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Lady Lambdadelta
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Post Post #5750  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 8:44 pm

Like, you could have replaced out instead of killing yourself. Why didn't you do that if you were exhausted?
That which yields is not always weak. Read my new GTKAS here, ask some questions!
SleepyKrew (11:13): cat in a pretty good mood thanks for asking how about you
Three heads are better than one. Just ask us~.

Flavor Leaf
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Post Post #5751  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:38 pm

Like there just wasn't. I understand why people think there might have been, but like, come on :roll:


I'm like the guy that always goes "I can win against all odds". Like it was done. People saying there was a chance, no, there wasn't. The fight was Nancy and Norwegian vs Flavor. They got me. They literally got me :lol:
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Thestatusquo
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Post Post #5752  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:41 pm

honestly I dont have a problem with FL conceding the game.

I have a problem with almost everything else he did, but I don't have a problem with him conceding in what I think was a clearly lost position.

This will be my last post in this thread.
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Flavor Leaf
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Post Post #5753  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:41 pm

And I don't replace out of games I sign up for unless I feel I'm getting too toxic, another telling of where I believe my level of toxicity was this game
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DkKoba
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Post Post #5754  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:41 pm

In post 5749, Lady Lambdadelta wrote:
In post 5748, Flavor Leaf wrote:I understand why some people think I had a chance, but it's like playing Go or Chess. The longer it takes for someone to realize that the game is over, the newer the player, and thus it's polite to resign when the game is seen to be over.

As Pooky said, and shown by the end of it, I was burnt out from Mafia, the last 3 months I was playing was for the first time just not fun anymore, and exhausted, so it was essentially, I'm completely out of energy, I put so much effort into this game, and I got KO'd.

My health bar got depleted. Like, they won. They beat me. The game was over.


Except Mafia isn't go or chess and it's not a zero sum game and it's not a game where you play by yourself.

It's a team game. Concession in chess and go and other zero sum strategy games is done because you can see that the movesets are closed off. That isn't the case with human psychology.

The truth is, I've convinced a group of 4 people ON THIS WEBSITE who SHOULD HAVE CONFIRMED THROUGH MOD INFORMATION ALL KNOWN that I was CONFIRMED SCUM that I was instead CONFIRMED TOWN by a narrative I had created by predicting this outcome and won that game off that lie.

A 0% to win game, turned into a win by sheer force of will.

Mafia is not a game where players can just say "well I concede" and be right.

And I find it incredibly offensive that you say shit like you did here, talking down to us. You're not better than most people here. You're certainly not better than me. Or did you not learn your lesson in Tenet where you pulled this shit and it probably was the main cause for town losing that game.

If you keep on this path, you're never going to improve. Part of being able to improve is recognizing your limits and knowing where your weaknesses are.

Mafia is not a game where anything is lost. If you fight to the end and you didn't make the right moves or say the right words, so be it, it happens.

I mean a great example of this is Wall street bets. A game where I was close to 0% to win and came within... I dunno, a single early game choice of who had the money of winning. I took an unwinnable game and got to final four with 2 votes believing I was town. All I needed was for the vig not to be bought by one of the people who didn't think that way. It was a shame and I just didn't get it right. I can learn from that.

But I could have given up when I realized they were buying it, but I had outs in which I could convince them to shoot someone else. Learning to try for those outs and playing to them is a sign of an experienced player, not a new one.


then town were playing against their win condition if you were indeed mechanically guilty from their PoV

DkKoba
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Post Post #5755  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:42 pm

relying on town literally gamethrowing is not the take you think it is wrt conceding a clearly lost position.

DkKoba
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Post Post #5756  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:42 pm

"aha i hope magnus carlsen blunders this guaranteed mate in 2"

Dannflor
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Post Post #5757  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:46 pm

the average mafia rating on here would be like 800

not magnus carlsen

DkKoba
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Post Post #5758  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 9:53 pm

In post 5757, Dannflor wrote:the average mafia rating on here would be like 800

not magnus carlsen


the point of the analogy that there was an extremely low chance of town messing up that gamestate because the case was set in motion based on evidence that cannot be taken back

Lady Lambdadelta
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Post Post #5759  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 10:07 pm

In post 5755, DkKoba wrote:relying on town literally gamethrowing is not the take you think it is wrt conceding a clearly lost position.


It turns out that Manipulating someone into a blunder and relying on them to make it on their own are two different things.

It turns out that there are win conditions beyond town playing perfectly, in which you... shockingly

INDUCE TOWN INTO A SUBOPTIMAL PLAY VIA MANIPULATION

I feel like I'm playing with people who play poker and look up hand strength online and fold anything that is below premium. Yes, I get it, you're not favoured. Part of poker is playing the other player, not the hand. Inducing folds. Inducing bad calls.

Poker is a much better metaphor for Mafia.

But the Dunning-Krueger here is super strong, because both of you seem to really enjoy talking down to people while lording how right you are, when you literally couldn't be more wrong.
That which yields is not always weak. Read my new GTKAS here, ask some questions!
SleepyKrew (11:13): cat in a pretty good mood thanks for asking how about you
Three heads are better than one. Just ask us~.

Lady Lambdadelta
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Post Post #5760  (ISO)  » Thu May 13, 2021 10:09 pm

In post 5753, Flavor Leaf wrote:And I don't replace out of games I sign up for unless I feel I'm getting too toxic, another telling of where I believe my level of toxicity was this game


Hmmmm
That which yields is not always weak. Read my new GTKAS here, ask some questions!
SleepyKrew (11:13): cat in a pretty good mood thanks for asking how about you
Three heads are better than one. Just ask us~.

Dannflor
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Post Post #5761  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 12:13 am

In post 5758, DkKoba wrote:
In post 5757, Dannflor wrote:the average mafia rating on here would be like 800

not magnus carlsen


the point of the analogy that there was an extremely low chance of town messing up that gamestate because the case was set in motion based on evidence that cannot be taken back

and my point is that we can't assume any given players are good enough to actually take full advantage of said evidence

like unless you're getting to the absolute highest levels of play in any game, people always have a chance to blunder

Jingle
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Post Post #5762  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 12:17 am

In post 5684, Jingle wrote:Also, I typed an entire case, had the forum eat it, and then retyped it and you people hammered Pine before he could post it. You monsters.


@FL.
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Ramcius
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Post Post #5763  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 4:41 am

That was a good entertainment, chess and poker examples, but you know, you should go a little bit deeper, you can't just use general idea, when you you speaking for specific circumstances. Sure, part of poker is bluffing, but also it's part of recognising if your opponent is susceptible for bluff, same for chess, you have to know, if you opponent is weak enough to make a blunder, or they simple look at you with a disgust for underestimating their intelligence - no one likes to be treated like an idiot. In this case, Nancy was a tipping point, Akarin would just sheep her, she wouldn't go against Nancy. So you saying that bring even more toxicity in this game via FL vs Nancy fight was a right choice, because you think there was non 0% chance to convince her? Key word here is "you think", there was no salvaging any more
Tact is for liars and politicians.

Nancy Drew 39
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Post Post #5764  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 5:16 pm

In post 5763, Ramcius wrote:That was a good entertainment, chess and poker examples, but you know, you should go a little bit deeper, you can't just use general idea, when you you speaking for specific circumstances. Sure, part of poker is bluffing, but also it's part of recognising if your opponent is susceptible for bluff, same for chess, you have to know, if you opponent is weak enough to make a blunder, or they simple look at you with a disgust for underestimating their intelligence - no one likes to be treated like an idiot. In this case, Nancy was a tipping point, Akarin would just sheep her, she wouldn't go against Nancy. So you saying that bring even more toxicity in this game via FL vs Nancy fight was a right choice, because you think there was non 0% chance to convince her? Key word here is "you think", there was no salvaging any more


Akarin was the first one to notice that something was off about you being the nk. She thought it was “weird” and then Norwee said it was because you were “obvtown”. :lol:

Like Akarin wasn’t?

So, yeah Akarin was already suspicious of that and after I laid out Pooky’s case, there’s no way in hell she wouldn’t have sheeped me.

@FL, no offense but your toxicity bar is unreasonably low. I replaced out of game for far far less than that. If you are causing the rest of the playerlist to be demoralized, that’s “too toxic”.


My theory is that’s the real reason for the ban but the mods for whatever reason didn’t want to say that.
Thing with Nancy is we just need to tread carefully because if you slip up around her as scum she notices and will tear your spine out and slap you to death with it.

(I'm slightly scared of Nancy)
~ the worst

Nancy Drew 39
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Post Post #5765  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 5:18 pm

@mod, are we ever going to get to see the scum PT?
Thing with Nancy is we just need to tread carefully because if you slip up around her as scum she notices and will tear your spine out and slap you to death with it.

(I'm slightly scared of Nancy)
~ the worst

Flavor Leaf
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Post Post #5766  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 6:24 pm

In post 5762, Jingle wrote:
In post 5684, Jingle wrote:Also, I typed an entire case, had the forum eat it, and then retyped it and you people hammered Pine before he could post it. You monsters.


@FL.


Oh, I was not about to let a Jingle case on me go through. :lol:
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NorwegianboyEE
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Post Post #5767  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 11:50 pm

Of all the things that are problematic with this game, FL self-hammering after getting 2 votes on him is the issue mods have a problem with?
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NorwegianboyEE
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Post Post #5768  (ISO)  » Fri May 14, 2021 11:57 pm

Rather FL should have gotten an medal for self-hammering, because at least the pain wouldn’t be dragged out any more.
★ ☆ ★ ☆ ★
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DkKoba
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Post Post #5769  (ISO)  » Sat May 15, 2021 12:15 am

In post 5767, NorwegianboyEE wrote:Of all the things that are problematic with this game, FL self-hammering after getting 2 votes on him is the issue mods have a problem with?

yeah its a complete farce lmao.

Flavor Leaf
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Post Post #5770  (ISO)  » Sat May 15, 2021 1:02 am

I am willing to accept a medal.
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Loki Dokie
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Post Post #5771  (ISO)  » Sat May 15, 2021 9:50 pm

In post 5769, DkKoba wrote:
In post 5767, NorwegianboyEE wrote:Of all the things that are problematic with this game, FL self-hammering after getting 2 votes on him is the issue mods have a problem with?

yeah its a complete farce lmao.


Complete with a farce of a ban, it’s almost poetic.

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Post Post #5772  (ISO)  » Sun May 16, 2021 4:57 pm

i dont think its exactly playing against win condition to concede if you dont think you have a win condition

Nancy Drew 39
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Post Post #5773  (ISO)  » Thu Jun 17, 2021 12:34 pm

Is the scum PT ever going to get released?
Thing with Nancy is we just need to tread carefully because if you slip up around her as scum she notices and will tear your spine out and slap you to death with it.

(I'm slightly scared of Nancy)
~ the worst

PenguinPower
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Post Post #5774  (ISO)  » Thu Jun 17, 2021 1:39 pm

Sorry for the delay. Released.

PMs work well if you want to get my attention. This forum doesn't have a functional @ feature.
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