Not Known 15's Mini Normal Review, May 2021

[implosion]

13 players

10 Vanilla Townies

Vanilla Townie

You are a Vanilla Townie.

You have no active abilities.

You win if all threats to the town are eliminated and at least one town-aligned player is alive.

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

2-shot Bulletproof Informed Innocent Child

2-shot Bulletproof Informed Innocent Child

You are a 2-shot Bulletproof Informed Innocent Child.

You are confirmed to be town at the start of the game.
You know additional information about the setup: Exactly two people are aligned with the Mafia. There is no Encryptor.
You are protected from the first two kills that targets you.

You have no active abilities.

You win if all threats to the town are eliminated and at least one town-aligned player is alive.

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

2 Informed Goon(s)

Informed Goon

You are an Informed Goon.
Your team-mate is

NAME

. You may talk to them

here

during night phases and confirmations only.

You know additional information about the setup: The only Power Role of the Town,

Name

, 2-shot Bulletproof Informed Innocent Child, knows that there is no Encryptor.

You have the following active ability:
Each Night, if no other member of your faction is performing this action, you may target a player. Assuming no interference with your action, that player will die.

You win if at least one mafia member is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

Welcome to my Mini Normal.

Rules:
1.Follow the Site Rules. This includes not talking about ongoing games.
2.You may have access to private threads (e.g. Mafia factional chat); you can talk about this game there, but you may not quote anything from them outside of the PT. You may not quote any game-related PMs without express permission by your game mod.
3.Play to win this game.
4.Lurking: You will be prodded after 2 days of no substantial contribution(no prod dodging). After 24 hours of an unanswered prod I will search for a replacement(unless V/LA). Four prods in total, or two prods in one day will result in an instant replacement. ASK FOR REPLACEMENT IN A PM.
5.Vacation/Limited Access: Tell me when you are going to have limited access. If you have limited access, you will still count as having a prod after 3 days, and you will be instantly replaced after 5 days in total.
6.Weekend: For the purposes of prods and nights, Sunday and Saturday count as 12 hours each.
7.CHEATING:Cheating(breaking site rules, posting while dead, quoting Role PM's without explicit permission, encrypting posts without explicit permission, editing/deleting posts without explicit permission, doing anything obviously against the spirit of the rules) is forbidden. Don't do it.
Setup information:

8.Length of day phases:7 days. More if replacements force me to extend the phase.
9.Length of nights: 2 days. Will usually not end before all replacements are finished.

10. Elimination:The town can kill one person per day. This is called Elimination. People may vote to eliminate someone (e.g.VOTE: Not Known 15)
An elimination during the day necessiates more than 50% of all possible votes. You may vote for No Elimination. A No Elimination needs 50% of all possible votes.

11:Hammer:As soon as the required number of people for an Elimination or NoElimination is reached, the game descends into Twilight.
12:Twilight:Alive people, including the hammered elimination target, may continue to post until the flip.
13:Flip: After the flip the game descends into Night.
14:Daychat: No one has Daychat by default.
15:Natural Action Resolution applies. Same priority cycles are resolved by making all actions of the same priority fail(e.g.Roleblocker vs Roleblocker, only both roleblocks fail).
16:Color, Backup Mod color and Vanilla Role PM:

Vanilla Townie

You are a Vanilla Townie.

You have no active abilities.

You win if all threats to the town are eliminated and at least one town-aligned player is alive.

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

At least one person recieved this Role PM.

This is my color

#808080). Do not use it.
17:Breaking rules can result in any kind of punishment. Do not break the rules.
18:I may add additional rules at my discretion. I will tell everyone via PM if this happens.

[implosion]

Primary: Isis
Secondary: Ircher

[Ircher]

I wonder if this would be better as an open setup where everyone knows the setup.

In any case, this setup is similar to Plus Innocent with the obvious difference that the IC is pretty tough to kill in this setup.

According to that same page, 9-2 Plus Innocent has an EV around 36%. Since this has 13 players and the IC is hard to kill, the EV is going to be higher in this setup.

[Isis]

There's two problems

1- I think the EV is a little high for town, but only just.
2- I don't think it's considered "normal" for the experience playing the setup not to be qualitatively different in at least one way. Optimal play here seems to be for everyone to share the information that they have on the first page of the game. The town could be a little unsure whether there's weak town power in the setup but it doesn't seem substantial enough to count.

I think these issues could be resolved with some combination of night specific Strong abilities, night specific activated informed abilities in place of passive informed abilities, and day X IC reveal abilities in place of Day 0 IC reveal abilities.

[Not Known 15]

9 Vanilla Townies

Vanilla Townie

You are a Vanilla Townie.

You have no active abilities.

You win if all threats to the town are eliminated and at least one town-aligned player is alive.

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

2-shot Bulletproof Townie

2-shot Bulletproof Townie

You are a 2-shot Bulletproof Townie.

You will survive the first two attempts to kill you.

You have no active abilities.

You win if all threats to the town are eliminated and at least one town-aligned player is alive.

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

Informed Innocent Child

Informed Innocent Child

You are an Informed Innocent Child.

You are confirmed to be town at the start of the game.
You know additional information about the setup: Exactly two people are aligned with the Mafia. There is no Encryptor.

You have no active abilities.

You win if all threats to the town are eliminated and at least one town-aligned player is alive.

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

2 Mafia Informed Night 1 Strongman

Mafia Informed Night 1 Strongman.

You are a Mafia Informed Night 1 Strongman.
Your team-mate is

NAME

. You may talk to them

here

during night phases and confirmations only.

You know additional information about the setup: The Informed Innocent Child knows that there is no Encryptor. The only Bulletproof role is 2-shot Bulletproof. There is no Watcher.

You have the following active ability:
Each Night, if no other member of your faction is performing this action, you may target a player. Assuming no interference with your action, that player will die.

If you attempt to kill someone Night 1 then your kill can only be stopped if your target commutes.

You win if at least one mafia member is alive and all other players are dead (or if nothing can prevent the same).

Confirm by replying to this PM with a summary of your role.

Okay. This should make things different. It is explicitely intended for the information(minus the Encryptor part) to be shared page 1; it is sort of additional information for the town. The Encryptor part should ideally be shared Day 1, but there is room for error. If the BP player is treated as locktown then the Mafia can fall back on letting town execute in the evens(or not if the 2-shot BP is too dangerous, as a player).
Misplays by the BP are obviously bad - of course(getting executed, revealing oneself Day 1); but they do not prevent a town victory.

[Isis]

I think I like it.
As an idea I had, you could also do a night specific strong kill that simulates both the failed kills on the bulletproof. That is, a strong kill that is night specific to such a late night, you don't actually reach it unless you submit a couple no kills. That moves some information out of town hands. If my math is right it would be N1N6 strongman and you would probably want a backup.

What if instead of having two shots of bulletproof on the strong man

I think I'm not supposed to suggest stuff when I'm already happy passing, though. I think post 4 is passworthy unless ircher talks me out of it

[Not Known 15]

Ircher?

[Ircher]

It's probably fine, sorry.

[Isis]

What if instead of having two shots of bulletproof on the strong man

That incomplete thought was supposed to be erased but drafting posts on a phone is hard.

This setup has passed review