XnadrojX's Mini Normal Review the Second


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Post Post #50 (ISO) » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:28 am

Post by mykonian »

I want the RB to go. I feel it's taking a sledgehammer to not such a solid town.

Like as a compromise, bc we should move there someday, you could make it a limited shot information role, but I really think you should get out of the towns power's way and actually let them do their work somewhat unobstructed to end up with a fair game. If it were a full cop and a full tracker her in stead, or if there were a protective role in the mix, I could see the lure of a full scum roleblocker. Here I think it's way too generous.
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Post Post #51 (ISO) » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:33 am

Post by mhsmith0 »

In post 50, mykonian wrote:I want the RB to go. I feel it's taking a sledgehammer to not such a solid town.
No.

3-Shot Gunsmith
Odd-Night Cop
2-Shot Tracker
Miller Doublevoter
VT x 6


Mafia Ascetic
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon

is something that I would EXPLICITLY reject as unbalanced (town has three claimable roles that are very unlikely to get mislynched, a 4th [tracker] that adds a bit, and on top of that the GS/cop can both get N1 investigative results if scum take a poor N1 shot). If you and mastina prefer that setup, then please find a third reviewer. I'm sorry for possibly being a jerk about it, but I simply don't agree that such a setup is at all fair to the scum team.

I'd MAYBE think about it being ok to cut the tracker entirely and do

3-Shot Gunsmith
Odd-Night Cop
Miller Doublevoter
VT x 7


Mafia Ascetic
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon

I'd intuitively be a bit uncomfortable with it, but scum at least does have the ascetic to potentially make people think there's a roleblocker of sorts, which is at least something that might help, so I'd at least be willing to discuss that.

Would be fairly swingy with town power strongly in two slots' hands, but I think that's probably ok given how strong GS/cop can be.
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BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
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SR: I want to give him a day
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Post Post #52 (ISO) » Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:26 am

Post by mastina »

In post 51, mhsmith0 wrote:3-Shot Gunsmith
Odd-Night Cop
Miller Doublevoter
VT x 7

Mafia Ascetic
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
I'd actually be okay with this setup.

The town has three very strong roles. The gunsmith is three-shot, but realistically you're not going to get much more than that in a mini anyway so it's pretty strong. The cop is odd-night, which realistically is probably only two investigations. In spite of that, having two VERY strong investigation roles helps the town a lot. The ascetic gives the scum some defense against the roles, and then the scum also have their nightkill, which in this setup is disproportionately powerful thanks to a lack of roles to stop them from killing the PRs. This is not a bad thing! (The only bad thing is if the ascetic chooses to publicly claim when the miller also does so, but even there with a cop/gunsmith combo the town may assume both are town negative utilities.)

I would admit the setup is still
slightly
swingy, because if the town loses one/two/all of their PRs early they're in for a very rough ride, and if they don't lose their PRs then the scum are going to face some rather nasty POE, but I don't think the swing can ever be eliminated and this level of swing is definitely acceptable to me. I genuinely think that this proposed setup has around 50-50 odds for each side.
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Post Post #53 (ISO) » Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:31 am

Post by mhsmith0 »

I'll research strong investigative vs basically nothing setups historically but it makes me VERY uncomfortable.
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Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
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Post Post #54 (ISO) » Tue Mar 21, 2017 4:32 pm

Post by mykonian »

shrug, go ahead then.
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Post Post #55 (ISO) » Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:53 am

Post by Nexus »

hello?
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Post Post #56 (ISO) » Wed Mar 29, 2017 2:55 am

Post by XnadrojX »

Bump?
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Post Post #57 (ISO) » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:50 am

Post by mastina »

is my latest thoughts and still applies for me.
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Post Post #58 (ISO) » Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:04 am

Post by XnadrojX »

Currently only waiting on smith and mykonian to decide whether the rb is necessary or not
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Post Post #59 (ISO) » Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:13 am

Post by mhsmith0 »

I think I'd compromise on

3-Shot Gunsmith
Odd-Night Cop
Miller Doublevoter
VT x 7

Mafia Roleblocker
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon

MAYBE even nerf to odd-night roleblocker to match the cop. But ascetic alone gives the scum too little night power against what town has (and ascetic is even swingier than roleblocker and involves way more luck and way less actual good play wrt night actions). Personally I think we're giving town too much help even with that, but towns have a losing record in games I've reviewed and I don't mind biasing a bit in the pro-town direction in case my radar is a bit off.
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Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
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Post Post #60 (ISO) » Thu Mar 30, 2017 10:53 am

Post by mastina »

Full roleblocker against only two investigatives is a definitive no-go for me. The scum have a nightkill with absolutely nothing stopping them from utilizing it. Give them a roleblocker and they are capable of entirely shutting down the town's power outside of the miller double-voter on night one. Night one, the scum can turn the game into basically mountainous. That would not be okay with me. I don't think an odd-night restriction to gate the roleblocker would be much better, either. Maybe X-shot roleblocker, with X being either 1 or maybe (MAYBE) 2.

The game has three, I repeat, THREE town roles. No method of stopping a nightkill. And we all know just how notoriously scumsided mountainous games are. The town NEEDS those roles. Scum can have
some
defense against them. But they don't need much.
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Post Post #61 (ISO) » Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:10 pm

Post by mhsmith0 »

I think scum mainly needs protection against a night one town steamroll (two investigations, and a bad scum shot). Maybe just a one shot Roleblocker and daytalk to go along with the ascetic? I feel like that's going pretty townsided (each town PR is actively useful and clearing as opposed to trash like a one shot rolecop, a fruit vendor, etc etc etc) but I GUESS I can live w that as a compromise.
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Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
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Post Post #62 (ISO) » Thu Mar 30, 2017 10:33 pm

Post by mastina »

Giving them a 1x roleblocker and the ascetic is still giving them too much immunity. One or the other is what I would say.
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Post Post #63 (ISO) » Fri Mar 31, 2017 3:36 am

Post by mhsmith0 »

Ascetic is nearly useless, and is basically a RNG element added to the game (unless scum claim it which actually bizarrely happens). I can live with a two shot Roleblocker and day talk and no ascetic I guess.
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Conq: you, sir, are great at being town.
BATMAN: Only jugg was the only one we didn’t scum read at least not me
Quick: There is little to no chance this slot is Power-Wolfing.
SR: I want to give him a day
Life is simply unfair, don't you think?
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Post Post #64 (ISO) » Mon Apr 03, 2017 9:53 pm

Post by XnadrojX »

Mykonian?
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Transcend: lol that actually sounds funny

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Post Post #65 (ISO) » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:16 pm

Post by XnadrojX »

It appears that my reviewer is dead
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Transcend: lol that actually sounds funny

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Post Post #66 (ISO) » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:16 pm

Post by XnadrojX »

It appears that my reviewer is dead
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Transcend: lol that actually sounds funny

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Post Post #67 (ISO) » Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:16 pm

Post by XnadrojX »

Oops double posted soz
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Transcend: lol that actually sounds funny

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Post Post #68 (ISO) » Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:39 pm

Post by mykonian »

In post 63, mhsmith0 wrote:Ascetic is nearly useless, and is basically a RNG element added to the game (unless scum claim it which actually bizarrely happens). I can live with a two shot Roleblocker and day talk and no ascetic I guess.
If this is the route you'd go with, I could live with that.
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Post Post #69 (ISO) » Wed Apr 05, 2017 11:56 pm

Post by mykonian »

I think we'll need roles then!

Rather awkwardly I won't be here in the coming week and a half. I hope you can do with just 2 reviewers actually signing off on the setup. I think the more heavy lifting has been done for this game now...
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Post Post #70 (ISO) » Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:30 am

Post by mastina »

Yeah, need roles reposted and then we can sign off.
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Post Post #71 (ISO) » Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:48 pm

Post by XnadrojX »

3-Shot Gunsmith
Odd-Night Cop
Miller Doublevoter
VT x 7

Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon


Was the agreed on setup?
It certainly doesn't look boring to host.
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Transcend: lol that actually sounds funny

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Post Post #72 (ISO) » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:07 pm

Post by mastina »

That was the consensus, yes. Post rules, post roles, and you're basically good to go for me.
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Post Post #73 (ISO) » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:35 pm

Post by XnadrojX »

Roles:

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Odd-Night Cop
Miller Doublevoter
VT x 7

Mafia 2-Shot Roleblocker
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon



Rules:

The All Important Rules

General:
1. All site-wide rules apply here.
2. You may not quote your Role PM or any other moderator provided information directly, paraphrasing or copy/pasting is OK so long there is NO QUOTE
3. All votes must be in the format "VOTE: Nexus" and all requests to the moderator must be in the format "@MOD: (request)". These may NOT be hidden in any way.
4. Although this is a game about being an asshole, please be asshole to a certain extent. Do not go too far with your words or I may warn you or even replace you without notice. If you are unsure of what is OK, please PM me first (I'm generally quite tolerant).
5. Please inform of any mistakes I make
6. Do NOT use any form of sneaky tactics including but not limited to encrypted text, hidden messages, hard to see colours and small text
7. Do not attempt to game the system or pretend to break the rules in any way. If you do, sufficient punishment will be dealt.
8. I reserve the right to edit, add, or remove the rules to fix any loopholes.

Game Related:
1. My life sucks so I occasionally may not be able to provide a votecount. if this happens, I am incredibly sorry.
2. Days last 14 days, Night 48 hours, extensions may be granted on a case-by-case basis (e.g site crash, other major issue)
3. If you do not post within 48 hours, I will prod you.
4. If you are prodded, respond within 48 hours or I will replace you.
5. If i find a replacement at Night, the night will be extended by 24 hours to accomadate the new replacement.
6. You may make a "BAH!" post ONLY IF: You were not present during the twilight, and your post may only contain the letters "b", "a", and "h" along with an optional "!"
7. If you will be unable to be active in thread for over 48 hours, please make a V/LA post in bold. As long as the time is reasonable, you will be exempt from prods.
8. If someone receives 3 prods, I will forcefully replace them.
9. I reserve the right to edit, add, or remove these rules as well.

Sample PM:
Welcome to Mini Normal _____, you are a Vanilla Townie
You have a power in your voice, and since you live in a democracy, you have power in your vote.
You win when all threats to your faction are eliminated, who are defined as having this win condtion.
Please confirm to me by replying with your role name (Vanilla) and faction (Town).
The game thread is here

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Transcend: lol that actually sounds funny

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Post Post #74 (ISO) » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:49 am

Post by XnadrojX »

Bump?
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Transcend: lol that actually sounds funny

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