TM2020 - Large Theme - Gay Mafia IV: TOWN WIN

[chennisden]

First

[chennisden]

Hi RC

[chennisden]

HEAL: Chennisden

You have done this TWICE as scum good sir it will NOT work a THIRD time

[chennisden]

NO NO STOP VOTING ME, NO YOU CAN'T DO THAT

[chennisden]

I'm a pringle mingle and ready to single

[chennisden]

Tempted to townread Volpe and Farkran

Leaning town on Espresso Gif and maybe Vex

[chennisden]

Also I think chennis would be more hyped than this so I throw my coin of concern that way.

I was doing this great thing called sleeping and watching anime so

[chennisden]

Also wouldn't I be more hyped to roll scum?

I enjoy playing scum more than town in most cases

I don't really think it should be an issue that I haven't taken up half of the thread in the first RL day

[chennisden]

I'm usually transparently town, so my slot will eventually become a non issue

[chennisden]

except when you use caps then you're probably scu-

hmmmhmhmh

I've actually probably posted maybe 10 times in all lowercase ever in my past few games

That sounds like an overestimate

[chennisden]

Tell pops she is bad at smash (:

[chennisden]

I know I'm just so proud of that one scum read I had with that lol

It kind of taught me more about how I approached the game and approached scum vs how I approach town, so I think it came at a good time for my scumgame as people were starting to figure it out

Luckily all the losses were from hydra games, bastard games, or bastard hydra games

[chennisden]

I think EP is actually a really easy lynch and might not be scum at this point

[chennisden]

I don't think he's

towny

I think he might be

town

[chennisden]

Scum is almost never in the "too good to be true" easy options

[chennisden]

I think EP is actually a really easy lynch and might not be scum at this point

Why do you think espresso is an easy lynch based on what happened so far? He only interacted with 2 or 3 people and is only fossed by maria and anka, with just 1 vote from maria. There's nothing pointing to him being lynchbait at this point

Or is there any meta reason i am not aware of?

I don't have a lot of meta with him so it's not meta

I feel like his position is uniquely one which will cascade into a lynch. Like, he feels really lynchable. If I were scum that would be an avenue that I'd take eventually

[chennisden]

I think I need to be wary of Farkran and Volxen right now. My Farkran read is more serious/developed.

Farkran because his posts contain a certain "reasonableness" that has

words

but flow in a way that makes it so I'm not really inclined to

read

them beyond surface level

Volxen because I think he's ballsy enough to try to pocket me again as scum

These are not necessarily scumreads perse, but I think watching how these slots develop would be useful in sorting the game.

[chennisden]

I've ISO dug him and looked specifically for "stuff that sounds like he's doing stuff but won't be dug in too deeply." I came out with pretty much his entire ISO.

Please read these quotes word-for-word and not gloss over them. I initially got a towny feel from him because I wasn't really considering his content or tone specifically but rather the general feels he gave, which I think is pretty common in scum players these days.

(I might double-check with meta if I feel like it but I think Farkran being scum is likely to be independent of meta.)

Why does that have to be the case?

That's my question to you. You went out of your way to say i am pocketing you, but made no mention of my other townreads.

I think town would have either said nothing or ask me why i am townreading them and the other guys rather than instantly fossing me for pocketing.

Why? Do you agree with my other reads so much that you don't need to question them?

Uncharacteristically serious reaction to something that was probably meant to be jokey. Reads poorly through a tone perspective as well.

Ok

Honestly I'm mostly fucking around atm, I don't actually believe that

VOTE: ankamius

Reconsidering my previous read after this very weak exchange

@a50 what do you think of anka rn?

Also weird, don't understand the A50 callout

Spoiler: a million flavour signals

Okay.

Moving onto more important topics.

Do we have any single ladies in the house tonight?

I'm a pringle mingle and ready to single

Now put your hands up!

‘Cause if you like it then you shoulda put a ring on it

All the single ladies

(All the single ladies)

You make crumbing look like a baking contest.

This post is observant of you, but it lacks a conclusion statement - do you think deas flavor could be AI, or indicative of anything else relevant? Was it just a note?

This is terrible.

The quote from EP is also pretty bad.

@volpe generally speaking i understand your concerns but surely you must have some thoughts about anka now, if not about him directly, you should have noticed some people revolving around him

From your posts i get that you're trying to give your direction to the game and that is NAI - not being trustful of other players fits either with a paranoid town mindset or a scum looking for a broad lynchpool

Which one are you?

Personally my opinion of Fark's list is "bad."
Not alignment-indicative. Just bad.
Farkran how confident are you in your scum game?

I like playing scum, won 2 games so far, one of them being the one you recently hostes so you should know more than other players here how i go around as scum

What makes my list bad to you? As in, what reads would you consider wrong and why?

First line is pretty NAI

Second seems too earnest

@volpe generally speaking i understand your concerns but surely you must have some thoughts about anka now, if not about him directly, you should have noticed some people revolving around him

From your posts i get that you're trying to give your direction to the game and that is NAI - not being trustful of other players fits either with a paranoid town mindset or a scum looking for a broad lynchpool

Which one are you?

You've watched me solve that normal 2106 in the dead thread, didn't you?

Do you think you need to ask what kind of player I'm? Do you really have no speculations of your own?

I honestly forgot about you in the normal dead chat, sorry i remember liking your posts but i didn't associate them with your nickname (i.e. in my mind i went like "player x posted stuff i like"). It may be helpful but i cannot form a super specific profile of you based on that only. Spectating is way different than actively playing.

That being said i already offered my interpretation of your posts here, and i want to hear more of your opinions of the current gamestate.

Right now you are mostly dodging questions and/or turning them back at who asked them, which is fine for a while but some answers would also be appreciated

This is pretty awful like actually READ this post.

"Right now you are mostly dodging questions and/or turning them back at who asked them,

which is fine for a while but some answers would also be appreciated

"

What the actual heck is this

How did he get away with this

Also I called it bad purely because it was out of place.

I interpret this opinion as in everyone is currently null to you?

Correct me if i am wrong - i fail to see the need of commenting my readlist if you don't agree nor disagree with it, unless you think i made it up in which case you are currently scumleaning me - again, please tell me where i am wrong, i don't want to put words in your mouth, just voicing my thoughts

The content isn't necessarily

bad

per say, but I don't really think that an actual town human being really thinks this. Sounds like scum trying to cover bases

Tone is weird.

Last post because I'm getting back to work

I did answer you on ank/vex though so I'm not sure what I'm dodging. It may look like I'm dodging since I throw a curve ball back but I think I more or less answered most things?

Anyway I'm just slow to give reads because I like the reads to be grounded, so I'm careful about what I say. I also think that most posts in a mafia game are a bit useless because I get my reads from 2 or 3 posts each person have that in my head I go "This really comes more often than town" or "This comes more often from scum".

I'm mostly looking around and waiting everyone to post enough to find meaningful posts for everyone or something

Sorry, my post was before i read your 140

I'd mostly like to hear your read of anka - or why you aren't interested in their posts given that you said you skimmed them.

I mean, i'm trying to build a profile of people around me because i literally haven't played with anyone in this plist, i just vaguely know some people from minor interactions like gif modding me or you posting stuff in that dead chat

Weird I guess, but fine

Also I called it bad purely because it was out of place.

I interpret this opinion as in everyone is currently null to you?

Correct me if i am wrong - i fail to see the need of commenting my readlist if you don't agree nor disagree with it, unless you think i made it up in which case you are currently scumleaning me - again, please tell me where i am wrong, i don't want to put words in your mouth, just voicing my thoughts

UT is scum. That's for sure.

Your readlist is horrible because you declared yourself as a king of readlists and yet you put "gif" and "powerscumming" together but I have tried very hard to drop that bias you see. So with dropping that bias, it rose to "bad."
It's also out of place because it's a first post readlist very early stage. Things like that is usually done by people who wants to be townread, and it should be concerning unless I know that they're the self-conscious type. I called it NAI because both town and scum can do it.

Is this your posting or team's?

What the fuck is this question

Let's talk more about Espresso. I see some common opinion forming on him that i don't agree with and i'd like to understand why. I'll go into detail in my next posts

Probably the towniest thing he's posted this game

Although, unsurprisingly, it's still possible to ascribe some scum motivation to this

am I being pocketed

I got my eye on you

Ok

Honestly I'm mostly fucking around atm, I don't actually believe that

VOTE: Ankamius

I really dislike the instant backtracking here

This though, this sucks.
VOTE: Espresso Pat
I feel like this is a surface level ready that scum go on. One of those classic 'hey this post looks scummy I can vote it.' Because town normally thinks a bit more about the posts in question. Like, why does scum Ank feel the need to backtrack so suddenly? It's not like Ank is a scared scum player or she needed to take back the read. No one was keeping pressure on her. I think this guy was just trying to find something to cling to.

Do you think espresso jumped opportunistically on the wagon against anka? Does this mean you think Anka's recent exchanges are NAI and this is scum!espresso trying to find scum motivation where you think there isn't any?

More specifically, why do you think Espresso has voted ankamius based on a superficial analysis whereas you don't find Ankamius reactions superficial?

I'm reasonably confident that the only possible scum on my wagon is espresso

Do you just agree with maria here or do you have your own reasons for believing espresso could be the only scum in your current wagon of {GIF, nom³, fark, espresso}?

Also sounds earnest and weird

I think EP is actually a really easy lynch and might not be scum at this point

Why do you think espresso is an easy lynch based on what happened so far? He only interacted with 2 or 3 people and is only fossed by maria and anka, with just 1 vote from maria. There's nothing pointing to him being lynchbait at this point

Or is there any meta reason i am not aware of?

Very meh post, sounds earnest again

[chennisden]

TL;DR I don't want to read a wall:

1) Farkran's ISO is towny on a surface level but actually bad if you read it
2) He's posting in a way that makes it really easy to just skim/not actually read his posts but moreso focus on the interactions

around

him, which really just comes from scum a lot (see Reundo in Large normal 224, etc)
3) Sounds reasonable at first glance but there's a lot of scummy overeagerness, which as #2 says, kind of doesn't get read into

I don't care, please give me the summarized one-liner:

"Right now you are mostly dodging questions and/or turning them back at who asked them,

which is fine for a while but some answers would also be appreciated

" is scummy as fuck
"Right now you are mostly dodging questions and/or turning them back at who asked them,

which is fine for a while but some answers would also be appreciated

" is scummy as fuck
"Right now you are mostly dodging questions and/or turning them back at who asked them,

which is fine for a while but some answers would also be appreciated

" is scummy as fuck
$\cdots$
"Right now you are mostly dodging questions and/or turning them back at who asked them,

which is fine for a while but some answers would also be appreciated

" is scummy as fuck

[chennisden]

Dave... you also feel similar to Large Normal 224

(For context he was scum)

[chennisden]

No one's here, I'm bored, I'll go watch anime now

[chennisden]

I’ve like tried to catch up, and I’m physically reading, but it just isn’t sticking in my head right now. Anyone else get like that sometimes?

Ya I get that feel, happens when youre in the wrong headspace for this game

[chennisden]

Like this game of mafia specifically

[chennisden]

I'm feeling like Farkran atm
Don't like how he came in claiming to be the king of read lists but has only done one so far
VOTE: Farkran

I was just about to post an updated one.

TOWN
Volpe*
nomnomnom*
GIF
Vex vience
Espresso
DeasVail
Elements
Gammagooey
davesaz
Maria

NULL
Volxen
DEB
Flavor Leaf
Kuribo
A50

SCUM
Anka
Chennis*

Starred reads are stronger ones, the rest are weak or in some cases extremely weak. I am kinda puzzled about the recent GIF but he's still fairly high. Analysis of my previous readlist is weird, but it often comes from town. Vote on volpe is weird, didn't understand where that came from, @GIF if you want to enlighten me i'm all ears

I kinda liked elements pop-in, despite voting for me shortly after. Seemed a good way to put the thread back on track after it was slightly falling off, but i'd like him to produce more content on the previous gamestate.

I want to sort Anka and chennis. The latter refusing to take a stance on the currently highest wagon is bad, adding up to all the other reasons i'm scumreading him. I may decide to switch my vote to chennis soon - waiting for some more content from him and anka though.

Everyone else i have already talked about or is weak enough that i don't have much to say about

pedit: uh nice

Is this really something you do as town?

[chennisden]

Farkran you're either scum or you're town playing in a too careful and tense manner.

If you're town I'd like to work with you. Note I'm not voting you. Instead of trying to fulfill every player's requests and obligations and tensing up, being afraid to offend someone (ingame) you should loosen up.

[chennisden]

Also the first posts of your ISO are much better than the later ones.

[chennisden]

Volpe as of right now I disagree with your methods and your conclusions

[chennisden]

Also Farkran I don't get your nomnomnom townread

I'm not scumreading her, I just literally had no impression of her slot and forgot she existed until you mentioned her

[chennisden]

Wall

Can anyone turn Fakran’s wall post into like 2-3 sentences?

I’m curious about if people can do that, not moreso on not wanting to read the wall, if that makes sense.

Fakran’s posting style seems like Scum Brian Skies, if anyone gets that.

Also not sure what you're trying to pull here FL, since my wall was before your first

mention

of Farkran.

[chennisden]

I want to sort Anka and chennis. The latter refusing to take a stance on the currently highest wagon is bad, adding up to all the other reasons i'm scumreading him. I may decide to switch my vote to chennis soon - waiting for some more content from him and anka though.

The reason I'm not taking a stance on Ank is because I don't have enough actual content to make a read

Also do you really expect me to really care about who's the biggest wagon at 300 posts

Do you really

[chennisden]

Farkran you're either scum or you're town playing in a too careful and tense manner.

If you're town I'd like to work with you. Note I'm not voting you. Instead of trying to fulfill every player's requests and obligations and tensing up, being afraid to offend someone (ingame) you should loosen up.

I do hate offending people - as in actually insulting or disrespecting them. But posting readlists is what i do, and there are plenty of instances in my (short) meta in this site. I don't see any reason why i wouldn't, and i can guarantee i wasn't being submissive to elements' request, it's just part of my playstyle - especially early playstyle.

On the offchance you are actually trying to sort me, take a look at that. And i am still waiting your stance on ankamius, i don't believe you could produce thoughts on espresso but not on her

pedit: about nom, i liked pretty much his every post so far. Nothing scummy, and i am favoring players who try to produce content about the gamestate rather than deviating it.

I added (ingame) to clarify that it's not actually offending, I mean saying something wrong and getting scumread

Talk about your scumread on me. From my POV it looks contrived and made up.

I also don't see why any sort of read on Espresso has to be accompanied by an Ank read

[chennisden]

Wall

Can anyone turn Fakran’s wall post into like 2-3 sentences?

I’m curious about if people can do that, not moreso on not wanting to read the wall, if that makes sense.

Fakran’s posting style seems like Scum Brian Skies, if anyone gets that.

Also not sure what you're trying to pull here FL, since my wall was before your first

mention

of Farkran.

Are you implying that you saying wall is pushing Fakran here?

Be forewarned, if you actually said something prior, then I am mistaken, but if you’re implying that “wall” is you pushing Fakran prior to me, that’s just hilarious regardless of your alignment

You could click the link to post 201 and check what it actually says before posting this

[chennisden]

FL you are doing a really good job putting words in my mouth that weren't there

[chennisden]

sigh.

[chennisden]

let's dissect everything wrong with your post

[chennisden]

I want to sort Anka and chennis. The latter refusing to take a stance on the currently highest wagon is bad, adding up to all the other reasons i'm scumreading him. I may decide to switch my vote to chennis soon - waiting for some more content from him and anka though.

The reason I'm not taking a stance on Ank is because I don't have enough actual content to make a read

Also do you really expect me to really care about who's the biggest wagon at 300 posts

Do you really

Yes, i do. You went out of your way to produce a (unmotivated) stance on espresso who had way less content than anka did, implying you did not agree with Maria (and to a lesser extent Anka) scumleaning the slot, so i find it weird that you had not said a word about Anka herself.

Pedit: i think i have talked plenty about why i am scumreading you in my recent posting. Read on espresso felt TMI, your push on me is awful, and not voting here when you literally screamed i am scum also looks like you're trying to avoid looking bad - note that you didn't ask me or prod me about anything, you just threw a (bad) scumcase towards me.

VOTE: chennis, could be scumpartners with Anka but, slots taken independently, i scumread this more.

I think it's really very clear that it's a gamestate reaction, so "unmotivated" is untrue. Also, since it's a gamestate reaction, my lack of enthusiasm to call EP scum is because EP being scum feels "too good to be true."

The reason I didn't say anything about Ank is because I don't really have a read on Ank

How I feel about EP doesn't really change that much right now based on their alignments

Trying to parse their alignments from EP is kind of useless right now

"TMI":

It's a gamestate read, not really sure how I'm supposed to respond to that. Also this implies you believe it's TMI because there's no reason to do so in the gamestate when the opposite is true

"Awful push":

I'll be primary looking at 227.
I assume your comment on A50 is referring to "Also weird, don't understand the A50 callout." I saw your scumread on him. That's not a satisfactory reason to "why did you ask A50

specifically

." In fact that's not even a

reason.

"Moreover, you twisted the sentence you bolded out thrice"

No. The sentence "Right now you are mostly dodging questions and/or turning them back at who asked them, which is fine for a while but some answers would also be appreciated" implies that you're okay with your questions being ignored. This also implies you're okay with ignoring scummy behavior in favor of avoiding noise. I don't think I've misrepresented what you've said.

"It's superficial"

Nope

"1) Farkran's ISO is towny on a surface level but actually bad if you read it
2) He's posting in a way that makes it really easy to just skim/not actually read his posts but moreso focus on the interactions around him, which really just comes from scum a lot (see Reundo in Large normal 224, etc)
3) Sounds reasonable at first glance but there's a lot of scummy overeagerness, which as #2 says, kind of doesn't get read into"

I think this is non-trivial. I also don't think you've responded to this at all.

"Turning questions back at who asked them can come from town"

Anything can come back from town. This is 1) really wishy-washy language and 2) means nothing to me.

"the correct course of action would have been to delve deep into my reads"

I could literally put the majority of the playerlist in an RNG and it'd offer as much information as your readlists

Spoiler: readslist

The only part of this "readslist" that was not determined by RNG was my placing on Farkran.

After removing some players that haven't really posted this is my "readslist"

davesaz - Busboy Revolution
GuyInFreezer - Bird That Carries You Over a Disproportionately Small Gap
MariaR - Ripple's Krazy Mistress Dunn
DeasVail - The Lit Torches

Flavor Leaf - Wild Cards
nomnomnom - SubOptimal Math
Volxen - Derp Wolves
Elements - Team "Team" Team
Ankamius - cancel food

Vex Vience - Doomsday
EspressoPatronum - Newb Kids on the Block
kuribo - The Four Horsement
Volpe14 - Tea Gathering Club

Almost50 - You Over a Disproportionately Small Gap
Farkran - DFKN

"which is based on literally your gut feeling alone."

Gut is valuable and it's actually a really good way to catch wolves, especially deepwolves. Probably a playstyle difference, but I believe there's this non-formalizable and hard to word exactly feeling that you just

get

from people and their posting and scum benefits a lot off of people not actually

getting

much from (shallow) posting.

"This in particular feels like you are actively trying to SQUEEZE out scum motivation from my posts instead of deducing it. Like, why would you find scum motivation in me talking about espresso when you were townreading him just moments ago?"

If I townread everyone who agreed with me on something I'd be somehow worse than I am now at mafia

"Not voting me":

It's easier to sort someone when you have a vote that hangs in the balance. This comes down to personal preference really, and right now I feel it's a net loss if I vote you

I can sort without votes. I usually prefer to sort without votes. I'm trying to figure this game out right now, not get you lynched.

[chennisden]

Wow. Seems like I'm late to the party

[chennisden]

Then talk about it more. I’m not stopping you.

I meant that people in general didn't talk about Chennis that much, not me

I don't think you've really talked about me a lot and "Ctrl+F Chennis" supports this

[chennisden]

Also unless I missed something major "Volpe's scumcase on Chennis" does not exist

It was practically a naked vote

[chennisden]

She's saying the

basis

of the push is bad

[chennisden]

Oh and by the way I have a life and work to do so yeah, not a great way to parse my alignment.

[chennisden]

Would you be willing to join Chennis wagon for now?

I'm indecisive about Chennis alignment and I think that would help me out

This is also bad Volpe

[chennisden]

I honestly think {Farkran Volpe} has a chance of being scum together

[chennisden]

I also didn’t hard push, I just voted.

People act like I’m some pariah god here. Without any meta on me as a player, this would have been taken much better.

Also, Volpe’s scum list is literally a combination of anyone going after him.

I feel scum are more likely to defend townVolpe in this scenario, so if Volpe is town, dave is probably lock scum.

This is absolutely true.

[chennisden]

I wanted to have my scum leans more sorted out before saying anything but hmmm dunno

MariaR/Vex/Ank have some pretty interesting dinamic.

Ank had just posted before, but instead of calling her out for a chat, Vex called me, and in the second question asked me how I feel about ank, while his read on Fark was pretty vague.

MariaR comes later with a push on Espresso for gunning for Ank, and says that "likes where nomnom head is" on Vex but doesn't think negatively of Vex apparently.

It really needed more development to flesh out but I'm getting annoyed with this gamestate.

Nomnom vote is odd to me when she should know a bit better about my scum game but again, I don't really expect her to have accuracy on reading me so dunno. The whole vote just feels very sheepy of FL vibe though.

Chennis is kind of over the top on Fark read

but I kind of think it may not be something scum!Chennis goes for? I don't know. I wanted the wagon to develop to sort it out but that happened.

I don't really think so? If I didn't say anything Farkran is the type of slot that would've gone for a long time unnoticed and not really thought about, which would've been bad regardless of his alignment.

[chennisden]

This 1v1 is kind of unproductive imo

[chennisden]

I also doubt that FL/Volpe engages in scum theater this way, so one of you are town at least

[chennisden]

Btw I'm around 50% sure that FL/Volpe is a dumb TvT spat

At least 50%

[chennisden]

Also Volpe it doesn't help when you act resigned/tunnel/misrepresent stuff

[chennisden]

I think Elements might be the kind of player to try and keep up appearances as scum and as town he's less apologetic and doesn't really fake stuff.

I haven't seen any staples of either type of play though and I don't think this merits him being your

highest

townread.

[chennisden]

Btw I think Gammagooey is a pretty towny slot

[chennisden]

Trying to throw other stuff out there so this day doesn't become a circlejerk

[chennisden]

Do I need to highlight that Ank popped in defended FL/Nomnom and vanished?

The fact that this is how you're playing means I feel very comfortable giving your reads no credence in this game.

[chennisden]

Btw I think Gammagooey is a pretty towny slot

"guy agrees with me"

"i townread guy"

Yeah. Chennis is town, confident in that. I suggest to be less superficial and emotional about your reads, though.

Before you call me out for posting superficial readlists as well, you should notice the difference in pushing hard reads (what you have been doing) as opposed to taking notes and outing my thoughts in the thread (what i have been doing in my lists). It's a significant playstyle difference, obviously i think my way is better and probably you think yours is, but if we are to meet eye to eye we gotta understand how our minds work.

That's actually not it at all, it's largely a toneread

[chennisden]

You can't operate solely on logic in what is bound to be a game around emotions

[chennisden]

By the way I don't scumread you anymore Farkran

[chennisden]

I'd love to read one of your games, Farkran, but to be frank, I don't have the time nor are you a high priority sort as of right now.

[chennisden]

Finally before I go I believe Dave has some scum equity here

[chennisden]

Well I guess I'm getting lynched today huh

I wouldn't say that to be fair especially if you're scum.

For example, I think that if you gave around 24 hours to the thread, let everyone else check in, and come up with "I need to reorganize my reads", pretend to re:read and begin pushing in somewhere between Gamma or something you could make a pretty good push/wagon to be fair.

You're actually just really sitting here in defeatism instead of trying to reassess where your head is at the game currently, which I honestly think it's a trait of cornered mafia but ok. I've seen...sometimes that happens to town.

You tried bringing up GiF or etc but when it didn't get heat you dropped it like you dropped your push on me when it started backfiring. You're at this exact moment waiting to see responses on GiF before starting to get some track on it. It's...very political in a not positive way.

You first had an easy town read on me but dropped it in a hat when I began to get heat, and really tried to rile up me, but when it started to go off the trail you just began to drop it again.

Right now you're still waiting for support to do anything about GiF too.

I'm more collected now and I'll be slightly shocked if you don't flip just red here.

I agree with this

[chennisden]

If there's scum in the Volpe/FL/Nom pile it's probably nom

[chennisden]

I'm going to force someone from my team to read this mess I guess

[chennisden]

Also I am townreading Ank

[chennisden]

[chennisden]

I think I'm leaning scum on Dave, if you have any thoughts wrt this please talk to me

[chennisden]

Dave has asked a lot of easy questions and made a lot of under-the-radar posts, however the reason I'm not confident is because of stuff like this

Hmm, I think I mostly finished? my very early reads and I'm looking at:

[Volpe]
[Elements]
[GiF, Fark?, Espresso]
[everyone else] - null or nullscum

I don't think I'm really on board with what FL is doing on the page I'm reading, but this reads list struck me as strange. In particular what has Elements done to deserve being highest town read?

Hmm, I think I mostly finished? my very early reads and I'm looking at:

[Volpe]
[Elements]
[GiF, Fark?, Espresso]
[everyone else] - null or nullscum

What has Elements done to deserve being highest town read?

This is a pretty significant question.

This is only for the outed threesome, no other hoods need reply.

In fact if the outed 3 prefer not to answer that's fine too.
I have no idea if the theory behind the question holds any water so do not consider it mechanical just yet. It may be a curiosity and have nothing to do with alignment. But now that we have an outed group it's feasible to pose the question.

Your hood's group is named for some aspect of entertainment biz, if it follows the two examples I have to work with. The individuals should have flavor names and the group members know all 3 names.
Are all members of the group flavor obviously members of the group's aspect? For example the sample PM's are Executive Producers. Another one might be singers, musicians, songwriters, IDK. Are the flavor names of the singers group all singers? Not asking for what your group's type is or the names, or who the oddball is if there is one. Just a yes or no for your group they all obviously fit the group's theme or not.

I'm not asking for discussion on the implied theory either, not yet. We have other better things going on right now.

[chennisden]

Dave has asked a lot of easy questions and made a lot of under-the-radar posts, however the reason I'm not confident is because of stuff like this

Should I interpret this as meaning you think those posts are town?

Yes

[chennisden]

Hate to say this, but a complete and utter denial of reality seems very town indicative for this game

[chennisden]

Being funny isn't my intent here

[chennisden]

You're the one who spent 10 pages in a useless 1v1

Not me

[chennisden]

Sorry I should probably go now

[chennisden]

Yeah I was not in a good headspace when I made that post

[chennisden]

I think I should take a break from this game for a couple of hours at least

[chennisden]

My team's reads mixed with some observations from skimming:

- why is Volpe townreading me so much?
- Elements is on par with his town game
- Ank's scumread on me is low hanging fruit. Maybe Ank is doing a slayer's play? The full town reads list with only me as scum is weird.
- if Volpe!scum, FL shouldn't get a free pass

...why do even you think of yourself as easy lynchbait? Are you famous for always rolling scum or something? Because i really see no indication of you being a low hanging fruit or lynchbait so far

Also do you think that volpe and FL would put THAT much effort into distancing? I could see FL doing that, hardly volpe, based on the profile i've drawn of the two slots. I made peace with them never being in the same scumteam.

The thing is it's the

way

they interacted that makes it unlikely for FL to bus this way.

[chennisden]

I understand chenn’s Post and see why those things are interpreted that way but they are the type of things I’d townread that player for. So far anyway the game is young.

Might agree with scumreading others for that

.

What does this even mean?

This bolded sentence? You do poorly in English? It means that I strongly disagreed with that specific post from chenn because whatever chenn was scumreading someone for was something that I think that individual would do as town. Other people posting the same thing might be scummy. It's just as clear as what I wrote. Two people post the same thing, one person it would be scummy another person it wouldn't be.

I think it's really, really weird that you play the pronoun game here instead of referring to Farkran by name and make no mention of the content of what I said (merely that it was a scumread) in both the first quote and this clarifier post

[chennisden]

Instead of saying "actually I think Farkran's posts appearing to be superficial is probably town indicative for him specifically, but could be scum indicative for other players" I think you take care to avoid actually mentioning anything specific.

This is also objectively easier to post as town compared to what you wrote and objectively is a clearer stance. I think you're avoiding taking stances here, Dave.

[chennisden]

I think this is probably going to be controversial but I really think we need to look at dave

VOTE: dave

[chennisden]

Okay, thanks.

Rn I want to sort you and I think it's really likely you're scum

A lot of your play feels like it's stepping on eggshells and trying to avoid taking any stances or really be noticed too much.

[chennisden]

I guess what I'm saying is you have a

presence

, but it's really hard to discern what that presence is doing and it feels deliberate.

[chennisden]

Why do you believe there's scum in that hood

[chennisden]

Dave I think when you're scum you focus

groups

of people more than

individuals

. Am I wrong?

[chennisden]

I can go more in-depth into why I think this if you want me to

[chennisden]

I can go more in-depth into why I think

you focus groups of people more than individuals

if you want me to

Although I think it's kinda clear why I think this

[chennisden]

That answer is a really wonderful way to avoid responsibility.

[chennisden]

I can go more in-depth into why I think

you focus groups of people more than individuals

if you want me to

Although I think it's kinda clear why I think this

TBH I don't know why you would think I focus more on groups as scum vs. individuals as town as a general rule. I steadfastly refuse to do pre-flip associations but this has nothing to do with that.

You imply there's probably scum in a hood and in your last scumgame you literally said "I think this subset of this wagon has at least 1 scum"

[chennisden]

Anyway I'm gonna go mock an AIME so I am leaving this game

[chennisden]

I feel very icky on Dave's recent posting but I feel even more icky on the way A50 and Dave are handling each other's slots.

[chennisden]

I just don't know if it helps scum more than town to go into this. Scum already know the actual distribution. It might help town to know the theoretical limits of the distribution but explaining it might give scum a roadmap on how to fake their way around it. I tend to err on the side of caution in these circumstances. If we know a hood, and there is scum in that hood, it's mathematically superior to lynch that scum than it is to lynch an unknown from an unknown hood. Notice the conditionals there. This principle applies only if we know the hood members, and only if one of them is scum. Any town lynch from any hood containing scum harms us badly. Mislynches are extremely bad unless scum started out insanely weak.

I would need to look back to see if I screwed up what I wrote when I said I'd like to lynch scum from that hood, or if the conditionals didn't stick.

Pedit: Oh, a shot at bragging rights. Fine, I'm not being obtuse, I really am a computer scientist / mathematician with more than 50 patents (rough equivalent to about 3 dissertations worth of stuff though I haven't bothered to get the pretty heavy degree).

Dave I believe you'd be able to use math to help you win the game

I just don't believe that's what you're doing right now

[chennisden]

Everything you're saying is very obvious and the conditionals are not met

Basically, Dave, I think you're making stuff up right now

[chennisden]

Everything you're saying is very obvious and the conditionals are not met

Basically, Dave, I think you're making stuff up right now

[chennisden]

I also have a background in math. I think presenting what you're saying as "math" is incredibly disingenuous since yes, it is technically math, but it doesn't require a whole lot of expertise to know that if you know there's scum in a hood you lynch there, etc. What ended up happening when you said "math" was you ended up scaring people into submission and cutting off real discussion around your slot, whether this was your intent or not. I think a lot of people are scared to challenge "math" and I think you shutting down discussion like this is incredibly scummy.

I don't believe that scum can coast off of neighborhood distribution or whatever and I really don't believe you think this either.

[chennisden]

Nope, not making anything up.

This is all wrt your "neighborhood math" stuff.

[chennisden]

Gamnagooey bad scumread, nom is actually pretty good scumread

[chennisden]

Also dave, wrt 1188 I forgot entirely about the ability. My bad

[chennisden]

Feeling worse on nomnomnom every passing moment tbh

[chennisden]

Also DEB has literally refused to read D1, look at his last post

I think he uniquely has the balls to do this as town but wouldn't really as scum

[chennisden]

Every time Volxen has rolled scum he has always tried to pocket me and HEAL: IS POCKETING

[chennisden]

I think that's more headspace-indiactive than alignment-indicative

[chennisden]

Where does FL fit in your reads?

[chennisden]

Wow Ank wrote another wallpost

[chennisden]

Last time was Grey flag nightless or something? wow

[chennisden]

Btw these kind of "fuck the scumreads on me" wallposts from Ank -> Ank is town

[chennisden]

That thing

[chennisden]

My read is not predicated on the wallpost and there are other reasons I think it's likely she's town.

She hasn't left her scumrange persay but I think it's really much more likely she's town

[chennisden]

Same, Volpe, same

[chennisden]

Nom I find this kind of defense from you uncharaceristic

[chennisden]

Nom I find this kind of defense from you uncharaceristic

I normally wouldn't be this defensive but this is team mafia and I don't want to be mislynched on day one, especially when that never happened before. Would be humiliating for it to happen right now.

Besides I want to solve this game.

I'm talking about the

way

you're going about this

[chennisden]

Btw I think the way the gamestate is developing around nom makes it more likely she's town

But the way she's reacting to the gamestate makes it more likely she's scum

If that makes sense

[chennisden]

I think we should really focus on people who aren't brazenly scummy but more feel like they're playing from the sidelines

Dave and Elements are the poster kids of this

[chennisden]

She feels blatantly unapologetic while Dave and Elements feel like they're trying to cover it up

[chennisden]

I also doubt scum Ank fakes being in a bad headspace for this game

[chennisden]

See the thing is, I expect scum Ank not to be so brazenly out of her headspace and struggling to get in the game

She has other tools she could use, and this doesn't even help her coast at all

[chennisden]

You described Town Ank as having

sass

I'd say I expect scum ank to be more

aggressive

[chennisden]

I also doubt scum Ank fakes being in a bad headspace for this game

Do you think that scum!Ank would have all the usual sass/drive that town!Ank has and begin to limit her lynch pool/lynch possibilities in the game if she was content with gamestate?

Like, if we consider now town!nomnom getting wagoned, scum!Ank couldn't jump on her because nomnom would get sus, so throwing a TR and being lukewarm on it would be a good play to let town eat itself and...

exactly what happened??????

Honestly I'm dropping my confidence on you being town because you seem trying to justify why ank is town here rather than approaching this from a "is ank town or scum?"

The last sentence is extremely scummy

Am I overprojecting my confidence on this read? Probably

But that's because your scumreads on Ank are really weird from my POV

[chennisden]

And the "I'm dropping my confidence on you being town" is really really obviously manipulative. You're trying to strongarm me into publicly taking a worse position on Ank

[chennisden]

Also I really think we should look more into GiF because he also feels like he's avoiding playing the game

[chennisden]

I think we should really focus on people who aren't brazenly scummy but more feel like they're playing from the sidelines

Dave and Elements are the poster kids of this

Putting me in that category is utter bullshit.

Oddly this is kind of towny

[chennisden]

Also I really think we should look more into GiF because he also feels like he's avoiding playing the game

Without saying what you think it is, do you have any idea what I'm referring to, that GiF posted and that his reads are relevant to?

I think so

[chennisden]

UNVOTE:

[chennisden]

Btw this overeagerness to push nom from Farkran feels towny

[chennisden]

UNVOTE:

I feel really really icky unvoting and my mind and heart and soul tell me it's wrong

But I don't think I'm comfortable strongarming my Davesaz read when the rest of the thread seems to disagree

[chennisden]

Actually hmm

If Dave is scum I'd probably scumread people who handwaved off their thoughts about Dave

[chennisden]

Also I really think we should look more into GiF because he also feels like he's avoiding playing the game

Without saying what you think it is, do you have any idea what I'm referring to, that GiF posted and that his reads are relevant to?

I think so

???

[chennisden]

I did reply????

[chennisden]

Sorry, I don't think the "new post" thing is pointing to the right place all the time. It's jumping me to a later point in the thread and skipping over stuff.

Yeah php forums are kinda weird

[chennisden]

Hmmm I think that if nomnom was scum together with Elems, he would have voted nomnom before for bus points?

I think it's slightly unlikely that Elems is partners with nomnom to be fair.

Is this looking at scum teams D1 thing normal for you? I find it to be pretty useless this early in the game, when it's easy to get false relationships into your head and then carry them forward.

^^^

[chennisden]

Hey DEB, can you try reading the game instead

[chennisden]

I have played two games with chenn as town, that I remember at least which could mean I've played 9 with him who knows. The first was undertale where he went full on try hard as town leader controlling the game state etc. and haunted house when he didn't post as much and was more of a reactive player. This game fits neither of those.

Not really true for either Undertale, when I was spared D1 on the first iteration and really didn't get to say much and nightkilled N1 on the second iteration

[chennisden]

Parsing this thread will take some time

[chennisden]

Ok I doubt Elements believes his reads at all and just made shit up (i.e. kuribo 3P)

I don't know what that means for his alignment

[chennisden]

Yup

It's truly the new era of Mafiascum solving

[chennisden]

VOTE: elements

[chennisden]

I think Elements being scum actually doesn't have a whole lot to do with his self vote or his "woe is me" stuff

I think it's the way he reacted to people wanting him to play the game and the content he provided there.

[chennisden]

Otoh I think Kuribo's reaction to Elements "trust tell" is kinda scummy but I don't think it would be great to scumread kuribo off of that

[chennisden]

It's just what it is to me?

"you took a vacation to toon land?" isn't something I expect town to say after thinking someone behavior is utterly different especially when I explained a lot about it already in thread (and you didn't comment/give a opinion)

Your jump on Ank too kind of ssems wrong in hindsight because Ank asked about being convinced on you scum only but you already put words in her mouth with "why was I into your nullscum pool"

Ank never said you were into her nullscum pool it was something you made up on your own

You're also fairly reactionary and like, after the ball passed to ank you didn't really push her too much to talk it was mostly me. You mostly just say back.

Btw I still agree with this and think Dave is a wonderful lynch today

[chennisden]

I'm kind of confused why Dave has really only received flak from me and Volpe, really.

[chennisden]

It's just what it is to me?

"you took a vacation to toon land?" isn't something I expect town to say after thinking someone behavior is utterly different especially when I explained a lot about it already in thread (and you didn't comment/give a opinion)

Your jump on Ank too kind of ssems wrong in hindsight because Ank asked about being convinced on you scum only but you already put words in her mouth with "why was I into your nullscum pool"

Ank never said you were into her nullscum pool it was something you made up on your own

You're also fairly reactionary and like, after the ball passed to ank you didn't really push her too much to talk it was mostly me. You mostly just say back.

Btw I still agree with this and think Dave is a wonderful lynch today

This came out wrong, meant to say "but still think"

[chennisden]

VOTE: nomnomnom

[chennisden]

We should kill Nomnomnom first

[chennisden]

There's absolutely room to be wrong on Elements here.

Nom otoh really just feels like plastic

[chennisden]

You can absolutely skim an ISO of another game in 2 or 3 minutes, who's really gonna ACTUALLY go in depth and read the game post by post

The thing that really sticks out is Nomnomnom uses it when it's convenient to her and conveniently discredits it when she gets "no u"ed

[chennisden]

Elements could be town

I kinda doubt that even scum who didn't know what was going on and didn't ask partners for help would pick me out of a hat to vote.

[chennisden]

Otoh as scum it's possible Elements really would try to shade me and kinda had to double down later

[chennisden]

Right, it's just that it's possible scum elements has that as his first thought

[chennisden]

Actually I feel like if you're getting that feeling it's likely that they're just too obvious to be scum and scum is hiding elsewhere while the openly scummy slots get lynched

[chennisden]

On one hand stuff like nom saying "looney town" or whatever is actually absurd and really is contrived

But otoh there are SO MANY reasons piling up to lynch nom

It feels way too easy

[chennisden]

On one hand stuff like nom saying "looney town" or whatever is actually absurd and really is contrived

But otoh there are SO MANY reasons piling up to lynch nom

It feels way too easy

[chennisden]

Meh. Elements, can you... explain to me why you are doing what you are doing?

Talk to me only, ignore everyone else

Wow

This is definitely important but I really don't know what to think of this

[chennisden]

Yeah see what I said about coaching

but like, I also think it's probably not it?

and like, I'm not sure it makes sense for scum!Fark to act like that if elems isn't his partner especially when his most likely partner would actually be nomnom and I don't think he would try to redirect things that hard back to nomnom.

Yeah but even if it's not coaching it probably means something

Farkran I'd like you to explain why you said this

[chennisden]

Actually I want to take back eliminating the possibility of Fark/Elem team, I feel like it's not impossible Fark is just kind of live coaching Elem here

You're almost at my levels of paranoia towning, and i thank you for respecting me this much as a scum player, but... no.

I hardclaim not being in any kind of PT with elements.

This is also weird as fuck

[chennisden]

The fact that it's so hard to push Dave after he posts this kind of stuff really makes me feel I'm either completely out of touch with this game or the resistance is scum motivated

[chennisden]

@chennis

First bolded bit is because i honestly thought elements was high or drunk or something like that, and i tried an approach like good cop/evil cop - you know that stuff you see in tv series? - To see if he would regain his senses. Turned out he did, probably not because of me, but he did.

Hardclaiming not in a PT with elements because it occurred to me that someone could believe we were neighbors and i wanted to remove any chance of that happening.

On a side note, did your team or your hood tell you to vote nom? It was too sudden to come from you only

(Sorry about not quoting stuff, i'm from mobile in my bed where i'm gonna sleep soon since it's 3 am)

Nope it was just me

My team has abandoned me in the wilderness, the reason for this will be explained soon

Also why would you want to clear up that you were not neighbors?

[chennisden]

Tbh I kind of want to vote Chennis you play in such a bad faith kind of way it honestly disgusts me.

I'd say the same about Volpe honestly. You two have played absolutely disgusting imo. Particularly volpe, but like I don't know what you two are doing.

I don't recall doing anything that crosses the boundaries of this game, so...

[chennisden]

I'm honestly feeling resigned to just call nom town and being very very upset with this game if she ends up being scum.

[chennisden]

I can totally understand that kuribo, which is why I posted

"but I don't think it would be great to scumread kuribo off of that"

I do think it's objectively scummy to post that but 1) there's better stuff to bite into and 2) I really don't think scumreading you for defending the rules is good

[chennisden]

I don't think scumreading you for what you perceive are bad reasons merits calling my play "bad faith" or "disgusting."

[chennisden]

1674 is gamethrowing as town

The sooner you realize it, the better. Take your time.

He said "The sooner the better" but he also said "take your time"

You're a terrible liar Farkran and we're lynching you for this.

[chennisden]

1674 is gamethrowing as town

The sooner you realize it, the better. Take your time.

Yeah no townies has ever displayed sarcasm or has gotten fed up with a game because of 3 idiots pulling reads out of their asses right

I guess all these town games where I did the same thing doesn't matter either let's listen to Mr. Logic with logic that doesn't even make fucking sense from a team of nonames where I've only played with Kerset before and I don't even remember that game so that's to say how many nonames are on your team.

In this order:

1. Can you stop insulting Farkran's team, they're all wonderful people thanks

2. Can you try to understand where the scumreads on you are coming from, and try to establish a dialogue beneficial to town

3. Can you tell me what your thoughts on Davesaz are

[chennisden]

Yeah we get it, you're town, now can you play the game

[chennisden]

My team has abandoned me in the wilderness,

Can I bet that it's because they don't want to read my posting?

Nope. I will reveal the truth behind everything

Spoiler: THE TRUTH -- DON'T OPEN UNLESS YOU ARE READY TO HAVE YOUR MIND BLOWN

Tbh the real reason I'm in the Large Theme and have been abandoned despite being the worst at Large themes in my team is because

I kept 3 stocking popsofctown with my Pichu, she got really mad I was winning because "I needed a crutch to help me win" so I changed my avatar to prove I didn't need Pichu to help me win

So I went again, and booted up Smash again to prove my pro skills. Anyway long story short, pops got really salty because she kept getting bodied. She couldn't even deal any damage to me the entire set, what a noob. So like, I wanted to go watch anime but she kept insisting on rematching because she wanted to at least take a stock, which would obviously never happen. So I left the group chat and unplugged my controller and went home

So popsofctown gets really salty and meets up with Alisae and they begin devising a way to troll me so I would never dare body popsofctown in Smash again. Alisae says, "We should invite Chennis to our Team Mafia team." Pops is understandably confused, "Why do we need a stupid Pichu who spams posts in mafia games and spams F-Tilt in Smash Bros on our Team Mafia team?"

Alisae explains, "Pops you dum dum, we're going to put him in the Large Theme." Then it hits her. "And we're going to leave him alone in the wild lands of the Large Theme, and not help him with the game at all?"

"Exactly."

"But isn't that taking it too far? I wouldn't wish such a fate on my worst enemy."

"Chennis didn't need to three stock you seven times in a row, pops. I wouldn't wish that fate on my worst enemy either."

"Then it's a go."

Then their friend and fellow Team Mafia teammate wguerts learned about this plan. He said, "Wow, that sounds like a horrible thing to do to someone. I really pity him, but on the other hand now I don't have to even think about the Large Theme anymore. I never wanted to read what was going to be an inevitable shitfest anyway." So he went along with it and now chennis has to be here. Poor soul.

Actually the real reason is because my team is busy

Pops getting three stocked all the time is absolutely true though, I wouldn't make that up

[chennisden]

Yeah we get it, you're town, now can you play the game[/size]

I get letting her pass up but this isn't some kind of lock town tell or anything so back off on that

up to vote elems now?

I was thinking elems is a best lynch anyway

I really don't care at this point, sorting nom will be a task I'll put off for later in this game. Unfortunately I think this is really town indicative.

I'm not going to lock town this, it's just I really don't want to consider nom doing this as scum right now.

[chennisden]

what benefitial dialogue do you want me to have when I try arguing with someone saying that he got me locked scum because of a dumb ass psychology armchair reading, and another comes in with "you cannot possibly skim an iso in 2 minutes you're lying" then voting me? What the fuck do you want me to say? There's no dialogue to be had here and when I had dialogue earlier I'm just bashed because you're ego fueled to the point where you confbias yourself and pick every single of my posts to find more dumbass reasons to convince yourself.

Do you understand how frustrating my position is or are you so self-centered that you don't understand that

I really don't think anyone has called you "lock scum." And Volpe called you out for "iso 2 minutes" precisely because you used that point first - it was literally quoted in his post. And if you're concerned about people confbiasing, I think instead of flipping out at the thread you should try to, I dunno,

explain

that it's confbiasing.

I really think your last sentence is unwarranted.

[chennisden]

I’m pretty good at smash.

Yeah, but pops ofc badatsmash

[chennisden]

Yeah we get it, you're town, now can you play the game[/size]

I get letting her pass up but this isn't some kind of lock town tell or anything so back off on that

up to vote elems now?

I was thinking elems is a best lynch anyway

I really don't care at this point, sorting nom will be a task I'll put off for later in this game. Unfortunately I think this is really town indicative.

I'm not going to lock town this, it's just I really don't want to consider nom doing this as scum right now.

Unfortunately?

Also I've done this as scum too. NAI.

Unfortunately as in "I really hate that this is probably town indicative because excessive ATE makes the game unplayable"

[chennisden]

I used to play Pichu and Pikachu before he got nerfed, why would they do this to my precious boy

Now I play Pikachu and Joker, with Donkey Kong at the side in case I'm losing and I need to shake the set up or for counterpicking

[chennisden]

Guys, I think the mod's referring to me exposing Pops for being bad at smash

[chennisden]

Tbh a large reason I adopted my memey spammy Pichu persona was because it was a really good way to keep me out of conflicts

[chennisden]

Okay let's pursue something else

Gamma I feel like your reasonableness and lovely wallposts have me pocketed. Like my mind tells me it's possible you're scum who has been playing sort of under the radar but my heart tells me I'm pocketed

Can you help me here

[chennisden]

Like, I feel like you're town even though you've done some kind of scummy things this game

Hey Deas

What's the worst post in the game so far in your opinion? I don't need an explanation atm but I might bug you about it later when everyone's shown up and posted something meaningfulish

This is weird

I think EP is actually a really easy lynch and might not be scum at this point

then who might be scumz tho

This feels really forced

I'm fully caught up.

So here's where i am at:

- I townread

davesaz

for trying to sort FL vs volpe in an obvtown fashion
...
- I am slightly concerned about

Maria

for disappearing after that espresso read. Need more content from there, it looks like a veteran slot, reminds me of Micc. Internal consistency and good logic are more NAI here than elsewhere. Inclined to townlean her though.
...
- Scumleaning

Gammagooey

for his readlist and timing. Need more content though.

Hey Fark, can you try to describe what about dave's posts on volpe & FL are obvtown to you? I agree that volpe's read on Elements was a generally good thing for dave to look into, but the tone of dave's posts around there feels more commentaryish to me than investigative to me personally, and I think that type of content can pretty easily come from scum as well.

I also think I get where you could be coming from in regards to Maria and I not being around at particular points in the game, but I want you to think about that for a second for me. Do you think it's particularly likely that either of us are limiting our posting specifically in a way that scum are likely to do this early?

For myself I can promise you that I wouldn't want to deal with the volpe/FL clusterfuck before bed (and in fact still would prefer not to deal with it because I think a lot of FL's posts are likely posting for the sake of his own amusement/ego in that big ol' section and I doubt I'll be able to interpret anything useful out of his posts there) as either alignment, and people 'disappearing' (which I'm taking to mean posting once or twice in a discussion and then bailing) in general in a game this big is a lot more likely to be 'the person had real life shit they wanted/needed to do' or just didn't feel like dealing with the game at the time than scum-motivated hiding from the thread.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Last thing that'll probably be ignored - I would really like for the posting here to lighten up a little, at least until Almost/Easy Bake/volxen/etc show up with an actual opinion or two - I really want at least one or two solid opinions from everyone before I start diving into actually trying to get someone lynched today. Think before you spampost my friends.

There's good content here but there's something that feels off, and I have no clue what it is

WRT Maria: it's not just about limiting post quantity, but what you choose to post when actually posting. Going out of your way to say something about a specific player is relevantly AI. I don't know how at this point in time - it might be town!maria trying to put weight on the interactions engine, or scum!maria trying to look busy with the (supposedly) little time she has. The read is not strong though, as i said, i'd like a lot more content coming from there.

WRT you: same as above, you went out of your way and made a specific tier about me being scum, without having any context to base your read on. You can't expect to form hard reads like that and not getting asked to back them up. I mean, your push would be understandable in a vacuum -as i said, i've seen this movie so many times now- but the timing and confidence levels do not feel right. Your analysis of me is very similar to what chennis said and has the same information fallacy (you should really read one of my games. Any game. And not even the full game, take any random ~10 posts in my ISO to see what i mean) - incidentally, chennis was also your highest townread. Same as i said about dave, a town mindset would try to sort the 1v1 before taking super hard stances about players involved. Scum would pocket one side and sink the other, which is exactly what you did there.

With regards to the first point with Maria - I was talking about your concern with her for disappearing - I don't really get what you mean with her going out of her way to say something about a specific player (I'm assuming you mean her comments on espresso?). Like from my POV regardless of her alignment she thinks that espresso did something scummy and wants to call attention to it, either she's town and wants to call attention to it because it's likely to be coming from scum or she's scum and wants to point people at a player she thinks can be pushed as a mislynch (or as a distancing but that seems a lot less likely to me). I'm more asking you to re-evaluate *is someone 'disappearing'* actually alignment-relevant at all, esp. compared to what people actually do with their posts while they're around?

In regards to me - I don't hold my own reads in very high regard this early in the game, but at the time if I had to ignore the uber-lurkers and immediately shoot someone in the face to try to get scum it'd probably be either you or dave, and that seemed worth mentioning so people can at least attempt to read me (cause let's be real I haven't actually done much in-game aside from that and today's posts so far). I have read over some pieces of your previous games this morning and it does makes me feel a little better about you but I don't think it makes you likely town, just a little less likely to be scum than I thought before.

Chennis's push on you felt pretty genuine and well thought out and I agree with his reasoning on why you'd be likely scum here - I don't think scum make a case like that this early and push it that hard in what seemed like a genuine attempt to push and lynch scum.

And this feels like using a lot of words to word something in a certain way when you could've said it in a shorter way

[chennisden]

in d2 he only should get a pass if he has a cute doodle cat avatar with sunglasses as avi

How to get pass for d3

[chennisden]

Tell me if this is tinfoil but

I think it's possible that nom could be using "oh ATE is NAI I've done it as scum" so ppl don't get mad postgame when she flips scum.

[chennisden]

in d2 he only should get a pass if he has a cute doodle cat avatar with sunglasses as avi

How to get pass for d3

buy dog DLC expansion for $4.99

Last time I checked, a puppy costed a few hundred dollars, not a few hundred cents

[chennisden]

Sadly the best way to preserve the health of the game thread is to not talk about the game and endlessly post fluff

[chennisden]

You're asking for the impossible

I google searched it, it's been 30 seconds, I haven't found anything

Btw where is your current avi from

[chennisden]

Aren't we all bad at mafia

[chennisden]

Wow I can't believe Alisae is actually not helping me because I posted the story about my deportation to the Large Theme

[chennisden]

Alisae Pops and I are having a very crucial discussion about whether I should continue 3 stocking popsofctown

[chennisden]

The game isn't going to end until one of you top this.

[chennisden]

Well,

someone

got three stocked as a kid

[chennisden]

Did not know you could do that and I'm never voting another way again

[chennisden]

It gets worse

[chennisden]

Ali says he will supply a MariaR read for me

[chennisden]

Tl;dr you missed nothing

If anyone wakes up and is catching up tomorrow I'm pretty sure the same will still be true

[chennisden]

How are you an easy mislynch where the hell did you get that from reading this gamestate lol

This

[chennisden]

Congrats Volpe, you found it

[chennisden]

May I remind everybody that this is a game of 4-headed hydras in spirit? The way I look at TM is several games (5 this year) going on with 4-geaded hydras playing them, but only one head is allowed to post.

What this means is I would request each and every one of us to consult their teammates and give us their input (more eyes/opinions should increase our chances to win. You can fool me, but you can't fool skitts, jjh & Amrun too simultaneously).

If course, you would still be the one to make the final decision, but -even if you go against what your teammates advise you to- the rest of us are blessed with the knowledge of "someone outside the game's opinion". Someone outside the game also usually can see things we miss because they're looking at the bigger picture, and not as emotionally compromised.

Seems like a given, but I think it needed to be mentioned. I/we need to know what the others 54 players are thinking here (or at least those of them who care to play TEAM Mafia)

P.S. Volpe's avi now looking close to Chara's is getting to me. Are you trying to subconsciously pocket me, lad??

Tbh this is not high priority for my team, Pops will take a look at this game but I think that's it for now

Lmk if you have anything specific for her

[chennisden]

How are you an easy mislynch where the hell did you get that from reading this gamestate lol

I personally don't think I am, but at least 3 people have said that.

The only thing that matters wrt to me using that to inform my read on Ank is whether Ank believes I'm a mislynch candidate.

That was at least 40 pages ago and is not relevant to the current gamestate.

[chennisden]

Congrats Volpe, you found it

Huh?

A Chara avi

[chennisden]

Wow

[chennisden]

It's explicitly a waste of time, you didn't miss much

[chennisden]

Maria is town

This is my read btw

[chennisden]

I absolutely agree with how Maria views dave

[chennisden]

Ooh I also think kuribo is town after thinking about it a bit more

[chennisden]

I absolutely agree with how Maria views dave

Do tell, how does Maria view me?

"I agree with the former part of this quote that I forgot to quote that I’m probably a bit bias in the fact that I consider myself such a good scum player combining that with team mafia maybe my expectations are a bit high. Like if I saw an ‘easy’ scumread or reason to scumread someone I would probably give it pause (like the Ank example from before) I also agree that walls and effort are pretty NAI. The part I want to know is what examples from dave/chen do you find dif because our reads are exactly the other way around where I see Chenn as ya know, doing things. Compared to Dave who is playing to get an advantage."

Forgot which post this was from.

Also unrelated but I think I'm starting to scumread Gamma. I'll try to expand on this later

[chennisden]

Basically Ctrl+V how I felt on Farkran/Dave

[chennisden]

Also it's notable Gamma has agreed with a lot of the direction the thread has gone and gone with the flow. He really hasn't pushed anything he ostensibly believes with any weight, really, and his ISO looks like busywork. Since I also kind of think the game has been going in the wrong direction I think this is a productive avenue to explore

[chennisden]

As scum I would attempt to warp the gamestate btw

My approach to scum is basically I warp the lens of how the game is viewed as a whole rather than the results of individuals

[chennisden]

How does writing walls instead of using new posts make the game harder to read????

New posts are like paragraph breaks; I use them to separate ideas.

Also this might be a selfish line of thought but actually splitting separate thoughts into separate posts makes it more likely people read what I write and make the trajectory of my slot easier to read.

[chennisden]

As scum I would attempt to warp the gamestate btw

My approach to scum is basically I warp the lens of how the game is viewed as a whole rather than the results of individuals

Yeah, you’re Mini Boon.

Yeah I actually think "flavor leaf" is a pretty concise way to describe my scumgame

Also I think that style of scumplay is actually kind of disproportionately effective because people just haven't learned how to counter it

It’s an Old School vs New School mentality. Gamma’s ‘09 so walls are easier to read. Just the times, and the smart phone boom coming after players started playing Mafia.

I find it really hard to play mobile actually, I think it's my stream of consciousness mentality where I literally think of something right after I post something else

[chennisden]

ME ME ME

Can I permanently commute from this game

[chennisden]

That’s on a mech level, and he thinks GIF outing the neighborhood (which I’m actually not sure if he did or not, I thought it was nom?) is cray town.

GIF, A50, maybe DEB.

These aren’t strong, and my teammate, at least Jingle, doesn’t agree with that GIF read.

I don’t have a lot of scum reads that I’m confident in right now, which is why I’m not voting.

I’ve never talked about the A50 one, but if you look at anytime I brought him up, you can tell I was feeling it. It’s not strong, but like I said before, I’m really good at reading him. If he’s scum, I feel I’ll be sure of it pretty soon.

Odd you don't call this out Gamma

I don't have a problem with this but I feel heebie jeebies that you don't either when this is identical