iDanyBoy's Mini Normal Review

[Nexus]

1. Yes, I'll be ready to run the game as soon as it's approved.
   
2. This is a 13-player game.
   
3. Open
   10

   Town

   : 3

   Mafia
   
   
4. I have no backup or co-mod.
   
5. I have no previous modding experience

Mafia

– 1x Shot Bulletproof Traitor, 1x Roleblocker 1x Rolestopper

Mafia

– Backup

Mafia

– 1x Shot Strong Neighborizer, 1x Shot RoleCop, 1 Shot Cop

Town

– 2xShot Vigilante

Town

– Gunsmith

Town

– Ascetic

Town

– 1x Shot Jailkeeper, 1xBodyguard,1xShot Doc

Town

– Vanilla(6)

Mini Normal:X

Welcome to Mini Normal:X

This game is moderated by iDanyboy
This game was reviewed by 1 and 2

Complete Playerlist

• Player 1
  
• Player 2
  
• Player 3
  
• Player 4
  
• Player 5
  
• Player 6
  
• Player 7
  
• Player 8
  
• Player 9
  
• Player 10
  
• Player 11
  
• Player 12
  
• Player 13
  
  *
  = prodded,
  replaced

Alive

Spoiler:

• Players Alive

Dead

Spoiler:

• Players Dead

Important Events

Spoiler:

• Day 1:

Votecounts

Spoiler:

• Day 1:
  VC1.1

Spoiler: Post 1 Rules

RULES

(taken from

Fro99er

who took them from

GuyInFreezer

and modified for this game)

General Rules:

1. This game was reviewed for normalcy and balance by mastina and mhsmith0.
   
   
2. Site-wide rules always apply here.
   
3. If you have a question for me, you can always PM me. If you need to talk to me in thread,
   please bold your question like this so I can see it
   
   
4. You may not use hidden or encrypted text. I decide if the text is small enough to be count as hidden text.
   
5. If you have a power to edit/delete your post, don't do it. If you scumslip, just accept it and eat rope.*
   
6. Play nice. Insulting players with using any form of racial/sexual slur or any kind of derogatory languages or excessive harassing in any way will result in immediate force-replacement.*
   
7. There will be strict adherence to the site policy about prohibiting discussion of ongoing games, which can be found here*
   
8. This means do not discuss other ongoing games in this thread AND do not discuss this game elsewhere.
   
9. Do not quote the PM that moderator sends you. Paraphrasing is fine until a certain level.
   If you're not sure about it, you're always welcome to ask me first before you post.
   *
   
10. Do not use provable randomization in this game. Saying that you rolled a dice is fine, using dice tag is not.
    
11. This is my color (#000080). Don't use it or colors closely resembling it.
    
    
12. If I find the certain factors/actions damaging the state of the game, I will intervene and/or take action.
    
13. Keep the personal complaint, whatever they may be, outside of the wrong VC/information, private by PMing me.
    
14. If you break these rules, I have full rights to punish you at my will. This can range from simple warning to modkill/force-replace.
    
15. I will always consult a list-mod before performing any modkill.
    
16. VIOLATING THE RULES WITH A STAR (*) WILL CAUSE AN IMMEDIATE FORCE-REPLACE NO MATTER THE CIRCUMSTANCES!
    
    
17. If I feel like it, I always have a full right to add/modify the rules. If I do, I will fully explain the reason behind such action.
    
18. Flavor has absolutely zero bearing on the game. It is just for fun.
    
19. Most importantly, have fun!

Voting and Lynching:

1. You vote by either using the vote tag VOTE: iDanyboy
   
2. Unvote is not required to change your vote. Also, if it looks like a vote for someone, I will count it. No tricking me!
   
3. A player is lynched when the majority of living players -- half players alive plus one rounded down -- vote for the same player
   
4. Once the player is lynched, the lynchee and the living players may talk until I get back and post the flip.
   
5. If the deadline is reached before the lynch has reached, the day will end with
   No Lynch
   .
   
6. If you're killed, you may not post a "bah" post.

Activity and Deadline:

1. Deadline for each day phase is:
   14 days
   .
   
2. Deadline for each night phase is:
   2 days
   .
   
3. If you're on V/LA, please tell me beforehand by either posting it in thread (bolded) or PM to me. Any V/LA that lasts longer than 120 hours (=5 RL days) will be a force replace.
   
4. If you don't post here for
   48 real hours
   , I will prod you. Failure to receive prod within
   24 hours
   will cause force-replacement.
   
5. Three prods overall will equate to a force replace.
   
6. If you do not submit an action before the night ends, it will count as
   No Action
   .
   
7. There will be
   deadline extensions
   given in this game only upon the moderators discretion.

Spoiler: Post 2 Set-Up

Game Information:

• This game features 10
  Town
  aligned players and 3
  Mafia
  aligned players.
  
• Daychat is disabled by default.
  
• Scum may use any abilities they have along with their factional abilities on the same night.
  
• Game will begin when 11/13 have confirmed their roles.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Vanilla Townie
  .
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess no special abilities other than your vote and your voice.
  Win condition:
  
  You are aligned with the
  Town
  and win when all threats to the
  Town
  have been eliminated and at least one
  Town
  -aligned player is alive.

Spoiler: Town PM's

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Vanilla Townie
  .
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess no special abilities other than your vote and your voice.
  Win condition:
  
  You are aligned with the
  Town
  and win when all threats to the
  Town
  have been eliminated and at least one
  Town
  -aligned player is alive.

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Town Gunsmith
  .
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night you can target a player. You will receive the result "Playername has a gun", "Playername does not have a gun", or "No result".
  Win condition:
  
  You are aligned with the
  Town
  and win when all threats to the
  Town
  have been eliminated and at least one
  Town
  -aligned player is alive.

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Town 2-Shot Vigilante
  .
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night you can target a player. Should your action succeed, that player will be killed.
  Win condition:
  
  You are aligned with the
  Town
  and win when all threats to the
  Town
  have been eliminated and at least one
  Town
  -aligned player is alive.

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Town Ascetic
  .
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • Any non-killing actions targeting you will fail.
  Win condition:
  
  You are aligned with the
  Town
  and win when all threats to the
  Town
  have been eliminated and at least one
  Town
  -aligned player is alive.

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Town JOAT (Doctor/Jailkeeper/Bodyguard)
  .
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night you can use one of your three powers. Each is one-shot.
    • Doctor
      : During the night you can target a player. If successful they will be protected from a nightkill that night.
      
    • Jailkeeper
      : During the night you can target a player. If successful they will be protected from a nightkill that night. Any night action that player takes will fail.
      
    • Bodyguard
      : During the night you can target a player. If they were to die, you will die in their place.
  Win condition:
  
  You are aligned with the
  Town
  and win when all threats to the
  Town
  have been eliminated and at least one
  Town
  -aligned player is alive.

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Spoiler: Mafia PM's

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Mafia JOAT (Strong Neighborizer/Cop/Rolecop)
  .
  Your partners are X(
  Roleblocker
  ) and
  REDACTED
  (
  Traitor
  )
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night you can talk in this private topic.
    
  • During the night you can select a player to kill. You must specify who is performing the kill.
    
  • During the night you can use one of your three powers. Each is one-shot.
    • During the night you can target a player. You will then be able to talk with that player in this private topic.
      
    • During the night you can target a player. You will receive the result "Playername is
      Town
      ", "Playername is
      Mafia
      ", or "No result".
      
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful you will receive there role name
  Win condition:
  
  You win if at least one member of your group is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Mafia Backup
  .
  Your partners are X(
  Goon
  ) and
  REDACTED
  (
  Traitor
  )
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night you can talk in this private topic.
    
  • During the night you can select a player to kill. You must specify who is performing the kill.
    
  • If one of your partners dies you will receive their remaining abilities.
  Win condition:
  
  You win if at least one member of your group is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Mafia Bulletproof Traitor and JOAT (Roleblocker/Rolestopper)
  .
  Your partners are X(
  JOAT
  ) and Y(
  Backup
  )
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night if you are the target of a kill you will survive.
    
  • During the night you can use one of your two powers. Each is one-shot.
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful any night action that player takes will fail.
      
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful any night actions targeting the player will fail
  Win condition:
  
  You win if at least one member of your group is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

[iDanyboy]

• Open
  10

  Town

  : 3

  Mafia

I meant the ratio is known not the roles.

[Antihero]

traitor needs to lose if main groupscum die

what's a strong neighborizer?

[iDanyboy]

Yes.
Means he can't be roleblocked.

[iDanyboy]

Traitor also comes up as 'Playername does not have a gun' if targeted by the gunsmith.

[Cheetory6]

Is rolecop going to get back "1x Shot Jailkeeper, 1x Bodyguard, 1x Doc" or "Jack of all Trades" as a result?
Will strong neighborizer go through ascetic?
Does the Backup only apply to scum roles or to all roles? Do the x-shots get refunded to the Backup if they were previously used?

Offhand it looks like scum has a lot of power, not sure if the traitor does enough to offset that.

[iDanyboy]

His going to get the title in the PM's so JOAT (Doctor/Jailkeeper/Bodyguard) or Mafia Bulletproof Traitor and JOAT (Roleblocker/Rolestopper). Btw the mafia traitor is only oneshot so I've adjusted the pm to reflect this

Spoiler: PM

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Mafia Bulletproof Traitor and JOAT (Roleblocker/Rolestopper)
  .
  Your partners are X(
  JOAT
  ) and Y(
  Backup
  )
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night if you are the target of a kill you will survive.
    This ability can only be used once.
    
    
  • During the night you can use one of your two powers. Each is one-shot.
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful any night action that player takes will fail.
      
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful any night actions targeting the player will fail
  Win condition:
  
  You win if at least one member of your group is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

No, I'm thinking of getting rid of the strong part as I don't know how to word it so the player will know how it works. I'm only using strong because I don't wan't him to get jailkept but the way I worded the PM's it isn't clear to the player how it should resolve. I don't think the traitor would block his on teammates and I don't think he would rolestop anyone but his team mates so the only problem is the Jailkeeper. I could change 1xjailkeeper to 1xroleblocker.

Backup only applies to scum and he doesn't get refunded any shots used.

[Cheetory6]

Wording on Backup is off on what partner is, currently says Goon.

[Antihero]

mod test

mafia backup turned roleblocker/rolestopper rolestops himself AND does the kill while protective joat jails them

what happens?

[iDanyboy]

You can't target yourself.

[iDanyboy]

Spoiler: Traitor

Getting rid of strong

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Mafia JOAT (Neighborizer/Cop/Rolecop)
  .
  Your partners are X(
  Backup
  ) and
  REDACTED
  (
  Traitor
  )
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night you can talk in this private topic.
    
  • During the night you can select a player to kill. You must specify who is performing the kill.
    
  • During the night you can use one of your three powers. Each is one-shot.
    • During the night you can target a player. If successfull you will then be able to talk with that player in this private topic.
      
    • During the night you can target a player. You will receive the result "Playername is
      Town
      ", "Playername is
      Mafia
      ", or "No result".
      
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful you will receive there role name.
  Win condition:
  
  You win if at least one member of your group is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Spoiler: Fixing errors in other Mafia PM's

Fixing partners role

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Mafia Backup
  .
  Your partners are X(
  JOAT (Neighborizer/Cop/Rolecop)
  ) and
  REDACTED
  (
  Traitor
  )
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night you can talk in this private topic.
    
  • During the night you can select a player to kill. You must specify who is performing the kill.
    
  • If one of your partners dies you will receive their remaining abilities.
  Win condition:
  
  You win if at least one member of your group is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

Fixed partners role and win condition is more clear.

Player Name

• Welcome to Mini Normal X, Player name
  
  You are a
  Mafia Bulletproof Traitor and JOAT (Roleblocker/Rolestopper)
  .
  Your partners are X(
  JOAT (Neighborizer/Cop/Rolecop)
  ) and Y(
  Backup
  )
  
  
  Abilities:
  • You possess your vote and your voice.
    
  • During the night if you are the target of a kill you will survive. This ability can only be used once.
    
  • During the night you can use one of your two powers. Each is one-shot.
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful any night action that player takes will fail.
      
    • During the night you can target a player. If successful any night actions targeting the player will fail
  Win condition:
  
  You win if at least one member of your group(not including you) is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same). You lose if your partners die and you are the last remaining member.

Please confirm by replying to this PM with your alignment and role.

The game thread is here.

If the Jailkeeper and rolestopper target the same user, am I correct in saying that using NAR they would cancel eachother out? if not Rolestopper would have priority.

[TellTaleHeart]

Hi there! ^_^/~
It's nice to meet you, iDanyBoy. I'm TTH! I'll try to help you make this setup as balanced as it can be while staying in the bounds of normalcy.

The setup certainly looks normal to me. These are all explicitly normal roles and modifiers so I think we're good there. :3

My initial assessment on balance is that this is a moderately scumsided game. Scum have quite bit of firepower: they have the rolecop to find town specials, they have the bulletproof to counter the vig, they have access to roleblocking abilities (which are shown to drastically boost scum's chances of winning),

and

all these powers are ensured to persist through the backup. On the town side, there's three decent specials and a negative utility.
A good rule of thumb for 10:3 games is three decent town specials against an all goon team. Considering the fragmented team, I think keeping 1 scum power and losing the ascetic would make this close to balanced.

[iDanyboy]

I don't mind getting rid of the rolestopper/blocker, I only added it because I taught scum were to weak. I think the bulletproof should stay thought because the traitor could get shot by scum or the vig. I want to keep the backup though because I want to see how the scum use there Neighborizer and don't want scum to lose it day 1 so I could make it the back up specific to the scum JOAT. Got rid of the Ascetic and replaced it with a VT as per your recomendation. Made 'Strong Neighborizer' to a 'Neighborizer'.

Mafia

– 1x Shot Bulletproof Traitor

Mafia

– Backup(1x Shot Strong Neighborizer, 1x Shot RoleCop, 1 Shot Cop)

Mafia

– 1x Shot Neighborizer, 1x Shot RoleCop, 1 Shot Cop

Town

– 2xShot Vigilante

Town

– Gunsmith

Town

– 1x Shot Jailkeeper, 1xBodyguard,1xShot Doc

Town

– Vanilla(7)

[Cheetory6]

It's probably still a little scumsided as it is.
Scum doesn't need a way to gate all of town's power and even with the traitor being unable to win on its own/the inability for scum to coordinate, the scumteam has a decent amount of power.
I'm kind of feeling like the roles for town as they stand would be breaking even against an all goon scumteam.
Would it maybe make sense to scrap the backup, make one a cop and the other a neighborizer that can only neighborize a maximum of one player at a time?

[Cheetory6]

Or maybe even an x-shot cop?
I feel like the rolecop is where I'm a little iffy.

[iDanyboy]

They are both 1-shot already, I could switch the Backup to a Neighborizer.

Mafia

– 1x Shot Neighborizer

Mafia

– 1x Shot RoleCop, 1 Shot Cop

Scum doesn't need a way to gate all of town's power.

I don't understand what you mean by this.

I'm kind of feeling like the roles for town as they stand would be breaking even against an all goon scumteam.

I would rather add town power then get rid of the cops unless you don't think it can be balanced, maybe a town tracker or watcher..

[iDanyboy]

Could also change the rolecop to a Neapolitan.

[Cheetory6]

Like, scum doesn't need a way to deal with all of town's power for the game to be balanced.
If you're giving scum little ways to fight everything town has to offer you're probably overcompensating in scum's favour.

[iDanyboy]

I'm using the rolecop so scum could try and find the traitor and would still be helpful even if they missed the traitor, but the cop is only useful if they hit the traitor otherwise its useless. I got rid of the bulletproof to weaken scum and added a Watcher for town to try and balance out the scum JOAT.

Mafia

– Traitor

Mafia

– 1x Shot Neighborizer

Mafia

– 1x Shot RoleCop, 1x Shot Cop

Town

– 2xShot Vigilante

Town

– Gunsmith

Town

– Wathcer

Town

– 1x Shot Jailkeeper, 1xBodyguard,1xShot Doc

Town

– Vanilla(6)

[TellTaleHeart]

I think you went too far the other way. Watcher is an extremely potent role.
If you kept one of the watcher or the gunsmith, I think it'd be close enough to balanced that I'd pass it.

[iDanyboy]

Mafia

– Traitor

Mafia

– 1x Shot Neighborizer

Mafia

– 1x Shot RoleCop, 1x Shot Cop

Town

– 2xShot Vigilante

Town

– Gunsmith

Town

– 1x Shot Jailkeeper, 1xBodyguard,1xShot Doc

Town

– Vanilla(7)

[Cheetory6]

Will spend a bit of time thinking about how the roles can play off each other in general but I think that's looking good overall so far.

[Antihero]

yeah i agree w getting rid of the backup, there also would've been a question of what happened if both buddies died same night (theoretically possible)

plus backup getting blocking powers would've op'ed scum

current iteration looks pretty ok i guess? honestly traitor's a little tough to balance but i don't see any glaring weaknesses

[iDanyboy]

• Open
  10

  Town

  : 3

  Mafia

Looking at the setup if the mafia cop dies night 1 then the town could find out that the scum team has a traitor, if I don't let the ratio known then it's possible that the Vig is a SK.

[Cheetory6]

You could confirm that the game only has a single scum faction?