I got cut from Season Finale specifically because they didn't want to cast me and PEG together. I didn't take it personally because it made sense. I doubt Ceph/Fen view it any differently. It shouldn't be viewed as a targeted slight because it probably isn't.

EDIT: FUCK YOU CC
Defined by who I dislike, not who I like~

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Post Post #64  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:28 pm

#NotMyJanitor
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D3f3nd3r
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Post Post #65  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:28 pm

Exactly, I don't know what can be done about it save for keeping people apart until merge (which doesn't exactly work well with the evolutions to the game that I mentioned), not casting pairs, and NEW CREATIVE THINGS. Somebody needs to think of the NEW CREATIVE THINGS!
Back to school, back to indefinite semi-V/LA. I should still be reachable through normal means though.

CuddlyCaucasian
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Post Post #66  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:31 pm

Twist: you get one guess at everyone's identities, and if 5 people get the same person's identity, that person gets eliminated :O :O :O :O :O
"CC is very [whatever the equivalent of photogenic as it applies to videos]" - racefan12
"CC is an objectively attractive person." - Crazy
"You look like a happy version of Trent Reznor." - LicketyQuickety
"Do you practice sounding like you're high all the time?" - xofelf

CuddlyCaucasian
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Post Post #67  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:31 pm

#jokes
"CC is very [whatever the equivalent of photogenic as it applies to videos]" - racefan12
"CC is an objectively attractive person." - Crazy
"You look like a happy version of Trent Reznor." - LicketyQuickety
"Do you practice sounding like you're high all the time?" - xofelf

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Post Post #68  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:48 pm

There's people I feel confident I can ID in like 5 posts at this point

Idk how I could have that not have an impact on my play, I ID some ppl before we have even moved past small talk based on tone

I don't think mods would know that bc I'm not like rl friends with them/dating them?

Should ppl be reporting this to mods when signing up for a game so they can keep it in mind with casting

Haha I just want to check out this rabbit hole, looks fun
SlappyKrust

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Post Post #69  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 8:53 pm

For what it's worth, the application for Ned's Declassified had a section for people to list anyone they can habitually ID easily or people that routinely ID them
"CC is very [whatever the equivalent of photogenic as it applies to videos]" - racefan12
"CC is an objectively attractive person." - Crazy
"You look like a happy version of Trent Reznor." - LicketyQuickety
"Do you practice sounding like you're high all the time?" - xofelf

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Post Post #70  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:00 pm

I'm just here to rail against people making ID guesses in their confessional like I've been doing 5ever
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Post Post #71  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:01 pm

Also some people are just laughably IDable (xof, me, hiplop, broseidon -- I don't think just to me?) ((Also I know part if it with me is the med school thing but I also lied about my background in LoL and still got IDd by legit everyone in the game))

I know it's not something that can be completely fixed but idk it just feels like if this is going to be more strictly dealt with in the future it's useful to talk about stuff like this. Obvi just because someone is generally distinct in tone doesn't mean they should be blacklisted. Should they lie about their tone, that sucks
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Shadoweh
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Post Post #72  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:03 pm

Asking to be paired with Karass was a joke, I was pretty clear I wanted literally anyone but Winston. :P I'm self-aware of this stuff too.
Knowing it was Klick didn't have anything to do with knowing he was good at challenges... there was a survey about this question, it was near-unanimous.
It had a lot more to do with him getting 200 on Flappy Bird because jesus fuck. I'm more surprised no one commented it was the first time I've betrayed Klick.

Like Def said, there's so many people that can id each other at this point.. see: the entire LoL jury. You notice me because I always post my thoughts. Bella and Radja specifically have the problem of being id'd off of timezones, they can't just log in at 5am so it's a matter of time. Anonymous games give plausible deniability and the ability to make terribly wrong id guesses so that IDs aren't the starting point for relationships. At least that's how it seems to me.

Honestly, if this conversation had started at not casting us together that often (Bella hasn't actually been in a game I'm not in) I would understand.
I HATE YOU SO MUCH PLEASE GO JUMP INTO A FREEZING LAKE - Mr. Freeze
Plan B: it serves you right if i (hug) you in the face though, right?
I love it when people talk about my brutal murder in front of me, it's actually my secret fetish - Sangmin

Shadoweh
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Post Post #73  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:09 pm

In post 66, CuddlyCaucasian wrote:Twist: you get one guess at everyone's identities, and if 5 people get the same person's identity, that person gets eliminated :O :O :O :O :O

Behind the Masks was a great game though
I HATE YOU SO MUCH PLEASE GO JUMP INTO A FREEZING LAKE - Mr. Freeze
Plan B: it serves you right if i (hug) you in the face though, right?
I love it when people talk about my brutal murder in front of me, it's actually my secret fetish - Sangmin

D3f3nd3r
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Post Post #74  (ISO)  » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:13 pm

In post 72, Shadoweh wrote:see: the entire LoL jury


Four to five people there were essentially stating their usernames.
Back to school, back to indefinite semi-V/LA. I should still be reachable through normal means though.

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