In post 47, RadiantCowbells wrote:ok
me and nsg were going over changes to the setup on sitechat
how would you feel about
JOAT (Vigilante, Neapolitan)
1-Shot Bulletproof Miller
Doctor
Rolecop
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
1-Shot Strongman
Encryptor
Goon
A 13-player pre-designed Performer setup
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implosion he/himPolymathhe/him
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A 13-player pre-designed Performer setup
w/ special guest rc
Last edited by implosion on Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:36 pm, edited 3 times in total.-
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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Performer Mafia Scum
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I wanted to go a bit crazy with this one....so here goes.
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Mafia 1-shot Bulletproof Follower (has 1s bp)
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia 1-shot Strongman & 1-shot Rolecop
vs
Ascetic Odd-night Cop
N2 Cop
1-shot Bulletproof Doctor: has 1s bp, unlimited protection
Informed Miller 1-shot Vigilante: you are informed that the mafia team has 3 members & they may or may not have someone with bulletproof ability.
1-shot Neighborizer
6th pr??
4 Vanilla Townies
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pedit:I’m an informed Miller who knows there isn’t any Loyal modifiers and there is a total of 4 scum.-Morality
I'm easily the best person in the game at mechanics. I don't presume to be the best at anything else.-Jingle
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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implosion he/himPolymath
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Performer Mafia Scum
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How about this:
Mafia Follower
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia Rolecop
vs
Ascetic Odd-night Cop
N2 Cop
1-shot Bulletproof Doctor
Informed Miller: you are informed there is someone with bulletproof ability
Tracker
Backup Tracker (or can be VT...not sure if 6th pr is needed in this setup)
4 Vanilla TowniesI’m an informed Miller who knows there isn’t any Loyal modifiers and there is a total of 4 scum.-Morality
I'm easily the best person in the game at mechanics. I don't presume to be the best at anything else.-Jingle
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Performer Mafia Scum
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Intents of the setup:
-Day play focus
-In terms of the scum rolecop, 2 town cops, town 1-shot bp, informed miller - cause some intense wifom
-Ascetic, miller, and night-specific modifier (n2) - to balance the 2 investigatives & doctor with some negative utilityI’m an informed Miller who knows there isn’t any Loyal modifiers and there is a total of 4 scum.-Morality
I'm easily the best person in the game at mechanics. I don't presume to be the best at anything else.-Jingle
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Performer Mafia Scum
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other ideas for changes:In post 5, Performer wrote:How about this:
Mafia Follower
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia Rolecop
vs
Ascetic Odd-night Cop
N2 Cop
1-shot Bulletproof Doctor
Informed Miller: you are informed there is someone with bulletproof ability
Tracker
Backup Tracker (or can be VT...not sure if 6th pr is needed in this setup)
4 Vanilla Townies
-Only replace Mafia Follower with Mafia Bulletproof Enabler
-Only replace the 2 cops above with Odd-night Cop & Even-night Cop
-A combination of both of those ideas
-None of the above ideas for, but other changes?I’m an informed Miller who knows there isn’t any Loyal modifiers and there is a total of 4 scum.-Morality
I'm easily the best person in the game at mechanics. I don't presume to be the best at anything else.-Jingle
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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northsidegal Survivor
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1-shot BP Doctor is really powerful. Mafia's power comes from high PR-finding ability, although I expect a lot of claims on D1 anyways given that the majority of town isn't vanilla.
Millers tend to be written off as town anyways in practice (i believe) but in this scenario I could see the miller getting suspicion, especially if claiming the informed part. I'm waiting for the day that someone makes scum informed one way or another that miller is a safe fakeclaim and I could see people going down that line of thought.
Tracker/backup tracker means that all three members of the scumteam can be caught at night doing things that they'll have to explain later.
As for balance, it's a bit hard to parse which makes me want to call it swingy. Let's say that scum is lynched D1 after any PR except the Odd-night Cop has to claim. One of their night actions is gone no matter who's lynched (dead encryptor means rolecop or follower have to no action to perform the kill), and their kill is likely to get blocked.
I feel like a lot of this game would eventually come down to setup speculation after everyone claims. Mafia PRs claiming anything other than PR is dangerous given the double tracker, so I could see VTs being setup-specced as town (only exception potentially being the Encryptor, who can still get caught performing the NK).
Still starting out so I don't really have a concrete answer as to whether I think it's balanced or not. My personal recommendation would be to strip away a bit of power on both sides
What's the purpose of the miller being informed, and being informed of that?-
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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northsidegal Survivor
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Elaborate?In post 11, RadiantCowbells wrote:Most scum power in this setup is getting tprs lynched
Another thought: anyone saved by the doctor is conftown unless scum fakeclaim a protective / blocking role.-
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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northsidegal Survivor
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yeah, i was just thinking something kind of similar.
let's think about this. any scum run up d1 are likely going to be claiming a PR. similarly, any of the 6 TPRs will claim their real role. given this, it's very likely that town ends up lynching a PR claim.
of the last 9 games that have featured town doctors, in three of them the doctor has been lynched. on second thought, that might be a bit less likely here given that the miller is informed ofabulletproof, but it's still possible that the doctor gets lynched.
something similar could be said about the tracker / backup tracker (i can so clearly see someone saying that it's likely that there has to be one scum among the two)-
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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northsidegal Survivor
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to counterclaim / introduce doubt that the informed is referring to the doctor?In post 16, RadiantCowbells wrote:Maybe give scum a BP role-
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RadiantCowbells He/himSmooth CriminalHe/him
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northsidegal Survivor
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-shrug-
i'm not here to design a setup for performer, but i think an interesting way to go off of this setup would be to focus it a bitmoreon the interaction between the miller and the sort of unrealistic doctor role. stripping away some of the other TPRs and replacing mafia PRs with a jailkeeper or other such blocking role seems to me like it'd have a bit more "synergy" or a bit more of a theme to it.
could still give mafia a BP in that scenario for purposes of introducing doubt as to doc-save "clears".-
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northsidegal Survivor
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like, if you made the miller specifically informed of a BP doctor.-
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implosion he/himPolymathhe/him
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This makes me curious how often scum fakeclaim doctor in normal games in practice.In post 15, northsidegal wrote:of the last 9 games that have featured town doctors, in three of them the doctor has been lynched.-
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northsidegal Survivor
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i'm not sure i've ever seen scum fakeclaim doctor and i read a lot of games-
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Performer Mafia Scum
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In post 16, RadiantCowbells wrote:Maybe give scum a BP role
Hmm interesting. How about this one:In post 19, northsidegal wrote: focus it a bitmoreon the interaction between the miller and the sort of unrealistic doctor role. stripping away some of the other TPRs and replacing mafia PRs with a jailkeeper or other such blocking role seems to me like it'd have a bit more "synergy" or a bit more of a theme to it.
could still give mafia a BP in that scenario for purposes of introducing doubt as to doc-save "clears".
Mafia Bulletproof
Mafia Encryptor
Mafia Jailkeeper
vs
Ascetic Odd-night Cop
N2 Cop
1-shot Bulletproof Doctor
Informed Miller: you are informed there is a Bulletproof Doctor!
Tracker
Backup Tracker
4 Vanilla TowniesI’m an informed Miller who knows there isn’t any Loyal modifiers and there is a total of 4 scum.-Morality
I'm easily the best person in the game at mechanics. I don't presume to be the best at anything else.-Jingle
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northsidegal Survivor
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going to defer to RC on whether that's balanced or not. my ~secondary reviewer~ opinion would be that i might replace tracker / backup tracker with something else and for the sake of normal game meta i would make the jailkeeper multitasking.
random thought: multitasking jailkeeper has some element of synergy with keeping a tracker around, but not really any more than tracking someone to the nightkill in the first place.
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